Protests in Turkey

4,337 Views | 39 Replies | Last: 9 mo ago by AtticusMatlock
nortex97
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7:17a, 3/23/25
AG
It feels like there was a possibility of a revolution a few years ago, but is this going to happen/force a real change this time?

As with Syria, and Libya/Iraq before that, I'm not a big fan of the guy running it, but wonder what outcome would be most likely? They are facing rampant stagflation (of around 50%/year) while spending huge (comparative) sums on weapons/war (including in Syria). Reasons for Euro/American skepticism:
Quote:
And let us not forget the immigration mess. Turkey has long played gatekeeper to Europe's borders, holding millions of migrants as a bargaining chip. The 2016 EU-Turkey deal was meant to fix this, but Ankara's selective enforcement opening the floodgates for leverage has fuelled Europe's illegal immigration woes. A security partner shouldn't wield your weaknesses as a weapon, yet here we are.

What about Ukraine then? Turkey's stance is a masterclass in ambivalence. While it sells drones to Kyiv, Ankara refuses to join the EU's sanctions on Russia. This isn't principled neutrality, but opportunism. Contrast this with the EU's firm stand against Russian aggression, and you see a gap very difficult to bridge. A security partner must share your enemies, not flirt with them.

Consider, too, the latest crackdown shaking Turkey's faade of democracy. Turkish police have just arrested Istanbul Mayor Ekrem Imamoglu, Erdogan's most formidable rival, on charges of corruption and alleged terrorist ties, effectively barring him from the presidential race. The rule of law in Turkey is a hollow shell, hardly the mark of a stable ally the EU can lean on in times of crisis.

None of this is to say Turkey lacks strengths. Its military is powerful, its location unmatched, its diplomacy outstanding and its industrial capabilities robust. But strengths don't make a partner trust does. And trust is precisely what Ankara has spent decades eroding, from Cyprus to Syria, from the Mediterranean to the migrant routes and beyond.
Not a minor scene:


This could have a huge impact on both Ukraine and Syria, and of course Europe.
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Fightin_Aggie
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In reply to nortex97 • 7:21a, 3/23/25
AG
nortex97 said:



This could have a huge impact on both Ukraine and Syria, and of course Europe.
Also NATO. Turkey is the only Muslim country that is a member

Turkey also has a lot of advanced US weapons, they even have trainees at are most advanced war schools
The world needs mean tweets

My Pronouns Ultra and MAGA

Trump 2024
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ts5641
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7:31a, 3/23/25
If we're not hearing much from the MSM about it then you can conclude these protests are a good thing and could lead to more freedom and liberty. These are antithetical to left wing values.
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P.H. Dexippus
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7:50a, 3/23/25
AG
So now arresting the opposition on false pretenses to try to sideline him from the presidential race doesn't make a good diplomatic partner?
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nortex97
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In reply to ts5641 • 7:55a, 3/23/25
AG
Valid point.
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HollywoodBQ
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7:58a, 3/23/25
AG
Interesting Turkiye fact (and I don't know when or why they stopped being Turkey).

My Russian friend was telling me that the use of Turkish Airlines has become the #1 choice for Russians due to countries restricting Russian airlines from flying over Europe.

So basically the most international flights out of Moscow now, are to Istanbul and then they connect to the rest of the world on Turkish Airlines.
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Aggie Spirit
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8:12a, 3/23/25
AG
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.
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agent-maroon
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In reply to nortex97 • 8:34a, 3/23/25
AG
Thanks for posting this. I had no idea anything was going down in Turkey and it's always good to see erdogan struggling to maintain power.

Just spit balling here, but is there any chance russia is supporting the protests in an effort to have Turkish leadership that's more friendly to allowing warship access to the Black Sea?
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Dave Robicheaux
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In reply to ts5641 • 8:35a, 3/23/25
AG
ts5641 said:
If we're not hearing much from the MSM about it then you can conclude these protests are a good thing and could lead to more freedom and liberty. These are antithetical to left wing values.


We'll see
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nortex97
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In reply to Aggie Spirit • 8:36a, 3/23/25
AG
There are around a couple million Turks in Germany as well, who are…reliable leftist voters and if looked at in isolation are probably the reason the AfD isn't part of the new majority coalition.

His RPP is hardly 'conservative' by American standards but I think they want Erdogan out mainly and did very well in 2024. They've also gotten X to suspend a bunch of protest-related opposition accounts.

To the above poster, I think Turkish Airlines changed their name back after briefly switching. They also have a huge new airport in Istanbul which is trying to rival the Middle East 3 airlines for grabbing pax flying to/from India etc.

Not sure if this is right:
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General Jack D. Ripper
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8:53a, 3/23/25
They appear to be protesting the arrest of Ergodan's political rival, the former mayor of Istanbul. He is a social democrat that supports Kemalist ideals. Kemalists follow the political values of Turkey's founder, Mustafa Kemal Ataturk.

Ataturk shook off the Arab and extreme Muslim practices in Turkey. Turks are not Arabs. He outlawed the hijab and pushed for western values. While many considered him a "benevolent" dictator, one cannot ignore the Armenian genocide, where a possible 1.2 million lost their lives. Of course, we saw the strategic importance of Turkey and ignored it completely.

I grew up in Turkey, and while I wasn't a Turk, it feels like my childhood home. I was shocked the last time I visited with so many women in hijabs. Erdogan has a very tight grip of the country and has the support of the Islamists. So, I'd imagine these protests get shut down very quickly unless the military follows their constitutional mandate of overthrowing the government.
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YouBet
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8:53a, 3/23/25
AG
Leftists like to gaslight about Trump being a fascist and wanna be dictator. Go look at Erdogan. There's your guy for this. He wants the Ottoman Empire back. Might actually be a good thing if it put a muzzle on the rest of the ME.

Many believed he set that coup up in order to smoke out his remaining rivals and to put a nail in the coffin of Turkeys secular first governing mentality. He was moving the country back towards embracing Islam and he's an economic dumbass to boot.
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Get Off My Lawn
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In reply to Aggie Spirit • 8:55a, 3/23/25
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.
They're at that nexus of Eastern Europe, northern Middle East, and western Russia. They'll be a misfit in any alliance. And I don't begrudge them from working with Russia (the largest strategic neighbor) because any nation in proximity needs to talk with and coordinate with that type of entity. What I do begrudge is their hard veer toward islam. Thats a poisoned pill that can't be unswallowed.
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nortex97
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In reply to Get Off My Lawn • 9:15a, 3/23/25
AG
They're also (again) going to get the F-35 apparently.

Bad Trump? If Erdogan-Trump did in fact talk yesterday and nothing about this but Trump's take away was just 'warming' relationship it was a failure as to American interests, imho. Of course, I have no idea if that…is what happened. The call might have been last week, before the arrests/protests etc.

Personally, I'm more in agreement with Erik Prince:

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HollywoodBQ
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In reply to General Jack D. Ripper • 9:15a, 3/23/25
AG
Solid post. Thanks for sharing.
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HollywoodBQ
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In reply to nortex97 • 9:17a, 3/23/25
AG
My point about the Russia - Turkish Airlines connection was that while everyone is trying to punish Russia, those actions are benefitting Turkey.
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bam02
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9:29a, 3/23/25
AG
What are Turkey-EC relations?
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Street Fighter
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In reply to Aggie Spirit • 9:42a, 3/23/25
AG
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.


No.member of NATO is reliable, except maybe Poland.
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YouBet
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In reply to bam02 • 9:47a, 3/23/25
AG
bam02 said:
What are Turkey-EC relations?
Pretty rocky.
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YouBet
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In reply to ts5641 • 9:52a, 3/23/25
AG
ts5641 said:
If we're not hearing much from the MSM about it then you can conclude these protests are a good thing and could lead to more freedom and liberty. These are antithetical to left wing values.
FTR, the WSJ is reporting it on its front page.
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74OA
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10:49a, 3/23/25
AG
Turkey still in turmoil.

"Huge crowds gathered outside Istanbul City Hall the fourth night of demonstrations over Imamoglu's arrest. Organizers said around 300,000 protesters took part, many waving red Turkish flags and unfurling angry banners reading: "Dictators are cowards!"

ARREST
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to Aggie Spirit • 11:13a, 3/23/25
AG
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.


And he converted the Hagia Sophia into a mosque.
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txwxman
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11:35a, 3/23/25
OP invested a lot of time and energy writing a solid post. Then y'all had to piss on it with "MSM!", "libs!", and other garbage.
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P.H. Dexippus
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 9:25p, 3/23/25
AG
CrackerJackAg said:
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.


And he converted the Hagia Sophia into a mosque.

Too bad the British navy stopped the Russian army at the gates of Istanbul 150 years ago.
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General Jack D. Ripper
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 9:35p, 3/23/25
CrackerJackAg said:
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.


And he converted the Hagia Sophia into a mosque.


Erdogan? Man, they converted that to a mosque in the 15th century. I've visited it both in the 80s and about 10 years ago. The Christian images, such as Mary and Jesus are still there.
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Jugstore Cowboy
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In reply to nortex97 • 9:50p, 3/23/25
AG

Quote:
They also have a huge new airport in Istanbul which is trying to rival the Middle East 3 airlines for grabbing pax flying to/from India etc.
I noticed for a few years now that whenever I look up flights from Houston to central Europe, Turkish Air is usually the cheapest option. All flights require an overnight in Istanbul. So I figured they expanded the airport to try to snag more tourist dollars in Instanbul.
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Gaw617
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9:55p, 3/23/25
Erdagon is not going to allow the protests to hurt is power. He wants to bring back some form of the Ottoman Empire. He was behind the Syria revolution and with Iran weakened he sees this as his time.
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Aggie97
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In reply to General Jack D. Ripper • 11:19p, 3/23/25
AG
General Jack D. Ripper said:
CrackerJackAg said:
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.


And he converted the Hagia Sophia into a mosque.


Erdogan? Man, they converted that to a mosque in the 15th century. I've visited it both in the 80s and about 10 years ago. The Christian images, such as Mary and Jesus are still there.


Ataturk converted into a museum in the 30's. It stayed that way until Erdogan changed it.
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nortex97
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In reply to Gaw617 • 4:55a, 3/24/25
AG
I think that's clearly his intent now, but the de stability is not something he can just order to stop via brutality and arrests.

It's the economics that underlay the mob's anger, imho.


This wasn't just 'one year' of 50% inflation, and their monetary/industrial situation is precarious right now, to say the least. And, fwiw, he arguably won via fraud last time.
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to P.H. Dexippus • 5:04a, 3/24/25
AG
P.H. Dexippus said:
CrackerJackAg said:
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.


And he converted the Hagia Sophia into a mosque.

Too bad the British navy stopped the Russian army at the gates of Istanbul 150 years ago.


Could have done more after WW1 too
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YouBet
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In reply to Jugstore Cowboy • 7:47a, 3/24/25
AG
Jugstore Cowboy said:

Quote:
They also have a huge new airport in Istanbul which is trying to rival the Middle East 3 airlines for grabbing pax flying to/from India etc.
I noticed for a few years now that whenever I look up flights from Houston to central Europe, Turkish Air is usually the cheapest option. All flights require an overnight in Istanbul. So I figured they expanded the airport to try to snag more tourist dollars in Instanbul.


A few years ago they went all-in with the vision of becoming one of the biggest airlines in the world and wanted to be THE European airline due to their geographic vantage. As someone else mentioned, they sit at the crossroads of Europe, Asia, and the ME.
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nortex97
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In reply to YouBet • 7:56a, 3/24/25
AG
Yep. It's actually supposed to be a pleasant airline to travel on (And will have over 500 aircraft this year, eyeing growing to over 800 by mid 2030's), and I'd consider it even as I still have Constantinople on the bucket list (Justinian walls, Hagia Sophia etc).

I'd definitely keep my trap shut though, while there, as I have zero interest in seeing a Turkish prison up close…
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LMCane
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In reply to nortex97 • 7:59a, 3/24/25
Erdogan is the worst and much of Turkey is heavily Sunni Islamist fundamentalist not much different than ISIS

they want to reestablish the Ottoman Turkish Empire which ruled most of the Middle East and Persia
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nortex97
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In reply to LMCane • 8:09a, 3/24/25
AG
I certainly hope none of my comments appeared to 'white knight' for Erdogan. I think he went after the islamicist segment of his 'electorate' (and, oh btw, military) when he lost a lot of the 'centrist' folks. That's also why he converted the Hagia Sophia back to a mosque (and went after/confiscated thousands old/ancient monastery/church properties over the past 10 years).


I'd post more, but it pisses me off too much.
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titan
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In reply to General Jack D. Ripper • 10:06a, 3/24/25
S
General Jack D. Ripper said:
CrackerJackAg said:
Aggie Spirit said:
Let's see...

Turkey bought the S-400 system from Russia.
Turkey facilitated the takeover of Syria by HTS
Erdogan calls Israel a "terror state"

Under Erdogan, Turkey is easily the most unreliable member of NATO.


And he converted the Hagia Sophia into a mosque.


Erdogan? Man, they converted that to a mosque in the 15th century. I've visited it both in the 80s and about 10 years ago. The Christian images, such as Mary and Jesus are still there.
No, you are a bit out of date if what have heard is true. You are forgetting that Turkey itself made it into the museum you visited. It was no longer a mosque. What has happened is that Erdogan has set in motion the steps to make it a mosque again, not a museum. That may or may not have already happened --- the Blue Mosque has tours and is operational so it may be a half-way measure. But that is what the online posts are griping about in the Orthodox community with cause. They may not have yet vandalized or removed the images, but they are at greater risk now.
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