Everyone around me, work and otherwise, is under the idea that air travel is a surefire way to catch COVID-19.

My understanding is other than surfaces (which are cleaned regularly by airlines) and the air (which is on a HEPA filter and sucked up vs pushed through), your primary risk is sitting directly next to someone currently infected with COVID or catching it in the airport.

To me, a train or a long-distance bus is a much higher risk area than an airplane.

Thoughts, especially from the doctors?

I feel like it's clear that mass transit for long periods of time next to an infected person is one of the biggest "stranger to stranger" transmission points. Planes are probably safer than buses, which are safer than subways, because of the way you're seated and the fact that airplanes are ventilated differently. But if you spend 3+ hours sitting next to someone with COVID you have a really good chance of catching it, no matter where you are.

That said, what are the odds the person sitting next to you has it? At this point, probably higher than average (because people who are flying are probably out and around more in general with more opportunity for transmission) but still very low.

Anecdotal, but:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/virologist-hospitalized-coronavirus-believes-he-got-it-through-his-eyes-n1206956

SoupNazi2001 said:

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amercer said:

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We've decided not to fly this summer. Being in a confined space with a bunch of people is a good way to get exposed to viruses. I don't see much difference between planes, trains , or busses though.

The other thing to consider is how much flying is going to suck for the near future due to all the restrictions they are putting in.

If I needed to take a short flight I don't think I'd be too afraid of getting sick. I can't imagine flying cross country and leaving a mask on for 5 hours though.

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Airlines aren't enforcing or making you keep the mask on the whole time. I've talked to several people who fly a lot and verified this and Southwest told me this as well.

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I've seen that. I'm also pretty sure we're a week or two away from seeing videos of United pulling screaming passengers off planes for not wearing masks....

Plus I can only imagine all the fun new restrictions coming to airports.

coastsrs said:

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Thanks for the cheap flights suckers.

Keep living in bubbles. I'm sure you'll be able to enjoy life before you pass to the other side.

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I'm not seeing many cheap flights right now. They seem more or less the same or higher, when you can actually find one that is going somewhere.

The fact that gas is for all intents free probably plays a role in this just as much as covid does.

We are flying next month. Not too worried. Will take masks and all, even though I still think they are useless at least we can feel like we are protecting ourselves and others. But I doubt my kiddos wear them the whole time.

yukmonkey said:

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The airlines have no incentive to push lower fares. The travelers going right now are not enticed by another $50 off.

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Yeah for the most part people are traveling because they need to, not for leisure. As things improve you'll see some really low fares, hopefully in time for the end of summer.

GAC - are you flying for the airlines now?

If so, just curious how much flying hours you folks are getting. I haven't heard of pilots being furloughed.

Tough times for the industry for sure.

Flying has been cut way back. Depending on the airline, 60-90%. Not many furloughs yet because any airline that took CARES Act money is prohibited from furloughs or lay offs until October 1st. Unless things pick up in a huge way, there will be tens of thousands out of work from the airlines this fall.

No, but considering there are 143 seats per 737, and they are reporting about 10% ridership, that would be closer to 15 people on the whole plane. Spread out. Has there been any report of someone getting it from a plane since March?

Quote:

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You don't get sick on airplanes any more than anywhere else. Really, you don't.

If you think this is preposterous or even dangerous to suggest during a pandemic, consider this fact: The ventilation system requirements for airplanes meet the levels recommended by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention for use with covid-19 patients in airborne infection isolation rooms.

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Billions of people travel by plane every year, yet there have only been a handful of documented disease outbreaks attributable to airplanes in the past 40 years. If planes made you sick, we would expect to see millions of people sick every year attributable to flights. We haven't seen it because it's just not happening.

Consider one study that examined a passenger with tuberculosis on an airplane. It found that the median risk of infection to the other 169 passengers on the airplane was between 1 in 10,000 to 1 in a million. Wearing a mask, as some airlines now require, reduced the incidence of infection another 10-fold.

There's a reason the risks are low. The required aircraft systems do a really good job of controlling airborne bacteria and viruses.

To get technical, airplanes deliver 10 to 12 air changes per hour. In a hospital isolation room, the minimum target is six air changes per hour for existing facilities and 12 air changes per hour for new. Airplanes also use the same air filter a HEPA filter recommended by the CDC for isolation rooms with recirculated air. Such filters capture 99.97 percent of airborne particles.

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By this point, you may be thinking, "But I know I get sick when I travel. This article goes against everything I have experienced firsthand." The reality is that you are more at risk of getting sick when traveling, but it's not the airplane that's making you sick.

Every time you fly, you may also take a cab, bus or subway; stand in long lines in the airport; eat unhealthy foods; sit for extended durations; spend time in spaces with hundreds or thousands of other travelers; stay at a hotel or friend's home; arrive in a different climate and change time zones, disrupting your sleep. All of these factors are known to affect your immune system.

...

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/05/18/airplanes-dont-make-you-sick-really/

A lot of airlines have also now treated their plane interiors with a semi-permanent anti microbial coating. People will come back, and it hopefully will happen fast once people see vacation pictures and get FOMO

Agree that it is impossible to speak with any sort of certainty as to where you pick this up if you do. Did he take a cab or an Uber to the airport? Etc etc.

Still a long way to profitability. But I love good news, hopefully upwards from here

What's more likely?

He tests negative FOUR TIMES but actually has COVID.

Or

He gets some other respiratory infection after wearing the same unsanitary mask all day every day.

It doesn't matter. He got his 15 minutes of fame, the "story" got some clicks, and at least he started a conversation

Not sure if this is the best place to ask, but if my wife and I are traveling with our child, would they let him sit in the middle seat? Or would him and my wife get one row and I'm on another with a random person? He's 3 just for reference

Each airline has their own policy but you'd likely be allowed to sit together. My airline does not separate families

GAC06 said:

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Even more of an assclown. Even ended the hit piece with "I'm a runner and healthy and if it can happen to me it can happen to anyone"

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I starting to think that being a runner and healthy puts you in high risk. At least that's what it seems like from the news.

Yes, even healthy runners are at risk for... (checks notes) not getting COVID-19

Ia m surprised no one called the guy out on this. It sound real nonsense.

Quote:

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Fair has tested negative for COVID-19 four times, but he said that's not surprising, because he waited a while to go to the hospital so the virus may not be detectable and the "tests are far and away not 100 percent accurate."

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Athanasius said:

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oldag941 said:

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For what it's worth.....a good friend in my neighborhood is high up within one of the major airlines. He's in charge of maintenance. He told me that the air exchange in the plane is 2.5 minutes from top of cabin to bottom. So you breath new air every 2.5 minutes. In between, you are breathing HPA filtered air (or whatever the filter abbreviation is). My brother flew from Laguardia to Austin last week. They alternated rows of window and aisle. So you had a row to yourself but were offset from the person in front of you or behind you. Hearing all of this makes me think the airplanes may be a heck of a lot safer than a grocery store or my house.

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Do you have 60 random strangers in your house?

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A lot more strangers in the grocery store