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Need a real estate attorney in BCS or Houston

3,207 Views | 26 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by davido
TulaneAg
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We just sold a house in Houston in September and the name brand title company screwed up royally. Someone attached the wrong payoff letter to my account so they miscalculated the closing dollars AND ended up paying off someone else's note/loan/lien instead of mine with our proceeds. Just uncovered all this yesterday. I need to make sure everything gets fixed correctly and they pay their fare share. Email me at username @ yahoo with recommendations or post them here.

TIA ya'll.
Aggiemike96
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AG
I'm curious how this unfolds. Seems like the title company would be able to rectify this with little effort on your part. Perhaps your previous lender continued to draft payments from you? Keep us posted.
Red Pear Luke
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TulaneAg said:

We just sold a house in Houston in September and the name brand title company screwed up royally. Someone attached the wrong payoff letter to my account so they miscalculated the closing dollars AND ended up paying off someone else's note/loan/lien instead of mine with our proceeds. Just uncovered all this yesterday. I need to make sure everything gets fixed correctly and they pay their fare share. Email me at username @ yahoo with recommendations or post them here.

TIA ya'll.


Culley Lipsey should be quite helpful for this

https://www.collegestationlawyers.com/cully-lipsey

Sponsor Message: We Split Commissions. Full Service Agents in Austin, Bryan-College Station, Dallas-Fort Worth, Houston and San Antonio. Red Pear Realty
Orlando Ayala Cant Read
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Adam Fracht in Spring (with Stibbs) is a good Ag and thorough attorney.
The Fife
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Watchlisted.

Wouldn't this be an obvious enough screwup that the original title company would be all over it to make things right? I'd figure they'd be out to mitigate damages on this ASAP.
MS08
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Following. Yes, would press the title
Company to rectify this post haste. Sorry for the mess someone made
TulaneAg
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Sorry guys..I've been busy trying to fix the problem this past week and finally have time to give an explanation and update.

We sold our house in Houston in early September. We had a traditional mortgage and then a subordinate SBA loan from our Harvey rebuild that needed to be paid off from the proceeds of the sale. I honestly did not know what we owed on the SBA loan. I've sold two other properties on which SBA added themselves as 2nd lien holders when we secured the original loan and 100% of the proceeds from those sales went towards the principal on the SBA loan. That plus paying $850/mo on a 1.5% loan over 5 years...I never sat down and figured out what the balance would/could/should be.

Pre-closing, the title company does their title search and sees both loans and adds the payoff amounts to our side of the closing statement...standard stuff. They posted the SBA payoff at ~$62k. We close, we get the balance of funds at closing, and all is well.

Last weekend, we receive a written notice from SBA forwarded from our old mailing address that we haven't made a payment since August, here's your late fee, etc. on a balance of $157k. I call the SBA and the only activity on our account since our August payment was a payoff letter to XXXXX Title Co on Sept 6th in the amount of $157k. No record of a ~$62k payoff letter, $62k payment from the closing statement, no full payoff, nothing….nada. On Monday morning I get ahold of the title company and they have transaction numbers, records, etc. for a payment to SBA in the amount of ~$62k...all looks good and correct from their end but they'll look into it.

Turns out, the title company posted someone else's SBA payoff letter with the wrong account number and the wrong payoff amount (~$60k not $157k) to OUR closing file, inserted their payoff amount on our closing statement, and actually sent that payoff amount to the SBA and paid off someone else's loan with our funds.

Their reaction on Tuesday afternoon after I reached out on Monday morning was: "It seems we made a mistake. We are working with the SBA to apply the funds to your account. You were overpaid at closing and owe us $95k immediately. Will you be paying with a cashier's check or will you be wiring the funds?"

Before I paid back the money, I wanted to contact an attorney to make sure I wasn't covered from their error by some sort of errors & omissions insurance, law, statute, etc. Alas, it seems they are immune from their own errors and I do not get to keep the overpayment. And no one seems to want to answer my hypothetical question, "what happens if I've already blown that money on hookers and blow in Vegas?"

That's the story…sorry for the week+ of silence.


aggiepaintrain
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AG
this sounds like an attorney is not needed

Diggity
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somebody done played too much Monopoly



to the OP...thanks for taking the time to explain what happened. Sounds like a total PITA. Least the title company could have done is refund your escrow fee.
MS08
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Thanks for the explanation. A pretty huge administrative error so that's frustrating but nothing to do other than pay the piper.
Copp
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The first offer is never the best offer.

They definitely don't want a complaint filed against them with TDI. I'd provide a little resistance and ask for what I want. Who you sold it to has an encumbered title and can file a claim against their owners title policy. Title would have to payout and try and subrogate.

If the money wasn't supposed to be yours in the first place then play to your conscious, but that still wouldn't stop me from providing some resistance and ask them to take some responsibility for their mistake. Title wants this resolved and will work towards a reasonable solution.
Diggity
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Copp said:

The first offer is never the best offer.

They definitely don't want a complaint filed against them with TDI. I'd provide a little resistance and ask for what I want. Who you sold it to has an encumbered title and can file a claim against their owners title policy. Title would have to payout and try and subrogate.

If the money wasn't supposed to be yours in the first place then play to your conscious, but that still wouldn't stop me from providing some resistance and ask them to take some responsibility for their mistake. Title wants this resolved and will work towards a reasonable solution.
why would they have encumbered title?
Red Pear Luke
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Diggity said:

Copp said:

The first offer is never the best offer.

They definitely don't want a complaint filed against them with TDI. I'd provide a little resistance and ask for what I want. Who you sold it to has an encumbered title and can file a claim against their owners title policy. Title would have to payout and try and subrogate.

If the money wasn't supposed to be yours in the first place then play to your conscious, but that still wouldn't stop me from providing some resistance and ask them to take some responsibility for their mistake. Title wants this resolved and will work towards a reasonable solution.
why would they have encumbered title?
Because there is technically a second lien unreleased and thus still in effect with the prior owner. So that Second Lien - theoretically has a potential claim to property.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cloud_on_title.asp
Sponsor Message: We Split Commissions. Full Service Agents in Austin, Bryan-College Station, Dallas-Fort Worth, Houston and San Antonio. Red Pear Realty
ElephantRider
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Definitely sucks, but I can't imagine going through a real estate transaction and not reviewing the CD and checking the payoffs.
Diggity
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gotcha...I thought we were talking about a long-term encumbrance. That one will (presumably) be cleared.

I'm a little skeptical of how much liability the title company has beyond rectifying the error.

Clients sign so many CYA docs covering the title company on E&O that I'm we all sign our rights away somewhere in that package.
Aggiemike96
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OP, you didn't know if you owed $157 or $62? Wowser. You're either a billionaire and these amounts are immaterial, or you should stay on top of your finances better.
MS08
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htxag09
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You really thought you could just pocket $95K because someone made a mistake?
TulaneAg
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Diggity said:

gotcha...I thought we were talking about a long-term encumbrance. That one will (presumably) be cleared.

I'm a little skeptical of how much liability the title company has beyond rectifying the error.

Clients sign so many CYA docs covering the title company on E&O that I'm we all sign our rights away somewhere in that package.


Spot on: We got a demand letter from their attorney threatening legal action within 3 days of pointing out their error to them and one piece of backup they provided was a document we signed during closing where we agreed to correct any errors as soon as possible.
TulaneAg
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Aggiemike96 said:

OP, you didn't know if you owed $157 or $62? Wowser. You're either a billionaire and these amounts are immaterial, or you should stay on top of your finances better.


Not a billionaire. If you read one of my paragraphs i explained there had been a lot of action on that account recently so had no idea. Probably should've had a better idea but also bought and sold close to 30 properties over x years and never had an error like this. So probably a little numb and/or lax to the process and the ability for modern idiots to screw sh*t up.
Copp
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It isn't a second anymore if the first got paid off. And if the new borrower purchased with a loan, that new borrowers lender is supposed to be in first position but is currently subordinate behind a lien that should have already been paid off and released. So they are open to a mortgagee and owner claim

Title wants it resolved asap. Many sellers spend the money on a new home or item. Highly presumptuous that the money is just sitting in an account
itsyourboypookie
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Red Pear BCS Luke said:

Diggity said:

Copp said:

The first offer is never the best offer.

They definitely don't want a complaint filed against them with TDI. I'd provide a little resistance and ask for what I want. Who you sold it to has an encumbered title and can file a claim against their owners title policy. Title would have to payout and try and subrogate.

If the money wasn't supposed to be yours in the first place then play to your conscious, but that still wouldn't stop me from providing some resistance and ask them to take some responsibility for their mistake. Title wants this resolved and will work towards a reasonable solution.
why would they have encumbered title?
Because there is technically a second lien unreleased and thus still in effect with the prior owner. So that Second Lien - theoretically has a potential claim to property.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cloud_on_title.asp


That second lien is now first lien. I'd let them foreclose. The new lender has a bullet proof policy, they can pay for the attorneys to un**** this.
normaleagle05
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aggiepaintrain said:

this sounds like an attorney is not needed



Serious question. Do you own a title company?

Get hit with a demand letter for $95k right now or we'll sue you over our mistake. Nope, no attorney needed. Only the title company could take that position.
aggiepaintrain
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normaleagle05 said:

aggiepaintrain said:

this sounds like an attorney is not needed



Serious question. Do you own a title company?

Get hit with a demand letter for $95k right now or we'll sue you over our mistake. Nope, no attorney needed. Only the title company could take that position.


How can you not know your payoff? Then say, thanks for $95k, y'all are delirious.
Waste money on a lawyer you're gonna lose
TulaneAg
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aggiepaintrain said:

normaleagle05 said:

aggiepaintrain said:

this sounds like an attorney is not needed



Serious question. Do you own a title company?

Get hit with a demand letter for $95k right now or we'll sue you over our mistake. Nope, no attorney needed. Only the title company could take that position.


No I'm just an honest person unlike it seems like many of you. How can you not know your payoff? Then say, thanks for $95k, y'all are delirious


Edit original response... It was too harsh. Tis the season.... I'm gonna let paintrain revel in his perfection.
normaleagle05
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So at what point do you wire them the $95k? Remember that they've already performed the services you signed a pile of paperwork authorizing them to perform. What if they don't pay off the 165k you owe with the 95k you send them? Who is at going to cure the 65k note that was paid off? Do those borrowers already have a recorded release of lien to shield them from repayment?

It's incredibly short sighted to think that you acting in a conscionable manner will cause the incompetent to be both good hearted and competent.
davido
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TulaneAg said:

Diggity said:



I'm a little skeptical of how much liability the title company has beyond rectifying the error.

Clients sign so many CYA docs covering the title company on E&O that I'm we all sign our rights away somewhere in that package.


Spot on: We got a demand letter from their attorney threatening legal action within 3 days of pointing out their error to them and one piece of backup they provided was a document we signed during closing where we agreed to correct any errors as soon as possible.


This is key. As I was reading the thread, I was thinking, "There is a specific document in that closing stack that directly addresses this." I remember signing it multiple times. You've already agreed to take the necessary steps to fix it. Their error, but you'll be the one in breach of contract IMO.
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