Justin Verlander.

Ace.

ceeej wilson went 6.1 giving up 2 hits with 7k in his first ever playoff start. i dont believe ceeej is an ace, but just pointing out that your are still in fact a complete dumbass...carry on.

The better point would have been Verlander has now gone at least 7 innings while giving up 1 or 0 runs in 4 of his last 5 playoff starts.

It was an offshoot of another thread.

Lefraud was dead on as always, though.

I've never seen someone try and draw attention to his own dumbass statements as much as corleone.

And i've never had as big a fan as hayden.

It's still flattering.

Best ERA in the AL this year goes 4.1 IP, 5ER in a home playoff game.

Ace?

Post Season Games Only

Anibal Sanchez: 3.03 ERA (4 GS, 24.2 IP)
Justin Verlander: 3.84 ERA (13 GS, 77.1 IP)
CJ Wilson: 4.82 ERA (10 G, 9 GS, 52.1 IP)

quote:

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Post Season Games Only

Clay Bucholz: 4.09 ERA ERA (2 GS, 11 IP)
CJ Wilson: 4.82 ERA (10 G, 9 GS, 51.1 IP)

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http://texags.com/main/forum.reply.asp?topic_id=2381779&forum_id=53&page=last#r37241344

And David Price?

That's the point -- in a ridiculous "ace" debate it's easy to cherry pick certain guys who put up good regular season #'s and certain guys who put up good playoff #'s.

Sanchez hardly looked like an "ace" today... But he did in the 2012 playoffs... But in the 2012 regular season he wasn't even Top 15 ERA.

Ditto a dozen other pitchers in similar scenarios.

The funny thing is that you can debate whether or not several guys are "aces".

The butthurt in this thread, and others, stems from the fact CJ still isn't one of those guys.

It's not from the fact that you listed 15 pitchers who were "aces", and half of them have put up #'s worse than CJ since then?

But if having TxAggie2011 on your side -- a guy that has had at least two posters point out how he tries to disagree with absolutely everything I post -- makes you feel better then good for you.

CJ Wilson = "a #3 at best" because he **** the bed in the playoffs a few times.

But Bucholz and Price and Sanchez are "aces", even though... well, they **** the bed in the playoffs a few times.

I'll step out of this one again now that I've made you look foolish... Though I guess at least there is a brightside for you -- you were too chicken**** to take the bet I offered a few years back so at least you aren't looking foolish AND out some money.

I'd bow out, again, as well.

You look as obsessed as you do foolish.

quote:

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And David Price?

That's the point -- in a ridiculous "ace" debate it's easy to cherry pick certain guys who put up good regular season #'s and certain guys who put up good playoff #'s

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Those are the names that got thrown out there.

Give me names, I'll post the numbers.

David Price's playoff ERA is 5.06 in 32 innings over 9 games (4 starts). His ERA is even worse than CJ's.

Happy?

Give me the names of any of the guys you think might be aces and/oror #1s. I'll post the numbers of whoever you give me, but I think if you name enough names, the trend is most of them have ERAs better than 4.82.

quote:

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But if having TxAggie2011 on your side

CJ Wilson = "a #3 at best" because he **** the bed in the playoffs a few times.

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If that's Corleone's side, I'm not on his side.

I've said 100+1 times I think CJ isn't what I consider an "ace", but he could be a "#1"- I believe we're saying that is a guy you sign long term to lead your staff in the long term- I just think he's on the low end of who you'd want. You need a deep staff if CJ is your "#1." I'd much rather have him as my #2 (as the Angels have set up their rotation with Weaver taking "#1" duties), and if I was so fortunate, plan on CJ being a #2/#3 with a 3rd guy.

Example:

Sanchez's average ERA+ over the last 4 years is virtually identical to CJ's (123.5 to 123.75), Sanchez's body of playoff work has been better. They'll take brilliant season's like the one he's had, but Detroit hasn't and has no plans for him to be their "#1". They have Verlander for that.

I've also said I think the biggest lesson from CJ's regression the past two seasons is that maybe its not incredibly wise to give long, expensive contracts except to a small group of players. Anaheim isn't going to be so welcoming of CJ's averageness-ish of the past two seasons when his contract bumps up $5 million next season, and $2 million each the two seasons after that.

[This message has been edited by TXAggie2011 (edited 10/7/2013 10:23p).]

I never said CJ was a 2/3 because he sucked in the playoffs.

I said he's a 2/3 AND he sucked in the playoffs.

haydens hurt feelings, time and again, ignore this simple distinction.

But yeah...CJ still isn't an ace.

And you'll notice that some of these guys who have had bad post season games have better body's or work than Ceej.

You know, MVPs, Cy Youngs, and WS rings.

Ceej is most well known for losing an AS game and a WS game in the same year.