Another Random Question This Morning: Fast Draws...

1,743 Views | 8 Replies | Last: 4 yr ago by marcel ledbetter
Stive
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AG
There's a couple of fast draw videos on Youtube by a modern fast draw artist where he claims that fast draw shootouts in the old west are all a myth. There were obviously lots of guys that racked up some solid body counts by gun play but not necessarily by drawing their gun in the street facing someone. There were guys that had reputations as being "good with a gun" or tough and unrelenting lawmen (Earp, Masterson). But were there actually fast draws and contest shoot outs between two men in the street? It seems a bit unlikely and more of the dime novel type legend.

The OK Corral obviously happened but seems to have had nothing to do with a fast draw. John Wesley Hardin was mean and killed a bunch of people but I'm not sure any of them were standing in a street facing him when it happened. Hickok was killed essentially from ambush. People talk about him as being extremely accurate with a pistol and he was involved in some altercations but not necessarily with a speed aspect.

For those more astute with their late 1800's wild west history (not Louis L'amour novels) is this mostly, or entirely, a made up dramatization?
BQ78
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AG
Can't claim to be an expert but from what I have read this scene from The Unforgiven was probably pretty true to life:

Stive
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AG
Makes perfect sense.
Rabid Cougar
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AG
Most "gunfighters" didn't afford their victims any measure of a "draw". And most of them died by means that did not match their reputations, ie Hickock, James, Hardin all shot in the back of the head while not even in a fight.

CanyonAg77
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AG
Drawing fast, it's hard to hit the broad side of a barn . If there were "stand in the streets" gun fights, it's easy to imagine that the winner was the guy who stayed calm, took his time, aimed, and fired.

Meantime, quick draw's shots are going everywhere but on target
Trench55
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AG
Years ago (back in the era of the TV westerns) I read an article said the holsters used in the late 1800s were completely different from those used by the TV gunfighters of the 50s & 60s. According to the article, back in the post civil war era holsters were made of soft leather and held the pistol tightly so that it wouldn't fall out while working or riding. The holsters of the TV cowboys were made of hardened leather, often with a steel reinforced core and held the gun loosely in the holster. A leather loop over the pistol's hammer held the weapon in the holster. In order to draw the weapon the hammer loop had to be removed.

Now, how accurate this article was is anybody's guess.

I do know that the training I received as a federal law enforcement officer emphasized accuracy over speed in drawing a pistol and firing. Yes, we were encouraged to draw as quickly as possible and we were under a strict time limit, but our final score was based on accuracy. We were taught to draw, aim and fire.
EFR
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I am pretty sure gun fights and shootings then were about the same as they are now. Someone pulling a gun in a fight, or a couple of idiots lobbing poorly aimed shots in each other's general direction hoping to get lucky, someone caught in a break in, robberies, outright murders etc.
BrazosBendHorn
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for your consideration:

Quote:

Though movies and television would like us to believe otherwise, it was very rare when gunfights occurred with the two gunfighters squarely facing each other from a distance in a dusty street. This romanticized image of the Old West gunfight was born in the dime novels of the late 19th century and perpetuated in the film era, to such a point that this fictional version is what our mind's eye quickly conjures up when we hear the word "gunfight." In actuality, the "real" gunfights of the Old West were rarely that "civilized."

In fact, there are several misnomers about these "romanticized" gunfights, the first of which is that very rarely, did the gunfighters actually "plan" a gunfight to occur, "calling out" their enemy for dueling action in the street. Instead, most of these many fights took place in the heat of the moment when tempers flared, and more often than not, with the aide of a little bottled courage. They also didn't occur at a distance of 75 feet, with each gunfighter taking one shot, one falling dead to the ground, and the other standing as a "hero" before a dozen gathered onlookers.

Instead, these fights were usually close-up and personal, with a number of shots blasted from pistols, often resulting in innocent bystanders hit by a bullet gone wild. Much of the time, it would be difficult to tell who had even "won" the gunfight for several minutes, as the black powder smoke from the pistols cleared the air.

This is not to say that it never happened similar to the movies. One of the rare instances is the Bill Hickok-David Tutt Shootout in Springfield, Missouri. Even then, it wasn't a "planned" event, but rather, it occurred when Wild Bill ran into Tutt in the street and was insulted.

Always shown bravely facing each other in the popular westerns, in reality, the opponents were more often scampering for cover. The gunfights were not usually "clean" either, as the fighters were drinking and missing normally easy shots, continued to shoot until they had emptied their pistol.
https://www.legendsofamerica.com/old-west-gunfights/


https://www.cracked.com/image-pictofact-7363-13-now-you-know-facts-about-the-wild-west-they-didnt-teach-at-school
Bighunter43
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AG
There is no doubt the "gunfight" is a romanticized version of Old West history........some classics did occur, (Bill Hickock) as mentioned, but most just didn't happen.

For example, noted Texas "gunfighter" Bill Longley's historical marker claims he killed 32 men, and in reality it was no more than 8. He was supposed to be lightening fast on the draw....but the murder he would eventually hang for in Lee County he simply rode up to an unarmed opponent and dispatched him in the field while he was plowing. He also killed a preacher in East Texas (Rev. Lay) with a shotgun while the preacher was milking a cow!
marcel ledbetter
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I read a biography on Hank Vaughn, an eastern Oregon rustler who was accustomed to gunfights since he was a teenager. The book opens up with a description of a gunfight between him and the foreman of a big ranch that was very vocal about wanting to rid the countryside of rustlers. They had been drinking whiskey for a while and eventually they got into an argument and decided to settle it with pistols. The book says they held each others left hand began shooting with their right hands. They were each shot four times but both eventually recovered. It would take some powerful rot gut whiskey to make people want to do that.

The book credits Hank with at least thirteen killings and surviving multiple gunshots over the course of his life.
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