tysker said:

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Who knew planned obsolescence was coming to medical treatments!? But seriously it's an interesting problem because in all of the Asia countries were masking, social distancing, case tracking, etc supposedly worked to reduce covid transmissions and deaths would those populations also consider getting the vaccine?

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I would guess the Asian countries are generally more willing (or forced, in the case of China) to do what the govt recommends. There would also be less pushback against restrictions on doing things without being vaccinated.

I would bet vaccination rates in Asia end up higher than in the US and Europe.

BiochemAg97 said:

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tysker said:

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Who knew planned obsolescence was coming to medical treatments!? But seriously it's an interesting problem because in all of the Asia countries were masking, social distancing, case tracking, etc supposedly worked to reduce covid transmissions and deaths would those populations also consider getting the vaccine?

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I would guess the Asian countries are generally more willing (or forced, in the case of China) to do what the govt recommends. There would also be less pushback against restrictions on doing things without being vaccinated.

I would bet vaccination rates in Asia end up higher than in the US and Europe.

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Currently, most (close to all...did not look closely) Asian countries are far behind the west in per capita vaccinations. There is no current support that I see for your bet.

buffalo chip said:

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BiochemAg97 said:

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tysker said:

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Who knew planned obsolescence was coming to medical treatments!? But seriously it's an interesting problem because in all of the Asia countries were masking, social distancing, case tracking, etc supposedly worked to reduce covid transmissions and deaths would those populations also consider getting the vaccine?

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I would guess the Asian countries are generally more willing (or forced, in the case of China) to do what the govt recommends. There would also be less pushback against restrictions on doing things without being vaccinated.

I would bet vaccination rates in Asia end up higher than in the US and Europe.

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Currently, most (close to all...did not look closely) Asian countries are far behind the west in per capita vaccinations. There is no current support that I see for your bet.

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I believe they are currently behind because of availability not willingness to get the shot. Which is why I said end up.


Did see this data on vaccine hesitancy today. China, S Korea, Japan are way ahead of the US on willingness to get the vaccine. Odd trend in China and S Korea where they are getting more hesitant, but US has barely increased willingness and has a long way to go to catch up in willingness.

jagvocate said:

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PJYoung said:

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This thread should probably be deleted.

Unproven fear mongering nonsense.

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This is still America, we discuss ideas, we debate, but we shouldn't censor based on feels and disagreement.

The respondents in the article come from Johns Hopkins, Yale, Imperial College, London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine and the University of Edinburgh.

If they say we're it's possible that we're going to have less than a year of effectiveness, and the world is setting up for a never-ending cycle of vaccinations, I'm listening.

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Yeah I agree that it shouldn't be deleted. I have more of a problem with the thread title I guess.

Yes, it's possible that the vaccines eventually need boosters because of mutations but right now we are still a long ways from that becoming an issue.

tysker said:

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Duncan Idaho said:

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No that is still different. People primarily don't get the flu shot out of apathy not refusal.

In certain social circles refusing to get the covid vaccine is seen as brave/righteous/macho. In a strange form of virtue signaling, You see people bragging about the fact that they won't get it.

Almost no one brags about not getting their flu shot.

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You don't brag about not getting a flu because it rarely comes up. This covid vaccine response, like covid, is novel. I think its doubtful that the same people will be as openly self-righteous year after year.

It's easy to talk **** online and at the bar with friends but when push comes to shove and if not getting the shot means you cant get into Kyle in Sept, I think some people would change their minds (silently of course).

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I'm pretty sure that's never going to happen.

Schools? Sure, but public events or something like plane travel? I don't think so.

PJYoung said:

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tysker said:

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Duncan Idaho said:

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No that is still different. People primarily don't get the flu shot out of apathy not refusal.

In certain social circles refusing to get the covid vaccine is seen as brave/righteous/macho. In a strange form of virtue signaling, You see people bragging about the fact that they won't get it.

Almost no one brags about not getting their flu shot.

---

You don't brag about not getting a flu because it rarely comes up. This covid vaccine response, like covid, is novel. I think its doubtful that the same people will be as openly self-righteous year after year.

It's easy to talk **** online and at the bar with friends but when push comes to shove and if not getting the shot means you cant get into Kyle in Sept, I think some people would change their minds (silently of course).

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I'm pretty sure that's never going to happen.

Schools? Sure, but public events or something like plane travel? I don't think so.

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I'll be requesting a refund if Bjork pull this *****

Duncan Idaho said:

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No that is still different. People primarily don't get the flu shot out of apathy not refusal.

In certain social circles refusing to get the covid vaccine is seen as brave/righteous/macho. In a strange form of virtue signaling, You see people bragging about the fact that they won't get it.

Almost no one brags about not getting their flu shot.

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I know several people who don't get flu shot because they think they don't need it or that it will make them get the flu. Isn't just apathy, but a conscious decision not to because they don't see the risk outweighing the benefit.

I see a lot of that with the COVID vaccine, but there is more too. Lots of mistrust, misinformation, and twisted information.

PJYoung said:

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tysker said:

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Duncan Idaho said:

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No that is still different. People primarily don't get the flu shot out of apathy not refusal.

In certain social circles refusing to get the covid vaccine is seen as brave/righteous/macho. In a strange form of virtue signaling, You see people bragging about the fact that they won't get it.

Almost no one brags about not getting their flu shot.

---

You don't brag about not getting a flu because it rarely comes up. This covid vaccine response, like covid, is novel. I think its doubtful that the same people will be as openly self-righteous year after year.

It's easy to talk **** online and at the bar with friends but when push comes to shove and if not getting the shot means you cant get into Kyle in Sept, I think some people would change their minds (silently of course).

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I'm pretty sure that's never going to happen.

Schools? Sure, but public events or something like plane travel? I don't think so.

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I could see plane travel become proof of vaccine or proof of negative test. That may be enough to push some more to get vaccinated. And ticket master has already discussed something like that.

For a while at least. Eventually, we will move on from COVID fear and just go back to ignoring seasonal respiratory viruses and people will go back to going to work while sick, coughing, and spreading viruses.

Old Buffalo said:

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PJYoung said:

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tysker said:

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Duncan Idaho said:

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No that is still different. People primarily don't get the flu shot out of apathy not refusal.

In certain social circles refusing to get the covid vaccine is seen as brave/righteous/macho. In a strange form of virtue signaling, You see people bragging about the fact that they won't get it.

Almost no one brags about not getting their flu shot.

---

You don't brag about not getting a flu because it rarely comes up. This covid vaccine response, like covid, is novel. I think its doubtful that the same people will be as openly self-righteous year after year.

It's easy to talk **** online and at the bar with friends but when push comes to shove and if not getting the shot means you cant get into Kyle in Sept, I think some people would change their minds (silently of course).

---

I'm pretty sure that's never going to happen.

Schools? Sure, but public events or something like plane travel? I don't think so.

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I'll be requesting a refund if Bjork pull this *****

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Pretty sure a decision to do that would be way above Bjork. I doubt the AD wants to deal with the hassle of checking since it would just add cost and not increase revenue.

?w=480


This chart seems to suggest a clear trend towards the vaccine being more and more accepted. Obviously May was unknown, but it's gone from 49% in September that probably won't get it, to 39%, to 30% in February 21.

Either way, yes we are behind some countries, but I think it's negligible because more than enough will get it. And if I had to guess, as more and more data comes out, even some of the 30% that probably or definitely won't get it now, will.

We should be able to get 70% vaccinated easily. The other 30% will be mostly naturally immune. Heck, most of the anti vaxxers are also clearly the types to not wear masks, social distance, whatever. So most of them probably have already had it in the last year. And certainly over the next 4-5 months that we get up to 70% vaccinations.

wildcat08 said:

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EwingBarnes said:

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I've never gotten the flu shot. I don't get the flu. I've had China virus, I made it thru fairly easily. Now why the fff--- would I need to do either vaccine?

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Because the longer asymptomatic period for COVID makes it much more transmissible--so you get it not just for you, but for those around you. Also, as you get older, there's no guarantee that it will always be something that's not problematic for you.

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No, if everyone vulnerable has the vaccine then it is, in fact, a personal decision impacting only myself. If others need protection then it is or soon will be readily available.

So what is Tomer saying? Should I social distance and keep wearing a mask even if Texas numbers fall off a cliff just because another country is low on vaccines? Somehow I think our 4000 cases a day make any real, substantial difference on if a variant slips through or not considering hundreds of millions of probably cases worldwide over the next 6 months before vaccine distribution is prevalent enough everywhere. If not another year.

Thus far the vaccine is winning the race through 16 months, and this is with the virus having zero immunity worldwide. I think modern technology wins out.

beerad12man said:

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So what is Tomer saying? Should I social distance and keep wearing a mask even if Texas numbers fall off a cliff just because another country is low on vaccines? Somehow I think our 4000 cases a day make any real, substantial difference on if a variant slips through or not considering hundreds of millions of probably cases worldwide over the next 6 months before vaccine distribution is prevalent enough everywhere. If not another year.

Thus far the vaccine is winning the race through 16 months, and this is with the virus having zero immunity worldwide. I think modern technology wins out.

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He is just echoing what the poll at the top of this thread was saying: the less people around the world that get the vaccine, the greater chance there is that a variant will pop up that will eventually be a problem for us here.

If that does occur, I think like you, I have full confidence that we will be able to quickly roll out a booster that ends the threat for us. The rest of the world might not be so lucky.

PJYoung said:

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Maybe we should take all the vaccines not being fully utilized in the US and provide them to other countries that actually have a pressing need.

tysker said:

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PJYoung said:

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Maybe we should take all the vaccines not being fully utilized in the US and provide them to other countries that actually have a pressing need.

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Yes we have already given some to Canada and Mexico.

I think it's the smart thing to do.

tysker said:

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PJYoung said:

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Maybe we should take all the vaccines not being fully utilized in the US and provide them to other countries that actually have a pressing need.

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Other than our stash of AZ vaccine that hasn't gotten EUA yet, what vaccine is being underutilized? Plenty of people still waiting to get theirs, as was mentioned, we have shared AZ vaccine with Canada and Mexico. I think it was actually termed a loan, so presumably once the FDA grants EUA on AZ, some of the shipments that would have gone to Canada and Mexico will eventually be for US.

At some point, yes we have purchased more than enough for everyone and the excess will go to other countries, probably through something like the COVAX scheme to help poor countries get vaccine.

BiochemAg97 said:

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tysker said:

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PJYoung said:

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Maybe we should take all the vaccines not being fully utilized in the US and provide them to other countries that actually have a pressing need.

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Other than our stash of AZ vaccine that hasn't gotten EUA yet, what vaccine is being underutilized? Plenty of people still waiting to get theirs, as was mentioned, we have shared AZ vaccine with Canada and Mexico. I think it was actually termed a loan, so presumably once the FDA grants EUA on AZ, some of the shipments that would have gone to Canada and Mexico will eventually be for US.

At some point, yes we have purchased more than enough for everyone and the excess will go to other countries, probably through something like the COVAX scheme to help poor countries get vaccine.

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Not right now but we're already starting to see mismatches in supply and demand in locations particularly being in locations where initial demand (tier 1) was high but secondary demand (tier 3 and 4) will be low. And this will only be exacerbated by the end of the month. Instead of sitting on current and future oversupply, push the excess to places that need it.

If only the US had organizations that were good at supply chain management and real-time resource allocation