I grew up with high hands flying right elbow and reverse C. Thanks Jack. That flying right elbow causes me to cross the line at the top and I can't fix it. So be it. I did stop Reverse C. Protect my back. Here are some swing trends I've seen in my life and my thoughts.

• Dog wags the tail mechanical swing: Dave Leadbetter and Faldo. Core controls the swing. I just couldn't generate a lot of swing speed with this.
• Gravity golf: Let the arms just fall with gravity. ehh...
• X-factor: Jim McLean figured larger the delta between the hip turn and the shoulder turn results in longer shots. Except when many tried to restrict the hip turn, they couldn't make the shoulder turn.
• Single Plane: Jim Hardy... I guess it has merit as many swing on single plane. I just couldn't.
• Natural Golf: Moe.
• Stack and Tilt: Bennett and Plumber... and of course Foley ****ed up Tiger's left knee with this, I think

And the latest trend: Shallow the club on the downswing while you squat to take a dump then rotate your upper body through the shot. Can y'all really pull this off intentionally? Golf club should shallow automatically due to gravitational and centrifugal forces already.

Of course we can't not discuss Ben Hogan's Five Fundamentals. What he forgot to add to the title of the book was Five Fundamentals TO NOT HIT A HOOKEN****ER when you early extend and have a super strong grip.

But the instruction I subscribe to is Ernest Jones Swing the Clubhead as I feel left arm swings the club and the body/core responds.

Still a fairly new golfer (2 years playing more than 2-3 times a year), and I guess I'd call what I learned the single-plain swing. Still feels robotic and unnatural, but I hit the ball better everytime compared to anything else I slip into doing.

I personally do not subscribe to the "shallow, squat, rotate"

I have tried to make it work. Committed to it for a few months, and just played the worst golf of my life. It was so unnatural feeling to me, and I hit either 45 degree blocks or insane hooks.

I'm tall, and in general just try to takeaway a little steep, transition smooth, and just naturally flatten out a little as I rotate. I hit a nice draw with it when I'm practicing enough. Occasionally I swing big and get across the line and lose patience and hook that ****er to Bernie Sanders, but it's playable. Oh and sometimes I get sloppy with setup and bring my right foot back, do everything right, but the path is so in to out, it also goes lefter than left.

khaos288 said:

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I personally do not subscribe to the "shallow, squat, rotate"

I have tried to make it work. Committed to it for a few months, and just played the worst golf of my life. It was so unnatural feeling to me, and I hit either 45 degree blocks or insane hooks.

I'm tall, and in general just try to takeaway a little steep, transition smooth, and just naturally flatten out a little as I rotate. I hit a nice draw with it when I'm practicing enough. Occasionally I swing big and get across the line and lose patience and hook that ****er to Bernie Sanders, but it's playable. Oh and sometimes I get sloppy with setup and bring my right foot back, do everything right, but the path is so in to out, it also goes lefter than left.

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Tall as well and can't hit a driver. Weak slice / fade. I hate it!

Leander - Ag said:

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khaos288 said:

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I personally do not subscribe to the "shallow, squat, rotate"

I have tried to make it work. Committed to it for a few months, and just played the worst golf of my life. It was so unnatural feeling to me, and I hit either 45 degree blocks or insane hooks.

I'm tall, and in general just try to takeaway a little steep, transition smooth, and just naturally flatten out a little as I rotate. I hit a nice draw with it when I'm practicing enough. Occasionally I swing big and get across the line and lose patience and hook that ****er to Bernie Sanders, but it's playable. Oh and sometimes I get sloppy with setup and bring my right foot back, do everything right, but the path is so in to out, it also goes lefter than left.

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Tall as well and can't hit a driver. Weak slice / fade. I hate it!

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The guy I got lessons from gave me a great setup tweak. I'm tall and super right eye dominant. He had me tilt my head to the right to see the inside of the ball more. The line I was seeing as "straight back straight through" was like two dimples outside in.


No clue if that's helpful, but boy do I tear up the inside cover nowadays. I've got to make sure not to over tilt, or else hook city. Also helps drop the right shoulder.

Leander - Ag said:

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khaos288 said:

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I personally do not subscribe to the "shallow, squat, rotate"

I have tried to make it work. Committed to it for a few months, and just played the worst golf of my life. It was so unnatural feeling to me, and I hit either 45 degree blocks or insane hooks.

I'm tall, and in general just try to takeaway a little steep, transition smooth, and just naturally flatten out a little as I rotate. I hit a nice draw with it when I'm practicing enough. Occasionally I swing big and get across the line and lose patience and hook that ****er to Bernie Sanders, but it's playable. Oh and sometimes I get sloppy with setup and bring my right foot back, do everything right, but the path is so in to out, it also goes lefter than left.

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Tall as well and can't hit a driver. Weak slice / fade. I hate it!

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You might benefit from Shallow-Squat-Turn.

It's called the Hooken****er
I actually get credit for submitting it to the urban dictionary. Should be under u da man.

Trust me brother. There is not enough pages in books in the world to encapsulate the myriad of words I've used to describe that shot.

I remember 30 years ago on the takeaway my clubhead should be pointed straight up in the air when it reached hip level. Now the face seems closed at the hip for everybody.

Bobby Jones "How I play Golf" series. Maybe we should have quit right there.

Even if you don't sign up for their program, watch some of their You Tube videos. Especially "Pros vs Ams" series. They don't label the swing as Stack n Tilt, Single Plane or any of the other catchy titles. They show you what the pros do versus what the amateurs do. I can say it has helped me.

Athletic Motion Golf

Oh yeah, those 2 clowns. After watching their video, I'm sure to go out and shoot a smooth 92.

Wearer of the Ring said:

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Bobby Jones "How I play Golf" series. Maybe we should have quit right there.

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I love those black and white videos. My all time favorite golf instruction book is Bobby Jones on golf. It's not a swing instruction book rather how to play the game as he so eloquently wrote. The book only has about 5 drawings of Bobby swinging...

Jones certainly had his idiosyncrasies in his swing but his tempo, Balance and the impact position are ever so perfect Imo.

I believe he is mostly forgotten and underrated today but for me. He's one of the top 3 greats. And certainly one of the best putters to roll the ball on the green.

AggieDruggist89 said:

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Oh yeah, those 2 clowns. After watching their video, I'm sure to go out and shoot a smooth 92.

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Not sure why you are calling them "clowns"? Shaun Webb has been on Golf Digest's Top 100 instructors for the past two years. What they are talking about in their videos is backed up by using Gears technology to see what pros do in their swings and what is different and could be faults in the amateur swings they see. What is it that you don't like?

I believe their diagnosis and analysis are spot on with their use of computer model. Wondering if their program is a derivative of "Swing Like a Pro" program authored by Ralph Mann.

Everyone is different and most amateurs can't swing like a pro no matter how much or how hard we try to emulate them. X-factor is one example.

I understand their intent and I especially like their visual or what pro's pelvis/hip does in the swing. But to incorporate what they teach even though Shawn (is that the short guy?) provides the drills, it's much more difficult than we can fathom.

Like many other instructors, they put a lot of emphasis on freeze frame position of the body/club throughout the swing even though they illustrate slow motion where the positions are. unfortunately, I feel golf swing is a lot more non-static and much more difficult to teach.

For me, I focus on tempo, balance and steadiness when I practice fullswing and nothing much more.

I call them clowns because one time I had a pretty long drive for a round of golf and watched their video on the way down. And the mistake was trying to incorporate what Shawn taught-swing the hands faster.. and had one of the worst round of the year last year.

I know this.....

Monte Scheinblume is the layman's answer to AMG - very aligned philosophically, but much easier to understand/follow.

Look at his "No Cast/Turn" video.

Watched this yesterday so now i'm obsessed with trying to lower my arms

MW03 said:

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Watched this yesterday so now i'm obsessed with trying to lower my arms

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Looking forward to your FGolf thread post!

AggieDruggist89 said:

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Wearer of the Ring said:

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Bobby Jones "How I play Golf" series. Maybe we should have quit right there.

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I love those black and white videos. My all time favorite golf instruction book is Bobby Jones on golf. It's not a swing instruction book rather how to play the game as he so eloquently wrote. The book only has about 5 drawings of Bobby swinging...

Jones certainly had his idiosyncrasies in his swing but his tempo, Balance and the impact position are ever so perfect Imo.

I believe he is mostly forgotten and underrated today but for me. He's one of the top 3 greats. And certainly one of the best putters to roll the ball on the green.

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When you say best putters, are you saying around, top 15, top 25 or top 50 range?

Didi is my swing spirit animal.

We are usually the 2nd group off at my home course on the weekends, and the first group has a guy with the same reverse/sideways pivot like the dude in that video. Hits a beautifully consistent draw with good distance and is probably about a 2-3 handicap. The other 3 have better looking swings and worse handicaps. Have always smh. That's golf

G Martin 87 said:

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Didi is my swing spirit animal.

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The classic "National Guard" swing.

Fire and fall back.

I started playing in 2012. What I have noticed is the difference in "old school" vs modern swing theory is how to square the club face.

Old school,toe up to toe up. Meaning toe to the sky at last parallel on the back swing and then toe up again at last parallel on the follow through. This requires a you to relax the forearms and let the face rotate during the swing.

Modern, keep face parallel with spine throughout swing. Requires much less face rotation with you hands and forearms but requires more hip action imo.

Modern techniques works better for me but I can see the other method working for others.