this seems on brand

don't like what someone has to say, just walk away

gvine07 said:

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At my son's school/dayce 3 and up wear masks except when eating or playing outside... I don't think any of them are scared

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I personally don't agree that masks are developmentally appropriate for 3 yr olds in a school setting. I guess it helps with the biters but it's not beneficial for emotional or mental learning.

Biters haven't been an issue since they were 1. Our doctor recommended he go to school under the CDC guidelines.

Do you have data that being in masks is worse for them?

cone said:

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this seems on brand

don't like what someone has to say, just walk away

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It's more how one communicates, how they say something rather than the content in it, that makes me feel a back and forth discussion wouldn't teach me anything. I like discussing various opinions, can usually argue both sides myself, but only with people interested in actual discussion and not "winning" a minimum character text exchange online. ie almost nowhere online can I find a discussion I enjoy.

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Do you have data that being in masks is worse for them?

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considering that the elite panic over putting three year olds into masks is all of 6 weeks old, i would guess not

I think that it would be impossible to quantify the negative social/mental effects of masks on young children. It seems common sense to me.

agreed

and there are private options not requiring masks for 5 year olds

gvine07 said:

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Biters haven't been an issue since they were 1. Our doctor recommended he go to school under the CDC guidelines.

Do you have data that being in masks is worse for them?

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Biting happens up to three in some cases. CDC recomeends masks for older children in school but does not delineate what "older"means. In fact the specify that 2 and younger should not wear masks due to risk of suffocation.

I'm not pulling up the mountains of research that show infants, toddlers, and children learn from reading facial cues and expression. Its only the stuff that parents especially moms have known for centuries. Babies even recognize faces within days of birth. Are you trying to argue that masks won't dampen emotional and social learning in young children? In my opinion and for me personally, that dampening isn't worth the risk of covid exposure.

to add and edit: I should say I dont think a three or four year old wearing a mask a few hours a day in a classroom will make daycares look like Russian orphanages but there is a trade off and hopefully by the spring or by next year masks wont be as necessary and the kids will adjust accordingly. Unfortunately our kids are the experiment.

So are we keeping masks indefinitely? After all flu season is approaching and the flu seems to be a greater threat to young children.

Where did you see that?

A lot of these restrictions will go away once we get a vaccine.

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CDC recomeends masks for older children in school but does not delineate what "older"means.

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here's what I read:

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Younger children (e.g., preschool or early elementary aged) may be unable to wear a mask properly, particularly for an extended period of time. Wearing of masks may be prioritized at times when it is difficult to maintain a distance of 6 feet from others (e.g., during carpool drop off or pick up, or when standing in line at school). Ensuring proper mask size and fit and providing children with frequent reminders and education on the importance and proper wear of masks may help address these issues.

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so if they're only going to make them put on the masks when they have to line up for something, that's less of a deal

but gtfo if it's most all of the day

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A lot of these restrictions will go away once we get a vaccine.

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how good does the vaccine have to be?

or is it mostly just as a psych marker that we've done all we can, time to move on

tysker said:

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gvine07 said:

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Biters haven't been an issue since they were 1. Our doctor recommended he go to school under the CDC guidelines.

Do you have data that being in masks is worse for them?

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Biting happens up to three in some cases. CDC recomeends masks for older children in school but does not delineate what "older"means. In fact the specify that 2 and younger should not wear masks due to risk of suffocation.

I'm not pulling up the mountains of research that show infants, toddlers, and children learn from reading facial cues and expression. Its only the stuff that parents especially moms have known for centuries. Babies even recognize faces within days of birth. Are you trying to argue that masks won't dampen emotional and social learning in young children? In my opinion and for me personally, that dampening isn't worth the risk of covid exposure.

to add and edit: I should say I dont think a three or four year old wearing a mask a few hours a day in a classroom will make daycares look like Russian orphanages but there is a trade off and hopefully by the spring or by next year masks wont be as necessary and the kids will adjust accordingly. Unfortunately our kids are the experiment.

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My son is 4 and started Pre-K today. The school is in Denton County, but for whatever reason the Dallas health department regulates it (because of a document from when it was built). They're required to have the kids wear them when they're inside and unable to social distance themselves.

Obviously they're outside for as much as the heat allows so they don't have to worry about them.

Now the options are to not go to pre-k, wear masks and minimize the risks for the virus, or don't wear masks and get shut down for 2 weeks at a time every time more than 1 kid tests positive. My wife and I both work so the first option doesn't work, and the 3rd option would be a real pain. Having them wear masks is normal for kids that have been attending the whole summer (I think they've been wearing them since May). It's not ideal, but not setting back their development significantly.

Charpie said:

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Where did you see that?

A lot of these restrictions will go away once we get a vaccine.

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https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Among-Ages-0-18-Years/nr4s-juj3

CDC says 76 COVID deaths 18 and under. 25 4 and younger.

https://www.aappublications.org/news/2020/04/10/fluupdate041020

CDC also said 2019-2020 flu season killed 166 children.

So why not masks forever?

Hadn't seen this CDC graphic before:

that's becoming clear to me as well

no doubt it will have some useful effect, but the main utility is to end liability concerns and signify the end of the psychic trauma

CDC info for 0-18 age group, if anyone wants to take a look. You can expand the table info for more details.

https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Among-Ages-0-18-Years/nr4s-juj3

but there's still likely going to be spread with the masks in place

so option 3 is live, although at a reduced likelihood compared to no masking

but still, good for you getting out in front of putting masks on your kids and getting them used to how we're expected to act to protect the teachers

Complete Idiot said:

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CDC info for 0-18 age group, if anyone wants to take a look. You can expand the table info for more details.

https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Among-Ages-0-18-Years/nr4s-juj3

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I've posted the same thing elsewhere, but if we wind up with 1 million deaths from Covid in the US and the death rates by age remain constant. of that 1,000,000 deaths about 600 will be kids under 10. 600 of 1 million. Interestingly, about 600-700 kids die in car wrecks in any given year, so Covid is roughly as risky as driving in a car for children (assuming we total 1 million deaths...).

I could be wrong here, but I think the mask orders trickle down to schools is to slow community spread.

The kids may not get sick at all, but if they spread it to 4 people and those 4 spread it to 4 then our hospitals can get overwhelmed.

3rd Gen - my daughter had one class today with a teacher teaching from home to a full class in person. Will be interesting to hear from her directly. I am sure it wasn't perfect...so what....they are trying to make it work.

I hope your school affords you a similar opportunity. Just letting you know that some districts are, and maybe you can use that information to your benefit.


edit - she was actually teaching from a remote room on campus, and my daughter said it was no big deal, worked just fine. The teacher told the student she had some health issues.

This is the way it should be done, everyone wins.

Smokedraw01 said:

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Harry Stone said:

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Smokedraw01 said:

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jenn96 said:

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My own kids experience with online in the spring (1st and 4th grade) was so negative that we are not considering online unless forced. No qualms at all about sending them to school.

Most of my friends who are not doing in-person have withdrawn and are homeschooling. They all have stay at home moms which makes a big difference, obviously. Not an good option for my family.

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Online learning in the Spring was a failure because teachers were forced to change directions very quickly with no preparation for how to teach online. I don't see that being as much of an issue this coming year. I can tell you that the level of expectations on students will be much higher than it was in the Spring when we didn't know what Corona virus was, how to teach online, or even how to learn on line.

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my employee is in new caney isd and they started yesterday and said it was a disaster.

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How so?

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first off she had to take the day off because both parents work. second she said none of the kids would focus, the kids had problems using the computers so if a parent wasnt there itd be impossible. then she said that at one point the teacher computer logged off. how are parents supposed to do this when they work? how are kids gonna stay focused at home when they already have trouble with it at school? then when it came to the assignments, her son struggled working the computer to do the assignment. the districts are expecting children to understand technology.

Im sure its going to be the same problems for all districts. it may be better than in the spring but to realistically think the problems magically go away is shortsided at best.

Harry Stone said:

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Smokedraw01 said:

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Harry Stone said:

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Smokedraw01 said:

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jenn96 said:

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My own kids experience with online in the spring (1st and 4th grade) was so negative that we are not considering online unless forced. No qualms at all about sending them to school.

Most of my friends who are not doing in-person have withdrawn and are homeschooling. They all have stay at home moms which makes a big difference, obviously. Not an good option for my family.

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Online learning in the Spring was a failure because teachers were forced to change directions very quickly with no preparation for how to teach online. I don't see that being as much of an issue this coming year. I can tell you that the level of expectations on students will be much higher than it was in the Spring when we didn't know what Corona virus was, how to teach online, or even how to learn on line.

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my employee is in new caney isd and they started yesterday and said it was a disaster.

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How so?

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first off she had to take the day off because both parents work. second she said none of the kids would focus, the kids had problems using the computers so if a parent wasnt there itd be impossible. then she said that at one point the teacher computer logged off. how are parents supposed to do this when they work? how are kids gonna stay focused at home when they already have trouble with it at school? then when it came to the assignments, her son struggled working the computer to do the assignment. the districts are expecting children to understand technology.

Im sure its going to be the same problems for all districts. it may be better than in the spring but to realistically think the problems magically go away is shortsided at best.

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Gotcha. So the instruction wasn't the **** show. Student behavior was. Both are important and that is t meant to be a loaded statement but I see how it could come across like that.

Smokedraw01 said:

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Harry Stone said:

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Smokedraw01 said:

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Harry Stone said:

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Smokedraw01 said:

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jenn96 said:

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My own kids experience with online in the spring (1st and 4th grade) was so negative that we are not considering online unless forced. No qualms at all about sending them to school.

Most of my friends who are not doing in-person have withdrawn and are homeschooling. They all have stay at home moms which makes a big difference, obviously. Not an good option for my family.

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Online learning in the Spring was a failure because teachers were forced to change directions very quickly with no preparation for how to teach online. I don't see that being as much of an issue this coming year. I can tell you that the level of expectations on students will be much higher than it was in the Spring when we didn't know what Corona virus was, how to teach online, or even how to learn on line.

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my employee is in new caney isd and they started yesterday and said it was a disaster.

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How so?

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first off she had to take the day off because both parents work. second she said none of the kids would focus, the kids had problems using the computers so if a parent wasnt there itd be impossible. then she said that at one point the teacher computer logged off. how are parents supposed to do this when they work? how are kids gonna stay focused at home when they already have trouble with it at school? then when it came to the assignments, her son struggled working the computer to do the assignment. the districts are expecting children to understand technology.

Im sure its going to be the same problems for all districts. it may be better than in the spring but to realistically think the problems magically go away is shortsided at best.

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Gotcha. So the instruction wasn't the **** show. Student behavior was. Both are important and that is t meant to be a loaded statement but I see how it could come across like that.

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This is an intentionally obtuse statement. The instruction format obviously influences student behavior (and the ability to effectively control it).

They are only providing remote learning through the first three weeks, but very happy that my 3 kids will be starting school tomorrow. We have one in HS, one in MS, and one in elementary - so probably different challenges for each in doing it remotely.

Oh, wait. The school district texts at 9:20PM the night before the first day and says first two days of HS cancelled due to tech issues. Yikes. This will be a bumpy ride, but we'll make the best of it.

LOL. Leander ISD is already running into issues and school won't start for high schoolers until Monday...it was supposed to start tomorrow.

Charpie said:

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LOL. Leander ISD is already running into issues and school won't start for high schoolers until Monday...it was supposed to start tomorrow.

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Filters aren't working correctly on district issued laptops. The company that does the filters knew about it earlier in the week too. Told Leander this afternoon. Off to a great start.

Charpie said:

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Where did you see that?

A lot of these restrictions will go away once we get a vaccine.

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The cold, flu, or Covid vaccine? What goal post are we moving today?

I hate to see districts punishing kids in families that want to stay safe. They may have grandparents living in the home...but blocked from being in band unless they go to actual school buildings or blocked from trying out for the UIL spelling team...even though this time of year most band activities are out of doors where viral load is highly reduced and academic UIL events are all available for study and practice online anyway.. UIL academics has a ton of scholarship money for kids who are successful. So they are forced to opt for face to face...take this mess home and kill grandma or grandpa

And they and their parents live with the emotional trauma of this for the rest of their lives.


I am still so worried. Latest is they want to high school kids to eat in the classroom...
I felt fairly safe behind a mask AND a face shield, but now you want me to have 30 high school kids who are already crowded in shoulder to shoulder to just fit in my room...with masks OFF eating at lunch. Plus no way I can then take MY mask off to eat.

I am actually considering getting one of those soccer mom pods to put on at lunch and add one more layer of protection for me. Some teachers are building shower curtain forts around their teacher desks.

I keep praying God has this and we will stay online for a longer time. My class count is already 28 in every class and many are still registering. Last year it was 31 per class and looks to be the same. And kids had to sit at the coteacher desk because we could not get that 31st desk in and still have any space to walk TO the desks.

does the covid vaccine have to be more effective than the flu vaccine for restrictions to be lifted?