Spain

6,061 Views | 33 Replies | Last: 5 yr ago by DadHammer
GAC06
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AG
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/spain/

Anyone have insight on the recent uptick in cases there? Spain and Italy looked very similar in cases and deaths until the last week.
sbrk
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European countries have been easing lockdown measures in the past month or so and seeing rebounds as a result.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/07/21/spain-quarantine-scotland-lifted-uk-hotel-bookings/
Aggie95
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so it's not just the big, bad USA that is having trouble?
SirLurksALot
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Hong Kong and Australia are also having new outbreaks and are having to reimpose some restrictions.

Some people don't seem to understand that we are never going to stop the spread of this virus. There are only three options; indefinite restrictions, open everything up, or revolving periods of easing and the strengthening restrictions. Sadly it seems as if most of the world has chosen the third option.
KidDoc
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GAC06 said:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/spain/

Anyone have insight on the recent uptick in cases there? Spain and Italy looked very similar in cases and deaths until the last week.
Off hand I suspect it is spiking in areas that never had many cases. Just like Texas & Florida are spiking now relative to NY at first. But if you look at USA as a whole you don't see the regional patterns.
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Complete Idiot
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Aggie95 said:

so it's not just the big, bad USA that is having trouble?
If this is your first response it tells me you are listening to the wrong news sources. You should avoid anything that would be saying this as their main angle on the story.

Second, he didn't say Spain was having trouble right now. Spain had a lot of trouble months ago, it was widely publicized since they were one of the first countries with a big outbreak. He said they have had an uptick of cases, and in looking at the link he provided it looks like Spain is up around 1500 new cases a day recently, up from a 6-8 week period where they were running at 200-500 a day. However, their peak, when they were "having trouble", was up near 8,000 a day.

I think he's just asking what led to the recent uptick, and it was answered by the first reply. Or at least one possible answer/contributor.
SkiMo
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SirLurksALot said:

Hong Kong and Australia are also having new outbreaks and are having to reimpose some restrictions.

Some people don't seem to understand that we are never going to stop the spread of this virus. There are only three options; indefinite restrictions, open everything up, or revolving periods of easing and the strengthening restrictions. Sadly it seems as if most of the world has chosen the third option.
Or a 4th option which involves opening more things back up with continued social distancing and wide spread following of mask wearing and flexibility with change as we learn more and more about the virus....but too many selfish people around for that to happen.
GAC06
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I guess my planned trip to Spain in a couple months isn't looking up
SirLurksALot
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SkiMo said:

SirLurksALot said:

Hong Kong and Australia are also having new outbreaks and are having to reimpose some restrictions.

Some people don't seem to understand that we are never going to stop the spread of this virus. There are only three options; indefinite restrictions, open everything up, or revolving periods of easing and the strengthening restrictions. Sadly it seems as if most of the world has chosen the third option.
Or a 4th option which involves opening more things back up with continued social distancing and wide spread following of mask wearing and flexibility with change as we learn more and more about the virus....but too many selfish people around for that to happen.


That falls into option number 1, Indefinite restrictions. Since we don't live in a utopia, People aren't going to socially distance for months or years unless they are forced to.
GAC06
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KidDoc said:

GAC06 said:

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/spain/

Anyone have insight on the recent uptick in cases there? Spain and Italy looked very similar in cases and deaths until the last week.
Off hand I suspect it is spiking in areas that never had many cases. Just like Texas & Florida are spiking now relative to NY at first. But if you look at USA as a whole you don't see the regional patterns.


Yeah I remember reading that Madrid was hit hardest earlier and that article mostly references Barcelona
KidDoc
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Yes I am correct: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/world/europe/spain-coronavirus-cases.html
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
SkiMo
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SirLurksALot said:

SkiMo said:

SirLurksALot said:

Hong Kong and Australia are also having new outbreaks and are having to reimpose some restrictions.

Some people don't seem to understand that we are never going to stop the spread of this virus. There are only three options; indefinite restrictions, open everything up, or revolving periods of easing and the strengthening restrictions. Sadly it seems as if most of the world has chosen the third option.
Or a 4th option which involves opening more things back up with continued social distancing and wide spread following of mask wearing and flexibility with change as we learn more and more about the virus....but too many selfish people around for that to happen.


That falls into option number 1, Indefinite restrictions. Since we don't live in a utopia, People aren't going to socially distance for months or years unless they are forced to.
Indefinite has such a looong period of time sound to it. I don't think it'll be that much longer. If people can chill till we see if some of these late phase trials are gonna prove to work then that's all anyone is asking. I would gather if they don't prove to, we will revert back to "normal" and the thing will spread like wildfire and everyone will get it and it will just become part of life.
SirLurksALot
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SkiMo said:

SirLurksALot said:

SkiMo said:

SirLurksALot said:

Hong Kong and Australia are also having new outbreaks and are having to reimpose some restrictions.

Some people don't seem to understand that we are never going to stop the spread of this virus. There are only three options; indefinite restrictions, open everything up, or revolving periods of easing and the strengthening restrictions. Sadly it seems as if most of the world has chosen the third option.
Or a 4th option which involves opening more things back up with continued social distancing and wide spread following of mask wearing and flexibility with change as we learn more and more about the virus....but too many selfish people around for that to happen.


That falls into option number 1, Indefinite restrictions. Since we don't live in a utopia, People aren't going to socially distance for months or years unless they are forced to.
Indefinite has such a looong period of time sound to it. I don't think it'll be that much longer. If people can chill till we see if some of these late phase trials are gonna prove to work then that's all anyone is asking. I would gather if they don't prove to, we will revert back to "normal" and the thing will spread like wildfire and everyone will get it and it will just become part of life.


A vaccine likely won't be readily available to the public until next year at the earliest. We have months more of this ahead if we choose to stay on the current path.

It's already a part of life. Covid is never going away even with the development of a vaccine.
chico
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AG
My niece and her husband live in Barcelona. The initial lock-down there was quite severe, stronger than anything in US. They probably have a strong incentive to keep it under control to avoid any similar lock-downs.
bay fan
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S
Aggie95 said:

so it's not just the big, bad USA that is having trouble?
Well, Spain is up to around 1500 cases a day as compared to our approx 70,000+ cases a day so they are likely to be able to get handle on it while we will continue to struggle unless we all get on the same team and mask and distance before everything is shut down again. It's time to do what we are able rather then just complain.
GAC06
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Aren't you in California? Didn't it already shut down again despite a mask mandate? In Texas I don't see another shutdown happening.
Agsrback12
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The day the panic patrol has to admit that Sweden is the only place that handled it correctly is getting closer each day. It's probably not going to hit them until after Election Day tho.
HotardAg07
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Will be hard for countries like South Korea, Taiwan, Hong Kong, New Zealand, and Japan all had slightly different approaches, but all so far have resulted in 100x less deaths per capita than Sweden and in many cases have far higher population density and proximity to China that Sweden has. Many of those countries have resumed a much higher level of normalcy than than US has, including in some cases soccer games with full stadiums.

A country like Japan has much more density and much older population than the US or Sweden and avoided large scale shutdowns, yet still has 100x less deaths due to a superior population level response of mask wearing, sanitation, and targeted focus on preventing super spreader areas and elderly. Japan did close school for about a month, but they have been going back regularly since then while -- wearing masks mind you. I don't understand why people haven't been pointing to Japan as the model country versus Sweden if you're trying to argue for a more hands-off approach.

My personal theory is that the population behavior response is more important than government policy in avoiding the virus - obviously there are other factors such as location (pop density, climate, etc) and health care (detection, tracing, treatment, etc.) that probably play more of a factor than government policy as well.

If I've learned anything, it's that nobody comes here to change their opinion on something, so I'm not sure why I keep posting stuff like this. The singular focus on Sweden's response versus the rest of the world has been very strange to me, given the broad array of different responses and different results that are more interesting to investigate.
GAC06
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I'm no expert but I wouldn't be surprised if examples like Japan and Hong Kong have more to do with previous exposure to corona viruses or differences in vaccine policy. I saw some stuff months ago talking about the vaccination angle but not lately.

The population density, elderly population, and multigenerational households should be hell for Japan with this. I doubt that masks are the difference.
cone
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gotta be careful with assigning spread to population behavior response
Bruce Almighty
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bay fan said:

Aggie95 said:

so it's not just the big, bad USA that is having trouble?
Well, Spain is up to around 1500 cases a day as compared to our approx 70,000+ cases a day so they are likely to be able to get handle on it while we will continue to struggle unless we all get on the same team and mask and distance before everything is shut down again. It's time to do what we are able rather then just complain.


Now compare our 70k a day cases to another country with 330 million people.
ElephantRider
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We're not socially conscious enough to be Sweden or Japan, so it doesn't really matter
DadHammer
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I disagree. Almost every person I see is wearing a mask and keeping their distance. Where are you that people are not complying at a high rate.

Other than the rioters and street idiots. Normal people are taking this very seriously.
B-1 83
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Did anybody......ANYBODY......say we wouldn't have an uptick in cases when things opened up?

Now, did anybody say the time we bought over the previous months has helped us to understand and treat infections better?
Being in TexAgs jail changes a man……..no, not really
Ragoo
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DadHammer said:

I disagree. Almost every person I see is wearing a mask and keeping their distance. Where are you that people are not complying at a high rate.

Other than the rioters and street idiots. Normal people are taking this very seriously.
dont go to Atlanta
AgE Doc
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DadHammer said:

I disagree. Almost every person I see is wearing a mask and keeping their distance. Where are you that people are not complying at a high rate.

Other than the rioters and street idiots. Normal people are taking this very seriously.
Stopped at a Buc-Ees gas station off of I-10 in Alabama about 3 weeks ago. Place was packed! Probably over 400 people in the store and maybe 5% of people were wearing masks. We needed a clean restroom and gas so we masked up and and braved the contagion, but it was shocking how reckless they were behaving.
jckrjr7
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DadHammer said:

I disagree. Almost every person I see is wearing a mask and keeping their distance. Where are you that people are not complying at a high rate.

Other than the rioters and street idiots. Normal people are taking this very seriously.


I wish I had taken pictures but I just got back from Coeur D'Alene Idaho and mask usage there was probably 25%. When we walked back from dinner last night there was hundreds of people packed indoors in 5 or 6 bars along the Main Street. Not to mention at the airport a third of people don't wear their mask properly. Not just kids either this was all ages.

A mask ordinance was passed In Coeur D'Alene on Friday. Not sure when it goes into effect but I saw a good number of people protesting the mask mandate yesterday morning.
DadHammer
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If that is true in those states I guess they will get to herd immunity much faster. Houston is obviously doing a better job, where I live anyway, of trying to slow the spread but keep things open. Data is showing 4-6 more weeks and this will be pretty much past us like NY and other countries.

Diet, exercise, Lose weight, take supplements, be safe.
Ragoo
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The problem is that we don't know what works and doesn't. We have manipulated the natural selection such that multiple flare ups can exist.
Dustoff00
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Ragoo said:

DadHammer said:

Normal people are taking this very seriously.
dont go to Atlanta


To be fare, he said Normal people and you Replied with the Oxymoron of Atlanta...
Dedicated Unhesitating Service To Our Fighting Forces
Complete Idiot
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Spain cases still rising, Italy has not experienced this type of increase in cases. Difference in reopening policies? Differences in % infected on first round?
Ol_Ag_02
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jckrjr7 said:

DadHammer said:

I disagree. Almost every person I see is wearing a mask and keeping their distance. Where are you that people are not complying at a high rate.

Other than the rioters and street idiots. Normal people are taking this very seriously.


I wish I had taken pictures but I just got back from Coeur D'Alene Idaho and mask usage there was probably 25%. When we walked back from dinner last night there was hundreds of people packed indoors in 5 or 6 bars along the Main Street. Not to mention at the airport a third of people don't wear their mask properly. Not just kids either this was all ages.

A mask ordinance was passed In Coeur D'Alene on Friday. Not sure when it goes into effect but I saw a good number of people protesting the mask mandate yesterday morning.


I love free thinkers!
SirLurksALot
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Complete Idiot said:

Spain cases still rising, Italy has not experienced this type of increase in cases. Difference in reopening policies? Differences in % infected on first round?


I don't know what the correlation is, but multiple EU countries are seeing increases of cases after reopening. Spain, Belgium, Netherlands, Czech Republic, and Luxembourg have all seen recent increases. A couple of other countries including Portugal, Poland, And Romania appear to have never flattened the curve to begin with.
Player To Be Named Later
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Sure, now let's see them all be consistent and start protesting being required to have a government issued Social Security Number to be employed, to open a bank account, get a loan, etc.

People are largely protesting this one because it's easy and makes them feel like a "patriot". But they won't protest government mandates that would actually be taking a real stand.
DadHammer
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Complete Idiot said:

Spain cases still rising, Italy has not experienced this type of increase in cases. Difference in reopening policies? Differences in % infected on first round?

Leveling off about 2,500, peak times were 7500. They are getting a bump that will occur every where they open up.
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