Help me crowd source a diagnosis?

2,529 Views | 22 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by Absolute
Absolute
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AG
Okay Auto Ags, you know stuff! Maybe we can figure out this problem.

Vehicle is a 2017 Infiniti Q50 Sport. Bought it in 2020 CPO with 30k miles on it. CPO warranty is up in February. Generally speaking it has been a great car with no big unexpected issues. Now at 105k miles.

So, the mystery issue. In the summer of 2023 with with around 70k miles this came up for the first time. Since then it has happened maybe 12 times. Have taken it into the dealer multiple times, including once where I drove it straight there while the issue was active (it typically goes away after a couple restarts.) They have tried multiple things, some covered by warranty, some at my expense and haven't fixed it.

Start the car after driving somewhere and it has basically no throttle response. It goes, but has no power (typically a pretty powerful engine - 3.0 twin turbo). The shift points are all messed up. Revs up to 5k before shifting. You can pump the accelerator and nothing really happens. There is a delay from pushing the accelerator down and the engine revving. It drives, but not well. Putting it in manual shifting mode doesn't help and the shifting is still l****.

The first time it happened I planned to take it directly to the dealer but stopped at home to clear out my work stuff and turned it off. Got back in to go and realized it was acting normal. From then it happens randomly. Since I figured out that turning it off seems to reset it, most of the time I just do that. As stated, I have had it into the dealer multiple times for it, including once where I drove straight there and did not turn it off so the tech could drive it and see the problem. Have not been able to really figure out any common factors. But here are the things I have noted.

Does not appear weather related - happens in hot and cold weather.

Has never happened first thing in the morning. Usually it will be midday. For my job I drive to multiple appointments with a couple hours at each. So it will happen when started after one of those appointments.

Had said it never happened while it was running/while driving. But yesterday that actually changed. It happened while driving after about 30 minutes on the highway. While sitting at the light after the offramp, it popped up for the rest of the drive home. Of course it was fine this morning when I took it in.

Has never gone away without turning it off. Does seem that it has to be turned off multiple times to "reset" it as it has progressed.

Does not appear that it throws any error codes when it happens. After the time I took it in while the problem was active they replaced a sensor and checked the turbos and stuff. (the turbos got replaced separately in July when they went out - that threw all kinds of error codes.) Never really thought it was the turbos because of the intermittent nature.

Typically they say they cannot recreate and they don't know what it is. Last time it was in they found the ECM and TCM were out of date and suggested updating them (not covered by warranty for some stupid reason.) But I paid to do it. Apparently that wasn't it.

Before the turbos were replaced I had planned to get rid of the car soon despite really liking it because of the high cost to replace them compared to the value of the car. But changed that plan when they got replaced and went ahead with various maintenance stuff. Now I am pissed because of putting a few thousand in maintenance into it thinking things were good. But still having this mystery problem. Heck, if I knew it would always be intermittent and go away, I would not really care. But if it gets worse and doesn't go away, I don't want to be stuck.

I would like to pass the car on to my daughter to finish out college. It updates her current car by a few years and 70k miles. But this mystery problem worries me. Particularly since it seems to be slowly getting worse.

Any ideas?

GrapevineAg
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AG
Sounds like transmission to me, maybe a sensor in it. Hope it's something simpler/cheaper than that. I know it's been to the shop multiple times, but double-check the fluid levels just to rule something out. How old is the transmission fluid?
Absolute
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AG
It is noticeable even in park. The revving and throttle response is still weird, muted might be a good word.

Hadn't really considered the transmission.
mefoghorn
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AG
Take it to AutoTech in Irving. They're pretty good with stuff like this.
fixer
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My guess is one or combo of the following:

Fuel pump is glitchy; possibly a driver module for pump

Fuel pump sock screen is getting clogged with debris. Sloshing of fuel is both causing the issue and alleviating it randomly

Gas pedal sensor for throttle input is flaking out not giving proper signal to ecm

Throttle position sensor flaking out

Throttle body actuator flaking out

Mass air flow sensor is dirty or flaking out

Vacuum leak check the intake hose between air cleaner and throttle body for leaks or missing clamps. Or loose clamps.
Milwaukees Best Light
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AG
Dump it while it is running normally. Sounds like you use the vehicle for work, so you need dependable tools for doing your job. Don't put your job at risk over a stupid car.
1agswitchin4lanes
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AG
Throttle Body or Position Sensor
92_Ag
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AG
Could be a CAN bus fault issue. Those are notorious for intermittent faults that only throw codes at very specific times.
Absolute
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AG
fixer said:

My guess is one or combo of the following:

Fuel pump is glitchy; possibly a driver module for pump

Fuel pump sock screen is getting clogged with debris. Sloshing of fuel is both causing the issue and alleviating it randomly

Gas pedal sensor for throttle input is flaking out not giving proper signal to ecm

Throttle position sensor flaking out

Throttle body actuator flaking out

Mass air flow sensor is dirty or flaking out

Vacuum leak check the intake hose between air cleaner and throttle body for leaks or missing clamps. Or loose clamps.


Something fuelnsupply seems like a possibility. Still, so intermittent
Absolute
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AG
Milwaukees Best Light said:

Dump it while it is running normally. Sounds like you use the vehicle for work, so you need dependable tools for doing your job. Don't put your job at risk over a stupid car.


Was going to change my daily either way. Already shopping for a truck. More a question of whether it replaces my daughter's bulletproof 12 year old normally aspirated g37 with 180k.

Absolute
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AG
1agswitchin4lanes said:

Throttle Body or Position Sensor


Okay. Don't know enough to evaluate these. Planning to bring these ideas to my service advisor. They obviously have no real theories or don't care.
Absolute
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AG
92_Ag said:

Could be a CAN bus fault issue. Those are notorious for intermittent faults that only throw codes at very specific times.
.

Again, this one is beyond my knowledge level. Care to expand?
Absolute
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AG
Do believe it was the mass air sensor they replaced last year after they drove it with the issue
Ag for Life
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Absolute said:

Milwaukees Best Light said:

Dump it while it is running normally. Sounds like you use the vehicle for work, so you need dependable tools for doing your job. Don't put your job at risk over a stupid car.


Was going to change my daily either way. Already shopping for a truck. More a question of whether it replaces my daughter's bulletproof 12 year old normally aspirated g37 with 180k.



Mileage isn't everything. I'd keep trucking with her reliable ride with 180K.
AggieMarkSA
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fixer said:

My guess is one or combo of the following:

Fuel pump is glitchy; possibly a driver module for pump

Fuel pump sock screen is getting clogged with debris. Sloshing of fuel is both causing the issue and alleviating it randomly

Gas pedal sensor for throttle input is flaking out not giving proper signal to ecm

Throttle position sensor flaking out

Throttle body actuator flaking out

Mass air flow sensor is dirty or flaking out

Vacuum leak check the intake hose between air cleaner and throttle body for leaks or missing clamps. Or loose clamps.
I was having a similar issue with mine. Got a code thrown for a MAP sensor having an issue. Pulled the sensor, cleaned out using sensor cleaner, reinstalled, code disappeared, engine humming happily again.
Tim Weaver
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fixer said:

My guess is one or combo of the following:

Fuel pump is glitchy; possibly a driver module for pump

Fuel pump sock screen is getting clogged with debris. Sloshing of fuel is both causing the issue and alleviating it randomly

Gas pedal sensor for throttle input is flaking out not giving proper signal to ecm

Throttle position sensor flaking out


Throttle body actuator flaking out

Mass air flow sensor is dirty or flaking out

Vacuum leak check the intake hose between air cleaner and throttle body for leaks or missing clamps. Or loose clamps.
Check these two out. The E-pedal could be bad, and/or the TPS is bad.



None of this other stuff should make it behave this way. The car isn't getting the correct throttle signal for some reason. If it's not the pedal or the TPS, it could be the throttle body (electric motor going out, but that should throw a code), or the ECU is messed up in some creative way.
JamesPShelley
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How old is the battery you're running?

Dropped a $400 battery into wife's 2019 G80 last Friday... cleared up a few things. Electrical gadget heavy vehicles are energy suckers.

Good luck.
none
Absolute
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AG
JamesPShelley said:

How old is the battery you're running?

Dropped a $400 battery into wife's 2019 G80 last Friday... cleared up a few things. Electrical gadget heavy vehicles are energy suckers.

Good luck.
Honestly not sure. Keeping up with the family's fleet of cars is a PIA and I tend to have good intentions of keeping good records but never do. I know it has been replaced since I purchased it.
92_Ag
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Absolute said:

92_Ag said:

Could be a CAN bus fault issue. Those are notorious for intermittent faults that only throw codes at very specific times.
.

Again, this one is beyond my knowledge level. Care to expand?
A couple of video shorts as an example on the topic:



Absolute
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AG
92_Ag said:

Absolute said:

92_Ag said:

Could be a CAN bus fault issue. Those are notorious for intermittent faults that only throw codes at very specific times.
.

Again, this one is beyond my knowledge level. Care to expand?
A couple of video shorts as an example on the topic:







Did not watch it all, but that seems much more extreme than my situation. It also fixes itself or goes long periods in between showing up.


Dealer has had it for 3 days with no info though. Enjoying a brand new luxurious suv with a hideously underpowered engine at the moment. Infiniti's choice to put the turbo 4 cyl in the qx60 is gonna kill that model. Worst engine/transmission combo I have driven in a long time.
Flaith
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AG
Quote:

Infiniti's choice to put the turbo 4 cyl in the qx60 is gonna kill that model. Worst engine/transmission combo I have driven in a long time.
You should check out the new Land Cruiser to compare bad engine choices
Absolute
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AG
Flaith said:

Quote:

Infiniti's choice to put the turbo 4 cyl in the qx60 is gonna kill that model. Worst engine/transmission combo I have driven in a long time.
You should check out the new Land Cruiser to compare bad engine choices
Made me think of the thread I read here about that very thing.

So sad. It has enough power to get going if you flog it. But it shifts horribly, hesitates, and sounds horrible.
Absolute
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AG
Update from dealer.

It did throw a code this time. Apparently they found problems with the left cam shaft actuator(?) and the related sensor. Not exactly sure what that entails, but they said it was a pretty big and expensive job and they would probably have the car until the end of next week. Glad they found something. Not making me feel warm and fuzzy about the car long term.
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