Et tu, CCA?

6,036 Views | 54 Replies | Last: 10 yr ago by Ryan the Temp
CanyonAg77
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4:28p, 7/20/15
AG
Great. Tha same idiot "data verification" scam, also known as "While you're on the line, wouldn't you really like to buy a $120 directory from us" has spread from the Association of Former Students to The Corps of Cadets Association.

You are supposed to be able to go online and update your info without speaking to a telemarketer. That link is

https://secure.corpsofcadets.org/onlinestore_iframe/MyInfo.aspx

It is not currently working for me, perhaps you'll have better luck.

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jfadioustoad
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8:56p, 7/20/15
And this is why I am not a member. Also why I don't donate. You give something and they assume you're a sucker and keep begging you for more.
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Ryan the Temp
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11:41a, 7/21/15
AG
I think the Corps of Cadets Association did this before the Association of Former Students did it. I was getting those postcards years ago.
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Ryan the Temp
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In reply to jfadioustoad • 11:51a, 7/21/15
AG
quote:
And this is why I am not a member. Also why I don't donate. You give something and they assume you're a sucker and keep begging you for more.
I don't donate because they spend about $400,000 a year on salaries and benefits for three employees, which is about 30% of their revenue. It appears only 10%-15% of revenue actually goes to the Corps.
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Ark03
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In reply to Ryan the Temp • 6:50p, 7/21/15
AG
quote:
quote:
And this is why I am not a member. Also why I don't donate. You give something and they assume you're a sucker and keep begging you for more.
I don't donate because they spend about $400,000 a year on salaries and benefits for three employees, which is about 30% of their revenue. It appears only 10%-15% of revenue actually goes to the Corps.
We discussed the CCA in depth on this board about 4-5 years ago, and after seeing this thread I pulled their 990 to see if anything had changed.

Nope. In 2013 they had $1,170,643 total contributions and grants, and paid salaries and benefits of $394,281. They actually took in less money in 2013 than in 2012, yet their reported salaries/benefits increased. And to be fair, there are likely more than three employees - they just claim three as officers and key employees - $133k of the $394k was paid to other employees, who CCA determined were not required to be listed as officers on the 990 filing.

That said, maybe that is acceptable if the salary is justified by the output of whatever those employees are doing. However, I haven't seen enough come out of the CCA to make it something I feel is worth donating to.

Here is their most recent 990 filing: http://www.guidestar.org/FinDocuments/2013/752/482/2013-752482454-0a8e1040-9.pdf
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sharpdressedman
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8:15p, 7/21/15
Wow. That is both surprising and disappointing.

On a similar but more egregious note, this evening I got a phone call from someone raising money for breast cancer research. I asked if she was employed by a professional fund-raising firm and she said yes. I then asked what % of the funds raised actually go to the breast cancer organization, and she said 15%. Yep, 15%. I ended the call.

I would like to see the Commandant weigh-in on this discussion.
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Ryan the Temp
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In reply to sharpdressedman • 8:17p, 7/21/15
AG
quote:
I would like to see the Commandant weigh-in on this discussion.
He will likely say the CCA has been there to provide whenever he has asked them to. Same thing he always says.
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A Person
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8:56p, 7/21/15
AG
The CCA does much less to meaningfully benefit cadets than their material would lead you to believe. The few things they do are high visibility, which is great for getting more donations, but not for bettering the Corps. Give money to your outfit directly, not the CCA
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Ryan the Temp
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In reply to A Person • 8:58p, 7/21/15
AG
quote:
The CCA does much less to meaningfully benefit cadets than their material would lead you to believe. The few things they do are high visibility, which is great for getting more donations, but not for bettering the Corps. Give money to your outfit directly, not the CCA
And you can send it to the outfit via the Texas A&M Foundation if you want the tax deduction. It's a little more work for the outfit to get the money, but that's where all of it gets earmarked.
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A Person
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In reply to Ryan the Temp • 9:07p, 7/21/15
AG
quote:
quote:
The CCA does much less to meaningfully benefit cadets than their material would lead you to believe. The few things they do are high visibility, which is great for getting more donations, but not for bettering the Corps. Give money to your outfit directly, not the CCA
And you can send it to the outfit via the Texas A&M Foundation if you want the tax deduction. It's a little more work for the outfit to get the money, but that's where all of it gets earmarked.


Yup! It's actually very easy for the outfit if you do it right, it goes straight to their account. If you have any trouble routing it correctly through the Foundation, talk to the outfit. I know we had to help route a bit last year
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Pro Sandy
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7:24p, 7/22/15
AG
I learned my lesson when the eagle scout association did this years ago. I called and ended up buying the $50 directory. Since then, everyone and their dog have killed a dozen forests sending me those post cards.
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Aggie Infantry
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10:33a, 7/24/15
AG
That is sad. I have been donating for several years now. I may rethink this...
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CT'97
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In reply to Ryan the Temp • 11:50a, 7/24/15
AG
quote:
quote:
I would like to see the Commandant weigh-in on this discussion.
He will likely say the CCA has been there to provide whenever he has asked them to. Same thing he always says.
Which is exactly what I would expect him to say on a public forum. What is said in a board room might be totally different.
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Warrior 66
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1:16p, 7/24/15
I probably shouldn't weigh-in, but I will. I am a big fan of the CCA. They take care of cadets from the time they start as fish (PT gear, fish bag, hydration devices issued at FOW), to the time they leave as seniors (Senior Dining Out), and a lot in-between (uniforms for athletic teams, numerous banquets and dinners - Athletics, FDT Banquet, Boot Dance, Food and drinks for March to the Brazos, just to name a few.) They truly do put a LOT of money toward cadets and the Corps - in meaningful ways.

I won't try to comment on their board or their finances - I am not a board member and am not qualified to comment. Many of you have drawn conclusions based on numbers that you've pulled from on-line, and thats your prerogative. I have a far different perspective based on what I have seen the CCA do first hand to support our cadets in the time that I've been Commandant.

I'll stand behind my statement that from my perspective, the CCA provides excellent support to the Corps and to cadets, and my staff and I are grateful for all that they do.

Thats my "weigh-in." You don't have to agree, but as one who's here every day, and has seen first hand what the CCA has done - at least over the last 4 years - I believe the CCA has done a great job of supporting our cadets and our Corps.

Thanks for your support of our Corps. Gig 'em!
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A Person
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1:25p, 7/24/15
AG
I would argue that something like subsidizing the incredibly high cost of uniforms would be a better use of donor's money than something like Boot Dance, which a number of people don't go to and have to pay to go to, Corps PT gear which is almost never used (not the everyday outfit PT gear), or Camelbacks for the fish that are only marginally more useful than a bottle of water for all Corps activities outside MTTB.

But it's not like I just finished four years in the Corps or have a good deal of development experience
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Tango Mike
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In reply to Warrior 66 • 1:33p, 7/24/15
quote:
Many of you have drawn conclusions based on numbers that you've pulled from on-line, and thats your prerogative. I have a far different perspective based on what I have seen the CCA do first hand to support our cadets in the time that I've been Commandant.
Sir - Not to sound overly snarky, but financial statements are how financial organizations are judged. There are very clear rules for stating financial positions and very clear ways to judge financial performance.

It's nice that the CCA buys Camelbaks and puts on the Dining Out (which I can only assume has improved exponentially since I was a senior), but none of that can overcome poor use of resources. If it takes them $100 worth of overhead to purchase a $5 Camelbak then they are not good stewards of their resources and it is unwise to continue to give them those resources - no matter how motivated they are when handing out bananas during MTTB.
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Warrior 66
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1:44p, 7/24/15
Like I said before, you are free to draw your own conclusions. I don't solicit for the CCA, and I am not now. Someone asked me to weigh in with my own personal opinion about the CCA, and I did. You don't have to agree, but as I said, thats MY perspective based on what I have seen the CCA do for our cadets over the last 4 years that I have been Commandant.

You can also argue all year about whether the money spent by the CCA could be sent on "better" things, but thats not the point. EVERYONE has an opinion about whether a PT uniform or camelback is value added for our cadets - but the fact is that the CCA DOES provide those for our cadets, FREE. Our cadets get many things FREE from the CCA, and as far as I'm concerned, while you have a right to complain that you believe those things aren't worthwhile, its hard to complain about FREE items, meals, drinks, etc from an organization that exists solely to support cadets and the Corps.

I won't debate this. I was asked to provide my input and I did. My position has not changed. In MY OPINION, the CCA has done a LOT for our cadets and our Corps, and I support their efforts fully. If you want to debate on this forum their financials, feel free to do so, but I won't.
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A Person
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1:46p, 7/24/15
AG
Does Charity Navigator rate the CCA?
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CanyonAg77
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2:40p, 7/24/15
AG
I started this thread as a criticism of directory scam, though I don't mind the hijack.

I support the CCA. I give them money. Which is why I'm on the mailing list.

I don't recall the last discussion, but it seemed that their expenses were very high relative to what they spent on the Corps. I seem to recall that the discrepancy was allegedly a short-term anomaly, and they would get better. Sadly, that does not seem to be the case.

I'm glad there is a CCA, and I'm glad they support the Corps and make it less of a financial burden for cadets.

But it would be irresponsible to continue giving them money, if their expenses are too high as a percentage of contributions, and their pass-through too low.
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CanyonAg77
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In reply to Ryan the Temp • 2:44p, 7/24/15
AG
quote:
I don't donate because they spend about $400,000 a year on salaries and benefits for three employees, which is about 30% of their revenue. It appears only 10%-15% of revenue actually goes to the Corps.
According to Don Crawford of the CCA they give 66% of revenues back to the Corps. While better than 30%, my opinion is that they should be closer to 90%
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CanyonAg77
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2:57p, 7/24/15
AG
Here's the 2012 CCA discussion

It pretty much went to hell when BeBopAg and mcrews chimed in.

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Ryan the Temp
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In reply to CanyonAg77 • 3:20p, 7/24/15
AG
quote:
quote:
I don't donate because they spend about $400,000 a year on salaries and benefits for three employees, which is about 30% of their revenue. It appears only 10%-15% of revenue actually goes to the Corps.
According to Don Crawford of the CCA they give 66% of revenues back to the Corps. While better than 30%, my opinion is that they should be closer to 90%
Their IRS filings don't support his claim.
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CanyonAg77
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In reply to Ryan the Temp • 3:25p, 7/24/15
AG
quote:
Their IRS filings don't support his claim.
The thing I never got in the last discussion were the "pass through" donations. The CCA said if you gave them $100 and said "give it to the Band", it went to the Band, but never showed up as "support of the Corps".

Why not? If they count it as part of their incoming revenue, then why not show it as "support".
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Ryan the Temp
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In reply to CanyonAg77 • 3:29p, 7/24/15
AG
quote:
quote:
Their IRS filings don't support his claim.
The thing I never got in the last discussion were the "pass through" donations. The CCA said if you gave them $100 and said "give it to the Band", it went to the Band, but never showed up as "support of the Corps".

Why not? If they count it as part of their incoming revenue, then why not show it as "support".
Unless they are literally taking the check from you and physically sending it to the Band, they have to account for it in some way on their filings.
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BigJim49 AustinNowDallas
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5:51p, 7/24/15
AG
Thanks to the Commandant for his input !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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bigtruckguy3500
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In reply to A Person • 9:32p, 7/24/15
quote:
I would argue that something like subsidizing the incredibly high cost of uniforms would be a better use of donor's money than something like Boot Dance, which a number of people don't go to and have to pay to go to, Corps PT gear which is almost never used (not the everyday outfit PT gear), or Camelbacks for the fish that are only marginally more useful than a bottle of water for all Corps activities outside MTTB.
How much do uniforms cost these days? ROTCs cover all cadets enrolled in ROTC, so fish, heads, and contracted white belts. So not everyone would benefit from help with uniform costs either. I also seem to recall that my uniform costs as a white belt were less than as a black belt, though I don't remember by how much.

I think overall the CCA does a good job of helping cadets, and it appears as though their support has increased markedly since I was in the Corps. At least it has increased in a more visible way, because we barely had sports teams, I don't think they covered much for the FDT banquet other than the plaques for the fish, we got PT gear near the end of my time in the Corps, they didn't do boot dance (as that was still a university event).

That being said, there are plenty of charities that do a lot of good, yet run outrageous overhead. But I have no idea what it takes to run an organization like the CCA, and I can't say what I think would be an acceptable overhead.
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Ryan the Temp
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In reply to bigtruckguy3500 • 9:45p, 7/24/15
AG
Industry standard salary for the executive director of a non-profit with a $1.1 million budget is about $75,000. Salary and benefits of $400,000 for a non-profit of that size is very unusual.
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bigtruckguy3500
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In reply to Ryan the Temp • 11:00p, 7/24/15
quote:
Industry standard salary for the executive director of a non-profit with a $1.1 million budget is about $75,000. Salary and benefits of $400,000 for a non-profit of that size is very unusual.
Thanks for the info.
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sharpdressedman
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In reply to Warrior 66 • 1:44a, 7/25/15
quote:
I won't debate this. I was asked to provide my input and I did. My position has not changed. In MY OPINION, the CCA has done a LOT for our cadets and our Corps, and I support their efforts fully. If you want to debate on this forum their financials, feel free to do so, but I won't.
Thank you, sir, for your comments. I choose to believe, admittedly without the benefit of conclusive facts, that the CCA performs an admirable function. They likely can improve the efficiency of their operations, but I respect and admire what they do accomplish. I will continue to donate.
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93Spur
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In reply to bigtruckguy3500 • 12:50p, 7/25/15
quote:
How much do uniforms cost these days? ROTCs cover all cadets enrolled in ROTC, so fish, heads, and contracted white belts. So not everyone would benefit from help with uniform costs either. I also seem to recall that my uniform costs as a white belt were less than as a black belt, though I don't remember by how much.
I originally believed that ROTC did not cover all uniform costs for blackbelts and contract white belts - because of the cost of the Winter A Jackets. As detailed below, the Commandant has clarified what is and is not covered.

The Commandant's Office had to go through what I would consider to be extraordinary measures to secure, at the time, sufficient A Jackets for the Corps. Some reference to that below as well.

I thought there were other limits on inventory. But, the Commandant has also clarified that below.
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Swing Your Saber
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12:57p, 7/25/15
To any recent or current cadets or bulls, how much is the average uniform rental cost? If it changes year to year, how much? Honestly zip year is the only year I would expect a change.
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Swing Your Saber
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1:02p, 7/25/15
Also when/why did boot dance become a corps function? IIRC it was open to non-regs & at least a few showed up. Has that changed?
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momlaw
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1:14p, 7/25/15
AG
Delta Company Scholarship Fund covers the cost of uniforms for Combat Veterans in the outfit (those not on contract for Commission) in addition to other expenses associated with participation in the Corps. The annual cost for uniforms runs from about $850 to $950. The higher figure for women's uniforms. This is a fixed cost whether for one semester or two. I do not have figures with me, however, believe that the cost is flat, regardless of class year. If I find differently will edit clarification.
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Swing Your Saber
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1:21p, 7/25/15
So for non combat vet or contract cadets annual out of pocket uniform expenses are $850-$950!?!
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momlaw
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2:12p, 7/25/15
AG
Actually, it is a little higher. Uniform parts are also an expense, though somewhat variable.

I must say the Commandant works very hard to raise scholarship and other funds to defray these and other expenses associated with participation in the Corps and there is an officer dedicated to finding appropriate assistance as needed.
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