It's just one, but is Mr. Mayor supposed to be any good? Love the cast, and it's a Tina Fey show.

Bruce Almighty said:

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The comedy genre itself is dying. We still see comedy, but in the age of genre blending, the traditional comedy movie is rare. Also, comedy is typically a young person's game. As comedians age, they take on more serious roles and are replaced by younger comedians. If the younger generation doesn't replace them, it's going to go away.

The younger generation doesn't watch a lot of tv, their comedy comes from tik tok and other social media platforms. They watch big budget action films and horror. The tv they do watch is mostly reality tv or Netflix. Add in our current PC culture (comedy is at its best when it directed at the misfortune of others), it's slowly eroding away.

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How many well known comedians are there under 30? I understand it takes a long time understand your style and craft but it seems there should be more late-20 somethings out there hitting their stride. Maybe they dont have outlets like SNL, late night and Comedy Central anymore. Or maybe I'm just not aware of their existence as a middle aged consumer myself

tysker said:

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Bruce Almighty said:

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The comedy genre itself is dying. We still see comedy, but in the age of genre blending, the traditional comedy movie is rare. Also, comedy is typically a young person's game. As comedians age, they take on more serious roles and are replaced by younger comedians. If the younger generation doesn't replace them, it's going to go away.

The younger generation doesn't watch a lot of tv, their comedy comes from tik tok and other social media platforms. They watch big budget action films and horror. The tv they do watch is mostly reality tv or Netflix. Add in our current PC culture (comedy is at its best when it directed at the misfortune of others), it's slowly eroding away.

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How many well known comedians are there under 30? I understand it takes a long time understand your style and craft but it seems there should be more late-20 somethings out there hitting their stride. Maybe they dont have outlets like SNL, late night and Comedy Central anymore. Or maybe I'm just not aware of their existence as a middle aged consumer myself

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No idea. I'v read that even comedy clubs aren't as big as they used to be.

Follow up question: Did video kill the radio star?

Confession:

I shot the sheriff.

Yeah I don't think it's more complicated than there is a lot more creative freedom at streaming services. Which means that's where the big names in writing and acting go.
Network TV is all but dead creatively.

Bruce Almighty said:

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The comedy genre itself is dying. We still see comedy, but in the age of genre blending, the traditional comedy movie is rare. Also, comedy is typically a young person's game. As comedians age, they take on more serious roles and are replaced by younger comedians. If the younger generation doesn't replace them, it's going to go away.

The younger generation doesn't watch a lot of tv, their comedy comes from tik tok and other social media platforms. They watch big budget action films and horror. The tv they do watch is mostly reality tv or Netflix. Add in our current PC culture (comedy is at its best when it directed at the misfortune of others), it's slowly eroding away.

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Nailed it!

All good takes. Seems to be a combination of factors, as opposed to one, apparent issue.

Mainstream television blows. Long term it's not a business model that can sustain itself IMO. There is literally not one mainstream television show I watch. I did watch This is Us for a while but it got too soap operay and political. Kids watch YouTube these days. When they are adults the dynamic is going to change dramatically.

Notable single-camera network comedies in the post-Seinfeld/Friends era...

- Scrubs (2001-2009)
- Arrested Development (2003-2006, 2013, 2018, 2019)
- The Office (2005-2013)
- 30 Rock (2006-2013)
- Community (2009-2015)
- Modern Family (2009-2020)
- Parks and Recreation (2009-2015)
- New Girl (2011-2017)
- Brooklyn Nine-Nine (2013-????)
- The Goldbergs (2013-????)
- The Good Place (2016-2020)

Notable cable/streaming comedies in the post-Seinfeld/Friends era...

- Sex and the City (1998-2004)
- Curb Your Enthusiasm (2000-????)
- Entourage (2004-2011)
- It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia (2005-????)
- Eastbound & Down (2009-2013)
- The League (2009-2015)
- Girls (2012-2016)
- Veep (2012-2019)
- Silicon Valley (2014-2019)
- Love (2016-2018)
- Vice Principals (2016-2018)
- Barry (2018-????)
- The Righteous Gemstones (2019-????)
- What We Do in the Shadows (2019-????)
- Dave (2020-????)

So, basically, the last "notable" single-cam network comedy - The Good Place - premiered over four years ago, in 2016, and it was only semi-popular at that. However, it has since ended, and of that group, only The Goldbergs and Brooklyn Nine-Nine remain, both of which premiered in 2013. In other words, it's been over seven years since a truly popular, single-cam network comedy premiered.

Cable comedies are in a bit better shape, with six notable ones remaining - Curb, Sunny, Barry, Gemstones, Shadows, and Dave. Technically, Master of None (2015-2017) and Atlanta (2016-????) should be part of the cable/streaming second list, and of those two Atlanta still remains, but I don't really consider either true comedies, though maybe I should.

I can't think of a single streaming comedy I watch, with Love on Netflix being the last - and only (?) - one. Either way, considering the current landscape - across network, cable, and streaming - you'd think we'd have at least a few more popular, half-hour comedies to choose from, considering what's come before, along with the sheer amount of content available today.

and Brooklyn Nine NIne has basically had to fight for its existence, right?

Yeah, it moved from Fox to NBC a season or two ago, and there's no word yet on when it's coming back, with Covid and everything. They also apparently had to rewrite a few episodes for the upcoming season due to the protests this summer, existing in a BLM world, etc. So I bet the next season is its last, whenever it finally returns.

Not going to dive in politically but....

Quote:

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Sure, a couple of those shows probably have, say, one two many gay jokes for modern times, but watching them again, none of them feel like they couldn't exist and succeed basically as-is today, both comedically and culturally.

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In "modern times" such as now, there's no such thing as too many gay jokes. It was the political correctness/woke/"culture" stuff that killed it in our house.

Which comedies, in your opinion, are bowing to political correctness/woke culture/etc? As I said above, it sounds like Brooklyn Nine-Nine is potentially going to address BLM in some way, but I can't think of a single other show out of those two lists that are or have gone PC in any way, especially on the cable side. In fact, some of them are as crude and jaw-dropping as ever in that regard.

Just to offer a different perspective:

I don't think the quality of Comedy or dramas on Network television has gone down. I think the way we consume and share has dramatically shifted, and this is the reason.

Far gone are the days of the majority of the nation choosing from 3 or 4 networks options, consumed on a specific night and time with the rest of nation, and rehashing it with actual folks at work or school. My first viewing of Seinfeld, King of Queens, Family Ties, Scrubs and so many other shows (Just Shoot Me, fired up, Mad About You, Remington Steele, Simon & Simon, etc) were because of lead in shows or just happened to be on that night and there wasn't an inventory of 7000 episodes of shows at my fingertips to watch anytime so I sat and watched. A show like Seinfeld is funny and you got others to watch it, or someone might tell you about Cheers so you tuned in and watched on Thursday, and then you would talk about it and then wait a week and not 12 second to watch the next episode. You didn't want to miss watching ER or Hill Street Blues because others would have seen it and unless you had programmed the VCR, you had to wait until trying to see reruns. Now so much is available at nearly anytime, and you might discuss on message board with strangers on message board who aren't on same episode and probably watched 20 other shows since.

To make a so so comparison, my grandfather made awesome homemade ice cream, and it was such a special experience to have it with my family maybe once a trip to their house. That is my memory of great dessert and now my entertainment options is a perpetual Baskin Robbins in my own freezer that I can eat all on my own whenever.

Personally, I am not in camp that the writing, directing, acting etc is not as good now. I just think the consumption of shows is so different now.

PatAg said:

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and Brooklyn Nine NIne has basically had to fight for its existence, right?

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The truly great comedies have always had to fight for their existence.

Arrested Development almost didn't get a second season despite winning Emmys. Scrubs survived a while, but had to move networks. Community never had good ratings because it was opposite BBT. 30 Rock never had good ratings. Parks & Rec's best season (ratings wise) was it's first, when it ranked 96th (!). What We Do in the Shadows rarely gets more than 1 million viewers for an episode.

Meanwhile, Two and a Half Men averaged over 13 million viewers for its entire run.

Overall, I agree that cable comedies have gotten better and better, and are in a pretty good place right now. And I agree that the zeitgeist likely won't ever consume or talk about network comedies like the good ol' days. But there's absolutely no way you can argue that, quality-wise, network comedies are currently as good or better than they used to be.

You're forgetting My Name Is Earl and Raising Hope in the list of great comedies too.

Good call on Earl. That said, I have no idea what Raising Hope is.

DubFalls said:

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You're forgetting My Name Is Earl and Raising Hope in the list of great comedies too.

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Raising Hope was seriously underrated

Gotcha. Good to know, thanks.

Damn it. Same. One of my favorites of all time.

I guess at this point we're just listing shows for the sake of listing shows but I would add Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt to the streaming comedies.

Probably Youtube. People have 24/7 access to exactly what they find funny or interesting. Network TV is one size fits all.

I'd add Better Off Ted to the list of great, underrated sitcoms.

bigcat22 said:

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Not to be "that guy" but I think "wokeism" is slowly killing comedy. I'm sure some writers might be gun shy on certain topics for fear of being cancelled. Just looks at the first few seasons of The Office, a lot of those episodes wouldn't fly in today's climate.

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It is.

I've heard several comedians mention as much.

Also, I know it's heresy around here, but The Big Bang is fun. (First season is terrible)

Never watched it when it was airing, it I enjoy the reruns

DubFalls said:

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I'd add Better Off Ted to the list of great, underrated sitcoms.

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The episode where their new motion sensors would not detect dark skin (ie black people) was the best of the series.

And probably wouldn't be written today.