I know I have caused a lot of problems on here, but I do have a serious question. Why didn't bonfire burn, why didn't the fire catch?

Pine trees are naturally fire retardant.

In a grass-fire situation where the heat is not immense, the bark of the pine tree burns and creates a layer of carbon that resists further burning.

In the Bonfire situation, the burning diesel did not bring the stack temperature to a high enough level to burn through the layer of carbon that formed, and the stack put itself out.

Had the leadership enough time to make mock-up stacks prior to burn (like it was suggested), they would have known about this issue and done their best to deal with it before. Hindsight is 20/20 in this case, and will be done next year.

The solution to this issue is being discussed on another thread.

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If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you can read this in English, thank a Soldier.

Thanks!

The reason forest fires spread in pine treed areas is because of the heat involved. A rapidly heated pine tree will boil the sap inside and cause the tree to split, exposing the heartwood and flamable sap.

Bonfire never got this hot, nor would the engineer care for that to happen so early in the burning. Remember: Every log on stack is non-treated pine and a bunch of ultra-hot splitting pine trees is very dangerous.

If you analyze pictures of stack, you will see that the diesel lit first (obviously) and created a very small amount of smoke with lots of flame. The logs were heated to the point that the sap came out the tops and bottoms of the logs. When sap burns, it gives off LOTS of smoke, which was evident in the plume drifting above stack.

The diesel burned up, stack cooled down, and the sap stopped flowing, thus killing the blaze. The only fires that remained were at the bottoms of the logs where the heartwood was exposed.

Where was this knowledge before burn? It was not brought out until it came time to explain why stack didn't burn. Again, had a mock-stack been made, this brainstorm would have happend prior to burn night and it would have been addressed.

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If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you can read this in English, thank a Soldier.

This is an inpressive analysis. Lessons were learned and nobody got hurt. As far as I am concerned, it was a successful Bonfire.

If only Bonfire's critics knew how much care is being put into the process these days, from the engineering studies through the precautions being taken throughout the night it burns.

Our family had a great time. Unlike the on-campus Bonfires in the 1990s, this was a wholesome, alcohol-free event. We will be back next year, with our contributions, expressions of support, and our presence.



BTW, sorry about the color of my son's jacket. It seems there's a rebel in every family these days.

[This message has been edited by DualAG (edited 11/24/2005 9:13p).]

Opie, I beg to differ with you regarding the mockups. As a member of Moses Hall, I stayed the night perimeter poles were handed out untill six a.m. the following morning with four others. The list of people there include:

Ben "That Guy" Harrison '05 (RAB)
John "Knocker" Goertz '07 (RAB)
Matt "Yokel" Brooks '09 (RAB)
Jeff "River Rat" Bulter '07 (FHK, Junior Greypot)
James "Bullballs" Frazier '07 (Walton, Junior Greypot)

That night, James and Jeff both decided to light the "mini-Stack" that had been erected at Hot Rod Hill. Initially, mini-stack was lit with 5 gallons of diesel and minimal soak time. Held together by duct-tape, it fell apart as soon as the tape melted (10-15 seconds) and the diesel burnt off, leaving a smattering of small, fallen logs and no fire. Jeff and James then proceeded for the next _THREE HOURS_ to unsuccessfully light the mini-stack pile with a mixture of diesel and gasoline. I sat idly by the perimeter fire Moses had lit during Perimeter Pole festivities, and it burned all night.

A model was built. An attempt to burn it, unsuccessful though it turned out, WAS made. 3 hours to get roughly 20 logs no longer than five feet to burn with no positive result.

I'm not heaping blame on Jeff or James, as the lesson was lost on me as well durning the stress of Stack and the 10 relatively sleepless nights we all got. However, the five of us that stayed that night failed to carry the lesson forward from 6 November to 19 November. Those that came to see Burn on 19 November have _my_ sincerest apologies for forgetting about that night until now.

That Guy
RAB 2005
BTHOB

I have to ask - since you used pine instead of oak this year did no one check out the feasability of burning pine? Even with ideal conditions, it would have been a royal pain to get it to light. There's a reason we never let pine or cedar into the thing back in the day.

NoAC, they checked into it. Supposedly the A&M Forestry Dept said, "It'll burn, no problem."

WillD and I discussed the "No Pine on Bonfire" stance before first cut. The line I was always fed for the reason was a fear that the Fire gets so hot that the pine would "crisp" on the outside and the inside would still be wet and cause the log to pop like a popcorn kernel. So, with this in mind, we did some research to ensure that a 30ft bomb wasn't being built out there. We were able to convince ourselves sufficiently that this wouldn't occur.

After watching those perimeter fires for a couple of weeks, I figured it would burn slow, I just never thought it would burn THAT slow. In all honesty, I thought those logs would dry a lot more than they did and it would catch easily. Hindsight is 20/20 though and this will be chalked up as a learning experience for ALL involved.

Scott Coker '92

[This message has been edited by COKEMAN (edited 11/27/2005 10:07p).]

quote:

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it fell apart as soon as the tape melted

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I knew about this fire, but I dismissed it's viability as a model because of it's construction.

Building a bridge out of toothpicks and considering it to be a "functional model" is not realistic.

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If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you can read this in English, thank a Soldier.

Hello everybody.

This is James Frazier and I would like to answer a few questions. 1) We checked with the Forestry Dept. at ATM and they told us that pine should not have a problem burning. 2) The ministack idea was a flop due to the fact that even though it was made out of the same material (pine logs) as the big stack, the logs used were about the same size as logs used in perimeter fires. The smaller diameter logs were able to catch fire easier as there was a considerably less amount of water to displace than that of the bigger logs on the stack. This is why third stack was burning and first stack merely charred. Now we know and can correct this problem.

Hey rookie, how goes it?
Did ya'll just stay at the Chicken last night.

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OC Hogs Build The Hell...

quote:

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After watching those perimeter fires for a couple of weeks

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What perimeter fires?...we didn't light any illegal fires other than stack...