Well put.
Indiana Jones and The Dial of Destiny - reshoots? Bomb?
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Last: 3 yr ago by bluefire579
It's going to be a challenge, no doubt. And Mangold might even fail on that level.
I'm also reacting to/speaking to the genesis of all these complaints and nonsense, which is the Kathleen Kennedy/anti-wokeness of it all. I'm no Kennedy fan myself, and can be just as annoyed by certain kinds of wokeness as the next guy, but I'm essentially trying to say that Mangold isn't someone who's going to suddenly bend and make Indiana Jones, of all franchises, a feminist plight because Kennedy has some crazed agenda and is telling him to. This is the incredibly dumb premise of all these asinine Doomcock videos, a premise I hate giving any credence to whatsoever. Never mind the simple fact that Mangold is one of the "manliest," most testosterone-driven directors out there.
I'm also reacting to/speaking to the genesis of all these complaints and nonsense, which is the Kathleen Kennedy/anti-wokeness of it all. I'm no Kennedy fan myself, and can be just as annoyed by certain kinds of wokeness as the next guy, but I'm essentially trying to say that Mangold isn't someone who's going to suddenly bend and make Indiana Jones, of all franchises, a feminist plight because Kennedy has some crazed agenda and is telling him to. This is the incredibly dumb premise of all these asinine Doomcock videos, a premise I hate giving any credence to whatsoever. Never mind the simple fact that Mangold is one of the "manliest," most testosterone-driven directors out there.
John Williams hinted at filming for a new ending while at an event in Italy.
Not sure where to go with that.
Mangold has also emphatically stated the rumors of the previously mentioned ending are categorically false, so thank God for that
I'm still excited for this. As mentioned, SW found all of the wrong ways to handle Luke, Leia, and Han. I hope Mangold handles this well, because Last Crusade is one of my all time faves and crystal skull was just incredibly disappointing. I want Indy to get the finale he deserves.
Quote:
So we have just about completed the film. We have maybe another ending to shoot and to record, maybe in a couple weeks.
Not sure where to go with that.
Mangold has also emphatically stated the rumors of the previously mentioned ending are categorically false, so thank God for that
Quote:
No one is 'taking over' or replacing Indy or donning his hat nor is he being 'erased' through some contrivance and he never was, not not in any cut or script but trolls will troll that's how they get their clicks.
I'm still excited for this. As mentioned, SW found all of the wrong ways to handle Luke, Leia, and Han. I hope Mangold handles this well, because Last Crusade is one of my all time faves and crystal skull was just incredibly disappointing. I want Indy to get the finale he deserves.
Agreed, best they could do is revive River Phoenix and have him take over. The trailer looks super underwhelming and even the title sounds like an off brand Agatha Christie novel. It's just a tall task for a great director and I applaud him for trying but a huge problem will be the studio and producers, don't you think? These movies are not made in a vacuum and the amount of outside influence may overshadow the writing or the directing.
I will hold out hope this is any better than Crystal Skull but to think it will suddenly recapture the joy of Last Crusade is I think a fantasy. This will likely end up being something closer Jurassic World Dominion.
I will hold out hope this is any better than Crystal Skull but to think it will suddenly recapture the joy of Last Crusade is I think a fantasy. This will likely end up being something closer Jurassic World Dominion.
Dekker_Lentz said:TCTTS said:
Also, guys, again, this movie is written and directed by James Mangold, the writer/director behind Walk the Line, Logan, and Ford v Ferrari. He's one of the best, most reliable filmmakers out there. Given his pedigree, and given the lessons learned on Crystal Skull, the chances of them screwing this up are actually pretty low.
Just to play devil's advocate, because I agree that Mangold is a great film maker.
But Indiana Jones is kinda a different beast than all of those other movies. Indy/Star Wars have a lot of childhood nostalgia that really clouds people ability to objectively view those stories. I know I am guilty of this as it relates to Star Wars.
Here is what I think the biggest issue will be:
For Logan, I think people were ready to say goodbye to Hugh Jackman as Wolverine and this story brought closure. And people secretly knew a version of Wolverine would be back.
I, and a lot of people, were not ready to say goodbye to Luke/Han/Leia. And what we got was a pretty bad way to do it. If I am being honest, I am not sure there is even a good way. My inner kid wants Luke/Han/Leia out there fighting evil.
I think Indiana Jones, is the same way for a lot of people. They want him out there recovering treasure and stopping Nazis.
I am not sure any director can make a movie that people will feel good about saying good bye to Indiana Jones.
Not saying it won't be good. But it is going to be a hard story to tell, regardless of talent.
Agree with this. The perfect send off for Indy was last crusade - riding off into the sunset and a future full of adventure.
I'm skeptical of another old Indy adventure. It's weird seeing an old guy pull of stunts, and the magic of Indy is as much the era as anything else - it's fun seeing this guy adventure around a pre-WWII world fighting Nazi's.
If they really want more indy, they should just find the right time to recast indy. Or, if they want to be really crazy, slap Harrison's young face on a stunt double and use CGI magic to just keep giving us adventures with indiana Jones in his prime. We've been getting small doses of this for a few years with mixed results as the tech gets better, but once they crack the code, someone's going to give us a full-length motion picture with de-aged actors. And if Harrison's alive, they can have him do all the face and voice acting for computers to map it to the double.
Thanks and gig'em
Truer words have never been spoken.Quote:
The perfect send off for Indy was last crusade - riding off into the sunset and a future full of adventure.
But that does not mean that I ignore the existence of further Indiana Jones films. I liked Crystal Skull okay, actually more than the Temple of Doom (the kid and the blonde were fingernails on a chalk board for me). I certainly hope this last IJ movie will do the character justice.
Ok, now thats a resume i can get behind. Thanks for the info.TCTTS said:
Also, guys, again, this movie is written and directed by James Mangold, the writer/director behind Walk the Line, Logan, and Ford v Ferrari. He's one of the best, most reliable filmmakers out there. Given his pedigree, and given the lessons learned on Crystal Skull, the chances of them screwing this up are actually pretty low.
Logan especially, for a stunning surprise in that xmen series.
It is really odd how great r1, andor were….mando pretty good….but fett and kenobi were ****, and there is no denying that the recent main star wars **** were literally the most deliberately insulting, asinine, commie ****ed up bull**** ever put on any screen at any price…
So how in the world can anyone know what to expect?
It'll be woke for sure. Hollywood can't escape itself. Mangold may be good but too many hands in the pie. They are fine using once sacred IP to push their agenda.
Tibbers said:
It'll be woke for sure. Hollywood can't escape itself. Mangold may be good but too many hands in the pie. They are fine using once sacred IP to push their agenda.
There is literally not a single hint of wokeness in that entire trailer. None. Zero. Combined with Mangold's woke-free track record, in every other thing he's ever made, along with the fact that he has enough sway, power, and success to not even take the job in the first place, much less put himself at the mercy of anyone who would force any woke crap on him, and this is just more irrational TexAgs nonsense.
TCTTS said:Tibbers said:
It'll be woke for sure. Hollywood can't escape itself. Mangold may be good but too many hands in the pie. They are fine using once sacred IP to push their agenda.
There is literally not a single hint of wokeness in that entire trailer. None. Zero. Combined with Mangold's woke-free track record, in every other thing he's ever made, along with the fact that he has enough sway, power, and success to not even take the job in the first place, much less put himself at the mercy of anyone who would force any woke crap on him, and this is just more irrational TexAgs nonsense.
Uh, hello, they're letting a girl do stuff in it. Woke city.
Sadly, that's literally how their concern comes across.
Ok, skimmed through about half that absurd video in about 1 minute….and i will say that was the only minute i will ever spend on 'doomcock'. Wtf!?
Here's to hoping its just a good movie.
Here's to hoping its just a good movie.
Will circle back to this comment when the movie comes out. Hollywood can't get out of its own way sometimes. Can you point to me where Mangold has complete control of the film? If that were the case, why the necessity for reshoots?
Reshoots aren't uncommon and they aren't necessarily bad. At the end of a making a movie, you may realize something isn't working the way you hoped or something needs to be added.
It's concerning when you hear numerous reports that drastic reshoots are needed because something totally sucks. Like, say, when Whedon is brought in to totally reshoot Justice league. It still sucked!
The most famous "good" reshoot is back to the future. They originally had another actor for Marty, but realized after six weeks of filming that it just wasn't working, and then reshot it all with Michael J Fox. And Back to the Future is friggin amazing.
It's concerning when you hear numerous reports that drastic reshoots are needed because something totally sucks. Like, say, when Whedon is brought in to totally reshoot Justice league. It still sucked!
The most famous "good" reshoot is back to the future. They originally had another actor for Marty, but realized after six weeks of filming that it just wasn't working, and then reshot it all with Michael J Fox. And Back to the Future is friggin amazing.
Thanks and gig'em
Tibbers said:
Will circle back to this comment when the movie comes out. Hollywood can't get out of its own way sometimes. Can you point to me where Mangold has complete control of the film? If that were the case, why the necessity for reshoots?
Literally every big movie goes through reshoots. Every. Single. One. Reshoots are built into the budget. Once a director has an initial cut of the film, he/she for the first time is able to identify what connective tissue might be missing, what information isn't coming across clearly enough, etc, that they weren't able to see in script form. Thus... reshoots, or "additional photography" as it's often referred to. Again, "reshoots" doesn't necessarily translate to "screwed up." They're a natural part of the filmmaking process, no different than a second/third draft of a script.
As for Mangold having complete control of the film, that hasn't been stated publicly, but he's easily on the same level as Tony Gilroy, who wrote Andor, and said that *he* had complete creative control of that series (and look how that turned out). Again, Mangold didn't have to take this job. He has a dozen other super-high-profile projects in the works, and I'm *positive* only took this job on the condition he have a certain level of creative freedom. In fact, he and his writing partner came in and completely scrapped everything that had been written prior, by other writers for other iterations, and started from scratch with their own idea. Which indicates the level of control/sway he has on this thing, never mind the fact that Kennedy simply isn't going to tell someone like Mangold what to do, just like she didn't tell Gilroy what to do.
Was typing as you were posting, but well said.
Rogue One, I believe, is another example of a movie with lots of reshoots. That one is regularly regarded as one of the best Star Wars movies.
The director already called this bull**** and they usual suspects are riling people up over culture war *****hunter2012 said:
My favorite leak is the eye-rolling ending that Indy gets erased from time and sacrificing himself only for Bridge's character, who by the way was shown to be super awesome and more competent than him the whole movie, after he's wiped in the middle of his previous adventures she picks up the hat and takes his whole role in existence. The movie will end with the setup for launching the new Indy series staring Bridge. Sorry but this has KK's fingerprints all over it as if her mugshot was on the movie poster itself. Personally I hope it's right just for the comedy of it.
some get riled up because TC says it so let me remind you
You guys are following the words of an ******* named
DOOM
COCK
Doomcock
There is a woke mind virus for sure, but come on man
You guys are following the words of an ******* named
DOOM
COCK
Doomcock
There is a woke mind virus for sure, but come on man
What's wrong with a rooster that brings ill omens?
Actually I was referring to John Williams' comments.
Mangold sounds like a bond villains name. It makes me laugh a little every time it is said so nonchalantly in this thread.
They don't have to be ill omens, The original meaning of the word doom was more like judgment or decision or fate, not necessarily negative or positive. Hence, the "Doom of Men" in Tolkien's legendarium just means that it is the fate of Man to be mortal and die. While later Numenorians, misled and corrupted by Sauron, strove against their mortality, it in fact was no better or worse than the immortality of the elves; it was just different. In fact, it would occasionally also be referred to as the Gift of Men or even the Gift of Iluvatar.DubFalls said:
What's wrong with a rooster that brings ill omens?
1. For the last 3+ years, every legacy IP that Disney owns has been turned into woke propaganda, often replacing the main protagonist with female or minority copies of the original
2. Indy 5 cast woke Phoebe Waller Bridge to replace Shia LeBouf's character
3. The movie has production issues and has multiple delays. Recently, John Williams alludes to reshooting another ending mere months before it's release date.
4. Internet rumors surfaces that test screenings involve a cheap time travel plot. Some dork dresses up as a power ranger and posts the rumors on YouTube.
TCTTS is worked up about #4 while ignoring #1
If Disney hadn't already ruined Star Wars, no one would care about TCTTS's arch-nemesis Doomcock.
2. Indy 5 cast woke Phoebe Waller Bridge to replace Shia LeBouf's character
3. The movie has production issues and has multiple delays. Recently, John Williams alludes to reshooting another ending mere months before it's release date.
4. Internet rumors surfaces that test screenings involve a cheap time travel plot. Some dork dresses up as a power ranger and posts the rumors on YouTube.
TCTTS is worked up about #4 while ignoring #1
If Disney hadn't already ruined Star Wars, no one would care about TCTTS's arch-nemesis Doomcock.
Albatross Necklace said:
1. For the last 3+ years, every legacy IP that Disney owns has been turned into woke propaganda, often replacing the main protagonist with female or minority copies of the original
This isn't even a remotely true statement. Off the top of my head, to name a few, nothing about Rogue One, Solo, The Mandalorian, Andor, Spider-Man: Far From Home, Spider-Man: No Way Home, Loki, or Hawkeye could be considered "woke." Nor does simply casting a diverse or female lead make something "woke." This is such ridiculous, neanderthal thinking. For one, casting diverse/female leads in action/sci-fi/fantasy properties is, more often than not, an attempt to diversify/broaden your audience, with the aim of selling more tickets. And casting action/sci-fi/fantasy female leads, specifically, has been going on since at least the late '60s, with stars like Jane Fonda (Barbarella), Sigourney Weaver, Linda Hamilton, Angelina Jolie, Jennifer Lawrence, etc, among MANY others. This is nothing new, and again, Star Wars, Marvel, etc playing to those character types and trying to garner those audiences isn't "woke." Has there been some minor but legitimately "woke" stuff sprinkled throughout recent Disney properties? Sure. But as has been litigated a thousand times here, most of it is hardly egregious, and is by and large internet hysterics by people looking for something to be offended by and to use as a means to virtue signal.
2. Indy 5 cast woke Phoebe Waller Bridge to replace Shia LeBouf's character
Phoebe Waller Bridge didn't "replace" Shia LeBouf's character. Everyone and their dog disliked Crystal Skull, and not including Mutt was an attempt to distance this movie from that one (not to mention, when Dial of Destiny was casting, LeBouf was on the verge of being cancelled for sexual battery and physical/verbal abuse, something he's essentially admitted to as of late). It has nothing to do with an attempt to be "woke." Again, having female sidekicks or leads in action/sci-fi/fantasy movies has been a thing for decades now.
3. The movie has production issues and has multiple delays. Recently, John Williams alludes to reshooting another ending mere months before its release date.
The Mangold iteration has had ZERO "production issues" and was only delayed because of Covid. Yes, before Mangold signed on, Lucasfilm had trouble landing on the right MacGuffin/script, but that's no different than the development of every Indiana Jones sequel to date, especially Crystal Skull, which went through nearly two decades of development hell.
As for the "reshoots," again, see my post earlier above about literally every modern blockbuster having reshoots built into their budgets. Also, do you have any idea how many great endings were found in reshoots/additional photography? That, and if you actually listen to Williams' words, he calls it "another" ending. He doesn't say "new" or "different." A technicality, yes, but it could simply mean that they haven't yet shot some extra little end tag or post-credit scene. We have no idea, which is all the more reason to stop with the concern trolling.
4. Internet rumors surfaces that test screenings involve a cheap time travel plot. Some dork dresses up as a power ranger and posts the rumors on YouTube.
There have been ZERO test screenings for this movie as of yet. Anyone - be it Doomcock or other - who says there have been, is lying.
Seriously, how many more facts do I have to drop before you guys shut the hell up about this bad faith nonsense? The aggrieved, anti-woke, internet warrior stuff is so incredibly stupid, and getting so incredibly old.
TCTTS is worked up about #4 while ignoring #1
If Disney hadn't already ruined Star Wars, no one would care about TCTTS's arch-nemesis Doomcock.
I think some of you guys are really hoping this movie is a disaster just so you can complain and boast how right you were.
Albatross Necklace said:
1. For the last 3+ years, every legacy IP that Disney owns has been turned into woke propaganda, often replacing the main protagonist with female or minority copies of the original
2. Indy 5 cast woke Phoebe Waller Bridge to replace Shia LeBouf's character
3. The movie has production issues and has multiple delays. Recently, John Williams alludes to reshooting another ending mere months before it's release date.
4. Internet rumors surfaces that test screenings involve a cheap time travel plot. Some dork dresses up as a power ranger and posts the rumors on YouTube.
TCTTS is worked up about #4 while ignoring #1
If Disney hadn't already ruined Star Wars, no one would care about TCTTS's arch-nemesis Doomcock.
Ding ding ding. It's like they have sonar specifically geared to look for things that have even the slightest chance of offending them. And then they reverse engineer whatever their sonar pings back, in attempt to make it something they can be aggrieved by, and publicly b*tch and moan about, on a forum where, ironically, no one wants to hear it. They'll do this at all cost, no matter the reality, because deep down it's the only way they know how to express or define themselves.
I'm gonna have to disagree with you there on number 1. Jennifer Lawrence let everyone know just the other day she was the first female lead in an action type film.
I knew someone would bring that up.
(That said, she's since clarified her words.)
(That said, she's since clarified her words.)
Milwaukees Best Light
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AG
Doomcock. Awesome handle.
‘Indiana Jones 5’: James Mangold Denies Rumors Of Alternate Endings & Extensive Reshoots For The Upcoming Sequel https://t.co/CqDO6stEj0 pic.twitter.com/zEalrXjrVp
— The Playlist (@ThePlaylistNews) December 19, 2022
She kind of forgot about....TCTTS said:
I knew someone would bring that up.
(That said, she's since clarified her words.)
Kill Bill
Alien(s)
Terminator / T2
Among others.
Ok, this is gold. Well done.
Take your star.
Take your star.
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