I've come to believe the mule kick is insignificant. Seen them do it with all kinds of different hits.

Blood out of the nose should be dead deer.

Dog guys are going to tell you not to grid or randomly search. If anything, go back to last blood, get down on your hands and knees and go really slow.

Here's a list of trackers around the state.

https://www.texasbowhunter.com/discussions/forums/forum/topics/around-the-campfire/832770-2024-2025-season-tracking-dog-list

Rot Hindes is the 1A guy
Justin Dixon has really good dogs too, he may be worth a try. He'd probably be cheaper than Roy but his dogs are awesome and was mentored by Roy

BCO07 said:

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Anybody have a number for tracking dogs near Zapata? I'm freaking sick right now. My 10 year old put a good shot on his first buck. High mule kick, then slowly sulking into the brush. I couldn't get a follow up on him because of the brush but I saw blood coming out of his nose. Had a blood trail you could run to follow then it went to nothing. I'm working on a grid now, but it's not looking promising until the morning. I definitely don't want to lose this thing.

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I just went through this. Just quit pushing tonight. Let deer lay and die. Start in morning. Mark blood on a map to find possible routes. Look towards water or downhill. We found ours about 600 yards away from shot the next morning.

Found one more decent pile of blood in the daylight where he probably laid down again before we jumped him the night before. Someone else kept on the blood trail, which was very very faint and sparse, while I went to the water the blood trail was kind of leading to. I backtracked from there, zig zagging along g a fence I knew he probably couldn't/wouldn't jump. Ended up finding him along that route.

jpb1999 said:

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BCO07 said:

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Anybody have a number for tracking dogs near Zapata? I'm freaking sick right now. My 10 year old put a good shot on his first buck. High mule kick, then slowly sulking into the brush. I couldn't get a follow up on him because of the brush but I saw blood coming out of his nose. Had a blood trail you could run to follow then it went to nothing. I'm working on a grid now, but it's not looking promising until the morning. I definitely don't want to lose this thing.

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I just went through this. Just quit pushing tonight. Let deer lay and die. Start in morning.

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Did you know you made this post in the morning?

if you deer hunt a lot, especially with kids, invest in a thermal drone. kids are slightly off when nervous a lot. the last two years, the only reason I have found my boys bucks was because of a thermal drone. neither deer went far, but no blood trails and thick stuff made it crazy hard to find them. drone had them spotted in a matter of minutes.

or find a friend with one

You have the right to remain silent.

Any luck on the retrieval OP?

I'm just out of Zapata with nothing to do if you need an extra pair of old but experienced eyes?

Marlin39m said:

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You have the right to remain silent.

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Well that sucks. I can use them here in OK for recovery.

Or just practice the standard SSS...... Search Secure Shutup?

It's been 2 days OP, don't leave us hanging. Did you find the deer?

BCO07 said:

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It's the lowest on the list of problems

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Are we going to have to wait four days for you to elaborate?

Sounds like a Brad, Mitch, and Jerry situation.

Largely it's an issue of a overly intrusive land owner. He clearly has cameras all over the place and makes random comments via text to my buddy who's the "lease boss" to make sure we know that we are being watched. He seems offended that we don't let him know when we're coming down, though that type of communication is not in the lease agreement. A few years ago we mentioned to him that we were going to go shoot some dove during special white wing season and threw a fit about how it was going to ruin the deer hunting, though the lease is for all game animals. He regularly pops in while we're there clearly just to check up on us. The lease boss has been on the lease for 13 years and has never done anything to not be trusted and we've invested tons into maintaining things. Bottom line, it takes all of the fun out of things when you feel like you're always having to look over your shoulder.

First: what you've put into the Property is your accord and the land owner doesn't need to factor that into anything. You make up grades because you want them not because he needs them or asked for them. When a leasee tried to play the "but we treat the Property well" line we roll our eyes. Thats whats expected not a bonus. We had leasee that tried to pull that and we still laugh about it.

Next : Your perception doesn't make it reality. What types of Messages is he sending your buddy? If they're related to the well being of the Property then it's 100% his right. The Landowner has alot of liability in this situation so I don't blame him for keeping and eye on things. Honestly, none of what you posted sounds that intrusive. It's not like he's visiting you in the blind or trying to steer you into or out of specific shots. It's not like he's propane cannoning you either or creating an overt nuisance to your use. Sounds like you're reading the lease one way and he's reading it another and he didn't stop you from dove Hunting so hissy fit aside, he abided by the lease. We have cameras all over our place and frequently communicate w the leasee's. Why? They forget to close gates that seperate cow pastures from Farm land, they forgot to close gates around the lakes, they encumber upon the pipeline that's being built, they leave trash and empty feed or antlermax bags around, they decide they're too tired or it's too dark to drop carcasses off at the bone yard and instead leave them by the skinning station etc etc etc. We don't go out of our way to bother them, but we also arent their maids or their parents, we're the landowner and it's our Property. We even restrict where they can and can't access the Property and where they can and cannot place blinds. Thats part of being a responsible land owner.

Without seeing the lease agreement there's no way to tell which party (if any) is in the wrong.

We allow all game animals to be hunted but also requiere notice when they decide to do so for safety issues.

You don't own the land so you have to play by the land owners rules. Sometimes those don't make sense to you as the leasee but they don't have to make sense to you. You don't own it.

Now if he was intentionally creating a nuisance (coming out to blinds during hunts, intentionally setting off cannons to scare away deer, restricting your ability to hunt accoeding to the lease) that's a different story but from whats been posted, nothing seems overly draconian. Ok he got mad that you wanted to hunt dove. Thats life. At the end of the day, Text Messages arent going to scare away deer, visiting the camp won't scare away deer and asking for notice of arrival won't scare away deer. So honestly, it doesn't sound like he's restricting your ability to use the Property at all or any any way that would constitute a violation of your rights as a leasee.

And we visit our camps everytime they come to make sure they arent bringing anyone or anything that isn't allowed by the lease.

How many leases have you had in the past? This sounds very SOP.

The fact your buddy had been there 13 years and still comes back makes me think there's more to the story. It's either got great deer or you're blowing things out of proportion because you guys shot a deer and couldnt find it and It's easier to project the accountability to him for restricting access to dogs vs holding yourself account able for a shot that wasn't great. Also sounds like the **** doesn't hit you, it hits your buddy. If he's released for 13 years straight that speaks for it self IMO.

If we had a leasee fume over a poor shot and us restricting dogs on the Property it would be their last year here.

Reminds me of hunting w the Carters in South Texas - you wound it and It's your responsability to find it. If you don't find it, you still pay for it and you don't get released the next season. It's an accountability aspect.

If you want some lease language that's stiff - they REQUIRED each time you accessed the Property that you sighted in your rifle in the presence of the ranch manager and permitted the vehicles. If they caught you out w a firearm that wasn't sighted in with them present or driving around in an unsactioned vehicle, it was an automatic lease void and tresspass.

Believe me my guy things can be ALOT more onerous than what you've provided.

You're reading too much into it. I'm not saying he's outside his rights or doing anything outside the lease, I'm saying that I don't want to feel like somebody is always over my shoulder. If you don't trust me, the tell me to move on. I guess I'm used to hunting people's land that I already know and have a relationship with so they know me and know that I'm responsible.

I'm not fuming, throwing a fit, etc. I haven't said a word to him and I'll move on as soon as I find something else