Universals and Particulars - Plato and Aristotle in Western Thought

1,180 Views | 11 Replies | Last: 18 hrs ago by Maximus of Tejas
Notafraid
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There was a thread that got me thinking about the Vatican, and I thought I’s share a little bit of some of the incredible things that Lovelight and I got to see there.

I was kind of actually on the lookout for this room, which is just another room among many many rooms, filled with masterpieces. Rafael painted this, and this is like his “room number 5” or something like that. Not sure if it was his hand exactly that did it all, because when an artist is said to have done something, if it’s really big, often he had a team of his students that painted exactly in his style… Anyway, not to get side tracked…

This is a pic of Plato (pointing up) and Aristotle (gesturing down)
It symbolizes the differences in their philosophies in that Plato focused on universals, and Aristotle focused on particulars.

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Here they are again, kind of doing the same thing:


[URL=http://imgur.com/CNb6N]



The effect that these two philosophers had on Western thought and culture was profound. Especially Aristotle, who’s view really kind of won out, because it was really the one we could access. Universals however have always been built more on authority. This is one reason, the Reformation kind of took off and helped pull culture out of the middle ages, because not only were we making leaps and bounds in the particulars, but we had more of a universal standard to appeal to (the bible).

So right now, we really are kind of at the end of what was the closest thing to a golden age, and since most of Western culture has thrown off the universal standards, even the particulars are beginning to lose meaning.



[This message has been edited by Notafraid (edited 1/27/2012 6:28p).]
Ogre
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Wow. Very nice observation NotAfraid.
torrid
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AG
Universities definitely need to teach the classical philosophers.
kurt vonnegut
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AG
torrid said:

Universities definitely need to teach the classical philosophers.


What!?! Even if one of those philosophers has some writings that can be linked to ideologies that make me triggered and scared?
Rocag
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AG
Plato is too woke for college, didn't you know that?
nortex97
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AG
The forms vs. universals discussion has nothing to do with woke or other silliness on campuses today.
Sapper Redux
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Your personal politics don't change the underlying philosophical questions. Those questions should be addressed in a university and not dictated by politicians.
Maximus of Tejas
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The only true golden age was the Byzantine Empire but Rome and others made sure to end it.
Maximus of Tejas
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What you are seeing as far as western culture goes is the end of a long line of nominalism. Western philosophy rejected the essence-energy distinction so it could never solve the problem of the one and the many and universals. It's unfortunate but that's what happens when you split from Christ.
Sapper Redux
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Maximus of Tejas said:

The only true golden age was the Byzantine Empire but Rome and others made sure to end it.


Lol. Byzantine emperors could make Caligula look restrained.
Maximus of Tejas
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Sapper Redux said:

Maximus of Tejas said:

The only true golden age was the Byzantine Empire but Rome and others made sure to end it.


Lol. Byzantine emperors could make Caligula look restrained.
There will always be ungodly men.
KingofHazor
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Quote:

There will always be ungodly men.

At some point, though, don't you have to start questioning the institution when it keeps producing unGodly men one after another? "By their fruits ye shall know them." And how does an institution and its leaders sit idly by when those unGodly men are engaging in constant depravities?
Maximus of Tejas
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KingofHazor said:

Quote:

There will always be ungodly men.

At some point, though, don't you have to start questioning the institution when it keeps producing unGodly men one after another? "By their fruits ye shall know them." And how does an institution and its leaders sit idly by when those unGodly men are engaging in constant depravities?
The Orthodox Church has always been decentralized which protects it from bad players. Since there is an unbroken tradition you can easily point out who produced bad fruit and why they were removed. The Church has anathema services. Ultimately this topic gets into the theanthropic nature of the Church and the entire worldview.
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