here, i was waiting for this all summer :-(

summer? how about 4 years?

these guys are getting absolutely ripped all over the media today.

Here, every time Beasley touches the ball he gives it away

My hopes for a good WC weren't pinned solely on the US doing well, because I love watching Brazil, France, England, and the Dutch, so at least it will still be enjoyable

How can anyone overlook the Czech Republic when they are ranked second in the world by FIFA?

I'd just like to clear a few things up after my rants yesterday:

Objectively, before the game, I could only give us about a 30% chance of winning yesterday. I've always thought CR was the best team behind Brazil coming in to this tournament. Those are two spots where the FIFA rankings actually make sense to me. CR is clearly better than Italy, IMO, even without Baros.

I DO NOT think that the team overlooked CR at all. In fact, they looked scared from start to finish, and that tentativeness was part of the problem with the performance.

I DO believe that the media and a lot of fans overlooked the Czechs, but I that shouldn't (and didn't, IMO) affect the team, which has been training together for six weeks and secluded in Germany together for the last two.

In short, I was not angry that we lost. I would have simply been disappointed had our team played to their abilities and come up short. What I WAS pissed off about was the total lack of intensity by most of our players and the total mismanagement of the game by Arena. Of course, blame ultimately falls with the players, but Bruce set them up with a formation and personnel group that ensured defeat yesterday. Then, after the game, he refused to take any responsibility.

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No matter what anyone thinks, the United States will not be a legitimate threat on the international stage in the foreseeable future. It just will not happen. Regardless of what anyone thinks, our best athletes simply will not play this sport. Soccer requires a skill set that someone just one day can't jump up and say "Ya know, I think I will play soccer" and boom take out Brazil. It does require athleticism but also great skill.

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Most ignorant take thus far.

Baseball players are good at baseball. Football players, football. etc. etc. It's not like there is a pool of athletes in each country, and you have to evenly distribute them. People will play what they're talented at.

Which sport has the top athletes? Football? Why, because it's king here? I'd venture to say the Lance Armstrong is one of our country's top athlete, and cycling is not a popular sport here....and he competes against country's that promote that sport.

Besides that, over half the US team plays professionally in Europe. With the Europeans 'top athletes'.

So even if they aren't the US's 'top athletes' they are good enough to play with the rest of the world's top athletes.

We have just as much of a chance as other countries. We just lay a turd in Europe for some reason....and need to get past that hump.

[This message has been edited by aggrad99 (edited 6/13/2006 12:26p).]

Arena and most of the team were totally unprepared. It looks like this team didn't even want to be there. I am thinking that the they couldn't handle the pressure an expectations. I also believe that with what I am hearing from Arena (the players stunk) and Reyna (we played OK, but they just excuted their chances better, coach made some poor tactical decisions in the second half) makes me think that this team is going to totally implode and we are going to ahve France '98 all over again.

A few of the bright spots.

Gooch - the guy played his ass off. This is his first WC match, and it pisses me off that he is getting singled out. Keller and Mastroni had more to do with that first goal than Gooch, who got caught in no man's land trying to guard two men in the box. He also had a bad clear, but Rosicky's second goal wouldn't have happened had Reyna marked him and not been jogging his lazy ass behind the play. Other than that, I thought that he challenged well and was a good, physical presence on defense.

Johnson - If he doesn't play against Italy, I will be very upset. He is the only player that had any energy on offense for the US.

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Try and make something idiot proof, and all they do is make a better idiot.

[This message has been edited by stick95 (edited 6/13/2006 12:26p).]

Stick- I'm with you about Gooch. He made a stupid mistake on the second goal....but overall, I felt as if he was the only defender making a difference.

The way I view our team is like this. They looked like a group of very good soccer players, that were playing together for the first time.

They didnt pass well, never played to the open space, didnt anticipate each other at all, our defense was out of sync the entire game....etc.

We've got to come out and play.....and not be so intimidated. Just come out and go from the first whistle...

I would probably add Convey to this list was well. He missed on some crosses, but he was definately running AT the Czechs. I would definately keep him in against Italy.

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Try and make something idiot proof, and all they do is make a better idiot.

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football, baseball, basketball, track, tennis, golf gobble up 90% of the great athletes in the nation. soccer gets to pick from the few that CHOOSE soccer over those respective sports, which is FEW AND FAR BETWEEN.

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I understand what is meant, and I agree to a certain degree. However, that being said, I don't believe that the US dominates on all these sports as implied. They represent and are competative in ALL sports, which few countries can claim, but do not reign supreme over all like most want to believe.

Football - really can't be compared b/c no other country has a league like us. It's like England or India claiming they are number one in cricket. Does anyone else outside their country care?
Baseball - can't remember the last time the US won the baseball olympics or took the world championship. Who won it this past summer in San Diego? Japan? And yes, I realize that we don't send out best players, but who's to blame for that?
basketball - again, we don't dominte the international tournaments. We did back in the 90's, but not anymore. I believe we have the best players in the world, but if we don't win, you really can't make that claim.
Tennis - dominating players come from all over the world, not just the US, though we hold a sizeable %. A good international mix here.
Golf - yeah, mostly dominated by the US, but this is truly a rich man's sport, so if any country is to dominate the sport, might as well be the richest country in the world. If Ghana started dominating the internation circuit, I'd be a bit disturbed.
Just some thoughts.

[This message has been edited by aggivedave16 (edited 6/13/2006 1:33p).]

An ignorant take huh? Well, the US backed in to the knockout stage the last go round after getting their arses beat into the ground. In 1998 the US was one of the worst teams in the tournament. If you don't believe that the US would get the hell beat out of them by at least 16 of the qualifying teams you are drinking the kool aid.

Now, just calm down and try to understand what I am talking about. Take track for instance. In the 80s many teams had success taking track stars and turning them into elite NFL wide receivers. That is a position that if you can run you can succeed. That is not the case for quarterback. Take any elite major league pitcher and stick them behind center and a quarterback they do not make.

In the US our elite athletes are going to play other sports. They are not going to play soccer.

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In the US our elite athletes are going to play other sports. They are not going to play soccer.

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The retort is that the US elites aren't as elite as you may think. At as least their international records show.

Well, we are starting to see the world catch up to us in basketball. But once again basketball is a different game. Take Ben Wallace. The guy is a freak of nature but if you left him alone in a gym he could not score 20 points to save his life. Yet he is a front line NBA player.

What I am saying is that our sports, with the notable exception of baseball, if you are gifter athletically you have a chance to succeed. Anybody that can run has a shot to play wide receiver.

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Well, we are starting to see the world catch up to us in basketball. But once again basketball is a different game. Take Ben Wallace. The guy is a freak of nature but if you left him alone in a gym he could not score 20 points to save his life. Yet he is a front line NBA player.

What I am saying is that our sports, with the notable exception of baseball, if you are gifter athletically you have a chance to succeed. Anybody that can run has a shot to play wide receiver.

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This argument really makes no sense. Maybe we just don't see eye to eye.

You're conceding basketball to me.

And saying that baseball takes exceptional skill to play. What does that have to do with anything? Either way, my point is that the US "elite" don’t dominate this sport.

Moving on. You say that if you can run fast, you can be a wide receiver in the NFL. One position of the many, the sport has. A sport that only this country plays. And... ?

The point I'm trying to make is that, even if we did send our elite players and groom them to play soccer from a young age, would that guarantee US victories? Not at all. Keep in mind that the US, even after this past pitiful game, is still a good team. They made it to the quarterfinals last year, and would probably make it to the next round had they not drawn such a tough group.

What I mean is that just raw athletic ability will not allow you to just go out and start kicking the hell out of people in soccer. It is a game that requires more skill. Take Beckham. He is getting up there in age but the guy does have skill. But is he strong and fast? Nope.

One thing about soccer players is once they hit 30 their game slips. Manchester United has a policy that they will not sign a guy in his 30s to anything more than a one year contract.

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One thing about soccer players is once they hit 30 their game slips.

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This is true for most sports, with the exception of maybe golf. Stating the obvious isn't making your point any clearer. And please don't start spouting out NFL, NBA, or MLB player's names, b/c then I'll reply with some 30+ year old soccer players and we'll never get anywhwere.

That depends on the league. The EPL is a very physical league as compared to the others and once a player hits 30 teams really become wary. Arsenal right now is telling Pires to hit the road.

I don't know if we agree or just are not following what the other is saying or if we are not in agreement. Beats me.

However, back to my original point and this point is undeniable. The USA is not a player on the world stage as far as soccer is concerned. All we can do is piss in someone's punch bowl from time to time.

Also, you rpoint about grooming our best athletes and sending them to play soccer is a valid point. It would not assure us of anything. As I stated, we are starting to see that in basketball as well as baseball.

aggiedave, the US is in the top 3 if not the best in the world at the following sports:

golf
tennis (tough to measure)
baseball (threw a team together)
football
basketball (threw a team together)
track and field

i'm sorry. seriously, you have to be able to understand that our our athletes are spread SO THINLY across all of our sports. the popular sports get their pick of the athletes. if soccer is as popular as baseball and has a professional league, a decent one, in the US, your pool of potential soccer players grows, literally exponentially and i don't even know if that would do it justice.

most of the kids that play soccer aren't the best athletes in the school. the kids i knew that played were athletic, but not in the caliber of the upper echilon bball, baseball, football kids.

hopefully more kids will start playing the sport as far as possible, choosing it over/in addition to the other competitive sports that are open to them.

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In the US our elite athletes are going to play other sports. They are not going to play soccer.

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I dont understand this at all. Even with all your explanations, it makes no sense.

Have we reached our limit of pro sports or something? Why is the line drawn at soccer? We are a country that puts a high price on sports....and I dont see why people wont choose to focus on soccer (especially now that we have a pro league, and our players are getting paid hansomely to play in Europe).

And for the first time in our country's history, most kids grow up exposed to the sport. My father never played soccer. He wasn't aware of any leagues in the Dallas area as a kid. Today, there are leagues everywhere, filled by kids playing on Saturday morning.

I think it's ignorant to say that since we haven't been good in the past, we won't be good in the future. Like you said, We're not going to pick up a ball and start dominating, but we're making good strides (even if this particular team doesn't do well in this WC).

look at other successful soccer teams. italy, the czechs, argentina - are those players "world class athletes?" i dont think so. for the most part they are average/above average athletes with lots of skill. an american team full of super athletes means nothing w/o skill.

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look at other successful soccer teams. italy, the czechs, argentina - are those players "world class athletes?" i dont think so

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pretty sure you are wrong on that one. The teams that dominate the most popular and most played sport in the world are not world class? Yeah...good logic

[This message has been edited by my_december (edited 6/14/2006 3:11p).]

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Baseball players are good at baseball. Football players, football. etc. etc. It's not like there is a pool of athletes in each country, and you have to evenly distribute them. People will play what they're talented at.

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so how would you know if you're talented in soccer if you never played? the point is that other than playing as 4th graders, 85% of athletes want nothing to do with soccer. that doesn't mean they wouldn't be good players....THEY have no interest.

i can't believe some people are disputing this.

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pretty sure you are wrong on that one. The teams that dominate the most popular and most played sport in the world are not world class? Yeah...good logic

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so you are telling me italy is a team full of world class athletes? how many players on that team can be labeled "one of the fastest and/or strongest athletes in the world?"
they are more highly skilled than they are purely athletic