Gen. Ramirez at it again:

http://www.theeagle.com/news/local/article_4249e6fb-50d1-5b9e-9da3-0b16b2375170.html

quote:

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"As a veteran, as one who has presided over many military funerals, I do not think taps or a 21-gun salute is appropriate," said Commandant Joe Ramirez Jr., a retired brigadier general who served in the U.S. Marine Corps. "She is a school mascot. She is not a soldier, sailor, airman or Marine who died in defense for our country."

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Can't wait until this guy leaves A&M. He's the Corps' worst enemy at this point.

[This message has been edited by rebel06 (edited 8/28/2013 2:17p).]

Really......
largest Corps in 40 yrs.
6 new outfits in the last 3 yrs.

What am I missing?

It's pretty easy to grow the Corps in numbers when you water things down enough.

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Can't wait until this guy leaves A&M. He's the Corps' worst enemy at this point.

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I'm not saying this is you, but I find it hilarious how many folks were excited when GVA was out, and now I'm sure they'd love to have him back.

bigtruck, I was in the Corps when GVA was the Commandant and was a fan of him and appreciated all that he did. A good man.

My aunt, June Brown Leap (born in 1922) worked on campus during the war in the Ag and Genetics Departments and was very well-known on campus. (Her oldest brother was Paul A. Brown '28, who was a Marine captain captured on Corregidor and who died in a Jap POW camp in 1945). She published a number of poems in The Battalion and in The Cadence, a book of campusology issued to all students. Much later, she wrote this poem about the original Rev, whom she knew:

Old Rev
(Mascot, Texas Aggies, 1931-1944)
©June Brown Leap


Rev, . . .
Rev, . . .
Reveille!

Where are you, old dog?
Seasoned gridiron-halfer!
Court jester at yell practices!
Circler of bonfires!

Come on, Rev,
I know you’re here somewhere . . .
Has the time been so long?

I remember when you used
To cut in and out among the Aggies
When the big T was being formed
Like a cow dog at roundup time;
Nights when you watched
From the corner of the room
With your head on your paws . . .
Always a sympathetic listener
During bull sessions.

Rev, . . .
Rev, . . .
Reveille!

You’re under a tree somewhere,
You lazy, fat dog!
Just waiting with slit-eyes
For someone to give you a pat.

Old dog, if you’ll come,
I’ll help you up on my bench
And put your head on my lap.
I’ll rub behind your ears
And hum The Songs
And chant The Yells
For you:

“1! 2! 3!
Rah! Rah! Rah!
Is my hat on straight?
Lend me your powder rag
Sweet cherry phosphate!” . . .

Rev, . . .
Rev, . . .
Reveille!






[This message has been edited by OldArmy71 (edited 8/28/2013 11:16a).]

While I'm at it, here's another one of Aunt June's poems:

To the Aggies
Published in The Battalion, May, 1943
©June Brown Leap


When you go
You will leave the Academic Building
With the flag waving high and Sul Ross
Standing bravely in the sun.

You will leave your post office box,
Metallic and shiny, that has held
Many letters from home and a few
From “Up Denton Way.”

You will leave your roommate,
And your roommate’s kid brother, and
Your battery commander, and his buddy,
And his roommate’s buddy.

You will leave that corner room
You have been so proud of—the calendar
You put on the wall, and the funny sticker
That has been on the door for years.

You will leave the moonlight walks back
To the dorm that came after a show,
Or a Town Hall at Guion,
Or a dance.

You will leave Kyle Field
And the yelling mob of friends at a
Home game, and everyone singing
THE SONG.

You will leave the drill field, too,
The review on Armistice Day—the hushed
Silence and the salutes—and the
Final Review when you saw your brother
Cry and couldn’t figure it out because
You weren’t even a fish then.

You will leave many jokes and laughs;
Yell practices that made a lump come
In your throat.—All of the squshie,
Rainy days and blinding blue ones when
You went to class, and Fridays when you
Cut a quiz so you could hitch hike home.

When you go, you will leave many things
You love. But you will not fail.
You will not go alone. I shall be with
Each one of you every step of the way.
For when you go, a part of me will go with you.
And I am the Spirit of Aggieland.

I really didn't like GVA and at this point Im not that big on GRAM. Kudos to the "if you water it down enough everybody can participate" guy.

Sorry, I agree with his decision. Rev is a dog...

Henry07, you must have been one of the few CT's who dislikes E-2/Rev.

I liked Rev, and think the tradition of having her stay with E-2 is an excellent one. But she's a dog. Not a soldier. Nothing against her or E-2.

Van Alstyne was a *****. He would only shake hands with certain cadets he liked at graduations. He was asked to leave an Opus steering committee meeting for his remarks about others. He campaigned against the hire of Joe Weber because he didn't feel he should have to report to a 2-star (both were long since retired), and he got censured for it. JVA also "watered down" the standards.


Staff, can we delete threads with "Taco Joe" racist jokes?

Tango Mike, what outfit were you in? One of Ramirez's close buddies?

I was a fish and sophomore in K-1, then I left school to enlist in the Ranger Regiment. After four years, I returned to school. I finished as the 1SG of V-1 and then a BN CDR in the fall and major unit XO in the spring.

What does any of this have to do with not using racist nicknames? I'm way younger than Ramirez... I've never even met the guy.

Tango, just curious what outfit you were in. Nothing more than that. I guess I don't understand why Ramirez didn't go to bat for E-2 and allow them to plan the funeral as it has been done in the past. Given his prejudice toward the outfit, it makes since why he would be against having a funeral like the other Rev's had. Why support a guy like him that doesn't support his own cadets?

I agree w/ tango.
Rebel, what is your level of maturity that you feel you need to make a racist comment?

I always smile at the 'watered down' comments.
So reflective of the person making them and not the organization.

You know the Corps GPA was higher than the university right?

IF the Corps was producing a watered down product, then complaints would count only from two sources:
1. DoD
2. Employers

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Henry07, you must have been one of the few CT's who dislikes E-2/Rev.

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Few?

OP, I'm extremely offended that you refer to our commandant as "Taco Joe". You don't have one ounce of the character or success that this man has had in his professional career.

He has done more for this corps in the last few years than has been done in decades.... You should be ashamed to call yourself an Aggie.

[This message has been edited by Bigsteve (edited 8/28/2013 2:14p).]

[This message has been edited by Bigsteve (edited 8/28/2013 2:14p).]

In January 1944, during WWII by the generation of those who many of us revere the most, this is what the article about Reveille.

It was fine with them, not sure why not now.

quote:

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Reveille, Symbol of Fighting Spirit, Will be Buried in Kyle Field

COLLEGE STATION, Texas, Jan. 19

Aggieland says goodbye today to Reveille - a dog that won her way into the hearts of thousands to become a symbol of fighting spirit.

The little black and white mascot of Texas A. and M. termed "more than an animal: she is a tradition," by F.C. Bolton, died of old age yesterday in the veterinary hospital.

The aggie band will play "The Spirit of Aggieland" and "Silver Taps" this afternoon when they bury Rev in the center of Kyle Field, where the dog loved to cavort during half-time drills at football games.

Reveille's collar will be placed in a case and a plaque will be affixed to the entrance of the stadium.

Not long ago, when the cadets were raising money to have Reveille designated a general, they also contributed funds to have her portrait done in oil. It hangs where every cadet may see.

Reveille was picked up one night in 1931 by some Aggies on a road south of the campus. A leg-hurt was dressed and she was taken to a dormitory. She immediately was adopted by the cadet corps as its mascot.

She made trips with the corps; she frolicked in and out of the formations and when the band put on a show she wore an Aggie blanket.

Said Dr. Bolton:
To many a homesick freshman Reveille represented the dog he left at home; that dumb friend that could always be depended upon or a wag of the tail and a friendly bark no matter how dark the clouds or how negligent were other friends. Reveille was a tangible, visible connecting-link with a carefree boyhood.

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Fair enough. Thread edited but that doesn't change how he handled this situation and how he hold a grudge against E-2.

Some of you guys are so far out of touch with the opinions of the cadets that have been in the Corps while he has been Commandant. Few of them approve of the way he handles things. Why the love affair with Ramirez?

Bigsteve, you don't even know me so there's no way to judge my character. It was even that harsh of a comment so you need to calm down. I'm pretty sure that is the nickname numerous cadets, past and current, refer to him as.


[This message has been edited by rebel06 (edited 8/28/2013 2:24p).]

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He campaigned against the hire of Joe Weber because he didn't feel he should have to report to a 2-star

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Nope, they are both 3-stars...

Thanks for including that, Annie.

Cadets never like the Commandant, it's in their DNA.

Thinking back to the Rev funeral in 1975 (Ramirez would have been a correction, fish there in the Band) I really don't recall how the ceremony went. All I really recall was that we BQs were in class Cs (fatigues) having just come from afternoon drill. The E-2 guys were in Class As. I really don't recall what was played, nor if there was a rifle volley. Doesn't seem like a long, drawn-out ceremony. We showed up from drill, played something (probably Spirit) then went to chow.

That Rev had died over the summer, so they put her in a freezer until the cadets got back that fall. Keep that in mind when someone tries to tell you that the near-riot at Rice in the fall of '73 was because "aggies were upset that Rice mocked a Rev who had recently died".






[This message has been edited by CanyonAg77 (edited 8/28/2013 10:41p).]

quote:

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quote:

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He campaigned against the hire of Joe Weber because he didn't feel he should have to report to a 2-star

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Nope, they are both 3-stars...

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Well obviously I don't remember the specifics of his beef with Weber; the only reason I know he got censured was because my mother was the university official that wrote it.

By stroke of alphabetical luck, by best friend graduated immediately behind me. JVA shook my hand at the end of the stage. My buddy was 5 feet behind me. JVA made eye contact, then went back to sit down. Both Army commissions. Both in midnights. Awesome character

But neither of those excuse, "everyone else uses the racial slur, I think it's ok for me to use it too"

Maybe presiding over the funerals of soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines who have died in combat has given the Commandant a different viewpoint then someone who has never commanded troops in combat. On that basis, I would side with BGRamirez. If anybody doesn't agree with his decision, I would recommend having the balls to talk to him rather then sling racial slurs. It would seem that the watering down happened before him. Act like an Aggie.

AggieFNP

I did email him so it's not like I'm sitting here throwing around racial slurs because I'm afraid to approach him. It wasn't even that offensive. Take it I easy. I think if you guys were in E-2 you would better understand why everyone in the outfit, current and former members, is upset.

I have only posted on Tex Ags twice before, but since Rebel06 decided to take the liberty of posting all kinds of wild accusations about me on this post, I thought I should comment once again to ensure we clear the air on this subject. First, I was called by the Bryan Eagle yesterday and asked my opinion about playing Taps at Reveille's funeral. I gave my opinion, and I stand by it. After 31 years of military service, I feel I'm entitled to my opinion, whether Rebel06 agrees with it or not.

Second, the decision on how Reveille's funeral was to be conducted was made long ago, and I was not part of the committee that made that decision. My opinion was just that - an opinion. I did NOT make the decision about how Reveille's funeral was to be conducted.

Third, there is no "traditional" format for Reville funerals. As I understand it, the committee reserached past funerals, and found that all of them were conducted differently - including playing Taps. Some funerals had Taps played, others did not. So there is no "tradition" to playing Taps at Reveille's funeral. Its been done for some, not done for others. I have NO history with Reveille funerals, and as mentioned before, I was NOT a part of the committee that made the decision on how to conduct Reveille's funeral.

Last, if you want to disagree with my opinion, thats certainly your right. But to go on this forum, use racial slurs, then try to infer that YOUR opinion about the Corps today is reflective of ALL cadets is childish, immature, and irresponsible. Show me a man who has to resort to name-calling, and I'll show you a man who is losing his argument - badly.

I stand by my OPINION - and thats all it is - MY OPINION, and that won't change. Not because I feel any less about Reveille than any other Aggie does, but because after 31 years of military service, my perspective on Taps has changed significantly. I have presided over several military funerals, and have attended many more, and I remember all too well just how significant and sad Taps is for the families of those who paid the ultimate sacrifice for their country. I do NOT feel it is appropriate to play Taps for a university mascot, even though that mascot is loved deeply by all of us who wear the Aggie ring. I have too many memories of too many memorial services and military funerals for fallen American servicemen and women to ever think otherwise again.

You don't have to agree, but that's my perspective, just so everyone is clear about this. And if anyone wants to debate how the Corps has "watered down" over the past 3 years, I'd be MORE THAN HAPPY to discuss that with you. Largest Corps in over 40 years, highest grades ever, most diverse Corps ever, highest number of commissions in several years, ranked the #3 military school in the nation last year (behind only USNA and USMA), 12 of the 50 Who's Who last year in the Corps, Student Body President and Student Regent this year in the Corps, all 5 Yell Leaders in the Corps, shall I go on? PLEASE feel free to contact me and I'll be VERY happy to discuss just how "watered down" we truly have become over the past 3 years! My number is: (979)845-2811. I look forward to hearing from you.

Gig 'em and thank all of you for your support of our Corps.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, commandant. I apologize for the racial slur and frankly I didn't think it was that derogatory of a term but others think otherwise so that's why I deleted what I said out of respect for everyone.

At any rate, we each have the right to our own opinion which is something I am grateful for. We just happen to disagree on this particular matter.

I don't really see why anyone would have disliked General Van Alstyne. He was commandant for the 4 years I was there and I never once had a bad experience with him. I remember I was in the Trigon, and he randomly walked up to me and shook my hand and talked to me about how everything was going.

No harm, no foul, Rebel06. We'll just agree to disagree, and leave it at that. Gig 'em and BTHO Rice!

I can understand why the first Rev was beloved and given special treatment. There's a nice story there. On the other hand, I really don't think "tradition" is a good enough reason to give the other dogs military honors. It's silly, even though most (not all) of them were perfectly nice collies.

By that line of reasoning we should get rid of silver taps, except for commissioned cadets. Reveille is one of the oldest traditions at a&m, we should give her due reverence. And I would be interested in looking at physical fitness scores from now and during gva's time, that is where I think the corps has been watered down the most. That and GRam's obsession with killing outfit unity, and his "my way or the highway attitude." Cadets can't wear outfit PT gear into Duncan because he doesn't want cadets to feel closer to their outfit than the corps as a whole. It is ridiculous, you are obviously going to feel closer to your outfit, it's where you spend 80% of your time.
And as far as the GVA situation went, it was because the corps was put under student affairs so weber would be his boss. GVA had gotten his 3 stars before weber though, so he is technically always his superior.

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I have NO history with Reveille funerals

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Ummmmmm, yes you do, Joe. Don't you remember going to the Rev funeral when you were a fish? We marched over to the north end of Kyle Field to play for it after drill one day.

Of course, I understand if you, as a fish, blotted out some memories of that year.....

I honestly do NOT remember attending any funeral for Reveille my fish year. I guess that says a lot but just how significant an event it was. Like I said before - all of Reveille's funerals have been different, and I'm sure that one, even if I can't remember it, was no different. Thanks for the memory jog, though!