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First Deer Rifle

2,856 Views | 57 Replies | Last: 10 hrs ago by clonebucky
Maximus Johnson
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This year was my 5 year old son's first year to tag along hunting with me. He cannot get enough of it and it is all he wants to do. So much so that I worry about his sanity liking to kill things so much. After every hunt we have to have a long talk about how even though hunting is supposed to be fun, we just took the life of one of Gods creatures. It's been tough to manage but I also remember how giddy I was to shoot something at his age. Everything from dove to duck to deer hunting he did it all with me this season.

He is pretty nails with his cricket 22 and can consistently put shots on paper with it. We are going to go up to the lease next weekend to do a little pig and rabbit hunting and while we are there we are going to shoot some paper with one of my scoped 22's so he an get used to target acquisition through a scope.

My dad gave me the gun I used to take my first deer for my son to use. It's a single shot 223. I am going to let him shoot a doe next season with it for sentimental purposes, but want him to move up in caliber pretty quickly after that.

I have a few Begara's and have been very happy with their performance and have been eyeing the Begara Stoke for him. I handled one a Murdoch's earlier today and am sold on that rifle. I have an Athlon 6x24x56 I am going to put on top of it.

My question is what caliber would you guys recommend for a 6 year old? My gut tells me 243, but I have heard some mention of reduced recoil loads on here for the 7mm-08. Will that be too much for a 6 year old? They also come in 6.5 creedmore which is an option I would consider.

His shots will be inside or right at 100 yards. Thanks in advance for the help.
Lonestar-aught-six
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Howa's mini action in 6.5 Grendel is pretty soft shooting.
JuneBug07
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243 is pretty hard to beat for a starter rifle, or the 6mm Creed for a modern version of a 243.

Whatever caliber you decide, get one in a Tikka T3X. They are affordable and shoot great. I don't think I have ever seen a Tikka that wasn't accurate.
GentrysMillTX10
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Depends. Is this his rifle for the foreseeable future or will get an upgrade in a few years?

7MM.08 can last a lifetime. He will probably want to move up to a larger caliber after 243
ttha_aggie_09
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6.5 Grendel has been great for my daughters
harge57
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IMO I will never buy my kids a rifle that is not set up for a suppressor.

Caliber
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harge57 said:

IMO I will never buy my kids a rifle that is not set up for a suppressor.



+1
I set my daughter's up with a Ruger American ranch in 6.5 Grendel. Comes threaded so I could put a QD on it.

Called up Ruger after buying it to order a youth stock and after talking with them about buying it for my daughter's they ended up sending me the stock free of charge.

Shoots great suppressed and 6.5G has been excellent Texas whitetail.
AggieMPH2005
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Suppressed 30/30 would be a good option too. I like that you can visually check that the hammer isn't cocked easily.

Kicks the same or less than a 243 in my experience.
BrazosDog02
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.223 or .243....

7mm-08 is an excellent choice too and I feel like that's actually the perfect round from here on out, personally.
EFR
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He is young, personally I don't see a need to jump up in caliber or buy a new gun in a hurry. That single shot 223 will be deadly within 100 yards. If it was me I would wait until he needs a bigger gun due to him growing.
SGrem
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They make reduced recoil loads in 243 also....and 308.

My small shooters shot 22, then 204, then 243 and 6.5 Grendel.....and now 7mm-08 (reduced recoil loads) for one and 270 (reduced recoil loads) for the other.

They can go to full power loads for bigger game as needed.

And still have the "starter" calibers and use them for pursuits other than big game.

Having said that seen many big game animals shot confidently with 243....lots of elk and lots of kudu for example....
Gunny456
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Main thing you want to do is get him something that he can practice and enjoy shooting and not make him recoil sensitive.
There are sizes of calibers and all types of cartridge types within those calibers.
A large range of opinions with merit to each but the .243 is an excellent cartridge at his age. Thousands of deer killed by the .243 for decades. Ammunition easily available anywhere. As he grows up you and he will eventually want a new different rifle if he stays with hunting…..At that point he will have gained shooting experience and will be able to comfortably shoot larger calibers/cartridges.
TAMU Wildlife & Fisheries Sciences

"Boat Racing is like a beautiful woman.... expensive, high maintenance....... but well worth the fun!"
TxAg4eva
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Just had this guy built for my 8 and 10 year old. 6.5 Grendel minimal recoil, enjoyable to shoot can reach it and touch something in case you decide to take it on a hunt. I also built a 300 blkout which another great gun on an ar platform to get kids used to a larger caliber, has zero recoil, whisper quiet and have had good experience under 100 yards with whitetail.
Squid94
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My son could should his Cricket well, and wanted to shoot a deer. He was small for his age and couldnt handle the Model 700 youth i bought. He shot a deer with a crossbow, which had a shorter stock than the youth rifle. He was able to handle an AR, with collapsed stock, before the Model 700.
agsalaska
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Kids started with a Mossberg bantam patriot with a wood stock in .243. They have shot deer dead with it out to 250 yards with no issues.

My 17yo daughter smoke a deer with it this season. Great shooting sub moa rifle.
Maximus Johnson
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That's kind of my thought. If I get it in 7mm-08 he can have it forever. But the question is will it be too much for him now even with the reduced recoil rounds
S.A. Aggie
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My Dad had all three of us boys shoot a .32-20. Sweet gun.
Maximus Johnson
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Do you think the 7mm-08 reduced recoil loads would be too much for a 6 year old?
TheGifGuy
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Are you going to get a rifle with a muzzle break?
SGrem
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Maximus Johnson said:

Do you think the 7mm-08 reduced recoil loads would be too much for a 6 year old?


No I do not. The Hornady Custom Lite reduced recoil loads for example are 120 Grain at 2675fps or so if I remember correctly. Which is the same as 6.5 Grendel full loads. Good to about 300 yards or so on medium sized game.

Remember .243, .260, 7mm-08, .308, .338 Federal, and .358 Winchester allllllllll use the same parent case.
-which means they allllllll hold the same powder charge.
-which means theoretically if you had the same grain bullet out of the same weight rifle they would alllllllll have identical recoil.

Just makes sure the stock fits. Which usually means an AR with collapsible stock.... then junior stock on traditional rifle.

I know you want to get him a 7mm-08 cuz he can then have a rifle for life.....but the stock wont fit yet anyway. Get the 243 with the same reduced recoil loads. Then work up to full power....then another rifle at 13-15 years old when he hits his big growth spurt. 7mm-08 with reduced recoil loads..... then full power loads if he goes on an elk hunt or something.

I watched a 9 yr old little girl shoot about 10 plains game animals with a 300 win mag.... if they work up right there is no problem.
Then the next customer was a 40 something full grown man doing the same hunt and same plains game with a 243....
txags92
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AggieMPH2005 said:

Suppressed 30/30 would be a good option too. I like that you can visually check that the hammer isn't cocked easily.

Kicks the same or less than a 243 in my experience.

Wouldn't be an OB thread without an argument about calibers, but I have to just say this is not likely to be an accurate statement unless you are assuming they would leave the .243 unsuppressed. Avg 30/30 recoil is about 14 ft/lbs and the .243 is about 9 ft/lbs. If you are talking a 12-14 year old, no big deal, but he is talking about a 6-7 yr old.
HumbleAg04
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Anything here suggested suppressed.

Honestly a good hunting round in a suppressed AR format is hard to beat.
MechAg
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Bought a 22 Creedmore from Horizon last year. Shooting that thing suppressed is a perfect first gun for a kid. Quiet, doesn't kick at all & with 80gr ELD bullets have shot 10 deer this year with only 1 making a step & that was about 20 yards.
INIGO MONTOYA
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Just bought a stoke for someone as a gift (small female). They are threaded. Put a muzzle break or a suppressor on it and you are good to go.
Gunny456
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In my opinion people overthink what caliber and cartridge to get for kids. Especially young kids 5-10. They most importantly need to learn to become proficient and accurate shooters first and foremost…..Learning the fundamentals of accurate shooting like breath control, trigger squeeze, etc. etc. This can only be done by lots of bench and target shooting time.
Consistently hitting your target and accurate shot placement is paramount over what cartridge you chose to shoot.
I can't tell you how many youths came to hunt at our ranch that oftentimes missed deer, or worse, wounded deer. We would then put them on the bench to check the gun and oftentimes, more than not, their issue was flinching, jerking the trigger, even closing their eyes when pulling the trigger!
These bad habits were often a product of them shooting a rifle that had a lot of recoil/noise for a kid. Once developing those bad habits, it is extremely hard to overcome them.
To become proficient they need to simply do a lot of practice and shooting. For this they need a rifle in a cartridge they can sit on a bench and shoot a lot in a day without being beat up…..not something they are only going to be able to shoot 5-6 times before their shoulder hurts or they become apprehensive of shooting.
By being able to comfortably practice with their "deer rifle"…..shooting multiple rounds per day….without being apprehensive of recoil or noise,….will allow them to develop proper shooting techniques. This will allow them to develop confidence in themselves and their rifle to have accurate shot placement to shoot the animal where they are aiming.
A well placed shot into the vitals of an animal by a small bullet well trumps a poorly placed shot into the guts by a big bullet every time.
TAMU Wildlife & Fisheries Sciences

"Boat Racing is like a beautiful woman.... expensive, high maintenance....... but well worth the fun!"
ttha_aggie_09
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Quote:

These bad habits were often a product of them shooting a rifle that had a lot of recoil/noise for a kid. Once developing those bad habits, it is extremely hard to overcome them

Which is why going with a lighter/softer caliber, suppressed, and with a heavier stock is a great option. Put the kids in a rifle where they're not scared of the recoil/noise, even if it means having to buy a bigger caliber in 4-5 years.

My kids learned on .22 then 300blk suppressed with heavy stock and now are on 6.5 Grendel suppressed with heavy stock. I imagine we'll go to a 6.5 Creedmoor next running the same setup.

Don't be like my dad and give your 11 year old a .30_06… that's way too much gun for a little kid and I had some pretty dang nervous jitters shooting that thing for a few years.
SanAntoneAg
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I'd be more worried about a 6 year old hunting with a scope with minimum power of 6 and being able to hold a point of aim adequately in hunting scenarios.

A 3x9 or 3x12 for inside 100 yards is more than enough while taking shots at game on 3x or 4x.
Gunny456
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Yes sir! Sound wisdom. I learned to shoot with a Stevens single shot .22. At 7 my dad gave me his 1947 Vintage Win. 1894 .30-.30 for Christmas. Couldn't wait to go shoot it. It kicked the crap out of my little butt! Steel butt plate and all. Plus just cotton stuck in my ears so it made my ears ring for four days.
We were poor as church mice and the idea of getting another rifle was just a dream.
A deputy of my dad's felt sorry for us and he let my dad borrow his older Model 70 in .22 Hornet for me to shoot and hunt with.
I loved the old .30-30 because of dad and that Christmas but that little .22 Hornet let me kill many a deer with it……and I didn't "hate" to shoot it.
TAMU Wildlife & Fisheries Sciences

"Boat Racing is like a beautiful woman.... expensive, high maintenance....... but well worth the fun!"
strohag
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My son just turned 7. I bought a Ruger American Prarie 6.5 creedmore and put a Vortex 3x9 on it. You can take a section of the stock out and make it fit a kid better. Biggest gun he has shot was a 22. Set it up the 6.5 on a bog death grip tri pod and had him shoot it. First shot he was a little surprised by the kick which really isnt that bad. He shot about an 1" high at 80 yards. He got right back on the gun and was 1" low. I told him you're good. He said no you put 3 bullets in there and I'm shooting all 3. Last shot was a bullseye. Gun comes with a threaded barrell as others have said. I'm going to get a suppressor for it but I wanted him to feel and hear a big gun go off so he understood the power. He never got a chance to shoot a deer this season but he's ready. I moved target out to 120 yards last time and he's shooting great.
eastcut96
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In my opinion suppressors have really changed the game when it comes to recoil and muzzle blast for kids. I don't know how you could go wrong with a suppressed 7mm-08 and Hornady Light ammo.

My son started out with TONS of range time with a 22 and moved to suppressed 7mm-08 with reduced recoil ammo and is lights out.
Gunny456
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Personally I would let him get the rifle and learn to shoot it open sights and learn the fundamentals of properly gripping and holding the rifle, breath control, trigger squeeze, etc.
Then add the scope later. That way you don't take the chance of his first shot with a scope busting him above the eye because
of not holding the rifle correctly.
You talk about making a kid flinch forever…


TAMU Wildlife & Fisheries Sciences

"Boat Racing is like a beautiful woman.... expensive, high maintenance....... but well worth the fun!"
ghollow
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I was blessed with four daughters. About the time they were ready to hunt, I bought a 6mm Remington with a bull barrel. I bought a second stock off of eBay and cut 4 inches off of it. The bull barrel really helped manage the recoil. When they got big enough, I put the regular stock back on. My youngest, who is now in her twenties, moved up to a .270 last year. Saving the 6mm for the grandkids. Still have few years before any of them are ready to hunt
So the greatest civilization is one where all citizens are equally armed and can only be persuaded, never forced. It removes force from the equation... and that's why carrying a gun is a civilized act.
harge57
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So let's talk about actual rifle options. I'm looking for short threaded barrels to put a suppressor on.

Here we're AI recommendations.
Top 5 Rifle Recommendations
1. Ruger American Rifle Ranch (or Compact)
Ruger's American line is arguably the best value for a suppressed youth setup.
Why it's great: The "Ranch" models typically come with 16-inch threaded barrels, making the overall length very manageable once you add the 68 inches of a suppressor.
Top Caliber Choice: .350 Legend or 6.5 Creedmoor.
Feature: Includes a marksman adjustable trigger to help with accuracy.
2. Savage 110 Apex Hunter XP Youth
Savage is famous for their "AccuFit" system, which allows you to adjust the length of pull as your daughter grows.
Why it's great: It is a dedicated youth model. While not all XP packages are threaded, the "110 Magpul Hunter" or specific "Threaded" versions of the 110 are available.
Top Caliber Choice: 6.5 Creedmoor or 7mm-08 (if using a suppressor).
Feature: The AccuTrigger is very safe and crisp for small hands.
3. CVA Cascade SB (Short Barrel)
The "SB" stands for Short Barrel, specifically designed for use with suppressors.
Why it's great: It features an 18-inch barrel and a synthetic stock with a removable spacer to adjust the length of pull for smaller shooters. It is exceptionally well-balanced.
Top Caliber Choice: 6.5 Creedmoor or .300 Blackout (excellent for deer at close range when suppressed).
Feature: It uses a Cerakote finish, making it very durable for hunting in rain or snow.
4. Weatherby Vanguard Badlands (or Compact)
Weatherby is known for high-end accuracy. Their youth/compact models are built with the same precision as their adult rifles.
Why it's great: The Vanguard Compact features a 20-inch threaded barrel and a length-of-pull spacer system. It's slightly heavier than the Ruger, which actually helps further reduce recoil.
Top Caliber Choice: .243 Winchester or 6.5 Creedmoor.
Feature: Guaranteed sub-MOA accuracy (shoots groups under 1 inch at 100 yards).
5. Howa 1500 Mini Action / Youth
The "Mini Action" is specifically designed around shorter cartridges, resulting in a lighter, shorter bolt throw that is easier for a child to cycle.
Why it's great: You can find these with 16.25-inch heavy threaded barrels. They are incredibly compact and easy for a 10-year-old to carry through the woods.
Top Caliber Choice: 6.5 Grendel or 7.62x39. Both are low-recoil and excellent for deer.
Feature: The two-stage HACT trigger is very predictable for new shooters.
Important Tip for Suppressing
When you add a suppressor to a rifle, you are adding weight to the very end of the barrel. For a 10-year-old, this can make the gun feel "nose-heavy." Choosing a rifle with a shorter barrel (16"18") is vital to keep the balance point centered so she can hold the rifle steady without help.

ttha_aggie_09
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I have 2 RAR with 16" barrels and they're great little guns. I'm having a feed issue with the magazine/bolt of the Grendel but nothing terrible.

I replaced the stocks with the magpul hunters that you can adjust cheek height and LOP. Other similar options out there for stocks but something that lets them grow with the stock is ideal.

Agree with you on the balance of the gun.
Gunny456
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Lots of sound thoughts. However I think the emphasis on short barrels only for suppressor use is not as critical as one might think.
High quality suppressors of today are not that heavy and most shooters (kids or adults) are rarely going to take a shot purely off hand. Most are going to have a rest of some kind whether that be a simple as a tree limb, shooting sticks or deer blind.
Just saying… You greatly limit rifle choices by limiting your choice to purpose built short barrels only.
We've had a number of young kids hunt at our ranch where dads had them use standard rifles that had barrels threaded for suppressor use.
Especially if hunting in stands or blinds, we had many dads not put the suppressors on till settled in.
TAMU Wildlife & Fisheries Sciences

"Boat Racing is like a beautiful woman.... expensive, high maintenance....... but well worth the fun!"
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