Over the flood response.
https://www.kxan.com/news/local/austin/austin-firefighters-union-93-voted-no-confidence-in-chief-over-flood-response/

Austin media portraying it as racist. They only focused on what Charlie Cook said about a DEI hire and not what the firefighters said.

techno-ag said:

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The Fall Guy said:

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Over the flood response.
https://www.kxan.com/news/local/austin/austin-firefighters-union-93-voted-no-confidence-in-chief-over-flood-response/

Austin media portraying it as racist. They only focused on what Charlie Cook said about a DEI hire and not what the firefighters said.

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Quote:

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The post went on to say, "This is not about politics. It's about accountability and protecting public safety."

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That's key right there. Public safety should have zilch to do with skin color.

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Yep but the TV media goes right into Charlie Kirk not asking the actual firefighters who are white, black, Hispanic, and Asian. Put all those firefighters to defend themselves because they were labeled racists.

Quote:

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[color=#000000][size=3]Let's be honest here. There's enough firefighters on the payroll in Austin that they could send a significant number for a couple days and still cover the city in whole.[/size][/color]

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Agree. And those covering for other firefighters on deployment are getting overtime.

If at first you don't succeed, play the "R card".

jt2hunt said:

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zephyr88 said:

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It's a no-win situation, regardless of whether this was a DEI hire or not.

Austin is 100 miles away from Kerrville.

Let's just pretend that Fire Chief sends a significant number of the firemen to Kerr County and there's a fire in Austin where even a single person dies. He would be eviscerated for sending out taxpayer resources to outlying counties and be demanded to resign in shame.

Sounds more like (a) a beef that 93% of the department already had in place and this was the first and/or best opportunity for them to voice their opinions, (b) classic virtue signaling, or (c) both.

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Let's be honest here. There's enough firefighters on the payroll in Austin that they could send a significant number for a couple days and still cover the city in whole.

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Yep, at any one time there are probably almost as many off duty as on duty, depending on how they handle their shifts.

*Charlie Kirk

zephyr88 said:

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It's a no-win situation, regardless of whether this was a DEI hire or not.

Austin is 100 miles away from Kerrville.

Let's just pretend that Fire Chief sends a significant number of the firemen to Kerr County and there's a fire in Austin where even a single person dies. He would be eviscerated for sending out taxpayer resources to outlying counties and be demanded to resign in shame.

Sounds more like (a) a beef that 93% of the department already had in place and this was the first and/or best opportunity for them to voice their opinions, (b) classic virtue signaling, or (c) both.

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Agreed, Fire chiefs reasoning: " "I was not sure how much of the weather would impact my city the city of Austin. I need to make sure that I have an adequate amount of resources within the city so I can respond for my mutual aid calls and my automatic aid calls around the city of Austin,"

one safe place said:

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jt2hunt said:

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zephyr88 said:

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It's a no-win situation, regardless of whether this was a DEI hire or not.

Austin is 100 miles away from Kerrville.

Let's just pretend that Fire Chief sends a significant number of the firemen to Kerr County and there's a fire in Austin where even a single person dies. He would be eviscerated for sending out taxpayer resources to outlying counties and be demanded to resign in shame.

Sounds more like (a) a beef that 93% of the department already had in place and this was the first and/or best opportunity for them to voice their opinions, (b) classic virtue signaling, or (c) both.

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Let's be honest here. There's enough firefighters on the payroll in Austin that they could send a significant number for a couple days and still cover the city in whole.

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Yep, at any one time there are probably almost as many off duty as on duty, depending on how they handle their shifts.

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When The Hubs was there, 24 hours on, 48 hours off with shift changes at noon.

zephyr88 said:

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It's a no-win situation, regardless of whether this was a DEI hire or not.

Austin is 100 miles away from Kerrville.

Let's just pretend that Fire Chief sends a significant number of the firemen to Kerr County and there's a fire in Austin where even a single person dies. He would be eviscerated for sending out taxpayer resources to outlying counties and be demanded to resign in shame.

Sounds more like (a) a beef that 93% of the department already had in place and this was the first and/or best opportunity for them to voice their opinions, (b) classic virtue signaling, or (c) both.

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This completely ignores how things work. I don't know whether Austin is on the 24/48 or 48/72 system, but most fire departments have specific houses that contain special units that are prepared for things like water rescue. They have the boats, training, etc. Inside that house are at least 3 shifts and there are additional personnel all over the city that have trained in that area or served at that house -- or perhaps at a different department. He could have sent many personnel without any coverage issues in Austin.

Quote:

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[color=#000000][size=3]This completely ignores how things work. I don't know whether Austin is on the 24/48 or 48/72 system, but most fire departments have specific houses that contain special units that are prepared for things like water rescue. They have the boats, training, etc. Inside that house are at least 3 shifts and there are additional personnel all over the city that have trained in that area or served at that house -- or perhaps at a different department. He could have sent many personnel without any coverage issues in Austin.[/size][/color]

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AFD is 24/48. And most are cross trained for different missions.

P.U.T.U said:

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They had zero confidence in the chief and city counsel before. They are trying to use this to kick him out which I don't blame them. When Baker was first hired he said his top priority was to hire fire fighters based on the skin color of their neighborhood they served in. Another was placing priority of skin color over competency.

He was a DEI hire, just like he was in Atlanta. Sadly this is common for big cities.

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Yeah for whatever reason firefighting does not seem to attract minorities or women to fill those roles so it's been a big diversity target for a while now.

Unions have outlived their original purpose. Now, it is we don't like a decision the brass made, so we are going to ***** and moan until we get our way.

Krazykat said:

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Unions have outlived their original purpose. Now, it is we don't like a decision the brass made, so we are going to ***** and moan until we get our way.

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Bull***** This turkey just took the biggest test of his career and failed it. There is no coming back from this.

Sounds like Austin is full of racists.

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[color=#000000][size=3]Yeah for whatever reason firefighting does not seem to attract minorities or women to fill those roles so it's been a big diversity target for a while now.[/size][/color]

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Need physical strength and stamina. Plus have to pass drug tests and background checks. It is not for lack of trying to recruit minorities, it is finding suitable candidates that is the issue.

AFD has an entire recruiting department with a budget of over two million per year and they do outreach all over the country.

Ferg said:

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Krazykat said:

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Unions have outlived their original purpose. Now, it is we don't like a decision the brass made, so we are going to ***** and moan until we get our way.

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Bull***** This turkey just took the biggest test of his career and failed it. There is no coming back from this.

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Public Safety unions have limited power to manipulate situations. Before the citizens voted them to have meet and confer most AFD members had to work second jobs to make ends meet. They didn't get any decent wages until collective bargaining was allowed. They gave up pieces of civil service protection to get competitive wages.

They can't strike or anything to manipulate a contract. The union is basically powerless. Just a unified voice.

I use to think this way. Even after getting into firefighting I was strongly anti-union. I still believe they have strayed from their original path, but the IAFF has made some positive changes for firefighters. Changes that wouldn't happen without a unified voice.

Firefighting is unique in that most just can't up and leave to another fire job. Time invested in the department means a higher wage. Moving departments means starting over at the bottom, assuming you aren't too old to get hired since civil service departments have a strive 36 years old cut off. There are very few lateral moves available to firefighters. A union is the only way the group can affect change. I'd bet every last penny I have that the flood fiasco isn't the first thing this chief has misplayed, but it's probably the most public.

When I first read about this a couple things came to mind:

1. It really pissed me off when libs were trying to make things political especially when victims are still missing. We can't do the same thing we were just criticizing and saying was too soon/off limits.

2. If I read correctly the request went out July 2nd. I found a request for swift water rescue elements to be pretty damning. If plans like that were being made then why couldn't law enforcement cars have been pre-positioned near camp entrances and strategic locations along the river?

The guy may suck simply because of his DEI tendencies and I won't argue with that. But there's something about this that reeks of inconsistency.

Assets were prepositioned in an area. Nobody had any idea where the flood would occur. Only that there was a good chance of a flood in the area.

Had this specific rain event occurred just a few miles away from where it did, it would be a totally different story.

Also, it's pretty common practice so pre-stage assets when there are conditions favorable to a potential threat. They put them in a location where they would be safe during a weather event and that they could then deploy to wherever the need was in the region.

It may not be misplaced blame to go after the fire chief guy in this case. However, it seems like blaming someone for not providing an ounce of cure when so many more ounces could have been applied to prevention. At the point swift water rescues come into play you're already losing a great many of people.

This is all hindsight at this point. I do get that.

I'm not defending anyone or their actions. I got the feeling a while back that the Chief's not well liked among the firefighters.

I think the union saw an opportunity to take a shot...

why does this not fall under the umbrella of "politicizing the floods/deaths"

how is this any different from the libs yelling about meetings where folks didnt fund alert systems?

deddog said:

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zephyr88 said:

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It's a no-win situation, regardless of whether this was a DEI hire or not.

Austin is 100 miles away from Kerrville.

Let's just pretend that Fire Chief sends a significant number of the firemen to Kerr County and there's a fire in Austin where even a single person dies. He would be eviscerated for sending out taxpayer resources to outlying counties and be demanded to resign in shame.

Sounds more like (a) a beef that 93% of the department already had in place and this was the first and/or best opportunity for them to voice their opinions, (b) classic virtue signaling, or (c) both.

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Agreed, Fire chiefs reasoning: " "I was not sure how much of the weather would impact my city the city of Austin. I need to make sure that I have an adequate amount of resources within the city so I can respond for my mutual aid calls and my automatic aid calls around the city of Austin,"

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I am trying not to take sides one way or the other. I don't know enough to say. Kerrville public officials are being dragged by some of the media at the moment too. Keep in mind Lake Travis absorbed a lot of water in the Colorado River watershed from that same storm that hit Kerrville. Who is to say they held back because they anticipated need in West Travis County, Blanco or Hays Counties? But 93% sounds like there are a lot of other grievances in play here.

zephyr88 said:

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It's a no-win situation, regardless of whether this was a DEI hire or not.

Austin is 100 miles away from Kerrville.

Let's just pretend that Fire Chief sends a significant number of the firemen to Kerr County and there's a fire in Austin where even a single person dies. He would be eviscerated for sending out taxpayer resources to outlying counties and be demanded to resign in shame.

Sounds more like (a) a beef that 93% of the department already had in place and this was the first and/or best opportunity for them to voice their opinions, (b) classic virtue signaling, or (c) both.

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Out of territory deployments of this nature utilize off duty crew and personnel.

It would not affect staffing and would not deplete (significantly) assets available in the city. Some assets would have their response areas increased.

Additionally there is State grant money that departments of all sizes utilize for specialized equipment and training. State Interested Mutual Aid something or other, I forget the exact name/acronym. But if you get that equipment and training the state (generally under the purview of the Texas Forest Service) will call you up and "request" your participation.

TFS does it because they're the best in the state at managing and coordinating large multitagency response situations. TFS provided A LOT of personnel and especially high level logistical support and command structure for weather related situations.

Edit... I don't know if these were TIFMAS crews and resources or not.
https://tfsweb.tamu.edu/grants-financial-assistance/fire-department-programs/career-fire-department-programs/texas-intrastate-fire-mutual-aid-system/