At my course, a 2-3 handicap came in at 12 and won the member guest last month.

Past weekend, I was the guest at my old club where my buddy gorilla and I won the MG as a scratch/4 handicap 3 years ago. The winner this year was 12 member and 25 guest. Member is a legit 7 and the guest was a young kid about 4 to 5. Yes, we were the runner up and lost on the 18th alternate shot. Totally my fault with a blocked drive.

But net 55 on sunday got them in the shoot out.

AggieDruggist89 said:

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At my course, a 2-3 handicap came in at 12 and won the member guest last month.

Past weekend, I was the guest at my old club where my buddy gorilla and I won the MG as a scratch/4 handicap 3 years ago. The winner this year was 12 member and 25 guest. Member is a legit 7 and the guest was a young kid about 4 to 5. Yes, we were the runner up and lost on the 18th alternate shot. Totally my fault with a blocked drive.

But net 55 on sunday got them in the shoot out.

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how do you know the bolded parts of your post?

I'm curious too. Your course pro should know if that guy is a 2-3 or a 12. If he's not a 12, he should have adjusted it prior to the tournament. Unless you meant the guest turned in a 12.

I was recently in a league event where a well known sandbagger with a 18 index carded a net 8 under round. I was a little disappointed that I stupidly threw in $100 to this guy's pocket. Another member sent this graphic to me. So basically he had a one in 1,138 chance to shoot that round.

jj9000 said:

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AggieDruggist89 said:

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Totally my fault with a blocked drive.

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Would never have happened if you were in full MISIG shape, and swinging a 2023 Driver.

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Very true.

Now...my driver is fairly new. Ping G425 Max.

AgOutsideAustin said:

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Did those cheaters use a leaf blower too ?

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Only in the fall.

DargelSkout said:

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I'm curious too. Your course pro should know if that guy is a 2-3 or a 12. If he's not a 12, he should have adjusted it prior to the tournament. Unless you meant the guest turned in a 12.

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New Pro started in June this year.

There were many golfers with "stated handicaps."

MAROON said:

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AggieDruggist89 said:

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At my course, a 2-3 handicap came in at 12 and won the member guest last month.

Past weekend, I was the guest at my old club where my buddy gorilla and I won the MG as a scratch/4 handicap 3 years ago. The winner this year was 12 member and 25 guest. Member is a legit 7 and the guest was a young kid about 4 to 5. Yes, we were the runner up and lost on the 18th alternate shot. Totally my fault with a blocked drive.

But net 55 on sunday got them in the shoot out.

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how do you know the bolded parts of your post?

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2-3 guy, no one knew him but he's been a member. I played against him and he was talking about his outing to Pinehurst...where he shot 76...75..etc. And he carded a gross 76 when I played him. The legit 7 guy is well known at the other course and he tells everyone he's a 7. The 25 handicap kid... you're right. I don't know he's a 4-5 other than they net 55 on Sunday.

so these guys either don't turn in their scores to the GHIN or they turn in incorrect scores then.

Maybe some rule like if you haven't turned in X scores in the month prior to the tourney then your handicap is adjusted down by X number of strokes. And you have to agree that whatever gross score you shoot in the tourney is reported by the club to GHIN.

One of my best golf buddies takes a long time off before his member guest (he's the guest) every year and will start his season playing hero ball leading up to the tourney just to drop a few HC points, like decisions he'd never make in a tourney. I told him I think it's messed up, but to this point, they haven't won anyways

Hdcp committee also can adjust at any point during the tournament

TXAGGIES said:

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Hdcp committee also can adjust at any point during the tournament

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We will be making a recommendation to add a handicap committee.

booradley said:

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Every member guest that I play in uses a 6 month or 12 month low index. That has reduced the bagging a ton in my opinion.

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Have a member guest coming up

It's your low handicap in the previous 12 months

My member-guest has a GHIN requirement. With the "soft cap" GHIN uses, it's harder for somebody to manipulate their handicap in a few months leading up to our cutoff date. But, if someone wants to cheat bad enough, they'll usually find a way to do it.

agreed. Nothing stopping (that I know of) someone from posting incorrect scores into GHIN.

We have the opposite problem in my normal group. Two guys that don't post all their bad rounds or take long gimmies when they are already out of a hole to keep the score low. It sucks playing wolf or a team game when your partner is getting 3-5 fewer strokes than they should be.

The good ol' vanity handicap.

I'll gladly take your money if you have one.

Interesting question that i have with my group.

I never, never take a putt over 2'. I am a bad putter and have missed a few of them in pressure tournaments. Since i putt everything and miss a few times some think i am manipulating my hdcp.

Thoughts if i am not missing on purpose?
Side note, one guy who rakes everything lost a match to me on 18 b/c he missed a 2 ft putt.

Timely - just got an email today from my club that the handicap committee will be using this software moving forward. I'm new to the club so have never played in a tourney - nor do I have any knowledge if this has been an issue. But interesting nonetheless

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/how-to-catch-a-sandbagger-computer-algorithm-tournament-cheats

The biggest hdcp issue i see is courses tend to be not rated equitably.

I'll use two courses as an example since I am familiar with them.

My member guest partner is a 3.5 with most of his rounds at Oakmont.

Oakmont CC (Denton, TX) - he has a 3 course Hdcp
TPC Southwind (Memphis, TN)- he has a 4 course Hdcp

TPC Southwind is a much harder course than 1 stroke. You can miss the fairway, sometimes badly, but still have a legit second shot in at Oakmont. At TPC you are punching out or dropping.

His hdcp does not carry well to my course. Now when i play Oakmont I'll shoot 8-10 strokes better. Am i an sandbagger if i play a tougher course?

Is it common to require a max 10 differential in HC?

Say I'm a 5 and buddy is 16, he says if we're not within 10 can't be together

FirefightAg said:

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Is it common to require a max 10 differential in HC?

Say I'm a 5 and buddy is 16, he says if we're not within 10 can't be together

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Thats a common rule, you can atill play but will be adjusted to a 15

What about flighting after day 1 with max improvement of "X" shots for day 2 - go over that and you get bumped up to the next flight.

TXAGGIES said:

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The biggest hdcp issue i see is courses tend to be not rated equitably.

I'll use two courses as an example since I am familiar with them.

My member guest partner is a 3.5 with most of his rounds at Oakmont.

Oakmont CC (Denton, TX) - 3 course Hdcp
TPC Southwind (Memphis, TN)- 4 course Hdcp

TPC Southwind is a much harder course than 1 stroke. You can miss the fairway, sometimes badly, but still have a legit second shot in at Oakmont. At TPC you are punching out or dropping.

His hdcp does not carry well to my course. Now when i play Oakmont I'll shoot 8-10 strokes better. Am i an sandbagger if i play a tougher course?

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This is spot on. I completely agree that course ratings and slope are problematic.

I play 2 courses primarily.
Cimarron hills in Georgetown is a very difficult golf course.
Escondido in horseshoe bay is rated more difficult than cimarron and I think it's 4 - 5 shots EASIER.

So my handicap is some kind of average between the two. I rarely shoot anywhere near my handicap at cimarron and guys at escondido think I'm a bagger. I can't win.

Data from Blue Golf - I assume it is current / may not be

CH Par 72 Course rating of 77.0 Slope of 145
E Par 71 Course rating of 75.9 Slope of 143

CH has a course rating 5 strokes higher than par and E has a course rating 4.9 strokes higher than par (for scratch players)
CH has a slightly higher slope rating - indicating that is slightly more difficult for the BOGEY golfer - relative to the course rating.

So CH is slightly harder from the rating standpoint.

Do you feel the course rating for CH should be higher than 77 or that E should be much less than 75.9 ?
Everyone's game is different. CH may indeed be much harder for you. And they don't always get these course ratings right - I agree with you on that.