Pat Henry

2,771 Views | 33 Replies | Last: 15 yr ago by Houstonag
drewbie08
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First of all, he deserves a blue star. What he has done at A&M in his short time here has been remarkable. Build him whatever he wants, and keep the talent pouring in.

What does he do that makes his teams so successful? It's not like our teams were slouches before his arrival, but obviously he brings something to the table that pushes us over the top. Not to knock the distance folks, but if we were to have same talent in mid distance and distance events as we do in the jumps and sprints, we would be unstoppable.
S.S.Aggie
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quote:
Not to knock the distance folks, but if we were to have same talent in mid distance and distance events as we do in the jumps and sprints, we would be unstoppable.

We pour most of our money into multi-event sprinters and jumpers. There aren't enough scholarships to bring in high quality mid/long distance runners on top of what we already have. In T&F, you can't have it all. Oregon, on the other hand, focusses on the mid/long distances where they dominate.
drewbie08
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That is a good point. But a lot of the National Elite distance guys can double up in a few of the races, so you would think we could give out a couple scholarships to All-American talent on the men's and women's side.

Regardless, I wouldn't want to mess up Henry's formula, so whatever works is fine with me!
SpicewoodAg
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Keep in mind there are just 12.8 scholarships available for men and 18 for women. That includes cross country.

No one gets a full scholarship.

There are 60 names in the men's roster. That means an average of about 0.21 scholarships per male athlete.
JR69
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quote:
But a lot of the National Elite distance guys can double up in a few of the races


Not a lot - a few. And they are of no use in relays or hurdle events. Or as jumpers.
Look Out Below
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What does he do? Recruit. Period. How could you not with all his national championships? That speaks more than anything any other coach could possibly say.

I would bet a rare few have full rides. To get the truly elite athletes, you have throw that out there because everyone else you're recruiting with darn sure is.
therealnick05
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While some long distance runners can do the 5k and 10k, to be elite at both is very very tough (and there aren't many that can do it at the top level). The thing about the sprints is that you can run any combination of 100m, 200m, 400m and hurdles. Not to mention that they could also compete in relays. The thing is that there is usually very little change in the distance events. The top runners will continue to be the top runners, whereas in sprints, if you are one or two steps slower, then it makes a massive difference. Basically we focus on sprints because they can compete in more events and typically are able to find as recruits. Not to mention that the state of Texas probably produces more sprinters than long distance runners.

One of the keys to our program is that we have a spectacular coach staff (Vince Anderson, our other assistants as well as Henry) and our walk-on program is elite. Look at our list of participants and compare it to other schools (like texas in austin) and you'll see that A&M has more athletes and even more so, athletes that are REALLY good at what they do that choose to walk on. They want to work with the best coaches and even if they aren't offered a scholarship, some of them will still come because you can make a career from track as long as you have the elite training and physical abilities.
drewbie08
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All valid points on the distance topic. I haven't really gone through results, but I would have thought you could have guys that double in the 5k and 10k or 5k and 3k steeple. Those races seem more difficult to recover quickly from, which is probably why there are fewer athletes that double up. Maybe they should add a distance relay...4 x 1600 would be fun to watch and would take just a tad longer than the 5k. I also didn't realize there were so few scholarships. More points are available in the sprints, so no complaints from me.

And Henry does it simply by recruiting? That seems too easy. I mean, wanting to run under a coach with all those national championships is certainly enticing, but I would think there is also something else. If that was the case, you would think Arkansas and Oregon would win every year. My guess is that he puts something in the water...

[This message has been edited by drewbie08 (edited 6/14/2010 9:39p).]
therealnick05
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drewbie, it isn't just recruiting... it is also training. Not that we have scrubs on our team, but prior to the past two years or so, we didn't have the top recruiting classes (for men at least) and yet we have won back to back national championships for both men and women. You have to have a certain level of athlete, but then coaching can take them to the next level. Pat Henry and Vince Anderson (i think that is his name) are arguably the top 2 elite sprint coaches in the country. Others are in their level, but nobody outright exceeds them in sprints.

With the recruiting we have been doing recently and the coaching (and facilities) we already have, the only things that could hurt our chances for a few more national championships would be our elite athletes going professional or wanting to compete in the olympics.

I don't know about how/if athletes can compete in the T&F NCAA championships and also the olympics, or if that is a common thing. Unfortunately, I haven't followed track long enough to know that...
sshm
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quote:
I don't know about how/if athletes can compete in the T&F NCAA championships and also the olympics, or if that is a common thing. Unfortunately, I haven't followed track long enough to know that...
You can.

Objective Aggie
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Pat Henry
MidTnAg
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Look what Lisa Koll of Iowa State did at the Big 12 meet and the NCAA meets. She does not attend a school known for its distance runners.

It just takes one Lisa Koll to make a huge difference.
therealnick05
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True, but I assume Lisa Koll is on a full scholarship. Could we offer one Lisa Koll and hope to get her? Yes, but what if she turns out to be like most of the other top distance runners. You could be number 9 in the country and it not matter because only the top 8 score at the NCAA.

You don't just need a top tier runner, you need someone who is truly special and those people commonly go for full scholarships (because they deserve them) and sometimes there aren't enough ships to go around.

If someone wants to look up Lisa Koll's numbers in high school I figure you could find them. If they are best in the country, then you can see why she earned a full scholarship, but if she wasn't the top runner that means that whoever was the best in the country in HS underperformed in college compared to their HS expectations.

I don't think Pat Henry would turn down a surefire 20 point runner at the NCAA level no matter what events they ran. Then again, identifying those runners, recruiting them and commonly getting them to accept less than a full scholarship can be a very difficult task. Also, for a coach like Pat Henry, everyone knows he is as good as it gets at sprints and therefore he has a better eye for identifying who has the tools necessary to continue their development in college. Some kids top out in HS, others continue to get better with good coaching. And lastly, if you are a Lisa Koll, you likely want to go with a coach who will better prepare you to succeed at the NCAA level (and beyond) than a coach whose expertise is in sprints. Going to Oregon with coach Lananna would set you up with someone who knows distance running and can help you prepare for the NCAA level and beyond.

Again, I think Pat Henry clearly does a darn good job recruiting. While he could do better (as in pull in more elite distance runners), there are only so many scholarships to go around and even if you hit on all 20 womens scholarship and all 12.5 mens scholarships, unless they are scoring in multiple events or in the top 8 nationally in whatever their event, then their impact on the team is lessened. Getting it all perfect just doesn't happen, so you do the best you can and clearly Pat Henry does a darn good job of that.
coloradoag69
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This is a great discussion. I wish we had more of these.

Let me add that I've been a fan of Aggie track since I first saw Randy Matson end his A&M career at A&M with 6 70' plus shot putts followed by a couple of plus 200' discuss throws. These last several years have been the fulfillment of many up and down years.

On the practical side, I think that our focus on sprinters has geared us towards winning the outdoor NCAA championships. In doing so we've made the other two track events: indoor championships and cross country, a secondary priority. I remember at the time of the indoor championships, I was surprised that the contests were more slanted to intermediate and longer distances. I believe that's true because a several outdoor sprinting events are not run at the indoor meet. It's obvious that cross country is a large middle distance meet. Yet, I believe that the track scholarships apply to contestants in all three meets. Thus, I believe Oregon won the indoor meet and probably did very well in cross country, while A&M was close indoors and didn't qualify either the men or women's cross country team for the national meet.

So it seems it's a matter of choosing which track and field event(s) you want to try to win most as you put your teams together.

Discussion?
drewbie08
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I think it could also come down to where you want to do your long distance runs...College Station or Eugene?
cocacolaaggie68
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I would love to see us build a world class facility similar to Oregon's but the next level up to support a program that clearly shows it is the best, and then let us start hosting the NCAA T&F championships at Aggieland
SpicewoodAg
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A high school football stadium costs $20M or more.

It seems hard to imagine justifying spending that kind of money right now when we don't sell out Kyle.

I think Pat Henry is fantastic. But I'm OK with us going to Eugene or Arkansas for a while and showing people in other places how it is done. It would be very cool if year after year track fans from around the US get excited to see the Aggies come to town and run FAST.
drewbie08
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Maybe with the promised $20M a year we're getting in the Big 12-2 we could upgrade our outdoor track facilities...
AGGIE2207
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Or pay off our debt.
aggievaulter07
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As a former track athlete under Coach Henry, I figured I would drop in my 2 cents.

First of all you guys hit a big point right on the head. Recruiting and the distribution of scholarship money are huge reasons for Henry's success. His handling of scholarship money is VERY businesslike. If you come here on scholarship and aren't performing to the level that he expects, he won't hesitate to reduce, or remove your scholarship altogether and use it to bring in talent that WILL perform. This isn't common among other coaches. Many will keep their "promise" of a scholarship even if the athlete is underperforming. It is also very difficult if not almost impossible to walk-on here and "earn" a scholarship. If an athlete walks on and begins to outperform expectations, good for them, but they're already here. No need to offer them money. Henry will use the money he would have offered to go bring in more NEW talent, whereas many other coaches would feel pressured to reward the performance of exceptional walk-ons.

Just like in business, you want access to the least expensive high-quality components you can get to build your overall product.

Herein lies what I believe Henry's biggest key to success. He actually plays more of a CEO role in the program than an elite coach. Henry does the shaking hands and kissing babies and determines the overall direction of the program, while Coaches Anderson, VanHottegem, DeLaGarza, and Waters do more of the heavy lifting when it comes to the day to day coaching of technique and overall training. Don't get me wrong. Henry is involved in the coaching too, but his success is more derived from his business sense than his knowledge of angles, efficiencies, energy, diet, rest, etc.

The second major reason for Henry's success in my opinion is how his coaching staff is structured. Most other programs in the NCAA have separate Men's and Women's coaching staffs. What Henry does is have only one staff, and pay the coaches significantly more than anywhere else. This allows him to surround himself with the best assistants in the nation and pay them well enough to keep them. Each coach coaches both teams in specific event groups, ie: Jumps, Sprints, Throws, Distance, etc. The men's and women's teams practice together as a team and travel as a team. tu actually separates their teams. They don't practice together and often they don't even go to the same meets together unless it is a conference, regional, or national championship meet.

A side benefit of this setup is a more tight knit group where everyone holds the others accountable. As an example, when the girls sprint relay lines up to run, the guys are almost equally as nervous and supportive as they are for their own relay team gets ready to compete. They see each other as one big team as opposed to two separate programs. It's a bond that not a lot of programs have. Do you think the men's Aggie basketball team cares or even knows what the women's basketball team is doing? Probably not. I'm sure they are friends, but they most likely don't see each other as teammates.

Sorry to ramble, but I felt like that is another positive way that sets Henry's program apart from many others.

Hope I gave an idea of how the program really works and where I saw Henry's strengths being and how it effects the overall success of the program as a whole.

[This message has been edited by aggievaulter07 (edited 7/2/2010 10:27a).]
Aston04
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^Excellent post. Appreciate the first-hand insight.

drewbie08
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Great post. You bring up a good point with the accountability ingrained by being a single team, rather than two. I didn't realize most other schools treat the men and women as separate entities.

Also interesting on the walk-ons and under-performing athletes comments. That really is a business like approach. I can see how that could potentially irk some people, but it also is a strong motivator as well.
AGBlastoff
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drewbie, my first thought was the same as yours, that it could piss some people off. But as I think about it, maybe not.

Basically, they all must know that coming in, but if you're coming to A&M for T&F, you have higher aspirations than a little bit of scholarship money. He can kinda look at the kids and say "Look, we have the best thing going in the country right now. This is an individual sport, so you have every opportunity in the world to prove yourself. If you can't succeed in this program, then you're not going to succeed in most programs."

It may not be 100% true, but it's 95% true and makes a very good case for him. The same attitude wouldn't work as well in a team sport (like football or basketball) where you can be the victim of circumstance (playcalling, scheme, poor teammates, too good of teammates).
drewbie08
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I agree. The burden is on you to perform. Like you said, circumstance (injuries, sickness, etc.)is not as much as a factor as other team sports, and the athletes that come in now know they have extremely high standards to live up to. And while it might scare some people away, being a contributer on a National Championship team sure is enticing. With a handful of National Championships in the trophy case, I can only see even better talent rolling into College Station in the immediate future.
Aggie kith and kin
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Regarding the walk-on policy for track and field at Texas A&M...here's my take/story. Our two older children are graduates of Texas A&M, '99 and '01. They both had great experiences at A&M which prepared them well for their chosen careers. Our youngest, who graduated high school in '09 and participated in track and field, never waivered in original and only choice of wanting to attend Texas A&M. Did not even consider other offers and chose to walk-on here. Made the team with the understanding that there would be no financial aid. To this family, it was an easy choice. We wanted our youngest to also experience and earn a degree from A&M...and it is our opinion that the added experience/opportunity of being around such a quality track and field program will greatly outweigh any financial benefits received from chosing another school to attend and compete. It was amazing to observe how the first year alone was a total educational experience which will go a long way in preparing this student for the future.
aggievaulter07
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quote:
it is our opinion that the added experience/opportunity of being around such a quality track and field program will greatly outweigh any financial benefits received from chosing another school to attend and compete.


Coming from a similar experience as a recruited walk-on at A&M, I couldn't agree more. It's not about the scholarship money here. Your athlete will get to have experiences with this program that you can't get anywhere else. You didn't mention what event your child competes in, or even whether they were on the men's team or women's team, but I still have some involvement with the program and probably know who they are. They won't regret walking on here. I can assure you of that. Best of luck for them moving forward.
Aggie kith and kin
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aggievaulter07:

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I can assure you that your 'involvement with the program' tremendously helped our student athlete make the transition from high school level competition to college...especially from the stand point of confidence. We are excited about the future and thankful for the opportunity. Hope things are going well for you. Take care.
AGGIE2207
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One correction regarding coaching staffs is that virtually all programs in the NCAA are combined. In the Big 12 only Texas has seperate men's and women's programs. Arkansas also has a seperate program but teams like LSU, Florida, Oregon, Stanford, Nebraska, Oklahoma, and Tennessee have combined staffs.
aggievaulter07
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AGGIE2207,

If true I stand corrected. Our coaches made it sound like our combined setup was the exception, and not the rule, and I didn't care enough to research other programs and their coaching setup.
Brisbane Bombers
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Aggie Vaulter, many a team are set up like A&M's and those who are, now are switching...see the lady vols joining the mens program at Tenn.

I am also a former member of the Team, and agree with everything else you say and rate it as one if the best Posts I have seen on any forum, period.

As for those arguing just get one elite distance guy who can double, well they have tried that over the past 5 years, from all reports from friends still in the program it continues next year. I was one of these guys, and signed along with 2 other guys, another australian who lasted 2 months, and a kenyan who ended up at Alabama and won numerous All-American honors. You need a lot of luck with this, it is hit and miss, chances of injury are greater and it is not as simple as one man against another. The countries fastest 100m man is much more of a sure bet than the fastest 1500m.

I think the coaches stepped back from this approach for a few seasons to really focus on setting up the programs reputation by really hammering the jumps/sprints..this free's up more scholarships as you are more likely to lure top talent on coaching reputation now in these events, and hopefully use this extra budget to strengthen other event area's like distance.
drewbie08
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Does the appeal of running on a National Championship team carry over into the distance world? I think that sprinters will continue to want to come to A&M because that is what we are becoming known for. Do the distance folks start coming to A&M because they can be apart of a team known for sprints, but wins championships?
AGBlastoff
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Well, Oregon, which is a huge distance school, is now able to lure some sprinters as well. I think that eventually, it will come, but as some have said, it's a delicate thing. It's not like football, where you have 20 scholarships every year, and where it's all about convincing the best guys you can to come to your program.

It's a much more delicate balance of allocating the limited scholarships. It's like earlier when we were talking about Wayne Davis sitting out this year, and it was brought up that the coaches might not "red shirt" him, because they might be better off giving that scholarship money to lure someone who would be around for the next 4 years, and some people couldn't understand why they wouldn't redshirt a guy with the potential to be as good as Davis.
BTB2010
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Maybe it is because the A & M coaching staff has the knowledge and expertise to determine the athletes that have the capability to make it to Nationals. I seriously do not think anyone on this forum has the insight to do that. Back to Back Championships says all that needs to be said. Congrats to Coach Henry and all the coaches for another great year that put A & M at the top of the Directors's Cup! Whoop!
The Ghost of Johnny
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When Coach Waters proves that he can bring in a good high school distance runner and turn him into a great college distance runner, A&M will begin to get the big distance recruits. Until then, I do not expect much.
Houstonag
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Good job coach Henry and staff. Thanks.

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