[This message has been edited by aggiestud (edited 5/5/2008 10:14a).]

Does anyone want to break down the next series for me? I know we lost 3 of 4 vs the Wings this year.

i love the Stars, but i think "beat down" will be a better term for it than "break down"...

-T

The Stars in the playoffs have been a completely different team than the Stars in the regular season were. However, in the regular season we did play very well at the Shark Tank and against the Ducks.

I will preface this by saying I don't know a terribly lot about the Wings, but this is what I do know. Hasek is way past his prime, but still above average and Chris Osgood is still what he's always been: a servicable goalie in a great situation. Detroit has talent coming out the anus led by one of the all-time great defensemen in Nik Lidstrum. Chris Chelios may be 47 (ish), but he's still a solid bruising defenseman. Offensively, they have a lot of guys who can put the puck in the net led by Pavel Datsyk and Zetterberg. A guy by the name of Franzen took the last round by storm, scoring an NHL record for goals in a series by scoring NINE goals in 4 games. He had 2 hat tricks, a 2 goal game, and a bad game where he only lit the lamp once.

Detroit's strength is puck possession. They get the puck and they don't give it away. They are great in the neutral zone for this reason. The don't allow a whole lot of rebounds, and when they do, they usually snatch them up and take off the other way. This is why Osgood and the latest version of Hasek have been so "good". It's not that they aren't good, it's just that they aren't put in bad situations. They have a great power play (when you have a lot of talent, your power play tends to be good). Aside from the oodles of goal scorers, Lidstrum makes it easy for everyone. Don't know a lot about their penalty kill, but I know it's one of the top 5 or 10 in the league.

With that said...

The Stars have never been good against the wings. Marty has only won once in Joe Louis Arena in his career. I don't think it's a mental thing, I just think the Wings have been able to abuse our defense in the past and make it tough for Marty, since he was often left out to dry.

This is a different team than the one the Wings are used to seeing. Marty is playing some of the best goal of his career and the defense has been very good for the most part. As long as we don't let the Wings stay in our zone for extended periods of time, I don't see this being a bad matchup for the Stars. We have one of the top goalies, top defensive units, and top special teams in all of hockey, we aren't overmatched at all. However, if we don't come to play we won't survive this series. Detroit won the President's cup for a reason, and they beat Nashville and Colorado for a reason: they are damn good.

All the experts will pick Detroit, probably in about 6 games, but this series could go either way. I think this will be an incredibly physical series, but I am picking the Stars in 6 for several reasons:

1) I'm a Stars homer.
2) Marty Turco. He has been the best goalie in the playoffs this year BAR NONE. He is starting to remind me of Eddie Belfour from his days with the Stars. Everyone said he couldn't handle the pressure of playoff hockey even though he was always one of the best goalies in the regualr season every year. Once Eddie got to Dallas things started to click and he was phenominal. Starting with the Vancouver series last year Marty has been amazing. Goaltending and defense wins in the postseason...
3) Defense. The Stars have been a very aggresive team on defense, and a very physical team on defense. They are on of the top forechecking teams in hockey and one of the best backchecking teams in hockey. The Stars are a much improved scoring team over some of the teams they've had in the past, but they still are known for their defense.
4) Special Teams. The Stars are second in the playoffs (behind Calgary) in power play percentage at 25% and tied for 4th (with Detroit) in penalty kill percentage, at 85.7%. Special teams are HUGE in the playoffs because 5-on-5 hockey is so physical in the playoffs with most of the time spent in the neutral zone. The power play is the least of my concerns against the Wings, but penalty killing will be a huge part of this series. Fortunatly, the Stars are a very diciplined team and don't take too many penalties.

In the end, I think this will be another great series, but I like the Stars to finish off the Wings at the AAC in the 6th game. I predict Marty and Morrow to have huge series (again).

Hope this series analysis works for you.

Ross Lindsey '06

Your #2 is the reason the Stars have made it this far and the primary reason they have a chance to make it a good series against the Wings.

Turco's play against the Sharks was the best goaltending I have ever seen. I lost track of how many times we made some IDIOTIC plays in our own end, resulting in turnovers and 1-on-1 opportunities vs. Turco... and he stoned them every time.

-Another Stars Homer

I like your write up Stryker but I have to disagree about the defense lately. Turco has been out of his mind good. Not the D. Hell Zubov alone is responsible for both of Marleau's short handed goals against the Sharks.

They were also lucky to get out alive last night with quite a few costly turnovers in both the defensive and neutral zones. There's a reason the Sharks out shot the Stars last night.

While I would love the Stars to take it to Detroit and go to the finals, I don't see that happening. The Wings are playing very good hockey and I see them taking it in five or six.

I'm still pissed my Flames couldn't finish off San Jose... Bah!

[This message has been edited by zafzo (edited 5/5/2008 5:33p).]

i know this sounds cliche...but the 1980 USSR team was considered to be IMPOSSIBLE TO BEAT...in other words...the Stars are definitely the ALMIGHTY UNDERDOG in this series...like the 1980 USA Hockey Team. Just my $.02

Agree that Marty is playing the best hockey of his career, and the defensive support has been shaky at times, due largely to injuries- Zubiv was out for months and Boucher has been out for weeks. The Stars had 3 rookie defensemen vs. Anahaeim, and Zubov is still getting his legs back.

The wings have historically owned us, but this team has something special, and the Richards addition is huge and he could be a wing slayer. I like our chances, and I believe detroit is nervous.

The Stars aren't the underdog that some will say. They have the better goalie, hands down. Hasek was very shaky against Nashville. Osgood has won six straight, but he is what he is. He won't make a ton of spectacular saves, but won't give up any horrible goals either.

One player that STRYKER didn't mention is Niklas Kronwall. He has been great in the playoffs and gives Detroit a physical presence on the blue line that has been missing since Vladimir Konstantinov had his career so tragically cut short.

What really strikes me about Detroit is how much the skill guys seem to want this. Datsyuk has been really, really physical and that is a big surpise. Zetterberg has been amazing as well.

Brad Stuart has been a nice deadline pickup. He has been paired with Kronwall on the second unit.

Franzen and Holmstrom are the two best players in front of the net in the league right now. Dallas will need to stay out of the penalty box.

Detroit's lines should go something like:

Datsyuk - Zetterberg - Holmstrom
Franzen - Filppula - Samuelsson
Cleary - Draper - Drake
Hudler - Helm - McCarty

Lidstrom - Rafalski
Kronwall - Stuart
Chelios - Lebda

This should be a fun series. Here's hoping the Wing's pull it out.

Those are some scary lines.

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Here's hoping the Wing's pull it out.

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Up yours, buddy!!


I keed, I keed.



But seriously, up yours.

[This message has been edited by FlyFisher99 (edited 5/6/2008 11:05a).]

[This message has been edited by FlyFisher99 (edited 5/6/2008 11:05a).]

I used to like the Wings. But only because of Stevie Y. I used his curve when I first started playing hockey. I couldn't lift the puck and his freakishly open face helped me do that! Of course now I use a Forsberg curve. ;-)

No more Yzerman, no more likey the Wings.

[This message has been edited by zafzo (edited 5/6/2008 11:26a).]

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Does anyone want to break down the next series for me? I know we lost 3 of 4 vs the Wings this year.

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I am the key. I was at the game the Stars won vs Detroit in Feb sitting right behind the Stars bench. It was my pep talks throughout the game that helped us to victory.

So if someone pays for my tickets and travel expenses I will guarantee victory!

Yes the Wings are talented. But I don't think they've really been challenged this postseason. Nashville only has one line that's even a threat, and Colorado was basically a minor league team led by Joe Sakic with all the injuries they had. They didn't put up much of a fight at all.

Two keys that I see are:

How they deal with Holmstrom and Franzen in front of the net... The "Mule" and the "Jack@ss" if you will... Must stay out of the box.

The phsysicality of the Stars: Don't let Detroit enter the zone with the puck, make them dump it and let Marty's stickhandling ability help you beat their forecheck and Dallas needs to finish their checks every chance they get. The Wings are highly skilled bout outside of Darren McCarty, Dallas Drake and Kris Draper they don't have many grinder types. Time to see if their largely veteran team can take the pounding in a long series.

Thanks for the great discussion. I am counting down the minutes until Thursday night's game. It's great to be able to be an excited hockey fan again.

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1) I'm a Stars homer.

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Wings fan here, though not really a homer. This is the first season I've really paid much attention to since the strike/lockout.

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2) Marty Turco. He has been the best goalie in the playoffs this year BAR NONE. He is starting to remind me of Eddie Belfour from his days with the Stars. Everyone said he couldn't handle the pressure of playoff hockey even though he was always one of the best goalies in the regualr season every year. Once Eddie got to Dallas things started to click and he was phenominal. Starting with the Vancouver series last year Marty has been amazing. Goaltending and defense wins in the postseason...

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Turco has been pretty lights out, but I don't think the best. That aside, most actually say that Belfour's breakdown started to happen when he got to Dallas. He was one of the best goalies in the NHL with the Blackhawks, unquestionably. When he got to Dallas he started to become a head case. If he let a bad one by early, you could count on 5 more before the game was over. I think Dallas's biggest problem early in the decade was the inability to admit that Belfour was not very good anymore, I also think they won the cup in '99 in spite of Belfour, not because of him. Able to keep his head together long enough to win 16 games.

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3) Defense. The Stars have been a very aggresive team on defense, and a very physical team on defense. They are on of the top forechecking teams in hockey and one of the best backchecking teams in hockey. The Stars are a much improved scoring team over some of the teams they've had in the past, but they still are known for their defense.

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Some fairly foolish statements were made here, sounds like you're quoting the hometown broadcasters, "look at the forechecking, the Stars are among the best at this". You want to see good digs around the boards and behind the net, watch Detroit. During their series with the Avs, I watched two powerplays for the Avs where the puck barely left their zone. The Wings, down a man, kept on the attack for at least 100/140 seconds, twice that I saw, and I didn't watch them all. I don't think Dallas is as physical, nor as controlling as you think they are, but opinions vary.

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4) Special Teams. The Stars are second in the playoffs (behind Calgary) in power play percentage at 25% and tied for 4th (with Detroit) in penalty kill percentage, at 85.7%. Special teams are HUGE in the playoffs because 5-on-5 hockey is so physical in the playoffs with most of the time spent in the neutral zone. The power play is the least of my concerns against the Wings, but penalty killing will be a huge part of this series. Fortunatly, the Stars are a very diciplined team and don't take too many penalties.

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Can't comment, haven't paid attention to the stats on this. I will say Detroit's are probably inflated given game 4 when the Avs just completely fell apart, on special teams especially.


Sounds generally like everyone has accepted that Detroit should beat the Stars easily, and probably will. But, are making arguments as to why Dallas will be able to keep up with the Wings, not actually beat them.

I think it will be a much better series than everything indicates, though I am still happy the Stars pulled it out. The Sharks were my prediction for the finals, and the only team in the NHL capable of beating Detroit in a 7 game series, IMO.

>>I don't think Dallas is as physical, nor as controlling as you think they are, but opinions vary.<<

Dallas, even with great hitters like Derian Hatcher (when he was here), was never regarded as a terribly physical team. Well, OK, guys like Curtis Ludwig and his friends were pretty physical, but that style changed during the late '90s en route to the cup. Afterwards, the physicality was gone.

Now, I'd argue its back. Not to the extent of the beasts in the east, but did you see the Morrow hit in game 6 against the Sharks? In fact, one of my concerns about this series is Detroit's power play and Dallas' defense against it since I think the Wings will get a lot of chances.

Detroit always has the best regular season team and more often than not, they flame out in the playoffs. Detroit had or tied for the best record in the NHL every year but one since their last title in '02. What would give anyone the confidence that this year they will move past previous years' playoff hiccups? First 2 rounds wins? Please. Midget teams could have won those series. This Dallas team is better at this time than any team (save maybe the one that won the cup) that eliminated the Wings the last 3-4 times in the playoffs.

I'm not predicting anything because I think Detroit will get a lot of power plays and Marty could go bad on the road. However, I'll say it here: Dallas can win this series in as little as 6 games.

>>the hometown broadcasters<<

Ralph Strangis and Darryl Reaugh are the hometown broadcasters and they are often assigned network and cable duty when the Stars are on TV. Best in the NHL? Don't know for sure, but I'd bet a year's pay they are in the discussion. Hardly homers. In fact, I get very irritated at them sometimes for accepting a Dallas penalty called as correct when it isn't explained why the Dallas bump was called and the opponent's takedown wasn't.

Wow I really touched a nerve, and I didn't even try to. I was trying my best to be fair, and it irritated you a lot because the truth doesn't sit well.

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First 2 rounds wins? Please. Midget teams could have won those series.

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Bad argument, always. The better you are in the reg season the easier you're playoff track. Trying to criticize a team for being the best for the entire season is never a good idea. Don't be that guy. Especially when I already stated that the opposition fell apart in the last series, don't come back like it's some great zinger.

This will be a good series. Detroit hasn't played Dallas in the playoffs that I can recall (maybe in one of the Wing's cup years?), but I know the Wings haven't lost to them in the playoffs. Like I already said, Turco has been pretty lights out so far. But, as someone else already stated, Turco doesn't have a good track record at Joe Louis arena.

You say you think Dallas can win it in 6 games, but you never really said why. Only reasons you gave were that Dallas had a good hit against the Sharks, meaning they must be physical again, and that Detroit has for the past 3-4 years, lost when they should have won. Difference is, Osgood is playing very well, and these Red Wings remind me of the ones in the 90s, with the way they dominate the other team in every aspect. Remember the days when Detroit would have 50 shots a game, easily? That kind of crushing and relentless attack is what I see in this team. Not as good as those great Scotty Bowman teams, but they have the same kind of controlled aggression. For the first time in a long time, they have elevated their play tremendously for the playoffs, and the goaltending has as well.

So, like I said before, "Sounds generally like everyone has accepted that Detroit should beat the Stars easily, and probably will. But, are making arguments as to why Dallas will be able to keep up with the Wings, not actually beat them." All I've heard is that Dallas has a chance if they play really well and Detroit plays poorly. Nobody has been willing to make an unbiased comparison, because you won't like what you find.

kb2001, I respect your opinion as you obviously know most of what you're talking about, but I do take issue with some things you pointed out.

a. If Marty hasn't been the best in the postseason this year who has? Maybe my original post was a little off in saying that bar none he has been the best, as others do have some better statistics, but stats can often be inflated. If someone chips the puck in on net so they cna get a line change that counts as a save which can inflate percentages, and some goals allowed may not be a goalie's fault if a defenseman is way out of position or someone turns over the puck right in front of the net and leaves the goalie with no chance. I haven't watch any non-Stars games so I can't say who has or hasn't been phenominal. Osgood's stats are fantastic, but neither team he's faced has been a "quality" opponent. So if someone has been better than Marty, then who? Not speaking with arrogance, but curiosity.

b. I don't think I made any foolish statements when describing the Stars defense. Towards the end of the SJ series our defense wasn't quite as good as the first half of it, but it still got the job done. San Jose, a very talented, very skilled team, scored no more than 2 regulation goals in any of the 6 games. That's not good defense? If you question my assessment of the fore and backchecking I question how much Stars hockey you've watched. I stand by what I previously said. And that was Ross Lindsey's thought and analysis, not Ralph or Razor's.

I think Detroit is the better team. Neither team has faced a team like its new opponent so far this year, but I'm confident it will be a good series. I honestly wouldn't be surprised with anything this series. I could see Wings in 4, 5, 6, or 7 and I could see the Stars win in 4, 5, 6, or 7. Not saying these teams could easily sweep each other, but if 4 games go into OT and are determined by a timely goal or save 4 times and one team gets lucky in that situation 4 times it wouldn't surprise me.

To the Wings fans here: good luck. It'll be a helluva series and I can't wait for the drop of the puck.

Ross Lindsey '06

I also failed to mention that if you think we won the cup in 99 in spite of Eddie B you are on crack, the man outplayed Roy and every other goaltender he went up against, Hasek also. I thought Niewy deserved the Conn Smyth, but if didn't get it it shoulda been Belfour...

>>but you never really said why<<

Why? The same reasons they flamed out early in the playoffs the last few years after having the best regular season. You may have to help me with those reasons. Injuries? Always a possibility (and I don't know, honestly, so inform me), but like you said, the favorable playoff matchups (1-8) had to mitigate that somewhat. Yet, there were series they lost 4-2 when they were clearly the better team on paper -- just like now.

You misunderstood my argument about the first two rounds. I know all about the regular season's importance, which is especially true in the NHL as they reseed after every round (which is wrong, btw). I know you play your schedule and your playoff matchup and since the goal is to win (duh?), you take what you can get and go with it. My point is simply you don't prove you can win against a good team by beating a couple of bad teams, or teams that present no matchup difficulties. I wasn't criticizing the Wings, but simply asking what YOU see in this team that wasn't there the last few years, and that the first two rounds can't tell people much of anything. Nothing more.

Tonights game showed that the Stars can't win, especially at JL, if Detroit gets a lot of (in some cases gifted) power plays. I personally think the NHL rules and officiating is inconsistent to a degree not seen in any other sport. Some hits are penalized, others aren't. Some hooking is allowed, other is not. Some back checking is called, other isn't. Offsides is just insanely baffling. I referee 2 sports currently and have done at one time or another 2 more. I by no means throw refs under the bus just because they make calls against my team (go see the basketball forum where I try to educate many on the actual rules). I understand rules and officiating better than most -- even in circus leagues like the NBA and in sports I don't work, but I've been watching hockey for a decade and a half -- about as long as they've been in Dallas -- and I still can't tell clearly how or whether the rules are enforced. I didn't like any of this even when the Stars were in the finals.

Even when I watch soccer, which isn't often, I see calls I disagree with, but at least it appears that the official penalized what he thought was an unfair advantage or ignored what he thought wasn't. Sometimes he may just have missed something -- which is probably right a lot more than it should be since they've only got one damn guy out there when they need 3 or 4. In hockey, however, they either just miss a lot (i.e. 60% or more), have a skewed definition of unfair advantage, or work on a completely different system that no other sport works on.

There's no consistency in any of this, except that the RWs are going to get the benefit of all of it, especially in their arena. I would concede that a small part of that may be deserved -- similar to a pitcher who's always around the plate getting a benefit of the doubt strike call vs. a pitcher who's wild. But the Stars had fewer power play opportunities than even San Jose, a team reputed to be physical. They did have more than Anaheim in the first round, but anyone who saw that series knows the Ducks went out there solely to try and physically intimidate the Stars. Tonight the penalties severely favored Detroit and its hard to believe that the Stars think they can bully the RWs.

Anyway, you didn't touch a nerve. I just disagree with your comments. Don't mistake argumentation for sensitivity.

To stryker-

Yes, I do believe, as I said, that the Stars won the cup in '99 despite having Belfour. They managed to keep his head together for 16 wins. Can you really deny that he became a head case? I know '99 was early on in his time at Dallas, but even how well he played that year and that postseason was nothing compared to his play with the Blackhawks in the early 90s. His head was already starting to become a mess. My opinion. But, you can't deny results, and he did win a cup with the Stars.

91- I know you're a smart guy, and I'm not trying to flame or anything. This is actually a great thread where people are staying objective and to the point, so don't take anything I say the wrong way. I've been watching hockey for about as long as you have, since the Canadiens last cup victory in '93.

I said "but you never really said why" because the only reasons I saw from you were based on past years performance, not the teams that are taking the ice. Detroit losing series' they should have won the past few years is not a reason why the Stars can beat them. It's the situation NOW that I'm talking about, and I already addressed it. There's a fire in the way the Wings have played this postseason that I've not seen in a while from them, and it reminds of the mid-late 90s teams that were just incredible.

As for officiating, a LOT of things are very subjective in hockey, I agree. Offsides, not so much. The refs do a really good job with that one. You will see maybe 50 bad offsides calls in a season, which is pretty damn good. A lot of the rules seem tighter now than they used to be. For example, hooking. They used to only call hooking if you took the guy down or disrupted him enough to affect things. Now it seems like they call it whether it disrupts him or not. Slashing, same thing in the past. Now they call it you make the slash, whether the guy budges or not. But, this goes along with what I was saying I've seen in the Wings this playoff. Controlled aggression. They are relentless, pounding, and aggressive, but they have been keeping it under control and have not crossed the line and committed penalties. Everything seems to be meshing for them, including the goaltending (which has been weak in the postseason the past few years).

I only saw the last 5 minutes of the game tonight. It started at 5:30pm, I don't get home from work until 6:30, and I have two small girls, so I didn't get to see it until bath time. The last 5 minutes, I saw Detroit in complete control of every aspect, but it's the last 5 minutes and it's desperation time so I know better than to gauge on that. It sounded like Dallas had some good scoring chances early, but Osgood came through for us. Still a good series ahead. I've never felt that Osgood was too consistent, but he has been great this postseason. If the Stars want to have chance, they better take game 2, really need to win it. You may be able to steal one in Hockeytown early, but it's not likely with the series on the wire.

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Detroit hasn't played Dallas in the playoffs that I can recall (maybe in one of the Wing's cup years?),

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Yes, twice since they have been in dallas. Once in 95 when modano was hurt and it was not much of a series. And in 98 when i was there when carbo scored with minute left and then langenbrunner shot that crazy shot from center ice {in overtime) that osgood deflected into the net. The wings went back to detroit and won 2-0 to end the series.

For the record, belfour ahs always been a nut but he did not have a sip of alcohol the entire playoffs, until we beat buffalo.

[This message has been edited by Ribby Paultz (edited 5/12/2008 7:54a).]

All I have to say is "Go Stars!!!"

Big game tonight [/captain obvious]. My gut tells me a win at home is enough to get them back on track.

Despite the loss, they looked much better in game 2 than game 1 - they looked like they played faster and didn't make as many silly mistakes.

Was it just me, or did anyone else think Turco gave up a pretty weak goal to Helm - in order to beat Detroit, he has to make those types of saves (at the very least). I'm not saying it was a gimme, but I think a Stanley cup champion goalie has to make that save.

We've been destroyed these 3 games. I'm not mad at the officiating, or mad at the Wings or mad at the Stars. I have no problem with this because Detroit is just that much better than us right now. We aren't playing too bad, we just can't match the Wings intensity. Yeah there have been some bad calls, but the defense hasn't been up to par, so Marty has been sitting on his island, and hasn't even been remotely what he had been. It's ugly, and all I can do is commend the Wings.

the stars look great most of the time, besides when they give up a goal. this just proves how good detroit really is (as much as i hate to say that) in the way that if the stars let up one bit then it'll cost 'em. whether it be a penalty or robidas giving a half-ass effort of backchecking, dallas just cant match the offensive productivity that the wings have every night. i hope we can pick up some better defensemen that are more experienced, physical, and offensive-minded in the off season - zubov cant do the job alone

i'd be careful what you wish for with respect to zubov and getting more d like him. he's a great guy and a hall of famer (i think...up for debate, i guess. i really don't follow the qualifications for HOF defenders.). but he gave up a pretty silly goal on a bad pass because of his offense prowess. you take the good and bad, but having more than 1-2 of those type of defensemen can be playing with fire.

as an aside, i compare gonchar (with my pens) to zubov. i can only hope that gonchar can avoid some of the injury issues that zubov has had and has a few more good seasons...

I would like to see the Stars win this last one at home. I don't want a handshake in the AAC!

I'm amazed by Detroit's ability to get points on their first shot. I realize that Dallas was on its heals as Detroit had an odd man rush, but I thought Turco should have been able to get something on Zetterburg's shot.

edited: for correct use of "its" vs "it's"

[This message has been edited by texmet (edited 5/14/2008 9:39p).]

that 6 on 3 at the end was awesome

Dallas played a hell of a game. They had the same aggression as in game 3, and really were running the Wings over in the same way, but they didn't make the silly mistakes, at least, if they did Detroit didn't capitalize on them. Detroit played sloppy, and Dallas took advantage. And Turco finally put up a stellar performance against the Wings, picking up his 3rd win. He really made some incredible saves, and the series is over without his effort and game play tonight.

Congrats to the Stars, they definitely earned it, and deserve the credit for a solid win. Now, it's back to Hockeytown, and hopefully the Wings can put the Stars away in a similar fashion to game 4 against the Avs.

The thing that has probably killed the Stars the most this series has been lazy half-assed horrible passes at inside the offensive blue line where the point man will lazily backhand a pass over to the other point that gets intercepted by an opertunistic Wing who ends up getting a goal, i.e. Zetterberg last night at the start of the 3rd period. You would think after countless Detroit goals that way this series we'd stop, but no...

If they do that crap in game 5 it's over, if we play smart hockey, maybe I will actually get to use the seats I paid for in game 6..

Other than that, great win. The 6-on-3 was awesome!

Anyone that says the Stars won the Cup in '99 in spite of Belfour is flat out retarded. Those were the days of hardcore dump and chase and let your goalie be the difference.

Dude was right there with Joe Niuewendyk for the Conn Smythe. You don't get more clutch than that as a goaltender. He outplayed Tommy Salo (who could be brilliant when on), Grant Fuhr (a legend) Patrick Roy (an even bigger legend) and Dominik Hasek. What more could you ask for?