Saw this published earlier this month in JAMA from researchers at the Karolinska Institutet in Sweden.

One of the points that I keep seeing put forth here says "why should I risk the vaccine to avoid a mild cold." Putting aside the mortality factor which has is probably a very fair argument, my personal and anecdotal experience with COVID recoveries has not fit at all with the view that having COVID implies just a mild cold.

I have seen friends, acquaintances, and family members struggle with long hauler symptoms ranging from severe (damaging lung issues) to serious (blood clots, gout like symptoms, etc.) to the really annoying (smelling burning odors all day) 7-8 months after their recoveries.

I have wondered if my sample is just unlucky in the grand scheme, but this research quantifies the after-effects in more detail.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2021/04/210407174321.htm

Quote:

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In the third follow-up in January 2021, the research team examined self-reported presence of long-term symptoms and their impact on work, social and home life for participants who had had mild COVID-19 at least eight months earlier. This group consisted of 323 healthcare workers (83 percent women, median age 43 years) and was compared with 1,072 healthcare workers (86 percent women, median age 47 years) who did not have COVID-19 throughout the study period.

The results show that 26 percent of those who had COVID-19 previously, compared to 9 percent in the control group, had at least one moderate to severe symptom that lasted more than two months and that 11 percent, compared to 2 percent in the control group, had a minimum of one symptom with negative impact on work, social or home life that lasted at least eight months. The most common long-term symptoms were loss of smell and taste, fatigue, and respiratory problems.

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Messed up taste alone was a huge factor for me and getting vaccinated.

My Dads taste is still messed up from his case in January.

Which is why I still think people who can get this free, easy to get, safe and highly effective vaccine and decide to pass are nuts. I just don't get why you'd even take the chance? All the talk about long term effects of the vaccine, I have ZERO doubts that covid itself is going to prove to be much worse. This is not a beta position. This is not a fear mongering position. This is just take a step back, think logically, non-politically, and make a reasonable decision. Even for a young, healthy person, the vaccine is much safer for you than the virus itself.

If you've had covid, I somewhat get it, even though a booster shot could increase your immunity even more. But you are likely good, unlikely to get any more damage, etc. I can understand not wanting to add the unknown of the vaccine(which I believe is nothing, but that's not the point) to the long term covid.

I posted something similar in the vaccine reluctance thread an hour ago. This long hauler/lingering effect stuff sounds awful. Good enough reason to get vaccinated even if your risk of death from COVID is negligible.

6 times more likely to experience erectile dysfunction from covid!

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210407/erectile-dysfunction-risk-6-times-higher-in-men-with-covid

Paragraph immediately after the last you quoted:

Quote:

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"We investigated the presence of long-term symptoms after mild COVID-19 in a relatively young and healthy group of working individuals, and we found that the predominant long-term symptoms are loss of smell and taste. Fatigue and respiratory problems are also more common among participants who have had COVID-19 but do not occur to the same extent."

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Loss of taste and smell sucked, but this is not referring to the very dramatic and severe symptoms you listed, or at least does not appear to in this very vague and nondescript wording.

If this study is taken as the rule, then it comes down to whether or not a 9% chance of long term loss of taste and smell makes the vaccine "risk" worth it. This is probably only applicable if you haven't already had COVID. Study was also 80+% female with average age in 40s, idk if that has much of an effect.

Yeah, saying 11% is misleading if the side effect isn't exactly severe / life threatening. I think it's simple.

The risk of the vaccine to me, is almost assuredly less than that of the virus itself. I'm ultimately not scared of either, so the societal benefit along with the likelihood that covid itself would have more potential to create long term effects, clearly gave the vaccine the nod. I get it. We can't know 100% for sure on either until 10 years down the road. But in reality, I see no logical reason to think the vaccine would be worse for the average person with what we know.

If I already had covid, I probably wouldn't get it. At least any time soon. But if I hadn't had covid, there's no way I'd rather get covid than the vaccine. That's irrational to me.

I went from sleeping 5.5 to 6.5 hours a night to 7 to 8.

Had Covid mid-December.

Ive posted this on several threads before but im almost on month 11 of lingering Covid symptoms. Almost every week I get a feverish/hot feeling, chills, ear ache, cold sweats, leg/shoulder/arm/back pain, brain fog, fatigue etc. Probably the worst 11 months of my life, and Im a healthy 35 year old male. If you look on the Reddit long hauler thread theres tons of people younger than me with lingering covid symptoms for up to a year. For some reason it seems like the majority of the covid long haulers tend to be "younger."

I got fully vaccinated a month ago because I heard it helps with Covid Long Haulers. So far I feel a little better. Im still getting covid symptoms but they dont last very long as opposed to all day previously. I might feel sick for an hour and then it goes away, whereas previously I would feel sick for hours and sometimes all day. Although, I now have this arm pain that didnt exist before the vaccination and it wont seem to go away.

Windy City Ag said:

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Saw this published earlier this month in JAMA from researchers at the Karolinska Institutet in Sweden.

One of the points that I keep seeing put forth here says "why should I risk the vaccine to avoid a mild cold." Putting aside the mortality factor which has is probably a very fair argument, my personal and anecdotal experience with COVID recoveries has not fit at all with the view that having COVID implies just a mild cold.

I have seen friends, acquaintances, and family members struggle with long hauler symptoms ranging from severe (damaging lung issues) to serious (blood clots, gout like symptoms, etc.) to the really annoying (smelling burning odors all day) 7-8 months after their recoveries.

I have wondered if my sample is just unlucky in the grand scheme, but this research quantifies the after-effects in more detail.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2021/04/210407174321.htm

Quote:

---

In the third follow-up in January 2021, the research team examined self-reported presence of long-term symptoms and their impact on work, social and home life for participants who had had mild COVID-19 at least eight months earlier. This group consisted of 323 healthcare workers (83 percent women, median age 43 years) and was compared with 1,072 healthcare workers (86 percent women, median age 47 years) who did not have COVID-19 throughout the study period.

The results show that 26 percent of those who had COVID-19 previously, compared to 9 percent in the control group, had at least one moderate to severe symptom that lasted more than two months and that 11 percent, compared to 2 percent in the control group, had a minimum of one symptom with negative impact on work, social or home life that lasted at least eight months. The most common long-term symptoms were loss of smell and taste, fatigue, and respiratory problems.

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Yes, your experience is divergent from mine. I have had a dozen family members, including myself, catch the rona. Symptoms were mild with no lingering issues other than reduced smell for a couple.

Quote:

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Yes, your experience is divergent from mine. I have had a dozen family members, including myself, catch the rona. Symptoms were mild with no lingering issues other than reduced smell for a couple.

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Which I guess makes both of our experiences outliers in the grand scheme of things. I suspected mine was a bit extreme. Yours is probably a lot closer to the statistical average. Neither are good samples for educated decision making.

Yeah this study is just way too vague and doesn't define anything despite using a lot of subjective wording.
Or at the very least the report on it in the article does this and sucks.

beerad12man said:

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Which is why I still think people who can get this free, easy to get, safe and highly effective vaccine and decide to pass are nuts. I just don't get why you'd even take the chance? All the talk about long term effects of the vaccine, I have ZERO doubts that covid itself is going to prove to be much worse. This is not a beta position. This is not a fear mongering position. This is just take a step back, think logically, non-politically, and make a reasonable decision. Even for a young, healthy person, the vaccine is much safer for you than the virus itself.

If you've had covid, I somewhat get it, even though a booster shot could increase your immunity even more. But you are likely good, unlikely to get any more damage, etc. I can understand not wanting to add the unknown of the vaccine(which I believe is nothing, but that's not the point) to the long term covid.

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The main reason I got the vaccine. I know a guy mid thirties was an active runner and had mild COVID-19, one year later and he can't run at any kind of pace without his heart rate shooting up and his lung function remains terrible. I was not scared of COVID and went about my life, but don't want to get it and take even a small chance of severe disease or having these long haul effects. Seems like the ones freaking out about the vaccine can't do simple math. Yes your chances of dying or hospitalization from COVID is small and although bigger your chance for long term AE's is still relatively small, but the same negative outcomes from the vaccine are a million times smaller than that and the benefits far outweigh the risk. It's like they aren't afraid of COVID and for good reason, but are terrified of the vaccine. It makes no sense to me. It's like logic went away.

Vaccinate. It's safe, easy and free.

SoupNazi2001 said:

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As I've said many times long haulers are the new boogeyman to push people to get the vaccine. All sounds very scary and very difficult to prove any causation and people post Covid are probably attributing anything that is wrong with them to Covid. I know many people who had mild cases of Covid, no long haulers.

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Maybe so. I think they are overblown. Yet I still haven't seen a compelling reason to not take the vaccine in spite of this? And still don't understand anyone's logic behind it and have been genuinely trying to. (other than those who have already had covid then I somewhat understand)

It's basically zero risk, versus in a 1 in a 100 chance type of risk, all with the added benefit of helping society to boot. So a complete win win in my eyes, All for a free, easy and convenient cost

SoupNazi2001 said:

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As I've said many times long haulers are the new boogeyman to push people to get the vaccine. All sounds very scary and very difficult to prove any causation and people post Covid are probably attributing anything that is wrong with them to Covid. I know many people who had mild cases of Covid, no long haulers.

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Im not here to change your mind. But Im an 11 month Covid Long Hauler and it absolutely sucks. Imagine feeling good, being out with friends/family, them boom the symptoms hit and feeling like absolute dog crap out of nowhere and having to go home. Imagine being at work not being able to do anything because the fatigue, brain fog, and feverish feeling makes the simplest task seem like a huge chore. Imagine not being able to walk or run normally because the leg pain from the covid symptoms hurts so much. Im a 35 year old healthy man being forced to limp like an old man sometimes lol. The arm pain makes it impossible to workout.

This is how Ive basically felt every single week for the past 11 months. Thankfully it seems to be going away little by little, either on its own or because of the vaccination. And Im not alone, look at the Reddit Long Hauler sub, tons of stories similar to mine and worse. Im not looking for sympathy or anything, just sharing my experiences. I fully support people's choice not to get vaccinated, but I wouldnt wish this long hauler stuff on my worst enemy.

Capitol Ag said:

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ea1060 said:

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SoupNazi2001 said:

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As I've said many times long haulers are the new boogeyman to push people to get the vaccine. All sounds very scary and very difficult to prove any causation and people post Covid are probably attributing anything that is wrong with them to Covid. I know many people who had mild cases of Covid, no long haulers.

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Im not here to change your mind. But Im an 11 month Covid Long Hauler and it absolutely sucks. Imagine feeling good, being out with friends/family, them boom the symptoms hit and feeling like absolute dog crap out of nowhere and having to go home. Imagine being at work not being able to do anything because the fatigue, brain fog, and feverish feeling makes the simplest task seem like a huge chore. Imagine not being able to walk or run normally because the leg pain from the covid symptoms hurts so much. Im a 35 year old healthy man being forced to limp like an old man sometimes lol. The arm pain makes it impossible to workout.

This is how Ive basically felt every single week for the past 11 months. Thankfully it seems to be going away little by little, either on its own or because of the vaccination. And Im not alone, look at the Reddit Long Hauler sub, tons of stories similar to mine and worse. Im not looking for sympathy or anything, just sharing my experiences. I fully support people's choice not to get vaccinated, but I wouldnt wish this long hauler stuff on my worst enemy.

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I really wonder if we will find that Covid elicits a very strong immuno-response to a point it creates a temporary autoimmune disorder. Sorry to hear about you issues and hopefully they do go away over time.

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Thank you Capitol! Reading through the Reddit Long Hauler sub it seems like the 12 month mark is when it all kind of goes away on its own and people start to feel better. So hopefully just one more month of this and Im good to go.

I only got the vaccine BECAUSE of the statements saying it helped and/or solved the long hauler symptoms.

Baron Von Flag Smasher said:

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I only got the vaccine BECAUSE of the statements saying it helped and/or solved the long hauler symptoms.

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Same here!

Baron Von Flag Smasher said:

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I only got the vaccine BECAUSE of the statements saying it helped and/or solved the long hauler symptoms.

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I love how people are so quick to diagnose a virus ~1.5 years old as symptomatic of "long hauler" but don't consider there may be similar "long hauler" problems with a vaccine 0.5 years old.

Moderna vaccine has been in use for 14 months now.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/16/health/coronavirus-vaccine.html

StoneCold99 said:

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KlinkerAg11 said:

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Messed up taste alone was a huge factor for me and getting vaccinated.

My Dads taste is still messed up from his case in January.

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My best friend's mom had it in July of '20 (mid 50s), still has only about 50% taste back.

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I'm curious how 50% of taste is quantified. Do you mean she can taste sour but not sweet? Or do you mean the intensity of various tastes aren't as strong as before - as in a hint of flavor but not what she had experienced prior?