3/26 Update from TAMU Enrollment Manager

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double b
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AG
Last night, I had the pleasure of attending a presentation by Chris Reed, VP of Enrollment Management here in College Station. Below are the notes I took from his session, along with additional comments.

By the Numbers: Admission Stats
Here is the breakdown of the most recent application cycle:
  • Total Applications: ~83,000
  • Completed Applications: 68,000 (82% Apps Completed)
  • Admitted: ~30,000 (44% of Completed Apps Admitted)
  • Target Enrollment: ~12,000 seats (Expecting 40% yield rate)
    • (Includes: Main Campus, Blinn TEAM/TEAB, Galveston, and Gateway)
Academic Profile
  • Average GPA: 4.26
  • Class Rank: 76% of admits are in the top 25% of their graduating class.
  • Approximately 55% of the admitted students are in the top 10%
  • Average Volunteer Hours: 120
Best Practices

  • Apply Early: Aim for September 15th. Don't wait for the deadline.
  • The Essay Matters: Use it to show "Grit." If you don't know what to write about, write about how you've taught yourself things and can handle the rigors of Aggieland.
  • Take the Test: Submit your SAT/ACT scores. It can ONLY help. They have two scoring metrics (with and without test), and they take the higher Academic score of the two.
  • Engage: Meet with recruiters. Show them you want to be there.
  • The Waitlist: If you get waitlisted, be aggressive. The mindset should be: "I want everything," from their list of options.
Major-Specific & Special Info
  • Engineering: Out-of-state/non-top 10% applicants are averaging a 1400 SAT.
  • Mays Business School: Fills 70% of seats early; the remaining spots are filled based on "Best Fit."
  • Residency: Texas A&M does not factor residency into the admissions decision.
  • Homeschool: Just keep it simple: They just need a solid, clear Transcript. Take advantage of their test scores for admissions (1290 SAT = top 10%)
He really preached on two things that guide their decisions. One, do you demonstrate the ability to succeed academically in a college environment? Two, does your background suggest that you can thrive in their campus environment and graduate? That's basically it.

He did express that the vast majority of students who apply to Texas A&M are offered some form of pathway to TAMU, including the PSA Option. He harped on how transfer-friendly they are and how explicit they are about their expectations for getting to TAMU. Very few students do not receive the PSA offer, and if they do, it's because they believe they are not a good academic fit.

In my opinion, his views on admissions are dramatically different from those of many of our peer institutions, and I now understand them better after learning about his background. Mr. Reed comes from a small town, Uvalde, and is actually a product of a community college and the transfer process. He is very much about setting students up for success and creating pathways for those who want to be Aggies.

While most schools have adopted Early Action, which I think he was confused with Early Decision, they have no plans to move toward that process. In my opinion, if they did adopt it, they would find themselves with more complete applications earlier and getting decisions out faster. He mentioned that about half of the applications are submitted between Thanksgiving and December 1st.

Furthermore, most schools have moved to "admit by major," while TAMU is predominantly admitting by application, which means they're reviewing how successful you will be in college, except for engineering. For engineering students, they want to make sure their math skills are strong enough to endure the first year math courses. Most of our peer institutions have long since moved to this "admit by major" model, which has given rise to the "pointy" and "angular" student-development models. He is a firm believer that students need time to make their major/career choices, which, at a school as large as TAMU, is still possible given the size of our admission classes.

Overall, it was an informative session and provided good information for those applying to Texas A&M. However, I did think some of the advice he gave would not have worked for students aiming for more selective institutions.

He conducted about a 45-minute Q&A session, so there was lots more. Feel free to ask additional questions, and I'll answer any questions that he may have addressed in his session.
aggiejohn
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this is really good insight. thank you for sharing.

do we think TAMU will ever move away from rolling admissions? it seems that we are the only institution at this "level" which still does rolling admissions, and it seems to have a cheapening effect on the perception of TAMU, sadly.
double b
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Honestly, I'm not really sure. That's what I was hoping to learn from my question, but he misunderstood it as Early Decision (binding decision).

I do agree that it sort of cheapens our perspective nationally as TAMU is not typically seen in the same discussion as UMiCH, UVA, UIUC, and the UCs. This is my perspective as I talk with other IECs across the nation.

However, from what I've gathered from his talk that they're perfectly okay with their process and how they make decisions. Everything that resonated from his talk was trying to admit as many qualified students as possible to TAMU.
aggiejohn
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John Sharp et al have done a very good job of maximizing the throughput of students through the TAMU campuses, but it has come at the detriment of enrollment excessing swelling. Texas' population has grown, and they have attempted to grow with it (through RELLIS, PSA, Blinn TEAM, etc.) to meet those needs, but it has had a watering down effect on the generic TAMU degree.

From the eyes of most high schoolers nowadays, acceptance into UT is now perceived as a scarce option whereas an acceptances into TAMU are currently viewed as being in abundance.

Mr. Reed needs to understand this, and perhaps he already does (and does not see it as a problem).
double b
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aggiejohn said:

John Sharp et al have done a very good job of maximizing the throughput of students through the TAMU campuses, but it has come at the detriment of enrollment excessing swelling. Texas' population has grown, and they have attempted to grow with it (through RELLIS, PSA, Blinn TEAM, etc.) to meet those needs, but it has had a watering down effect on the generic TAMU degree.

From the eyes of most high schoolers nowadays, acceptance into UT is now perceived as a scarce option whereas an acceptances into TAMU are currently viewed as being in abundance.

Mr. Reed needs to understand this, and perhaps he already does (and does not see it as a problem).



Certainly, I do agree with you. However, I believe what he is trying to do is appease as many students as possible and trying to give them as many viable options to attend Texas A&m. Plus, given his background as a transfer student himself, I believe he places a lot more value on this experience than what most students and families probably do. Because of this, they probably see Blinn Team and the PSA option as opportunities that are strong alternatives to full admissions.

I know in the minds of many students and families though, they're all put off by those options and and see them as consolation prizes for 3 to 4 years of hard work.
GoAgs92
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  • Class Rank: 76% of admits are in the top 25% of their graduating class.
  • The Rest are athletes.
(1290 SAT = top 10%) for homeschoolers...wtf?

if you're not top 25%...don't waste your money or only apply during the free week.
Fat Tony
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aggiejohn said:

this is really good insight. thank you for sharing.

do we think TAMU will ever move away from rolling admissions? it seems that we are the only institution at this "level" which still does rolling admissions, and it seems to have a cheapening effect on the perception of TAMU, sadly.


What is rolling admissions and how does it hurt the perception of A&M? Genuinely curious. Have no clue about this stuff. Thanks.
aggie93
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Fat Tony said:

aggiejohn said:

this is really good insight. thank you for sharing.

do we think TAMU will ever move away from rolling admissions? it seems that we are the only institution at this "level" which still does rolling admissions, and it seems to have a cheapening effect on the perception of TAMU, sadly.


What is rolling admissions and how does it hurt the perception of A&M? Genuinely curious. Have no clue about this stuff. Thanks.

Rolling admissions is simply that A&M continues to accept applications as they come in. Every Top 100 school to my knowledge has dates they release decisions, typically a release date for Early applicants and a later one for Regular. Rolling admissions are perceived as something lower ranked schools do that are desperate for admits and it devalues how we are perceived.

A&M manages to pretty much do the worst of all worlds on admissions and I experienced both ends of it with my 2 boys as one was a Top 10% auto admit and the other a PSA. My youngest felt pressure to rush to get his A&M application in as fast as possible in August for housing but that meant he wasn't able to have some of the things he would have by the November deadline at most schools (or at least Oct 15) that hurt him for scholarships. He got that quick admit and then got Engineering and Eng Honors and eventually some scholarship money but the process was very drawn out and impersonal even though he was a very strong applicant. Admissions and financial aid are terribly run and often I spoke to people that were less informed than I was when asking questions and few were helpful, all after long queues and wait times. My eldest applied before September and didn't hear on PSA until March, by that time he had already decided on Galveston who he applied to separately anyway and was accepted in November. Just a terribly unorganized and cluster of a process.

We also give almost all our financial aid based on means as though we are a private school or make National Merit a pre qualifier. No other public school makes NM so valued and rightly so, to put one test in the Fall of your Junior year as far more important than anything else you do in High School is insane, it is incredibly difficult to get any aid if you aren't NM. My youngest is a T1D and had a blood sugar incident during his PSAT and just missed NM even though his SAT was a 1510 (btw not allowing for Superscoring SAT is another idiotic move by A&M, it only hurts our stats when our peer schools use that method).

A&M thus becomes a Safety school for the Top 10% who apply early and find out early. My son's HS had only 7 of the 65 kids in the Top 10% choose A&M and virtually all had family ties. The others either went to Texas or took scholarship money elsewhere (or went to T20s). My son is on a full ride elsewhere even though he's an Aggie at heart.

I think Blinn Team and PSA are good programs in a vacuum but poorly executed. They are being used on the wrong students. The ideal should be for kids who aren't prepared for the rigors of Freshman classes, ideally from poor performing or rural schools where the culture shock and academic shock are most likely to hit them. Instead Blinn and PSA tend to be filled with kids from high performing Suburban schools where the kids have an A&M tie and they are basically waiting to take the spots of the first group I mentioned who are most likely to flunk out. The goal should be about creating a successful path for as many students as possible.

I could go on and on. I would have loved to have attended that meeting. Unfortunately because we have such strong demand for our school and many alumni don't understand how other schools work.
"The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help."

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ArmyAg2002
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Residency is not considered at all for admittance?

I ask because Im a Texas resident (the kids are too),but stationed in Georgia so my children's high school does not qualify for top 10%. They'll be applying in August.
Fat Tony
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aggie93 said:

Fat Tony said:

aggiejohn said:

this is really good insight. thank you for sharing.

do we think TAMU will ever move away from rolling admissions? it seems that we are the only institution at this "level" which still does rolling admissions, and it seems to have a cheapening effect on the perception of TAMU, sadly.


What is rolling admissions and how does it hurt the perception of A&M? Genuinely curious. Have no clue about this stuff. Thanks.

Rolling admissions is simply that A&M continues to accept applications as they come in. Every Top 100 school to my knowledge has dates they release decisions, typically a release date for Early applicants and a later one for Regular. Rolling admissions are perceived as something lower ranked schools do that are desperate for admits and it devalues how we are perceived.

A&M manages to pretty much do the worst of all worlds on admissions and I experienced both ends of it with my 2 boys as one was a Top 10% auto admit and the other a PSA. My youngest felt pressure to rush to get his A&M application in as fast as possible in August for housing but that meant he wasn't able to have some of the things he would have by the November deadline at most schools (or at least Oct 15) that hurt him for scholarships. He got that quick admit and then got Engineering and Eng Honors and eventually some scholarship money but the process was very drawn out and impersonal even though he was a very strong applicant. Admissions and financial aid are terribly run and often I spoke to people that were less informed than I was when asking questions and few were helpful, all after long queues and wait times. My eldest applied before September and didn't hear on PSA until March, by that time he had already decided on Galveston who he applied to separately anyway and was accepted in November. Just a terribly unorganized and cluster of a process.

We also give almost all our financial aid based on means as though we are a private school or make National Merit a pre qualifier. No other public school makes NM so valued and rightly so, to put one test in the Fall of your Junior year as far more important than anything else you do in High School is insane, it is incredibly difficult to get any aid if you aren't NM. My youngest is a T1D and had a blood sugar incident during his PSAT and just missed NM even though his SAT was a 1510 (btw not allowing for Superscoring SAT is another idiotic move by A&M, it only hurts our stats when our peer schools use that method).

A&M thus becomes a Safety school for the Top 10% who apply early and find out early. My son's HS had only 7 of the 65 kids in the Top 10% choose A&M and virtually all had family ties. The others either went to Texas or took scholarship money elsewhere (or went to T20s). My son is on a full ride elsewhere even though he's an Aggie at heart.

I think Blinn Team and PSA are good programs in a vacuum but poorly executed. They are being used on the wrong students. The ideal should be for kids who aren't prepared for the rigors of Freshman classes, ideally from poor performing or rural schools where the culture shock and academic shock are most likely to hit them. Instead Blinn and PSA tend to be filled with kids from high performing Suburban schools where the kids have an A&M tie and they are basically waiting to take the spots of the first group I mentioned who are most likely to flunk out. The goal should be about creating a successful path for as many students as possible.

I could go on and on. I would have loved to have attended that meeting. Unfortunately because we have such strong demand for our school and many alumni don't understand how other schools work.


Thank you very much for your response. Really appreciate it.
double b
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ArmyAg2002 said:

Residency is not considered at all for admittance?

I ask because Im a Texas resident (the kids are too),but stationed in Georgia so my children's high school does not qualify for top 10%. They'll be applying in August.

It was explained to the audience that a student's residence is redacted from their application. However, that doesn't keep the student from mentioning it somewhere in their application (Essays, activity statements, etc.), which I would strongly encourage you to weave that information into it.
ArmyAg2002
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Thank you
double b
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aggie93 said:

Fat Tony said:

aggiejohn said:

this is really good insight. thank you for sharing.

do we think TAMU will ever move away from rolling admissions? it seems that we are the only institution at this "level" which still does rolling admissions, and it seems to have a cheapening effect on the perception of TAMU, sadly.


What is rolling admissions and how does it hurt the perception of A&M? Genuinely curious. Have no clue about this stuff. Thanks.

We also give almost all our financial aid based on means as though we are a private school or make National Merit a pre qualifier. No other public school makes NM so valued and rightly so, to put one test in the Fall of your Junior year as far more important than anything else you do in High School is insane, it is incredibly difficult to get any aid if you aren't NM. My youngest is a T1D and had a blood sugar incident during his PSAT and just missed NM even though his SAT was a 1510 (btw not allowing for Superscoring SAT is another idiotic move by A&M, it only hurts our stats when our peer schools use that method).


I've been banging this drum since 2010, and unfortunately, the situation has gone from lackluster to exponentially worse. There is now a massive gulf between what we offer National Merit/high-end students versus the actual cost of attendance.

Unfortunately, the math doesn't add up anymore. Outside of a few Presidential Endowed Scholars, the bulk of our "top" kids are looking at maybe $3k-$4k per year. In today's admissions and scholarship landscape, that covers maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of tuition. When our peers are throwing heavy merit packages at these same kids, a $3,000 yearly scholarship from A&M isn't the draw it used to be. For many, they are paying more out-of-pocket to attend Texas A&M than similar schools in terms of ranking and stature.
Fat Tony
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double b said:

aggie93 said:

Fat Tony said:

aggiejohn said:

this is really good insight. thank you for sharing.

do we think TAMU will ever move away from rolling admissions? it seems that we are the only institution at this "level" which still does rolling admissions, and it seems to have a cheapening effect on the perception of TAMU, sadly.


What is rolling admissions and how does it hurt the perception of A&M? Genuinely curious. Have no clue about this stuff. Thanks.

We also give almost all our financial aid based on means as though we are a private school or make National Merit a pre qualifier. No other public school makes NM so valued and rightly so, to put one test in the Fall of your Junior year as far more important than anything else you do in High School is insane, it is incredibly difficult to get any aid if you aren't NM. My youngest is a T1D and had a blood sugar incident during his PSAT and just missed NM even though his SAT was a 1510 (btw not allowing for Superscoring SAT is another idiotic move by A&M, it only hurts our stats when our peer schools use that method).


I've been banging this drum since 2010, and unfortunately, the situation has gone from lackluster to exponentially worse. There is now a massive gulf between what we offer National Merit/high-end students versus the actual cost of attendance.

Unfortunately, the math doesn't add up anymore. Outside of a few Presidential Endowed Scholars, the bulk of our "top" kids are looking at maybe $3k-$4k per year. In today's admissions and scholarship landscape, that covers maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of tuition. When our peers are throwing heavy merit packages at these same kids, a $3,000 yearly scholarship from A&M isn't the draw it used to be. For many, they are paying more out-of-pocket to attend Texas A&M than similar schools in terms of ranking and stature.

To make matters worse, there is a specific pool of merit-based scholarships called Achievement Awards, which are ONLY available to students in designated, targeted recruitment areas within the state of Texas. So if you're not among that group or do not live in those areas, then your student is not eligible for those dollars.


Why do you think A&M continues to do rolling admissions + handle their aid in this way? What goal do you think they are trying to achieve doing it this way?

Thanks for your insight here.
aggie93
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double b said:

aggie93 said:

Fat Tony said:

aggiejohn said:

this is really good insight. thank you for sharing.

do we think TAMU will ever move away from rolling admissions? it seems that we are the only institution at this "level" which still does rolling admissions, and it seems to have a cheapening effect on the perception of TAMU, sadly.


What is rolling admissions and how does it hurt the perception of A&M? Genuinely curious. Have no clue about this stuff. Thanks.

We also give almost all our financial aid based on means as though we are a private school or make National Merit a pre qualifier. No other public school makes NM so valued and rightly so, to put one test in the Fall of your Junior year as far more important than anything else you do in High School is insane, it is incredibly difficult to get any aid if you aren't NM. My youngest is a T1D and had a blood sugar incident during his PSAT and just missed NM even though his SAT was a 1510 (btw not allowing for Superscoring SAT is another idiotic move by A&M, it only hurts our stats when our peer schools use that method).


I've been banging this drum since 2010, and unfortunately, the situation has gone from lackluster to exponentially worse. There is now a massive gulf between what we offer National Merit/high-end students versus the actual cost of attendance.

Unfortunately, the math doesn't add up anymore. Outside of a few Presidential Endowed Scholars, the bulk of our "top" kids are looking at maybe $3k-$4k per year. In today's admissions and scholarship landscape, that covers maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of tuition. When our peers are throwing heavy merit packages at these same kids, a $3,000 yearly scholarship from A&M isn't the draw it used to be. For many, they are paying more out-of-pocket to attend Texas A&M than similar schools in terms of ranking and stature.

To make matters worse, there is a specific pool of merit-based scholarships called Achievement Awards, which are ONLY available to students in designated, targeted recruitment areas within the state of Texas. So if you're not among that group or do not live in those areas, then your student is not eligible for those dollars.

Agree completely and I know you are aware of my son's circumstances all too well . The main benefit to the NM is to attract OOS students who have an interest in A&M because they throw in the OOS tuition. A&M is also unusual in this aspect as most of our peer institutions make it much harder for OOS to get scholarships (UC schools ban it entirely for instance). A&M throws around In State tuition much more liberally. They offer free tuition to anyone under $100k like we were an Ivy but almost no help to the majority of students and then brag about not raising fees when they are already too high.

All of this is causing A&M to lose a LOT of top students in Texas. Why pay full cost at A&M who doesn't recruit you and treats you like a number. My son got far more material and attention from Ivy League schools than A&M, I think he got one postcard in the Summer before applying even though A&M can easily tell who the Top 10% students are and look at the higher ranked schools in Texas, certainly other schools do and we have no lack of resources. He loved A&M as a possible 3rd Gen of course but it made it easy to understand why so many of his peers who didn't have a tie to A&M had little to no interest or saw it as a Safety. BTW, Texas doesn't care a lick about National Merit and if you can get accepted to an Honors college you are likely to get significant scholarships, I know a lot of folks who have kids that got nice offers from Texas and nothing from A&M but rarely the other direction if they weren't NM. The amount of the NM is also not competitive.

We are not a poor school and we have a lot of money to work with. A&M could offer far reduced or free tuition to a lot more students based on merit but we don't. Instead our focus seems to be on getting First Gen students and taking advantage of the fact that a lot of people will just pay whatever the bill says for the chance to come to A&M and leaving a lot of top students to go elsewhere who recruit them and give them scholarship money. I didn't really see how bad it was until my son did a truly open minded search of peer schools and what they offer. If you are a top student in Georgia or Florida for instance it is really hard to walk away from the packages they offer and since people know they offer them at GT, UGA, and UFA so they often shut down the process before even exploring other options. When visiting we met multiple students who had thought of going elsewhere but couldn't walk away from the packages so they stayed in state. Another irony is most Top 50 schools couldn't care less about NM, it's really something that schools on a lower tier use to try to buy some top students to come so they can brag about how many NM they have (Tulsa currently being the most aggressive). If you are applying to a T20 and want to be competitive it likely isn't one of your top 3 Awards listed on your application, they want folks that can do more than do well on a test.
"The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help."

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aggiejohn
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aggie93 said:

A&M thus becomes a Safety school for the Top 10% who apply early and find out early.


That is the sad reality of the situation that I have also observed.

High schoolers in the 10% apply early, get accepted early and maybe get excited about it (but many do not), all while "sitting on" their acceptance for many months waiting to hear back from other places (like the school in Austin, for example).

With the exception of the most staunch Aggie legacy family, any allure around TAMU wanes or is forgotten over the months from Sep/Oct to Feb/Mar, and then if an acceptance to Texas isn't given, then TAMU is rightfully felt like a back up option.

This is further reinforced when their non-10% peers are granted acceptance into "TAMU" via the Blinn TEAM, PSA, alternate pathways further watering down the perception of acceptance into TAMU (even if it isn't fully enrolled, 100% on-campus TAMU).

In the end, for many Texas families, the cost/benefit analysis of TAMU's value wins out and the student enrolls at TAMU, but there is a tarnishing effect to a TAMU acceptance during the process.
double b
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I just received some notes from a colleague who attended an SEC roundtable discussion regarding admissions. The ACT science is officially dead. Below is the list of every school and their policy.

Science Section of the ACT
  • Ole Miss: will use it if it helps the student but will disregard otherwise
  • UGA: only uses English and Math
  • UF: no longer uses science
  • Missouri: will use it if it benefits the student
  • Mississippi State: will use it if it benefits the student
  • USC: will not use it in admission review; can be included for state scholarships eligibility
  • Oklahoma: Will use it if the student takes it
  • Auburn: does not require it but if it brings up the super score, it will be used
  • LSU: not required, but if the student takes it, it will be used
  • UT Austin: not required
  • Kentucky: Personal choice if they want to include it
  • Vanderbilt: For students who submit the science, they will include it in the superscore IF it helps the student's superscore. If the science lowers the superscore, it will not be considered
  • Texas A&M: they can submit with or without the science section since we are optional.
  • Tennessee: we do not require the science section but students can submit their scores with science if it increases their superscore.
  • University of Arkansas: will also accept it if it benefits the student. Our processing team uses in-house Superscoring to take an applicant's highest score at each category of all attempts.
Emotional Support Cobra
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aggiejohn said:

aggie93 said:

A&M thus becomes a Safety school for the Top 10% who apply early and find out early.


That is the sad reality of the situation that I have also observed.

High schoolers in the 10% apply early, get accepted early and maybe get excited about it (but many do not), all while "sitting on" their acceptance for many months waiting to hear back from other places (like the school in Austin, for example).

With the exception of the most staunch Aggie legacy family, any allure around TAMU wanes or is forgotten over the months from Sep/Oct to Feb/Mar, and then if an acceptance to Texas isn't given, then TAMU is rightfully felt like a back up option.

This is further reinforced when their non-10% peers are granted acceptance into "TAMU" via the Blinn TEAM, PSA, alternate pathways further watering down the perception of acceptance into TAMU (even if it isn't fully enrolled, 100% on-campus TAMU).

In the end, for many Texas families, the cost/benefit analysis of TAMU's value wins out and the student enrolls at TAMU, but there is a tarnishing effect to a TAMU acceptance during the process.


This is such an accurate representation of our emotional roller coaster this season and it goes both ways. I didnt research how this all worked before our daughter applied, so she presented herself in the best way possible and got blinn team in March, 6 months after she had been accepted to 3 other schools in October and the shine was wearing off A&M. She was accepted to an OOS land grant university and has gotten 20k per year in scholarships so far plus 2 yrs guaranteed on campus housing.

Anyway. All that to say we really wanted our kiddo to be an Aggie, but when the cards are on the table, we had to pick this other place. Maybe she can go to A&M for grad school.
LeanderAg
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I have two daughters in high school. One is a JR and the other a SO. Both are in the top 5% and both have submitted very good ACT scores to A&M. They are both getting a lot of college recruiting mail, but nothing from A&M! We visited last Fall so the school has their names. My wife and I are both former students so the lack of recruiting is very frustrating. Is this how it is now? It just seems strange.
aggie93
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LeanderAg said:

I have two daughters in high school. One is a JR and the other a SO. Both are in the top 5% and both have submitted very good ACT scores to A&M. They are both getting a lot of college recruiting mail, but nothing from A&M! We visited last Fall so the school has their names. My wife and I are both former students so the lack of recruiting is very frustrating. Is this how it is now? It just seems strange.

A&M doesn't recruit students like your daughters. They will come to the school and college fairs of course and have a monster line of people wanting to meet with them but you will be shocked in the next year or two how much your kids will get basically harassed by other schools while A&M may send one or two emails and maybe a postcard. Until they apply that's what to expect. It's one of the reasons why A&M loses so many top students, we won't even do the bare minimum of what other schools do to go after those students. If they are Top 10% they almost all apply and of course will be accepted but that's one reason A&M becomes a Safety.

It's not lack of money for advertising or marketing, we certainly aren't poor. The only logical reason is arrogance and basically a dismissive attitude from A&M about getting more smart Suburban kids when they want more diversity, more first gen, and more low income students. That is where the marketing and scholarship money goes. I would much rather A&M target kids that are at the level where they are accepted at both A&M and Texas and offer them merit money or for A&M to lower the cost of tuition overall. There is no excuse for not having a marketing campaign that goes after the Top 10% from the Top 200 Public High Schools in the State and makes those kids feel recruited though. The only reason is priorities.

The real gut punch for me was coming to the realization that being a legacy (for my kids both parents are Aggies and my Dad was a Yell Leader) at A&M actually works against you because by definition your children aren't First Gen. They take you for granted. It's too late for my kids but I really want to see that reformed for my grandkids someday. That doesn't mean they deserve special treatment but A&M seems to actively push them away in favor of others yet put forward and image to Former Students of something different. I know countless hardcore Ags that have gone through the same realization as they see their kids get attention from elsewhere and get treated like a rockstar while A&M could seem to care less if they apply because they know the population growth of Texas takes off the pressure of worrying about it.

What A&M needs is a balanced approach that focuses on making sure we are getting the lions share of the best students in Texas. The best model we should look at imo is Georgia and Georgia Tech or Florida who give massive advantages to the best students In State both in admissions and financial aid with a clear process. They also make recruiting rural students a major priority and give them additional advantages in admission. As a result they keep most of their top in state kids and they have made huge improvements in their rankings. I'd love for us to go recruit a guy like Rick Clark from Georgia Tech to reform our admissions processes, he has some great podcasts on college admissions in general as well.
"The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help."

Ronald Reagan
Emotional Support Cobra
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No, they dont recruit. Our mailbox/pile looked like Harry Potter's house with all the postcards from other schools but not A&M. If your kids can stay in top 5 they should get admitted eith little effortand will have a wonderful experience.

Its not personal-there are just so many Texas kiddos applying.
ArmyAg2002
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Emotional Support Cobra said:

No, they dont recruit. Our mailbox/pile looked like Harry Potter's house with all the postcards from other schools but not A&M. If your kids can stay in top 5 they should get admitted eith little effortand will have a wonderful experience.

Its not personal-there are just so many Texas kiddos applying.


We have had many Universities reach out in some manner. A&M has had departments reach out after my children have showed interest. I currently have number 7 and 14 in their class. I believe that will improve after this spring as they get credit for additional AP classes.

I hope it is enough for them.
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Every child is different, but my daughter did not even submit an SAT score and still got Blinn Team.

She has stellar ECs with leadership and had a 4-something weighted, APs, etc. But presenting a well-rounded holistic approach CAN be good enough if they make a good application. And Blinn Team is totally fine for a "very good" non-10% kid who didn't send in SATs in my opinion. That was her choice and I let her make it.

Also let your kids live their life in high school and not be 100% focused on the college app if that is not their way.

LeanderAg
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Thank you. That's disappointing to my wife and I. The kids don't seem to mind so that's good. They want to go to A&M, but we have encouraged them to look at other schools just so they know they have options and can compare. They also like Rice and we just had a good visit to Texas. That is interesting to hear about the departments. My JR wants to do architecture so we will look into how to engage with them.
ArmyAg2002
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LeanderAg said:

Thank you. That's disappointing to my wife and I. The kids don't seem to mind so that's good. They want to go to A&M, but we have encouraged them to look at other schools just so they know they have options and can compare. They also like Rice and we just had a good visit to Texas. That is interesting to hear about the departments. My JR wants to do architecture so we will look into how to engage with them.


We contacted the engineering department and mterorolgy/arts and sciences. My son didnt get much from engineering, but Arts and Sciences has sent multiple emails.

We contacted the Vet school in regard to the Biomedical Sciences degree, Arts and Sciences for Bilogy and Chemistry, and Agriculture and Zoology. My daughter has recived information from each. We also contacted the Theater department for a minor (I didnt even know A&M had a theater department).

We have also visited these departments. The kids have received multiple texts and emails from the school about online information sessions and emails asking if any questions could be answered for them.

My son has done spend the night with the Corps.

After we reached out to A&M the departments became interested in providing information, but we had to take the first step to make contact and plan visits.

We have received "cold call" letters from several universities (Alabama, OU, Tennesee amongst many smaller ones), but ironically none of the schools my kids were interested in until my children showed interested (Auburn, GA Tech, UGA)
LeanderAg
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Wow! That is very proactive! Thank you for sharing! We will have to step things up. We were interested in a summer architecture camp, but we had a schedule conflict. They are going to the Aggie stem camp this summer.
aggiejohn
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LeanderAg said:

Wow! That is very proactive! Thank you for sharing! We will have to step things up. We were interested in a summer architecture camp, but we had a schedule conflict. They are going to the Aggie stem camp this summer.


Be cautioned that the camps are very good at exposing the kids to TAMU, but I do not think attendance at the camps will increase the marketing efforts from TAMU admissions or the departments.

I do not think they communicate back/forth between those groups. I think they all operate as if they are on islands.
rcturner
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I'm glad it wasn't this complicated 50 years ago when I was there!
RCT'78
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double b said:

He did express that the vast majority of students who apply to Texas A&M are offered some form of pathway to TAMU


This needs to end.
TexasAg95
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aggie93 said:




The real gut punch for me was coming to the realization that being a legacy (for my kids both parents are Aggies and my Dad was a Yell Leader) at A&M actually works against you because by definition your children aren't First Gen. They take you for granted. It's too late for my kids but I really want to see that reformed for my grandkids someday. That doesn't mean they deserve special treatment but A&M seems to actively push them away in favor of others yet put forward and image to Former Students of something different. I know countless hardcore Ags that have gone through the same realization as they see their kids get attention from elsewhere and get treated like a rockstar while A&M could seem to care less if they apply because they know the population growth of Texas takes off the pressure of worrying about it.



amen and amen. Multigenerational family here. Son was in the corps, co 24, his first year was covid so there was no in person NSC. Daughter is 28 and I went with her to her NSC. Wife and I are both aggies, grandfather, etc. The whole entire morning of the first day of the NSC is all about "first gen" students and all the assistance and preference they receive. I'm sitting there and had the same realization you did...that kids of multigenerational aggie families are actually penalized in admission, scholarships, etc. It's really sickening and changes your view of tamu and the whole thing. You see the tailgate signs of these families who have all these generations and realize that this school doesn't want that anymore.

TexasAg95
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One very simple thing that would thin the herd of top 10 and make things more fair for kids from tough high schools would be to one, institute a minimum SAT score for the top 10 percent, and two, bring back the academic auto admit (top quarter with a 1350.). My son was in the last group to get that and it was fair. He had a bad semester his sophomore year and blew his chance to be top 10. But he knew if he made a 1350 he'd get in. He busted his butt and got it.


The way admissions are now-

Top 10 at any school gets in , period.
  • this results in a good chunk of kids who aren't going to succeed at A&M getting in automatically
  • also results in a good chunk of kids who are just outside top 10 , who cant get in auto, but have what it takes to succeed at tamu
So what do we do?
  • set up a "PSA" and "Blinn team" program where the kids who SHOULD get in auto have to go , to wait for the kids in group one, the autos who really shouldn't be here, for them to flunk out and transfer.
It's a big giant waste of time and energy but boy tamu gets to brag about "First Gen" and demographic numbers. Even though some of those kids shouldn't be here in the first place.

Why is there room for thousands of students to transfer in to tamu every year, why is there enough room for them to guarantee PSA spots if the freshman class is full? Because they know a big chunk of the auto admits won't be able to cut it and will transfer out.


How about a goal of, choosing the kids who can succeed at A&M from the start , instead of this giant shell game of thousands getting admitted and then leaving and then thousands being put in PSA and then get in? Simply having a minimum SAT score to be top 10 auto would achieve this.
double b
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Looking at the SEC landscape, there is a clear divide in how schools handle admissions.

Given our academic trajectory and the sheer volume of applicants we're seeing, it's worth asking: Which group should we be in?

Currently, A&M remains in the Rolling Admissions camp, a group largely defined by schools trying to fill seats. Meanwhile, our academic peers (UT, Florida, Georgia) have moved to Early Action several years ago to manage high demand and prestige.

Rolling

Alabama: Nov. 1 "Early Action" priority date for scholarships, then rolls.
Kentucky: Dec. 1 for competitive scholarship consideration.
LSU
Mississippi (Ole Miss)
Mississippi State
Missouri
University of Arkansas
Texas A&M University


Early Action
Auburn University: 4 rounds, starting on the 15th of each with September
University of Florida: Nov. 1
University of Georgia: Nov. 1
University of Texas: October 15
University of Tennessee: Nov. 1.
South Carolina: October 15
University of Oklahoma: Nov. 1

Early Decision/Regular Decision
Vanderbilt: ED (Nov. 1), RD (Jan. 2)

If A&M wants to be viewed alongside Georgia, Florida, and Texas, shouldn't our admission process reflect that?
aggie93
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TexasAg95 said:

One very simple thing that would thin the herd of top 10 and make things more fair for kids from tough high schools would be to one, institute a minimum SAT score for the top 10 percent, and two, bring back the academic auto admit (top quarter with a 1350.). My son was in the last group to get that and it was fair. He had a bad semester his sophomore year and blew his chance to be top 10. But he knew if he made a 1350 he'd get in. He busted his butt and got it.


The way admissions are now-

Top 10 at any school gets in , period.
  • this results in a good chunk of kids who aren't going to succeed at A&M getting in automatically
  • also results in a good chunk of kids who are just outside top 10 , who cant get in auto, but have what it takes to succeed at tamu
So what do we do?
  • set up a "PSA" and "Blinn team" program where the kids who SHOULD get in auto have to go , to wait for the kids in group one, the autos who really shouldn't be here, for them to flunk out and transfer.
It's a big giant waste of time and energy but boy tamu gets to brag about "First Gen" and demographic numbers. Even though some of those kids shouldn't be here in the first place.

Why is there room for thousands of students to transfer in to tamu every year, why is there enough room for them to guarantee PSA spots if the freshman class is full? Because they know a big chunk of the auto admits won't be able to cut it and will transfer out.


How about a goal of, choosing the kids who can succeed at A&M from the start , instead of this giant shell game of thousands getting admitted and then leaving and then thousands being put in PSA and then get in? Simply having a minimum SAT score to be top 10 auto would achieve this.


One issue is you would need the SAT to be higher. Over 400k grads from Texas high schools now and that doesn't count oos, homeschooling, or most private schools. Auto admissions really aren't practical anymore unless it's far higher than it is now like Top 5 percent of maybe Top 2 percent with a 1450 SAT. The solution is more holistic and then it's about what is prioritized.

You point out the problem with Blinn and System admits though. We should be doing it the opposite way but they care more about bragging about 1st gen and other numbers in admissions and less about outcomes and getting the best students. The reality is most 1st gen students from a bad school are set up to fail or have to overcome a lot to succeed. If those kids were in Blinn or System schools though they'd be more likely to graduate and do so with a meaningful degree. We aren't supposed to state the obvious though because it's much better to ignore uncomfortable truths.
"The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help."

Ronald Reagan
TexasAg95
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aggie93 said:

TexasAg95 said:

One very simple thing that would thin the herd of top 10 and make things more fair for kids from tough high schools would be to one, institute a minimum SAT score for the top 10 percent, and two, bring back the academic auto admit (top quarter with a 1350.). My son was in the last group to get that and it was fair. He had a bad semester his sophomore year and blew his chance to be top 10. But he knew if he made a 1350 he'd get in. He busted his butt and got it.


The way admissions are now-

Top 10 at any school gets in , period.
  • this results in a good chunk of kids who aren't going to succeed at A&M getting in automatically
  • also results in a good chunk of kids who are just outside top 10 , who cant get in auto, but have what it takes to succeed at tamu
So what do we do?
  • set up a "PSA" and "Blinn team" program where the kids who SHOULD get in auto have to go , to wait for the kids in group one, the autos who really shouldn't be here, for them to flunk out and transfer.
It's a big giant waste of time and energy but boy tamu gets to brag about "First Gen" and demographic numbers. Even though some of those kids shouldn't be here in the first place.

Why is there room for thousands of students to transfer in to tamu every year, why is there enough room for them to guarantee PSA spots if the freshman class is full? Because they know a big chunk of the auto admits won't be able to cut it and will transfer out.


How about a goal of, choosing the kids who can succeed at A&M from the start , instead of this giant shell game of thousands getting admitted and then leaving and then thousands being put in PSA and then get in? Simply having a minimum SAT score to be top 10 auto would achieve this.


One issue is you would need the SAT to be higher. Over 400k grads from Texas high schools now and that doesn't count oos, homeschooling, or most private schools. Auto admissions really aren't practical anymore unless it's far higher than it is now like Top 5 percent of maybe Top 2 percent with a 1450 SAT. The solution is more holistic and then it's about what is prioritized.

You point out the problem with Blinn and System admits though. We should be doing it the opposite way but they care more about bragging about 1st gen and other numbers in admissions and less about outcomes and getting the best students. The reality is most 1st gen students from a bad school are set up to fail or have to overcome a lot to succeed. If those kids were in Blinn or System schools though they'd be more likely to graduate and do so with a meaningful degree. We aren't supposed to state the obvious though because it's much better to ignore uncomfortable truths.








I bet if you made top 10 percent simply need to make 1300, it would thin it considerably. Make it top 10 need to make 1300, top 25 need 1350 (old academic admit). That would free up a lot of spots for
"holistic" review.




Texas A&M is so difficult now, if a kid can't make a 1300 or something similar on the SAT, they are going to struggle.

And the thing is, like you said, the best thing for many of the "1st gen" freshmen would be to start at a smaller system school and see if they can handle college. If they can, great. Come on.


cavscout96
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GoAgs92 said:

  • Class Rank: 76% of admits are in the top 25% of their graduating class.
  • The Rest are athletes.
(1290 SAT = top 10%) for homeschoolers...wtf?

if you're not top 25%...don't waste your money or only apply during the free week.

this surprises me. I didn't think they were still doing an SAT -> top X conversion anymore.

is that policy or just where they are currently landing.
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