StinkyPinky said:

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TX_COWDOC said:

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NWE said:

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Audiobooks don't count.

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Says who?

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Because listening is a different cognitive function then reading. Absolutely nothing wrong with it if that is the preferred format, but its inaccurate to say reading. Reading 50 books over a year is much different than listening to 50 books. That's my hill and will die on it! (not serious of course, just antagonizing because this debate always entertains me

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Why are you reading a book? Is it for the enjoyment of the story? Or are you trying to prove a point like it's a competition?


Because if you are reading books for enjoyment it doesn't matter if you are listening or reading.

Otherwise it's just elitist bull**** trying to prove you are better than someone else.


It's that second attitude that gone to ruin reading for so many people. There's always tons of complaints about how people nare getting dumber, kids don't read anymore, etc. Why do you think that is? Same thing with people that don't consider graphic novels "real books". If a graphic novel gets a kid interested in books and reading, we shouldn't be shaming them for enjoying it. On a separate note, graphic novels can be incredibly complex in terms of plot, story, and length.


I'm obviously biased because both my wife and I work in publishing. It's just incredibly frustrating to see the direct harm some of the opinions expressed in this thread have on books and reading.

Very good but hard to stomach. About 1/3 in.

https://www.amazon.com/Mans-Search-Meaning-Viktor-Frankl/dp/0807014273/

I think its harmful to tell kids that listening to a book is the same as reading. Just like watching someone on youtube play a game isnt going to develop hand-eye coordination and reaction times and strategic thinking that *actually playing* the game does. I mean, even physically engaging with the book in a tactile way is going to make it a different experience.


You are engaging with literary content, but to pretend its reading is harmful. It is good for you to sit down and focus on a book. You will 1000% engage with the content in a different way while listening than you will than while reading than you will when watching the movie/tv show based on the book. It doesn't mean listening or watching is wrong, but they are objectively different.

I'm a terrible reader. I read like 1-3 books every year, a mix of fiction and non-fiction. Nothing super technical or "smart". I do it for enjoyment but if I learn something new or expand my vocabulary, great, that's a bonus. I learn stuff from podcasts too I guess.

I've never considered reading a competition or a way to show superiority. But there's probably a correlation between "success" or intelligence and literacy on an individual basis and when comparing countries.

I trust that literacy rates are down because of the alternatives you are suggesting, not because other people make them feel bad for not reading. It's the same reason kids can't write as well these days. I've seen 18 year olds in college writing emails to profs. It's one long sentence with no capitalization or punctuation. How do you know how to use those things if you are only listening to someone speak or viewing a picture? Reading comprehension and writing composition I would assume are closely linked.

I think about it the same with language fluency. I probably should but don't know a great deal of Spanish. I'm probably smart enough to learn but I lack the motivation to do so. I am impressed by those that speak more than one language, but I don't feel dumber because they do.

No one is born with the ability to read. It's taught. And just like with other things we are taught, such as algebra or calculus, if you aren't doing it routinely, your foundational knowledge slips.

Thankfully I get plenty of cognitive stimulation in my daily life.

Literacy rates are down for many complex reasons.

Other drivers and pedestrians prefer that i don't hold a book and turn pages as I drive

NWE said:

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Starting a book called Dungeon Crawler Carl today.

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I'm on Dungeon Crawler Carl #6: The Eye of the Bedlam Bride

I both read and listen; DCC is much more entertaining if you listen to the Jeff Hayes version and not the AI.

Reading affects certain skills and listening affects others. Both are a vector for entertainment and I would argue that both are acceptable. Listening to books can be done easier than reading them but definitely takes certain skills and can promote reading and vice versa. Movies and Cliff notes are not in the same category as audio books versus hard copy reading.

People with certain disabilities physically cannot read with their eyes.

713nervy said:

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People with certain disabilities physically cannot read with their eyes.

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And those people would likely love and appreciate the ability to read more than any of us. They are probably pissed at the abled people who claim they are reading when really they are choosing to listen.

I imagine it's a little like a quadriplegic watching an able bodied person use a motorized buggy because they are too fat and lazy to walk around Walmart.

swimmerbabe11 said:

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I think its harmful to tell kids that listening to a book is the same as reading. Just like watching someone on youtube play a game isnt going to develop hand-eye coordination and reaction times and strategic thinking that *actually playing* the game does. I mean, even physically engaging with the book in a tactile way is going to make it a different experience.


You are engaging with literary content, but to pretend its reading is harmful. It is good for you to sit down and focus on a book. You will 1000% engage with the content in a different way while listening than you will than while reading than you will when watching the movie/tv show based on the book. It doesn't mean listening or watching is wrong, but they are objectively different.

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Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying kids should listen to books vs read. In general both are good but I am all for getting kids to read more.



In terms of the actual act of reading a book vs listening to an audiobook, there really isn't much of a difference for those who know how to read (like adults), especially when it comes to knowledge retention. The process is effectively the same. We know this in part due to research on Learning Styles which are actually a giant myth. There is no such thing as a visual or auditory learner for example. There isn't a ton of research on specifically listening to an audiobook vs. reading a physical book but what does exist shows no difference (including reading and listening at the same time). Functionally, it's all the same with the caveat the person already knows how to read.


What does differ is distraction and focus. If you are listening to an audiobook and trying to accomplish another task, your retention would be less compared to just reading a book. But the same thing happens if you are trying to read a book and do something else at the same time (like listen to music or watch TV).