Personally, I've always thought that moving big bouts from public TV to pay-per-view played a big role in decreasing the public awareness of the sport. That compounded by too many belts, too many divisions, and not enough coverage on the major sports outlets has killed the popularity of the sport.

And MMA hasn't helped either.

I'd be interested on any thoughts as to why these points or wrong, or what yall think might have contributed to the downfall of the sport.

I used to watch a lot of hockey before the 2004-2005 strike. Then when they came back on after the strike, the games were no longer on ESPN and I didn't have Outdoor Network. It was actually pretty funny because I could get college hockey games on some college sports channel I had access to. The only pro games you could ever get were for the closet market team.

I later moved and did not have cable for a while so I didn't watch hockey at all. When hockey started to come back on NBC I started watching it and now that I have a big sports package I watch even more games (or at least did last season). But, I still have not gotten back to the level I previously watched.

Hockey not being on tv definitely affected my interest and following of the game. I could see the same for boxing.


On another note, I know ESPN is loving having all the bowl games on its cable network, but part of me wonders if this will end up being a bad long term move for college football. They are getting more money from the arrangement now, but will they suffer long term from those fans without cable.

I think it's just cause of MMA

I'm old enough that I used to watch Ali/Frazier etc. Back in the glory days of fun and interesting heavyweights. Paid some attention through the years of Sugar Ray Leonard.

My honest answer, speaking for myself, is that I am no longer interested in sports where the sole objective is to injure the opponent. This change began roughly when I became a parent and my kids started getting active. It was highly unlikely they would ever become boxers anyway - but I decided early on that boxing was perhaps the only sport I would "disallow" my kids from participating in.

A lot of people say MMA is hurting boxing, but I don't buy it. How are they mutually exclusive? Are you telling me if MMA wasn't around that you would be more interested in boxing? Data shows otherwise as HBO Boxing still crushes UFC in PPV buys.

I think what you perceive is the UFC putting on top notch events with stacked cards every month or two, consistently making the fights that the fans want, and doing a great job marketing the sport. Stuff that is much, much easier to do when there is a single, dominant organization or promoter. As far as it hurting boxing though, nah, that's a lie the greedy promoters who are killing the sport like to say. Unfortunately, Bob Arum doesn't care about the fans or the sport. He's here to make as much money as he can right now. If he did, he'd learn a thing or two from the UFC.

Despite that fact, nothing is more compelling than boxing. At it's best, there's absolutely nothing like it. Back in 2010, you could've put Mayweather vs Pacquiao up against the Superbowl and people would've DVR'd the Superbowl and watched the fight live.

It's the old story about the guy pulling up to a red light and looking around. On one corner there's a guy playing the sax, on another corner there's some guys playing hoops, and on the other corner there's a fist fight. What is he going to look at?

What we see is the lack of interest in heavyweight boxing. This is due to the lack of top level American fighters and fact that both the current and the previous top heavyweight are extremely boring fighters to the general public - both inside and outside of the ring. For smaller guys, boxing is one of the few sports that you can earn a living at (or even still do in High School). Most big guys would rather play basketball or football and they do.

I actually enjoy the smaller guys. They are technically fantastic and really push the pace. It is comical to me how many people say they don't watch the smaller guys because they believe that they could beat them up. I'd love to watch them try.

I actually like the Klitschkos.

quote:

---

I actually like the Klitschkos.

---

I do as well. Those guys put on a boxing clinic every time in the ring. I liked Lennox Lewis too.

I know a lot of people who don't though. In terms of excitement, a prime Mike Tyson is a tough measuring stick.

If anyone wants to see a really exciting fighter, middleweight Gennady Golovkin (24-0, 21 KO) is one to watch. He is fighting Gabriel Rosado next Saturday (1/19) on HBO.

I watched a replay of that Amir Khan/Carlos Molina fight last night. Khan looked great, and I hope he gets that rematch with Danny Garcia.

The story of the fight card was the knockout Deontay Wilder put on Kelvin Price. Jeez, what a punch.

http://youtu.be/6-UnO8AF7L8?t=1m19s

6'7, 215#, 26-0 with 26 KOs, and no fight going more than 4? Monsterous.

I wish we were getting Khan-Garcia 2 instead of Garcia-Judah, but I'm confident it will happen soon.

So many good fighters at 140lbs. Brandon Rios, Juan Manuel Marquez, Khabib Allakhverdiev, Lucas Matthysse. However they match them up, we should see some great fights this year.

quote:

---

The story of the fight card was the knockout Deontay Wilder put on Kelvin Price. Jeez, what a punch.

---

This is why you NEVER move straight back when you're on the defensive and NEVER reach out to block punches.

Wilder does have crazy power. Beast!

not having a dominating American Heavyweight...imho...has killed boxing viewership in the US.

Gone are the days of Foreman, Holyfield, Tyson, Ali, Frazier.

After the Holyfield reign in the 90s...there hasn't been a dominant American heavyweight.

TMAC FTW

Lack of true champion: People want one champion. Right now, just between the IBF, WBA, WBO, and WBC, you have 6 titles. That's without another 3-4 organizations handing out belts for World Champions. Then these "champions" duck and dodge instead of unifying the belts, and in the case they do, the sanctioning bodies will strip the champion for not fighting whom is top in their rankings.

Inactivity by boxers: Boxers used to fight 6-8 times in a year, allowing a following to build. Then it became 3-4 times. Now they maybe box 2, maybe 3 times, and if you see Floyd Mayweather once, consider yourself lucky. Legecies are being created without even fighting. If you don't get to see anyone you know box, then why even watch.

Regular TV/HBO/Showtime: if there is one way to get into boxing, it's Friday Night Fights on ESPN2. Smart analysts, great color, and good fights. Otherwise, where do you go? HBO and Showtime shows are built for the boxing fan, not the casual fan. Over the Air TV has had the following in the past 20 years:
Celebrity Boxing
Tyson-McNeely
CBS had one fight like a month ago. A good fight at that. That I watched.
PPV is based around one big fight, typically overpriced, and drags on and on. I love it, but if they would just get more fights on Network TV, you'd gain more fans.

Understanding the sport: Even most boxing fans don't know **** past two people trying to punch each other into "Bolivan" Boxing gyms are fading. You can remember your high school football days, go see a high school, college, pee wee, or NFL game. You know most of the rules. That isn't around with boxing. There isn't a place to learn boxing besides hopefully locating a gym, wasting 50 bucks, or spending a Friday night at home. The more you know, the more you care.

Olympic Boxing: Ali, Sugar, Foreman: We had something to look to when our boys came home. People to follow and recognizable faces who were winners already. That changed when Roy Jones Jr. Got screwed in Seoul. They changed how it was scored indirectly leading to the Cuban dominance of Olympic Boxing. Meaning if the winners didn't defect, you'd have to wait 4 years to see them again. But the scoring changes also directly led to boring boxing. Nobody even cares to watch that crap no matter how "technically sound" it is.

Lastly, what I feel is the most important is Golden Gloves and USA Boxing are outdated. No delevopment of the American Heavyweight, Middleweight, or Lightweight. The heavyweight division is the most revered division, but lack of American contender is not valid, because there has been some and no knowledge of them. It's more so that without a sad backstory or a loud mouth, the American media refuses to get behind them.

MMA will never ever stop boxing, but boxing will kill boxing.

As far as broad appeal goes, I think (1) lack of an American heavyweight (or at least a champion that is exciting in the ring) and (2) the high cost of PPV for the big fights. I've been a huge boxing fan since I was a kid, but as a father with a stay-home-mom wife and 2 kids, there are very few fights that I deem worth paying $50-60 for when I can just wait and see them a week later on HBO. It would be awesome if the type of fights that are currently live on HBO would be on some broader platform like ESPN or network TV, and then the big fights were live on HBO. However, that ship has sailed and I don't see it ever going back.

[This message has been edited by DannyDuberstein (edited 1/15/2013 12:39p).]

They think they have PPV money hostage. Don King did this to us, and the Arums and Duvas followed suit. They stockpile all the important fights on PPV. The undercard fights would make for great network/basic cable headliners, but they don't feel they get enough money from that. Maximize the money, minimize the risk. Until a network and a couple of promotions with a good stable of fighters say "**** it lets do this" you'll continue to see them put all their eggs in one basket.

I love talking boxing..... I need more of this.

my rambling thoughts....

pay-per-view & HBO so that only a select few people can watch fights

at least 3 champions per weight class, so that nobody really knows who the real champs are

oddballs like Don King perceived as running the sport

corrupt/rigged fights, as judges rule one winner when fans think somebody else wins (scores should be shown round-by-round instead of after the fight)

other options for high-intensity sport: MMA, kick-boxing, whatever

poor kids in the US depression grew up to be boxers, and now they grow up to be soccer players in Latin America or basketball/football players in USA, so fewer US champs remain

television. tv rules sports & football/basketball can be seen numerous times and they look good on tv. Boxing can only stage a limited number of big fights for tv, whereas other sports can be on tv lots more.

part of natural changes. Same decline is seen in track-and-field overall as it's not as big a deal as it used to be.

American boxing as a whole isn't as bad as most people think. Take a look at the current issue of The Ring magazine and the US still has more ranked fighters than any other country. However, as many of you said, people's perceptions are based on the HW division.

I'm not holding my breath waiting for a great American HW to emerge, but there are some really exciting up and comers out the the UK. Some new blood would do the division some good.

For me, I don't care if a guy is American, English, Russian or Jamaican. I'll support a guy because I enjoy watching him fight. That said, I understand that ethnicity has always been a part of the the fabric of boxing and always will be.

It hasn't been like that in MMA for the most part and I really dislike how certain people (Cain Velasquez for example) are trying to bring it into the equation.

quote:

---

Inactivity by boxers: Boxers used to fight 6-8 times in a year, allowing a following to build. Then it became 3-4 times. Now they maybe box 2, maybe 3 times, and if you see Floyd Mayweather once, consider yourself lucky. Legecies are being created without even fighting. If you don't get to see anyone you know box, then why even watch.

---

I think the rules for some of the gaming/athletic commissions now require a certain layoff between bouts before they'll give a license. Could be wrong on that.

I think this is a problem, too.

Strawweight....................................................................................................... up to 105 lbs.
Light-Flyweight........................................................................................ over 105 to 108 lbs.
Flyweight.................................................................................................. over 108 to 112 lbs.
Super Flyweight....................................................................................... over 112 to 115 lbs.
Bantamweight.......................................................................................... over 115 to 118 lbs.
Super Bantamweight................................................................................ over 118 to 122 lbs.
Featherweight........................................................................................... over 122 to 126 lbs.
Super Featherweight................................................................................. over 126 to 130 lbs.
Lightweight.............................................................................................. over 130 to 135 lbs.
Super Lightweight.................................................................................... over 135 to 140 lbs.
Welterweight............................................................................................ over 140 to 147 lbs.
Super Welterweight.................................................................................. over 147 to 154 lbs.
Middleweight........................................................................................... over 154 to 160 lbs.
Super Middleweight................................................................................. over 160 to 168 lbs.
Light-heavyweight................................................................................... over 168 to 175 lbs.
Cruiserweight........................................................................................... over 175 to 195 lbs.
Heavyweight................................................................................................... all over 195 lbs.


that's a ton of divisions.

The layoff is typically 90 days and that's only if a fighter is stopped.

I'd like to see champions and big name guys fight 2x per year, but it's understandable why they don't. Marvin Hagler said it best:

"It's real hard to get up at 5am & run five miles when you're in a four post bed wearing silk pajamas."


I agree on the weight divisions, they're nothing more than a cash grab from promoters who want more "championship" fights.

I'd love boxing to go back to 8 divisions. It would literally do wonders for the sport.

Great card on HBO tonight! Hope some of you guys watch it.