Damn, this is getting good.

i listened to the entire interview online

he is hopping mad, but he forgets that he ****ing never did **** to give lebron a chance to win. Lebron carried that city on his back from 2003-2010 and he should be thankful that he took them as far as he could

Going down in flames.

What could have have done different to help LeBron?

When you have a player like LeBron, teams are a lot less willing to give you the better end of deals in trades than if you are a team like the Nets.

he couldve given up hickson for amare. i bet they beat go to eastern conf finals with amare

And if Bron told him not to deal Hickson?

well that fact is unknown. Dan LeBatard said on PTI today that LeBron fought hard for Amar'e to join the cavs, but the suns wanted hickson and the front office wanted to keep him. I dont know how lebron felt about hickson

Cleveland didn't always make the right choices but they were obviously working their arses off to get players for bron bron. They probably should have replaced the coach earlier.

how can you not want to play for an owner like that?

i mean the heat have penny-pinched wade for the last two years and they get rewarded..

yet the cavs and gilbert have shown a commitment to lebron for the last few years..and this is what they get???

gilbert is right on...

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Gilbert just said that James quit on the Cavs in the 2nd round series and has been covered up too long.

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If you watched the series, that statement is pretty much correct. The sorry part of this is it being planned since the Olympics when these guys played together. Then the prima dona move to give CLE the finger on national television.
Although Gilbert's words could have been chosen a bit more carefully, I can understand his bitterness. He revolved his entire program around LeBron, and now will lose an enormous amount of money due to his leaving.

Coach K to miami to coach team usa-lite

This guy really needs to take a breather. He is embarrassing himself.

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What could have have done different to help LeBron?

When you have a player like LeBron, teams are a lot less willing to give you the better end of deals in trades than if you are a team like the Nets

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Agreed. Looks like they did what they could to give him a chance. They just couldn't get that 'Pippen' guy. I don't fault LeBron for going somewhere to play with another superstar.

[This message has been edited by claym711 (edited 7/9/2010 8:21a).]

The problem I have with the owner is that while I do think he tried to get Lebron a team... he subtlely nickeled and dimed to do so.

Like Lebron or not, he's basically a once in 20-25 years talent in the NBA. You don't bring in Mike Brown to coach that kind of guy... you've got to bring in the best. And they opted for Antawn Jamison over Amare because of JJ Hickson? Come on... that's a joke. I think Amare's overrated, but he's been the top or 2nd guy on a lot of extremely good teams while Jamison's been nothing better than a 2nd or 3rd banana on tons of mediocre teams.

Face it, without Lebron, the Cavs really weren't run any better than the Clippers or T-Wolves...

somebody should have locked dan gilbert in a broom closet last night.

he's making a fool of himself and bringing down the cavs with him.

last night should have been about lebron stabbing cleveland in the back. now it's partly about that, but also partly about what a sore loser brat dan gilbert is.

if anything, he's helping lebron out because he's showing much of america what kind of guy lebron's been working for the last 5 years

Nickel and dime? They had one of the highest payrolls in the league the past several years. I'd agree they should have tanked Brown sooner and we can argue all day about the wisdom of some personnel moves, but to say they nickel and dimed is just moronic. They may not have been wise, but they weren't cheap. In fact, oftentimes they were probably TOO desperate to find someone to help Lebron, which led to bad decisions and more $$$ out the door.

[This message has been edited by Danny Duberstein (edited 7/9/2010 8:47a).]

exactly why he left. Like i said on another thread. Acting Like George Steinbrenner works... if you have the rings to back it up. You can't go all fire and brimstome when its a proven fact you havent found THE BEST players for LeBron to work with. Not getting stoudemire, signing larry hughes (?????), signing Mo Williams, not drafting a players that fit what LeBron needed led to his (gilbert's) downfall.

when i meant "signing larry hughes and mo williams" i was trying to say, overpaying for both to gigantic contracts

i forgot to add not going after michael redd (although he's injured now, who knows what would've happened injury-wise had he been signed with cleveland years ago) when redd had the chance to be a free agent years ago and LeBron was begging management to sign him

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Nickel and dime?

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Yes, nickel and dime... I don't give a damn how much money you spend on payroll. If you didn't pull a trigger on a deal for a top 20 player in the league but rather a top 80 or so guy... and the difference is freaking JJ Hickson, that's a petty move and totally nickel and diming.

Think about that, they went all in for Jamison rather than Stoudemire, because the Stoudemire option wanted your 7th or 8th best guy too. That's not petty to you?

To borrow from baseball, the Astros had a really high payroll too, but they're known as a pretty nickel and diming organization and for good reason too.

In a few years, Stoudemire is a guy that is going to be getting paid $20MM to watch 40-50+ games per year. I won't fault anyone for staying away from him. I can't decide whether he or Joe Johnson were the worst signing this offseason. In my book, trading for him would have been along the lines of past desperate moves that drove their payroll to the top of the leauge but didn't make a difference.

[This message has been edited by Danny Duberstein (edited 7/9/2010 9:00a).]

regarding amare, i think it's telling that the organization with what should be the best medical data on him (phoenix) refused to guarantee the last two years.

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somebody should have locked dan gilbert in a broom closet last night.

he's making a fool of himself and bringing down the cavs with him.

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Totally agree.

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Nickel and dime? They had one of the highest payrolls in the league the past several years.

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Totally agree. Cavs have been paying luxury tax for years. In fact, the Cavs probably weren't at all profitable. Gilbert was probably losing money on them.

It isn't like you have people in Cleveland that are paying 2k/game for front row seats.

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Yes, nickel and dime... I don't give a damn how much money you spend on payroll. If you didn't pull a trigger on a deal for a top 20 player in the league but rather a top 80 or so guy... and the difference is freaking JJ Hickson, that's a petty move and totally nickel and diming.

Think about that, they went all in for Jamison rather than Stoudemire, because the Stoudemire option wanted your 7th or 8th best guy too. That's not petty to you?

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You think James wasn't consulted on each and every move? How do we know that James didn't want to keep Hickson and thought that giving up depth would be worse than the difference between Amare and Jamison? Even if they traded for Amare, I don't think Bron would have resigned. He made up his mind long ago.

2009 Numbers:
Jamison
22.2 points
8.9 rebounds
.468/.351/.754
Amare:
21.4 points
8.1 rebounds
.539/.835 (only took 7 threes all season)

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In a few years, Stoudemire is a guy that is going to be getting paid $20MM to watch 40-50+ games per year. I won't fault anyone for staying away from him. I can't decide whether he or Joe Johnson were the worst signing this offseason.

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... and in a few years, Antawn Jamison is going to be 37 or 38 and even more useless... we aren't talking about Amare this offseason. We're talking about last season.

Cleveland doesn't = LA, NY, Chicago, Miami, or even places like Dallas, Houston, Orlando or Phoenix. At the end of the day, those are the places the best players want to go. Because of that, you might have to overpay a little bit to get that 2nd star player. Cleveland did a good job of bringing in decent rotational players and everything, but when it came to landing the 2nd big stud, they stiffened up and didn't do what they needed to do. Because of that, the Cavs organization should be pissed at themselves for this.

The fans of Cleveland should be pissed at Lebron for the way he did it and the Cavs organization for not doing whatever it takes to bring in the help any NBA superstar needs to wing a championship.

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You think James wasn't consulted on each and every move? How do we know that James didn't want to keep Hickson and thought that giving up depth would be worse than the difference between Amare and Jamison? Even if they traded for Amare, I don't think Bron would have resigned. He made up his mind long ago.

2009 Numbers:
Jamison
22.2 points
8.9 rebounds
.468/.351/.754
Amare:
21.4 points
8.1 rebounds
.539/.835 (only took 7 threes all season)

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Jamison's numbers were on a pretty ****ty Wizards team where the numbers meant nothing while Stoudemire did it on one of the best teams in the league. Come on... you have to know comparing their stats is a disingenuos way to compare the 2 players.

Maybe Amare doesn't put the Cavs over the top and maybe Lebron doesn't come back, but who knows what happens?

I'm sure James was consulted on moves to an extent, but given what they had on their roster, I really have serious doubts that he shook his head when they said they'd have to throw JJ Hickson into a package to grab Amare who he apparently has wanted to play with for a pretty long time.

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Cleveland did a good job of bringing in decent rotational players and everything, but when it came to landing the 2nd big stud, they stiffened up and didn't do what they needed to do.

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Seriously, what could they have done? They never had cap room. Teams don't want to trade Robin to Batman so they can go on and win a decades' worth of hardware.

They should have scouted better for better draft picks. They had the 10th pick in 04 and blew it on Luke Jackson. He could have been Andris Beidrins, Al Jefferson, Josh Smith, JR Smith, Jameer Nelson, or Kevin Martin. All would have made a nice second player - especially Al Jefferson and Kevin Martin.

Can't really complain about Shannon Brown with the 25th pick or JJ Hickson with the 19th pick.

But I have seen the Cavs scrambling to make deals throughout the last 7 years. But no one is going to give a team with the most talented player in the NBA a big stud.

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Jamison's numbers were on a pretty ****ty Wizards team where the numbers meant nothing while Stoudemire did it on one of the best teams in the league. Come on... you have to know comparing their stats is a disingenuos way to compare the 2 players.

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And Amare's numbers came on one of the biggest run and gun teams we have ever seen while one of the best point guards in NBA history is feeding him easy baskets. Jamison's team sucked, but he also put those numbers up without a real point guard on the team. SF Caron Butler was the only player on that team to average over 3.6 assists per game. It isn't disingenuous at all.

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But I have seen the Cavs scrambling to make deals throughout the last 7 years. But no one is going to give a team with the most talented player in the NBA a big stud.

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Kobe Bryant, Kupchack, and Pau Gasol would disagree.

Amare also got all of numbers on a much more talented team than the Wizards. Mike James scored 20 PPG on a bad team one season too.

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Kobe Bryant, Kupchack, and Pau Gasol would disagree.

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And how often do deals like that happen? I mean, it isn't every day that the biggest bust ever from a number 1 pick is traded for a proven All-Star, right?

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Amare also got all of numbers on a much more talented team than the Wizards. Mike James scored 20 PPG on a bad team one season too.

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Which might hold some validity, if it wasn't for the fact that Jamison put up 20/9 on a few playoff teams. It isn't like he pulled a Shareef and only put up numbers on ****ty teams, then got on a good team and put up nothing. Jamison is capable of putting up good numbers on decent teams. He isn't a bad player by any means. Not a huge downgrade from Amare.

Gilbert did everything an OWNER was supposed to do for Lebron -- he opened up his check book and wrote every check that was asked of him.

BTW, stuff does have a way of deflecting off of Lebron. People want to believe he's the greatest ever and close their eyes to his massive failures in the post season. I mean, at times in that Boston series the Cavs were better with Lebron OFF the floor.

If Cleveland should be mad at anyone, it should be Delonte West, he's the reason James is out of there

~ Trust Me, I'm A Doctor ~

Dan Gilbert typing up his comic-sans screed:

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And how often do deals like that happen? I mean, it isn't every day that the biggest bust ever from a number 1 pick is traded for a proven All-Star, right?

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Not very often... I was using it as an example that if teams actually do trade really good players to teams with superstars already in place. Also see Garnett. Look, I'm not saying the Cavs didn't do their job because they didn't bend some poor team over in a trade ala the Lakers... I'm simply pointing out that they were petty and cheaper with certain things and then got pissed when their once in a generation type player ditched them... what did they expect?

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Which might hold some validity, if it wasn't for the fact that Jamison put up 20/9 on a few playoff teams. It isn't like he pulled a Shareef and only put up numbers on ****ty teams, then got on a good team and put up nothing. Jamison is capable of putting up good numbers on decent teams. He isn't a bad player by any means. Not a huge downgrade from Amare.

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I actually think Abudur-Rahim is a GREAT comparison to Antawn Jamison. Sure, he put up points for a Wizards team that was barely over .500 and made the playoffs ... in the historically weak Eastern Conference. The only legitimately good team he played for before the Cavs were the Mavs... he came off the bench for them.

Amare >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamison ... if you are honest with yourself on this one, you can't even begin to deny that.