dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

I really wish that was the case.

---

It may not be. Just having been in the midst of large scale class action litigation where we had insurance and a client paying for our defense, it was made very clear to us that we were to have no unnecessary communication with potential litigants under penalty of losing their funding. I would be surprised if that instruction hasn't been given to the Eastlands. But it also doesn't mean they would have been more remorseful or communicative without it.

txags92 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

I really wish that was the case.

---

It may not be. Just having been in the midst of large scale class action litigation where we had insurance and a client paying for our defense, it was made very clear to us that we were to have no unnecessary communication with potential litigants under penalty of losing their funding. I would be surprised if that instruction hasn't been given to the Eastlands. But it also doesn't mean they would have been more remorseful or communicative without it.

---

Wait until you read the letter from Cile's parents tomorrow as I believe it is being released to the media. With all due respect, you need to forget about plaintiff attorneys and their motives. This is scummy behavior by the Eastlands and Mystic.

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

I really wish that was the case.

---

It may not be. Just having been in the midst of large scale class action litigation where we had insurance and a client paying for our defense, it was made very clear to us that we were to have no unnecessary communication with potential litigants under penalty of losing their funding. I would be surprised if that instruction hasn't been given to the Eastlands. But it also doesn't mean they would have been more remorseful or communicative without it.

---

Wait until you read the letter from Cile's parents tomorrow as I believe it is being released to the media. With all due respect, you need to forget about plaintiff attorneys and their motives. This is scummy behavior by the Eastlands and Mystic.

---

FWIW, I said nothing about plaintiff's attorneys motives. They should and will use anything said by the Eastlands against them.

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

Why talk about a memorial when Cile is still missing? They have revealed who they are,

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

Why talk about a memorial when Cile is still missing? They have revealed who they are,

---

I don't know their answer, but for myself, there is a point where there is zero chance the child will be found alive and where it is becoming more and more likely that the remains will never be found. It is heart breaking, but a fact in floods like these that sometimes the remains are never found. Not acknowledging or memorializing the loss of any of the girls or counselors while still waiting for something that is increasingly likely to never happen becomes its own form of insensitivity at some point.

Again, I am not defending what they are doing or have done. I am just saying there may be other explanations for why they are or are not doing things the way people think they should.

txags92 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

Why talk about a memorial when Cile is still missing? They have revealed who they are,

---

I don't know their answer, but for myself, there is a point where there is zero chance the child will be found alive and where it is becoming more and more likely that the remains will never be found. It is heart breaking, but a fact in floods like these that sometimes the remains are never found. Not acknowledging or memorializing the loss of any of the girls or counselors while still waiting for something that is increasingly likely to never happen becomes its own form of insensitivity at some point.

Again, I am not defending what they are doing or have done. I am just saying there may be other explanations for why they are or are not doing things the way people think they should.

---

I really do not understand the blind allegiance. Sorry,

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

Why talk about a memorial when Cile is still missing? They have revealed who they are,

---

I don't know their answer, but for myself, there is a point where there is zero chance the child will be found alive and where it is becoming more and more likely that the remains will never be found. It is heart breaking, but a fact in floods like these that sometimes the remains are never found. Not acknowledging or memorializing the loss of any of the girls or counselors while still waiting for something that is increasingly likely to never happen becomes its own form of insensitivity at some point.

Again, I am not defending what they are doing or have done. I am just saying there may be other explanations for why they are or are not doing things the way people think they should.

---

I really do not understand the blind allegiance. Sorry,

---

Respectfully, WTF are you talking about? I have said repeatedly that I am not defending their actions, just offering a plausible explanation for the lack of communication expressed by Badace. You asked me why discuss a memorial and I answered with my own thoughts, clearly stating that I have no idea what their rationale is. Show me where I am offering allegiance to anybody? The Eastlands are clearly responsible for the loss of the girls through their lack of adequate emergency planning. I don't think that is even questionable anymore with what has come out.

At some point after any tragedy there needs to come a time where the tragedy and next steps can be discussed rationally without anybody who you disagree with being accused of being an apologist for the clearly responsible party. Your grief and anger are understandable, but jumping on anybody who tries to discuss what happens next is unnecessary and counterproductive. I am on the record on this thread and others saying I don't think the Eastlands should be allowed to operate the camp going forward and that they will likely lose ownership of the property in the legal cases/settlements. How you take from that that I have any allegiance to them is mystifying to me.

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

Great post - and completely agree. Tough situation but I know there are a lot of young girls who are very excited to get to return to Mystic next summer. The tragedy isn't lost on them either and Mystic is the one time of year that some of these girls get to spend together.

There is no roadmap for dealing with a tragedy like this and trying to carry forward. Lots of empathy for all involved who are doing their best to move forward through this tragedy.

Nm. Best to let this thread rest

This thread has been amazing. May I suggest we move the current discussion to a new thread.


[We have cleaned up this thread and we are going repost a previous edit. There are other threads that are discussing legal issues and and other topics about the flood. -Staff]

[This is not a warning toward this poster we just want everyone to know that we are going to keep this thread in the spirit of what it was when the flood happened. If posters want to discuss lawsuits or responsibility it needs to be on a new thread or another existing thread. We ask that all posters read the latest edit in the OP. Thank you for your help. - Staff]

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

txags92 said:

---

Badace52 said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

JeremiahJohnson said:

---

It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

---

I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

---

Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

---

Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

---

Why talk about a memorial when Cile is still missing? They have revealed who they are,

---

I don't know their answer, but for myself, there is a point where there is zero chance the child will be found alive and where it is becoming more and more likely that the remains will never be found. It is heart breaking, but a fact in floods like these that sometimes the remains are never found. Not acknowledging or memorializing the loss of any of the girls or counselors while still waiting for something that is increasingly likely to never happen becomes its own form of insensitivity at some point.

Again, I am not defending what they are doing or have done. I am just saying there may be other explanations for why they are or are not doing things the way people think they should.

---

I really do not understand the blind allegiance. Sorry,

---

Respectfully, WTF are you talking about? I have said repeatedly that I am not defending their actions, just offering a plausible explanation for the lack of communication expressed by Badace. You asked me why discuss a memorial and I answered with my own thoughts, clearly stating that I have no idea what their rationale is. Show me where I am offering allegiance to anybody? The Eastlands are clearly responsible for the loss of the girls through their lack of adequate emergency planning. I don't think that is even questionable anymore with what has come out.

At some point after any tragedy there needs to come a time where the tragedy and next steps can be discussed rationally without anybody who you disagree with being accused of being an apologist for the clearly responsible party. Your grief and anger are understandable, but jumping on anybody who tries to discuss what happens next is unnecessary and counterproductive. I am on the record on this thread and others saying I don't think the Eastlands should be allowed to operate the camp going forward and that they will likely lose ownership of the property in the legal cases/settlements. How you take from that that I have any allegiance to them is mystifying to me.

---

So you are on record that the Eastlands were negligent?

---

Absolutely. They had a laughably simplistic "plan" and then they didn't even follow it. What else would you call it?

From Eloise Peck's mom

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/16HLp8L9PU/?mibextid=wwXIfr

Listen while reopening the camp is a priority for Mystic alumni and the Eastlands, that's fine. They won't be bankrupt, give me break, they generate approx $14m/yr in revenue. However, it literally hasn't even been 3 months since July 4th. While statically it is probably unlikely Cile will be found. There is technology being used that will more than likely allow this to happen, and the search is still VERY much active. I never received any communication through my attorney nor through the Eastlands about any of this, and in fact the last communication we received was about a refund check. Which I will add, wasn't volunteered. Y'all are talking about following the laws, they haven't even started the rule making process. Which will be wrapped up by January 1. All I am trying to say is that this was unnecessary, and while Mystic is still a treasured institution by some. There are also other options. When my son applies to college I can't guarantee he will get into A&M, but I do know that whatever school he goes to will be just as good. There is a reason why Bonfire no longer exists on campus, and there was a lot of tumult surrounding that decision. I view this event very much so in the same light.

Thanks Clarke. It is just really hard for me to see the actions, or lack thereof, of Mystic and the Eastlands that people can not see what appears so obvious. Maybe I should not have used the word evil but I wish some of the Mystic defenders could hear what Cile's parents and other parents are saying.

DoodleTX said:

---

From Eloise Peck's mom

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/16HLp8L9PU/?mibextid=wwXIfr

---

Thanks. Do posters on here believe Mystic handled this memorial deal right? Without consulting all the parents of the deceased? What is their motive for doing this and re opening so quickly? What is Mystic putting first in order of priority? It seems so clear.

As a Christian and small business owner, I would not have be acting the way Mystic is. Would y'all act this way? Maybe it is me.

txags92 said:

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dermdoc said:

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txags92 said:

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dermdoc said:

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txags92 said:

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Badace52 said:

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dermdoc said:

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JeremiahJohnson said:

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It is their only option. If they do not reopen, they will go bankrupt and have to sell.

I understand that people are sensitive because of the loss of life and rightfully so. If they follow the new regulations and open within those regulations why wouldn't they? Are you going to punish Dick? He is no longer living. They have no choice but to open. It will be a lighter summer numbers wise, but if they do not open now, they will be closed forever.

Alumni at Mystic do not want camp to be killed forever. They want it to reopen safer and better than before. There is a way to honor those lost and carry on their legacy with the camp in a safe manor.

I may be in the minority in this, and that is ok. If Tweedy can muster up the will to rebuild safely and honor those that were lost, then she should. I am just glad, I am not the one that has to make that decision.

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I know you mean well but Mystic and the Eastlands are scum. This is all about them making money. They did not contact my family about the memorial. Just "select" families. So is one girl's death more important than another's?

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Their handling of the affected families has been pretty bad honestly. Communication has been basically non-existent until the recent announcement about a memorial and about the Cypress Lakes Camp being open next year.

I've been more than a little disappointed with Camp Mystic and their handling of this tragedy both on that horrible night and in the months since. From the moment I awoke to a phone exploding with text messages from frantic parents July 4th morning to today I have seen I believe two total emails from the Camp. One on July 4th and this most recent one.

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Not to defend them or their actions in any way, but they have probably been instructed by their lawyers and their insurance company not to have any extraneous communication beyond info about operations of the camp going forward, particularly with any families that are part of any lawsuits. It is the sad fact of our litigious society that any conciliatory or remorseful communications they might send if they wanted to would be used against them in court. Giving the plaintiffs attorneys ammunition against the advise of the insurance company's attorneys could cause them big problems.

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Why talk about a memorial when Cile is still missing? They have revealed who they are,

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I don't know their answer, but for myself, there is a point where there is zero chance the child will be found alive and where it is becoming more and more likely that the remains will never be found. It is heart breaking, but a fact in floods like these that sometimes the remains are never found. Not acknowledging or memorializing the loss of any of the girls or counselors while still waiting for something that is increasingly likely to never happen becomes its own form of insensitivity at some point.

Again, I am not defending what they are doing or have done. I am just saying there may be other explanations for why they are or are not doing things the way people think they should.

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I really do not understand the blind allegiance. Sorry,

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Respectfully, WTF are you talking about? I have said repeatedly that I am not defending their actions, just offering a plausible explanation for the lack of communication expressed by Badace. You asked me why discuss a memorial and I answered with my own thoughts, clearly stating that I have no idea what their rationale is. Show me where I am offering allegiance to anybody? The Eastlands are clearly responsible for the loss of the girls through their lack of adequate emergency planning. I don't think that is even questionable anymore with what has come out.

At some point after any tragedy there needs to come a time where the tragedy and next steps can be discussed rationally without anybody who you disagree with being accused of being an apologist for the clearly responsible party. Your grief and anger are understandable, but jumping on anybody who tries to discuss what happens next is unnecessary and counterproductive. I am on the record on this thread and others saying I don't think the Eastlands should be allowed to operate the camp going forward and that they will likely lose ownership of the property in the legal cases/settlements. How you take from that that I have any allegiance to them is mystifying to me.

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Fair enough. Was blindsided by Mystic's actions on the memorial and only contacting some families (if it was on their lawyers advice why did they contact any) and then reading Cile's letter to the Camp which is partially linked above.
i got mad. Did not mean to lash out at posters.

dermdoc said:

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AustinCountyAg said:

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https://www.foxnews.com/us/camp-mystic-makes-controversial-decision-about-future-texas-camp-where-27-died-flooding


Not sure how this will go over

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Has everybody read this? Part of the letter from Cile's mom is in the link.

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Yes I have and this is heartbreaking. And I ABSOLUTELY agree that the idea of this memorial and sending out that email was a horrible idea. We have two close friends who lost little girls and they are livid about this. Totally tone-deaf.

My wife was a long-time Mystic camper and counselor and knew Dick and Tweety personally so I'm not sure I'm ready to say that they are evil and sinister. Negligent - absolutely. Slow to respond and misguided in their efforts that awful night - yes.

So, so sad - so many lives ruined. Summer camp was supposed to be a joyous time. People in these parts will never look at it the same way again.

https://www.khou.com/article/news/state/texas-news/texas-flood/camp-mystic-camper-family-letter/285-54a20d10-26f3-4e4c-9dc2-ba0391e88aa3?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook_KHOU_11_News&fbclid=IwdGRjcANCg4lleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHq6ql3jsWY38KFHneIy806AEWlhtp0hPyMfRbwh5o9P1cqyp8dQmkFDdEbHU_aem_v2y8_hNUnQFKEBLRlTdIqw#ok7d8m9qzgt2g82y1m7m8ch3025vozj.

DoodleTX said:

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https://www.khou.com/article/news/state/texas-news/texas-flood/camp-mystic-camper-family-letter/285-54a20d10-26f3-4e4c-9dc2-ba0391e88aa3?utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook_KHOU_11_News&fbclid=IwdGRjcANCg4lleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHq6ql3jsWY38KFHneIy806AEWlhtp0hPyMfRbwh5o9P1cqyp8dQmkFDdEbHU_aem_v2y8_hNUnQFKEBLRlTdIqw#ok7d8m9qzgt2g82y1m7m8ch3025vozj.

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Thanks. I had it but was told to hold off yesterday. There are only 2 options. Camp Mystic and its owners are not good people or they are receiving horrible legal advice.
Until they realize the deaths of these girls due to their negligence is more important than the re opening of Mystic nothing will change.
And they seem to not understand that.

I mean, Mystic did not even refund the campers (even the ones who lost girls) until forced to.

It was always going to be controversial/painful whether it be now or in years for Mystic to open. I do know that many families want it to reopen and are glad that as of now that appears to be the case (can always change). Lots of people have sent Tweety and the Eastlands letters stating such over the past couple of months. Nobody has to send their daughter to Mystic if they are uncomfortable doing so. And the location that is opening next summer is not on the Guadalupe.

Our daughter is so happy to be able to hug her camp friends, hug Tweety and hopefully enjoy a place that is very special to her. That means something to me as her dad. And I know many families that feel the same. And that doesn't diminish how much pain we feel for people who lost a child/loved ones. We see people who did daily and do our best to continue and shower them with as much love as possible. And I know at least one of these families thinks it's a good thing that Mystic is reopening.

Life is hard. Horrible horrible things happen in this world on a daily basis. This was the most tragic event that ever affected our community and family. But through horrible things you have to keep moving forward. Learn, pray, be better but never stop moving forward.

Alta said:

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It was always going to be controversial/painful whether it be now or in years for Mystic to open. I do know that many families want it to reopen and are glad that as of now that appears to be the case (can always change). Lots of people have sent Tweety and the Eastlands letters stating such over the past couple of months. Nobody has to send their daughter to Mystic if they are uncomfortable doing so. And the location that is opening next summer is not on the Guadalupe.

Our daughter is so happy to be able to hug her camp friends, hug Tweety and hopefully enjoy a place that is very special to her. That means something to me as her dad. And I know many families that feel the same. And that doesn't diminish how much pain we feel for people who lost a child/loved ones. We see people who did daily and do our best to continue and shower them with as much love as possible. And I know at least one of these families thinks it's a good thing that Mystic is reopening.

Life is hard. Horrible horrible things happen in this world on a daily basis. This was the most tragic event that ever affected our community and family. But through horrible things you have to keep moving forward. Learn, pray, be better but never stop moving forward.

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Until they admit negligence, don't talk to me. Sorry.

And I honestly believe if Mystic had fallen on their sword, offer to pay the families who lost kids, immediately refund camp fees, work together with the families who lost girls on how they wanted to be remembered, ask for forgiveness, embrace improvements and change for safety, etc. it would have gone much better for them.
And I believe the majority of the parents would be willing to work to re open a safer Mystic.
But they chose a different path. And to folks outside of the area it appears they put opening the camp up ASAP more important than the death of 27 girls.
I mean, wouldn't the Christian thing to do would be to make things right whatever happens financially?
As I said before, maybe it is me. But this whole thing about the camp must go on and we must move forward without justice rings hollow to me.
And I want Mystic to re open. And I am glad your daughter wants to enjoy Mystic. But this whole moving forward without the things I mentioned is not healing in my opinion.
You do wrong, admit it, make things right, THEN move forward
It just seems they are so tone deaf.

dermdoc said:

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Alta said:

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It was always going to be controversial/painful whether it be now or in years for Mystic to open. I do know that many families want it to reopen and are glad that as of now that appears to be the case (can always change). Lots of people have sent Tweety and the Eastlands letters stating such over the past couple of months. Nobody has to send their daughter to Mystic if they are uncomfortable doing so. And the location that is opening next summer is not on the Guadalupe.

Our daughter is so happy to be able to hug her camp friends, hug Tweety and hopefully enjoy a place that is very special to her. That means something to me as her dad. And I know many families that feel the same. And that doesn't diminish how much pain we feel for people who lost a child/loved ones. We see people who did daily and do our best to continue and shower them with as much love as possible. And I know at least one of these families thinks it's a good thing that Mystic is reopening.

Life is hard. Horrible horrible things happen in this world on a daily basis. This was the most tragic event that ever affected our community and family. But through horrible things you have to keep moving forward. Learn, pray, be better but never stop moving forward.

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Until you admit negligence, don't talk to me. Sorry.

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Derm, this is what I was talking about yesterday. Regardless of what the Eastlands actually do or do not feel towards the families who lost girls in the flood, it is very likely that there are clauses in their insurance policies that require them to not torpedo any lawsuit by admitting guilt and there may in fact be clauses in the insurance policy that specifically don't cover negligence. Regardless of how much money they have made running the camp, if they came forward before the legal claims are settled with a tearful "we F'ed up and it is all our fault" communication, they would be torpedoing any defense they might want to use in court, and it is likely to be a 8-9 digit mistake. This is the sad fact about litigation is that it causes situations like this where guilty parties can't express their true feelings because of how anything they say will be used against them. I would wager Tweety would give up her entire fortune gladly if it brought back even one of the girls that were lost. But there are other parties involved in the defense whose lawyers are likely making it clear to them what the consequences are if they speak out of turn before the claims are settled.

I know there is a counter-argument that they should be bankrupted for what happened and I am not in any way claiming they were not in fact negligent. It is just reality that legal claims and the high stakes involved for people beyond Tweety and her kids mean that they likely can't come to the families and communicate, pray, commiserate, etc. the way they would all otherwise want to.

dermdoc said:

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Alta said:

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It was always going to be controversial/painful whether it be now or in years for Mystic to open. I do know that many families want it to reopen and are glad that as of now that appears to be the case (can always change). Lots of people have sent Tweety and the Eastlands letters stating such over the past couple of months. Nobody has to send their daughter to Mystic if they are uncomfortable doing so. And the location that is opening next summer is not on the Guadalupe.

Our daughter is so happy to be able to hug her camp friends, hug Tweety and hopefully enjoy a place that is very special to her. That means something to me as her dad. And I know many families that feel the same. And that doesn't diminish how much pain we feel for people who lost a child/loved ones. We see people who did daily and do our best to continue and shower them with as much love as possible. And I know at least one of these families thinks it's a good thing that Mystic is reopening.

Life is hard. Horrible horrible things happen in this world on a daily basis. This was the most tragic event that ever affected our community and family. But through horrible things you have to keep moving forward. Learn, pray, be better but never stop moving forward.

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Until they admit negligence, don't talk to me. Sorry.

And I honestly believe if Mystic had fallen on their sword, offer to pay the families who lost kids, immediately refund camp fees, work together with the families who lost girls on how they wanted to be remembered, ask for forgiveness, embrace improvements and change for safety, etc. it would have gone much better for them.
And I believe the majority of the parents would be willing to work to re open a safer Mystic.
But they chose a different path. And to folks outside of the area it appears they put opening the camp up ASAP more important than the death of 27 girls.
I mean, wouldn't the Christian thing to do would be to make things right whatever happens financially?
As I said before, maybe it is me. But this whole thing about the camp must go on and we must move forward without justice rings hollow to me.
And I want Mystic to re open. And I am glad your daughter wants to enjoy Mystic. But this whole moving forward without the things I mentioned is not healing in my opinion.
You do wrong, admit it, make things right, THEN move forward
It just seems they are so tone deaf.

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Responding to your later edit...

I think it is delusional that they could have avoided a lawsuit by doing all that. There are 27 families involved and there is pretty close to zero chance that they were going to be able to satisfy every one of them to the point that nobody would sue. And once somebody sues, all of that stuff you just said becomes usable in court against them. Believe me, I have been there in other situations where companies came to groups that had been wronged with a clear admission of responsibility and an open checkbook ready to right the wrongs they caused, and somebody will still always sue. The reality is that just like Bonfire it will take years for the lawsuits to make their way through court unless there is truth that the families aren't after money and just want changes made and safety improvements to keep it from ever happening again. If so, their lawyers will be very disappointed, but they should be able to come to an agreement pretty quickly, after which I expect the tone from the Eastlands will change dramatically.

dermdoc said:

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txags92 said:

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dermdoc said:

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Alta said:

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It was always going to be controversial/painful whether it be now or in years for Mystic to open. I do know that many families want it to reopen and are glad that as of now that appears to be the case (can always change). Lots of people have sent Tweety and the Eastlands letters stating such over the past couple of months. Nobody has to send their daughter to Mystic if they are uncomfortable doing so. And the location that is opening next summer is not on the Guadalupe.

Our daughter is so happy to be able to hug her camp friends, hug Tweety and hopefully enjoy a place that is very special to her. That means something to me as her dad. And I know many families that feel the same. And that doesn't diminish how much pain we feel for people who lost a child/loved ones. We see people who did daily and do our best to continue and shower them with as much love as possible. And I know at least one of these families thinks it's a good thing that Mystic is reopening.

Life is hard. Horrible horrible things happen in this world on a daily basis. This was the most tragic event that ever affected our community and family. But through horrible things you have to keep moving forward. Learn, pray, be better but never stop moving forward.

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Until you admit negligence, don't talk to me. Sorry.

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Derm, this is what I was talking about yesterday. Regardless of what the Eastlands actually do or do not feel towards the families who lost girls in the flood, it is very likely that there are clauses in their insurance policies that require them to not torpedo any lawsuit by admitting guilt and there may in fact be clauses in the insurance policy that specifically don't cover negligence. Regardless of how much money they have made running the camp, if they came forward before the legal claims are settled with a tearful "we F'ed up and it is all our fault" communication, they would be torpedoing any defense they might want to use in court, and it is likely to be a 8-9 digit mistake. This is the sad fact about litigation is that it causes situations like this where guilty parties can't express their true feelings because of how anything they say will be used against them. I would wager Tweety would give up her entire fortune gladly if it brought back even one of the girls that were lost. But there are other parties involved in the defense whose lawyers are likely making it clear to them what the consequences are if they speak out of turn before the claims are settled.

I know there is a counter-argument that they should be bankrupted for what happened and I am not in any way claiming they were not in fact negligent. It is just reality that legal claims and the high stakes involved for people beyond Tweety and her kids mean that they likely can't come to the families and communicate, pray, commiserate, etc. the way they would all otherwise want to.

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Why doesn't Tweety say that? That does not imply guilt. Why did they not refund immediately without legal coercion?

I am not a neophyte at this and understand how it works. Mystic has handled this as poorly as they could. And give the impression they are more concerned about the camp's viability and money. That is not smart.

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In answer to the first, it goes back to what I said yesterday. They are likely to be under instruction from the lawyers to have no communication that is extraneous to future camp operations. In response to the 2nd, I agree with you. The response has not been handled well and their lawyers are not doing them any favors by not coming up with a way for them to express remorse and do a better job communicating with the families without admitting anything that will hurt them in court.