Let's talk DISD

4,356 Views | 24 Replies | Last: 1 mo ago by rhutton125
rhutton125
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AG
Howdy all,

First off, apologies if there's a better DISD thread or if this has been discussed ad nauseum. I searched before posting but haven't really seen any discussions in recent years.

I live in east Dallas. My kids aren't school age yet but will be before too long. We also bought a house right as COVID was hitting, so we have those sweet sweet 2020 interest rates. Plus we like it here, except for poorly-rated schools that our kids would be going through.

So I guess I'm torn between "stay in this house forever despite the schools" and "move across the metroplex, paying way more on your mortgage, for your kids' academic future." Private school isn't really an option for us based on our earnings but I suppose anything is on the table.

Curious what y'all's thoughts and experiences have been. I don't want to move, and the elementary school within walking distance seems nice and wholesome and the few parents we've met in the area seem to like it, but I know eventually they'll be at Skyline High School which probably isn't great.

Thanks in advance!
powerbelly
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AG
The magnet schools are some of the best in the country. The rest are a huge mixed bag between okay and terrible.

There are some good elementary schools but those are mostly in the more affluent areas.
dallasag_123
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Are the kids boys or girls?

One of my girls went to Solar Prep which is an all girls DISD school on Henderson ave, and it was great. It is a lottery but you would want to get in the list. There is a Solar boys school also right off Henderson but I have heard more mixed reviews from it. Both of those go pre-k though 8th grade. Gets you through the Jr High which generally are not great even in the good feeder patterns. (kids that age just kinda suck)

Travis TAG (in uptown) and Sudie (near love field) are test in but great schools. They go 4th-8th I think. Dealy Monterssori (in North Dallas off Walnut hiil I think) is also a good test in school. If Girls, Irma Rangel is a very good magent school and that is 7-12 I think.

High schools you have a lot of good choices. You can take the IB track and go to Woodrow Wilson out of feeder if you want a traditional school with a football team, close to you etc. TAG HS and STEM HS are top ranked in the area (including suburbs) but test in and pretty hard to get in. My daughters went to Booker T Washington in down town. perfoming Arts high school but pretty high performing academically and nationally known. Where those kids go to college and the scholoarship money is kinda of mind blowing to me.

akaggie05
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AG
I graduated from Hillcrest in 2001. Back then, the only non-magnet high schools that most people would even remotely consider sending their kids to were Hillcrest, WT White, and Woodrow. That may have changed now but I'm out of the loop (I live in the RISD part of Dallas now where my girls are in elementary and junior high).

I had a good experience, but it was definitely a "school within a school situation." A core group of us who grew up together in the feeder elementary schools who stuck together and took AP classes, and all went on to college and by all accounts are doing well now. I credit my experiences in DISD as getting me better prepared for the real world to a large extent, from a social perspective. However, I definitely had to buckle down and re-assess my study habits and overall priorities real quick at the start of my first semester at A&M. High school was easy for me and I really didn't have to over-exert myself to be in the top 5 percent of my class. The auto-admit to A&M was a nice bonus and it would have been much harder to crack even the top 10 percent at a more competitive suburb or private school.

Looking back, it was the right choice for me at the time and I'm not sure I'd do anything different today given the same set of variables.
rebag00
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Daughter went private for K-5. She attended the DISD all girls Irma Rangel 6-8. It's in Fair Park, we lived in East Dallas, so about a 20 minute drive to drop off and pick up. There are busses, but they aren't great.

Overall the academics were great, there are some great teachers there. The administration was ok, they have a lot of outside funding for all girls programs, which helps (everything is paid for). Consistently top rated in state. Our daughter was ahead of her private school peers in Math/Science when she went to 9th grade.

It is still DISD, we had some issues with specific teachers (one was bi-polar and continually missed school/screaming at the kids/talking about inappropriate things, it took a couple months for them to remove her, one died mid-year and they didn't replace him, etc...). This was during COVID. But for the most part the administration and teachers there were good.

The school facility was fine, private school-like uniforms. Only a few extra curriculars (lacrosse is only sport, all other sports were back at your assigned middle school). The other kids are ok, but there isn't much in the way of social activities. She was singled out for being white and not speaking Spanish with some mild bullying. Since its not gen-pop, the girls generally behave because they know they can get sent back to their home schools for multiple infractions. There is a boys only school - the Obama Leadership Academy. I know nothing about it.

Demographics are about 60% Hispanic, 30% black, 10% white/Asian. It is a good alternative to private (for girls). Middle school is kind of a **** show everywhere. Friends who went to Travis TAG liked that, too, but went to Woodrow for HS to have a more "normal" HS experience.

Went back to private for HS, which was good for our daughter.
rhutton125
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Thanks for the feedback everyone! I know even less than I thought I did. The elementary school in our neighborhood is now one of those lottery systems but isn't listed as a magnet school. I didn't know anything about magnet schools though so I'll have to look into that more.

We have one boy and one girl. I hadn't really considered the possibility of them going to different schools. I guess that's another wrinkle to consider.

If the elementary school / Jr high school go to Skyline, can you just... choose to send your kid to Woodrow Wilson instead? Do you apply or something? How does that work?
akaggie05
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I thought Skyline was a magnet school? At least it was when I was in DISD. Maybe that changed. If Skyline is still a magnet, you would have to apply to go there regardless of where you live in the district. Conversely, if you live in the Woodrow attendance zone then you can go there no questions asked.
rhutton125
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Looks like you're right! I'm going online and pretending like I'm enrolling my kids. I guess it's not as mysterious as I thought it was. So you can apply for schools outside your zone, but have automatic acceptance to your local area school.

Interesting. Thanks everyone. The schools I went to as a kid were all good, but having a dedicated engineering program (for example) is so far beyond what I'm used to that it feels like a totally different system. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. I'll just have to do some more research!
JDL 96
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rhutton125 said:

Thanks for the feedback everyone! I know even less than I thought I did. The elementary school in our neighborhood is now one of those lottery systems but isn't listed as a magnet school. I didn't know anything about magnet schools though so I'll have to look into that more.

We have one boy and one girl. I hadn't really considered the possibility of them going to different schools. I guess that's another wrinkle to consider.

If the elementary school / Jr high school go to Skyline, can you just... choose to send your kid to Woodrow Wilson instead? Do you apply or something? How does that work?

Woodrow is not great. Even in IB. one of my daughter's friends is there. A few she knows actually. It is not good.
JDL 96
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I don't want to be Debbie downer, but I'd HIGHLY recommend NOT gambling with DISD. Your kid only has one childhood and future, and I wouldn't gamble with it. Bite the bullet and do a private you can swing, or move somewhere with good schools. It will be a sacrifice either way, but it is WORTH it for your kid. Don't try to convince yourself they won't be in a risky (at best) environment in DISD. Educationally and socially it is very risky.
double aught
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I'm not speaking of you specifically, but I feel this mentality is one of the biggest problems with public schools.

It's mainly these stay at home moms with too much time on their hands. They start talking and once the idea of private school gets mentioned, they all feel like they need to abandon the local school. But in fact, if people would just commit to their neighborhood school, send their kids there, get involved and supportive, it would be just fine.

But maybe that's just my experience.
rhutton125
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Can you elaborate on your experience? I'm open to all ideas here.

One thing that may be tricky, but maybe there's a resource for, is me comparing DISD schools to those in Sunnyvale or Richardson or wherever. How do I compare them accurately?
agfan80
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Catholic schools in Dallas are very good, and relatively affordable. Getting more and more competitive on admissions, though. Helps a lot if you are active in the parish.
YankeeAg05
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Catholic k-8 are mostly affordable, good quality and are all over town. The Catholic high schools are not cheap but do offer scholarships. If you're thinking about moving for suburban school districts, you could always consider the difference in potential mortgage vs current mortgage as your budget for private school.
Matilda
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AG
No firm answers here, but in my observation there are only a handful of DISD elementary schools that families with at least one "professional" parent generally consider acceptable. These range from magnet schools that some view as equivalent to (or better than) the selective privates (Dealey, Solar for girls, maybe Sudie TAG?), to top neighborhood options comparable to strong DFW ISDs (Lakewood, White Rock, Mockingbird), to those that are at least defensible (Kramer, Withers). I do agree though that at the high school level, TAMS/Townview are consistently ranked among the best in the state.

That said, private school is not a sure thing either. Set aside cost (which is insane) and religious preference (obviously family-specific), and the real issue is that only a few selective privates are actually better than your replacement-rate public option in a top DFW ISD and admissions at those schools is insanely competitive now. Go read the City Data admissions threads. Plenty of crashouts, including legacy kids with siblings already enrolled and parishioners whose kids still didn't get in. So private is not some clean escape hatch.

No clear answers, but I get why people end up in Southlake, Frisco, or Richardson lol.
gvine07
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I've been a public school teacher for 13 years. I've worked at a very low income school, a kinda low income school, and an affluent school. All 3 have way more low-income students than they did 10-15 years ago. Solid kids came from the low income schools, but my kids from the affluent school are 10x more prepared for anything. Sadly it's a lot tougher to get into A&M.

Some kids will be successful anywhere. Some will be unsuccessful anywhere. Better schools with better students will help most kids.

To me it's all about the district: I'd move to Prosper/Celina or something nice on the Fort Worth side (Aledo?). You want something that hasn't peaked in enrollment yet - if you haven't started kindergarten you have at least 13 years before graduation. Schools start to decline after attendance peaks - the only homes turning over frequently are low-income.

Whatever the schools are now, don't expect them to be as nice in 5, 10, or 15 years unless the area is still growing.

I'm in Plano because I have 2 sets of in-laws within 10 minutes - they both do a lot with our kids. If not, I'd be in Grapevine or Prosper. I'd be lying if I said I had no concerns that our schools will be great when my daughter graduates in 10 years.
BoomGoesThe
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That's an interesting theory, that I think has some merit. Although, after saying that, you stated that Grapevine would be a place you would move to. GCISD has seen a large decrease in enrollment over the last handful of years.
Sumlins Pool Guy
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I think the biggest problem with DISD is that it like everything administered by the City of Dallas has been steadily degenerating for the last 50 years. Multiple high schools have under 1% college ready seniors. They have become low expectation failure factories.
Craigy
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Get a job at at a private school and get free tuition for your kid
dallasag_123
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sure, it has some very bad neighborhood schools but also has 5 of the best 25 or so schools in DFW: https://www.niche.com/k12/search/schools-with-gate-program/m/dallas-fort-worth-metro-area/

willing to bet a lot of the hardcore neysayers have never had kids in the district. and that is fine and is what it is. I get it. But, you do have choices in the district that can lead to very postive outcomes for those who want it.
Sumlins Pool Guy
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Haha yes the very niche specialty schools that are ultra selective are the exceptions that prove the rule. Because they're filled with students who are trying to get out of their neighborhood school.
Matilda
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AG
Plus those schools are all at the middle/high school level. I speculate that admissions at those ultra selective magnets may be as competitive if not more competitive than St Marks/Greenhill/Hockaday bc there is presumably a much larger applicant pool.
dallasag_123
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There are a ton of spots at these schools. only a very small % of DISD students try to get into these schools. In fact, some take students from outside the district to fill the space. That is not a good comentary on a high % of parents for sure, but if you are a high achiever you can find a school to go to. and yes, I am not sure anyone of thise thread would just suggest to go to the large % of neighborhood schools and call it a day. But, the point is there are choices.

And if you read my first post of this thread there are just as many non HS options as HS. Maybe more actually. Just not a ranking system I know of for Elem and Jr high. The point is, you can do very well in DISD if you do the homework. That is not for everyone and I am certainly not comparing the entire system to HP or most of the higher end suburbs, but then again I have heard of enough stories from friends with kids in HP you could not pay me enough to send my kids there. (and of course they would likely say the same about DISD but Booker T has plenty of HP kids.)
91AggieLawyer
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double aught said:

I'm not speaking of you specifically, but I feel this mentality is one of the biggest problems with public schools.

It's mainly these stay at home moms with too much time on their hands. They start talking and once the idea of private school gets mentioned, they all feel like they need to abandon the local school. But in fact, if people would just commit to their neighborhood school, send their kids there, get involved and supportive, it would be just fine.

But maybe that's just my experience.


This is naivete at best and wishful thinking at worst. Sorry, but it is.

First, even IF stuff you're alluding to were a problem at public schools, it isn't a big problem and it certainly isn't "one of the biggest" ones. With all the public school failures, it is hard to understand why you would think it is unreasonable to not only seek out and discuss other options but to act on it. The fact is, public schools aren't and haven't been very good since at least when I was going there. Even in pockets of areas where they function (or at least have for many students) -- think Plano, etc. in the '90s and before and the Southlakes, Highland Parks, and Coppells (just to name a few DFW area "superior" districts) in the 2000s and later -- they aren't as effective as advocates for them would like to think. For example, I know for a fact that one of the districts I mentioned here has both severe grade inflation (ala Harvard) AND essentially a no-fail policy. I know that because I had a client who taught in that district and wanted to know how to handle unwarranted negative reviews from their principal due to refusals to change grades. I was able to gather a great deal of evidence in the matter that showed the kids were graded accurately and fairly and the teacher wasn't going to get bullied by parents that were pissed that their kid either didn't get an A (they got Bs and Cs) or they failed. The client, an Aggie, by the way, ended up leaving the district so it didn't matter. I think as a result of that experience, he pretty much just gave up at his new school and gave out the grades desired. And while good students in these and other districts find ways to succeed, in public schools the way is in spite of, rather than because of, the school.

Second, you're flat out wrong when you allege that support seems to fix everything. The only "neighborhood" schools in most areas of Texas are elementary schools in cities with populations between roughly 150K and 300K. Below that, and they aren't neighborhood; above that and you have situations like FWISD and DISD where, even if they're close by creating that atmosphere, open enrollment brings in kids from all over. Parents put their kids in one school for a year or two then move on, or move the younger one somewhere else when the older one advances to Jr. high. There's virtually no such thing, except MAYBE in Frisco (if there are other communities like that, let me know), of a neighborhood Jr. High or HS. Even there, things aren't like they're drawn up to be. Frisco and other places are having to close multiple elementary schools due to declining enrollment (in large part because too many "neighborhood" schools were built way back when) and there is a virtual war between parents and the school boards over which schools should close. Hint: it BETTER not be MY school or I'm gonna have a piece of your ass. At least, that's what parents say privately -- sometimes publicly. Better not be my school because the school is better educationally for my kids? Nope. Its in the area where I bought my home so my kids could walk there. Besides, I don't have time to take them to the one they'd go to so the board better figure it out. I don't give a damn if the district does lose tax money; that's not my problem.

You'd be a fool if you think quality of education is on the forefront of the minds of much of anyone related to school district decisions these day, be it parents, administrators, or boards. That's the rhetoric. The reality is whatever they need to do to stay in office, in their job, or keep their comfortable setting in tact.

I'm not saying private school is ALWAYS the answer, but public school almost never is. If someone has no other choice, then I suggest investing heavily -- as best you can -- in your child's education AS IF they're being home schooled. In other words, they go to public school but they spend a significant amount of time working with the parent as if the parent was home with them all day.

My mom taught for 31 years, and my wife will complete her 36th year in a couple of months -- all in public schools. I went to public schools for everything but a year at Baylor. I know where all the bodies are buried and trust me: you don't want to see that graveyard. Nothing, including private school is perfect, but whatever the question is, public school isn't the answer. (And, by the way, I can continue this for what amounts to 10 Microsoft Word length pages with examples if you want, so don't think what I hit here is all I've got. It BARELY scratches the surface. Otherwise, sorry for the length/rant).
rhutton125
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AG
For those that moved their kids around… how disruptive was that, starting over at new schools one or more times? My wife and I had the good fortune to go through school with the same kids from K to 12, and still have some of those lifelong friends. It's sounding like that won't really be my kids' experience if I stay in Dallas public school.

I guess it's "navigate the system to get them the best education possible" or "move somewhere else" at the end of the day.
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