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Texags Classic Movie: 12 Angry Men

2,045 Views | 27 Replies | Last: 6 mo ago by Lathspell
Brian Earl Spilner
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AG
So we did this for Lawrence of Arabia a while back and I guess I forgot to ever do another one. (Thanks AgBQ for the reminder.)

Looked at my watchlist and this has been on there forever. One of the big holes in my classic movie watch history.

It is ranked #5 on IMDb and 100% on RT.

It's currently streaming on Prime Video, and for free on Tubi and Pluto TV, so easily accessible to all posters who care to watch.

So whoever is interested, give the movie a watch before Monday, and then we can jump in here and discuss our thoughts.

If anyone who's seen it already cares post about it before then, feel free, but please no spoilers before Monday.

Looking forward to discussing.
jokershady
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AG
Are you referring to the original or the remake?

Because honestly both are incredibly awesome! The remake is pretty much shot for shot and line for line re-done but they picked the perfect cast for the remake:

Courtney B Vance
Ossie Davis
George C Scott
James Gandolfini
Tony Danza
Jack Lemmon
Edward James Olmos

There's other actors I don't recognize but man everyone is nails for the remake…
Brian Earl Spilner
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I didn't even know there was a remake.

This is for the original of course. (1957)
Head Ninja In Charge
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One more terrific version to consider is the "Nine Pretty Darn Angry Men" episode of King of the Hill.
jokershady
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AG
Is that the one regarding the lawnmower?
AgBQ-00
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In. Have seen it but it's been years. Looking forward to it
God loves you so much He'll meet you where you are. He also loves you too much to allow to stay where you are.

We sing Hallelujah! The Lamb has overcome!
jokershady
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Brian Earl Spilner said:

I didn't even know there was a remake.

This is for the original of course. (1957)
Cool. Keep it to the original.

But yeah the remake is strong. Wouldn't go so far to say it's better than the original but it's a fun watch.
rhutton125
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Watched this in high school criminal justice class, one of the few good ones they put on.
Brian Earl Spilner
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Bump for the weekend crowd.
toucan82
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I'm a fan of movies that mostly take place in one location
Claude!
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Greatly superior to the prequel, 40 Irritated Gents in Voir Dire
surfandturfsbisa96
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Brian Earl Spilner said:

So we did this for Lawrence of Arabia a while back and I guess I forgot to ever do another one. (Thanks AgBQ for the reminder.)

Looked at my watchlist and this has been on there forever. One of the big holes in my classic movie watch history.

It is ranked #5 on IMDb and 100% on RT.

It's currently streaming on Prime Video, and for free on Tubi and Pluto TV, so easily accessible to all posters who care to watch.

So whoever is interested, give the movie a watch before Monday, and then we can jump in here and discuss our thoughts.

If anyone who's seen it already cares post about it before then, feel free, but please no spoilers before Monday.

Looking forward to discussing.
Great movie! It's hard to see Cobb in another movie and not assume he's going to be a jerk. Lots of subtle moments in this one that make you think.
Quad Dog
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Thanks for picking this. It had been forever since I'd seen it. Amazing movie. I watched the 1957 version. Probably had a great double meaning at the time coming off McCarthyism.

One woman in background of opening establishing shot, not a single woman speaks in this movie. Even though there is a women's bathroom door off the juror room.

No character names just the juror numbers until the very end.

Interesting camera work. Long uncut takes from a single position that pans and zooms around almost as if we are in the room with them or this is a play. The opening in the juror room is one very long take. Sometimes with jurors waking in and out of frame with the main speaker in the background. Sometimes looking directly into the camera. Sidney Lumet's first movie. Create a sense of claustrophobia.

Such good writing. The way the jurors tell you the accused's backstory and exposition also tells you about their character at the same time.

With modern DNA and evidence handling,etc. pretty crazy they allowed the jurors to touch and handle the murder weapon.

The ad man juror is joking about the invention of corporate buzz words "let's run it up the flag pole and see"

The baseball ticket juror brags about making 27 grand selling marmalade. That's 300,000 in today's dollars.

Cold line from the immigrant: why am I so polite? For the same reason you are not, because of the way I was raised

I think my favorite moment is then all turning their backs on the racist juror.

You think the person that cleaned up the jury room later found it odd that there was an open switchblade matching the murder weapon in there?
Brian Earl Spilner
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I meant to post this morning but got sidetracked at work...

Watched this on Saturday afternoon, and man.... what an absolutely fantastic movie.

It's amazing how riveting a movie with 12 men talking in a single room for 90 minutes can be. It does such a great job of painting the picture of the crime, but beyond that, of developing every one of our jurors, fleshing out their backstories and prejudices just enough to understand why they are leaning guilty or not guilty.

Obviously every performance was fantastic, but Henry Fonda really hit it out of the park. That may be one of the best performances I've ever seen. I am very surprised this movie didn't garner a single acting nomination at the Oscars.

Other than him, my favorite character was probably Juror #2. He's very steadfast in his opinion, but is also quick to consider all the arguments that Juror #8 brings up. (Recognized this actor as the president from Superman 78. It was really bugging me until I decided to google it. Also learned that the juror who's impatient to get to the Yankees game was the grandpa from Problem Child, which blew my mind.)

Overall, thought the praise this movie gets is absolutely warranted. Glad I finally watched it.

So does everyone think the kid was guilty? My take is he's very likely guilty, but the jurors made the "right" choice because reasonable doubt did exist. Which I suppose was the point the movie was making in the end.

Or do you guys think he was actually not guilty, the knife did in fact fall through his pocket, and he did see a movie that night?
Brian Earl Spilner
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Quote:

Cold line from the immigrant: why are you so polite? For the same reason you are not, because of the way I was raised
Loved this line.
Claude!
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I'd always gone with the assumption that the kid was not guilty because he was found not guilty, but I think you're right that part of the point of the movie wasn't about guilt or innocence, but about reasonable doubt. The jurors wound up with reasonable doubt so found him not guilty, regardless of whether he was innocent or not.
Quad Dog
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Quote:

does everyone think the kid was guilty? My take is he's very likely guilty, but the jurors made the "right" choice because reasonable doubt did exist. Which I suppose was the point the movie was making in the end


Not a lawyer, but pretty sure it should be a mistrial for introducing evidence not presented in court. The vision of the neighbor and the uniqueness of the knife.
Chipotlemonger
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Rewatched this movie tonight. Had seen it once years ago. It holds up well and I highly recommend the watch! Another benefit is the shorter time should make it easily accessible to all.

One thing I didn't remember was how funny the Baltimore sports line was at the beginning. Got a big chuckle out of that. It was also masterful acting and writing all around in this movie. That Baltimore reference came up about an hour later in an offhand comment in a subtle way.

I also loved how the movie moved among the people, even though they were all so close physically in that room. Someone mentioned it earlier but it really makes you feel like you're in there with them.
AgBQ-00
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Was finally able to do a rewatch last night.
1st thought that hit me. I didn't remember Jack Klugman (Quincey M.E.) was in this movie until I started watching it again.
The camera work was fantastic. I'm still trying to figure out what the direct on shots of the old man were about. They almost had a fish-eye quality to them. Maybe it was a signal to note a shift in momentum of the deliberation. A couple of instances that came off as a play vs a movie i.e. the scene when the prejudiced man was shunned with everyone leaving the table and turning their backs on him.
I think my favorite character was the immigrant. Started off idealistic and almost naive to the process going on. Then realized he had to fight for his beliefs in even the most serious situations like deliberating about a verdict. He had some of the best lines in the movie.
Klugman's character was fantastic as well.
The jury foreman did a great job. The polo with a tie outfit made me chuckle.
The building of tension and the building heat leading up to the catharsis of the thunderstorm was very well played. I could feel the temp in the room lowering as the rain started. Love when movies do that and you actually can feel the changes like that.
Not sure if the guy got off with committing the murder or not. My wife asked part way through "Do we find out who did it?" It made me smile. I told her "It's not that type of movie. All they are trying to do is come to a verdict." She was messing with something else while I watched but was paying attention the whole time. She thinks the kid did do it though
This movie again made me think about jury duty in general. I've always been sad about the fact that it is almost always made up of people who couldn't find their way out of it. Understandable as that is, it is also an indictment about our attitude towards civic duties. Fantastic movie. So glad to have these threads going again. Hopefully more will follow.
God loves you so much He'll meet you where you are. He also loves you too much to allow to stay where you are.

We sing Hallelujah! The Lamb has overcome!
Head Ninja In Charge
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toucan82 said:

I'm a fan of movies that mostly take place in one location
The last one that I remember that received some semblance of acclaim was the Hateful Eight. They're basically stage plays on screen. I'm sure there were other great ones after this, but that's the first one that comes to mind.

Agreed though. If done well, all you need is good writing and good actors.
agdoc2001
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One of the greatest films of all time. I had an amazing history teacher in high school who loved this movie and referenced it continually. He finally set up to show it in class and, of course, there were lots of silly comments and cutting up over the 1st 10 minutes. By midway through, everyone was dead silent and staring at the TV - no one was sleeping or doing other homework. It takes something special to capture the attention of 25 sixteen year old idiots, especially in black and white.
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Joan Wilder
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I love Klugman's (Juror 5) facial expressions and acting as he's processing the information, turning to the guy on his left and saying, "you know, I don't think she could have seen it" - it's a small moment, and you see it all on his face as he's thinking it through. It's a small moment but a master class of acting.
vwbug
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Great preview of jury at all of the Karen read trials
Prosperdick
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Quote:

Also learned that the juror who's impatient to get to the Yankees game was the grandpa from Problem Child, which blew my mind.)
You don't know Jack Warden...that dude is a legend. The Verdict, Being There, And Justice For All, Heaven Can Wait, All The President's Men and on and on.

If you haven't seen any of the movies I mentioned they should be next on your list, especially The Verdict since this thread is about a courtroom drama (although you never see it). Paul Newman is incredible in it.
Brian Earl Spilner
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Can't say I've seen any of those...but I have seen Problem Child 2.

Brian Earl Spilner
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I joke, but this movie did have kind of a stacked cast. It introduced me to John Ritter and Lorraine Newman, two comedy legends in their own right.

And Gilbert Gottfried, a...comedian.
13 - 0
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Claude! said:

I'd always gone with the assumption that the kid was not guilty because he was found not guilty, but I think you're right that part of the point of the movie wasn't about guilt or innocence, but about reasonable doubt. The jurors wound up with reasonable doubt so found him not guilty, regardless of whether he was innocent or not.
In Scotland there are three possible verdicts: Innocent, Guilty or "We know you did it, but we can't prove it". Hence the phrase "Got off Scot Free".
Lathspell
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agdoc2001 said:

One of the greatest films of all time. I had an amazing history teacher in high school who loved this movie and referenced it continually. He finally set up to show it in class and, of course, there were lots of silly comments and cutting up over the 1st 10 minutes. By midway through, everyone was dead silent and staring at the TV - no one was sleeping or doing other homework. It takes something special to capture the attention of 25 sixteen year old idiots, especially in black and white.
We also watched this my Junior year of high school, sometime around 2003-2004. I remember being cynical about having to watch a black and white movie. 10 minutes into the movie and I was enthralled by the story and characters.

Definitely deserves the hype it gets.
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