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Shotgun reqs.....

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Jbob04
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9:17a, 8/10/25
AG
I just picked up a weatherby element waterfowler and shot it for the first time yesterday. Really liked the feel and how smooth it was. Got it at academy for $750. It was down to the weatherby and the Winchester sx 4. For me, the weatherby just felt better in my hands and shoulder than the sx4 did.

https://www.academy.com/p/weatherby-element-waterfowl-realtree-max-5-12-gauge-semiautomatic-shotgun-115137402?sku=12-gauge
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Gunny456
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In reply to Jbob04 • 9:31a, 8/10/25
Gunny456
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In reply to chjoak • 1:14p, 8/10/25
AG
There is a nice Beretta A300 Ultima 20gauge. 28" barrel on Gunrunner Auctions right now. Bid is $520.00. Might check it out.
It's lot # 37.

ETA. There is also a Beretta A400 XCel 20ga. 30" barrel that they say has box and docs like new. Bid is $920
Lot #47
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AgDad121619
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6:07p, 8/10/25
AG
FWIW OP - SGrem has great advice but keep in mind he is a professional fish and duck guide as his vocation. He is likely a better shooter than 99% of us so keep that in mind while deciding between a 12 and a 20.
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SGrem
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7:14p, 8/10/25
I would consider myself a fair shot on game. Not excellent on clays. I hope I don't shoot better than 99%.....many of yall are really good on a clays course. (Now being a guide i can probably clean fish better than most. I'll take that one.)

I started with a 20ga. Was broke so thats all I had. For everything. Shot just as many ducks and geese as everyone else. Maybe just good hunts but never felt disadvantaged. I see the benefit in larger shot size for geese but Im not a big goose hunter anyway. We have had geese come in while duck hunting and shot em all the same. Some fell some didnt.

Started shooting clays a few years ago. Got a lesson or two. Shooting coaches said whoa why shooting a 20ga you need a 12ga. Not broke anymore so I got one....got a few. Didn't enjoy shooting any of them. No real improvement on clays just more guns and better repeatable form for consistent scores. Tried my 20ga guns again and I was shooting the same. Started having much more fun.

Never knew a 20ga was not "desirable" till I got the shock of guys I was shooting with and a lessons instructor told me I needed a 12g. I give all my customers a 20ga for rental shotguns on ducks. Have had a few experienced shooters that didn't have a saltwater throw down marsh gun be shocked that we would use a 20ga on ducks. Then they shoot em fine. The inexperienced shooters don't know any difference and they too shoot fine.

Honestly all this time "I didn't know any better". Never knew everyone would be so adamant that a 12 was the only way to start. When you look at patterns and how chokes affect patterns at distance they are so close. I just cant see the big deal. So I stayed with the 20 and got rid of the 12s.

I guess admittedly I also enjoy doing more with less. Kind of a hobby and personal challenge.
Www.gowithgrem.com
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AggieMarkSA
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In reply to dr_boogs • 2:18p, 8/14/25
dr_boogs said:
chjoak said:
So that's another good question worth bringing up. I have been planning to go with 12g but should I be focusing on 20g instead? I would be using this for dove and maybe the occasional clays?


Lots of good and also some bad advice on this thread. You have to hang around the OB a bit to figure out that there are some regular posters who mean well but just come off as are excellent/superior at everything and never have any problems or failures in life. But I digress…..

There are several 4H youth shotgun coaches on this board. Unless the shooter is an 8-12 year old child unable to handle the weight of or perceived recoil of a 12 ga, we get them into a 12 ga as soon as possible. Given your OP, 12 ga is the answer, please listen to me on this. 12 ga will allow you to kill more dove, have better success with clays, and build confidence and have more fun than the 20 ga. Once you gain some proficiency then pick up a 20 or 28. Happy to discuss more offline, PM me if you need any other specifics.

A soft shooting 12 ga semi-auto that fits your frame well, with a 28 inch barrel, is what you should buy given your history and intended use and frequency of use. Make sure you can adjust the stock with provided shims to get your fit right. The A300 is an excellent recommendation. But there are a lot of great 12 ga semis at that price point.

I agree with this to a point. Growing up I did the progression of .410 to 20 to 12, but only really shot that 12 for a year or 2 before I was back to the 20. Granted, there weren't all the lightweight auto-loader options for 12 gauge then that you have now, but i always found the lighter weight of the 20 gauge to be preferable when carrying in the field, and allowed me to adjust on the fly a lot easier.

That being said, for the beginner, the pattern on a 12 gauge is very forgiving, especially on clays.
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Drundel
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4:26p, 8/14/25
AG
This thread kinda escalated so I skimmed.

To the op, do you have any physical limitation that would prevent you from shooting a few boxes of 12 gauge during a dove hunt? If no, then get the 12 for the sheer fact, its easy (and usually cheaper) to find ammo with more options.

As far as the gun, unless you want to buy new, see if you can find an older Beretta 391 (or any of the newer ones), maybe a Benelli M1 or M2.

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StillNotAnAggie
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4:55p, 8/14/25
You can get the Benelli Nova on sale for $449 at Academy.
Full disclosure, I don't have this gun I've just heard good things about it.
https://www.academy.com/p/benelli-nova-3-12-gauge-pump-action-shotgun-155472934

Edit: Sorry I didn't read the part where he didn't want a pump.
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gringogambler
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In reply to SGrem • 9:46a, 8/15/25
AG
Agree - I hunt with a 20 but know some serious dove hunters that always grab their 28 ga's
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schmellba99
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In reply to chjoak • 10:25a, 8/15/25
AG
chjoak said:
So my question...... What reliable budget options (<$750?) would be available and is there an advantage to double barrel (side by side or over under) vs semi auto other than the number of shells than can be loaded?

As Bender said, if you are going new you will get a better gun in semi-auto at that range than you will O/U.

That being said - I personally think O/U is better for field hunting, and better especially for newer hunters because you only have 2 shells versus 3. And it's universally known that if you have 3 shells, you shoot 3 shells. It's like a law or something.

12 gauge is heavier, more felt recoil. That's the downside. The upside is that you have better odds of hitting your target because you are throwing more shot up in the air. Purely a numbers game. I'm not talking that you are going to have 2x or 3x better chance, it isn't that dramatic - but overall, 12 gauge is good for the fact that it throws more shot up and that is what most everybody else carries so if you run out of ammo you are better able to bum some off of somebody else.

20 gauge is lighter and less felt recoil in most guns. I hunt with a 20, hell I shoot clays with a 20. But that is primarily because I haven't gotten around to getting a 12 gauge O/U and unless I'm duck or goose hunting, I pretty much only shoot an O/U because I just like them better. I love my 870 for what it is, but it's my duck/goose gun.

If you are hell bent on new- look at an auto, one of the ones mentioned here is going to be your best bet. If you don't mind finding a good used gun, I'd steer you towards an O/U. You may end up spending a little more on an over/under, but for me personally it would be money well spent.

Here is a CZ Uplander for $700 - solid gun. A little on the heavy side, but otherwise it is a very well put together OU that won't put you in the poor house but will also last forever unless you use it as a pry bar.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1117399569

Here is an SKB for a little over your $750, but it is a hell of a good gun

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1121192659

Another CZ

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1119316358
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schmellba99
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In reply to gringogambler • 10:43a, 8/15/25
AG
gringogambler said:
Agree - I hunt with a 20 but know some serious dove hunters that always grab their 28 ga's

28ga is a niche gauge, usually shot by people that can afford to shoot hem and want a low recoil gun that is also a conversation piece.

Here is the basic hierarchy of shotgun gauges:

10 gauge - blue collar, but that type of blue collar that has just a toe into the white collar world. Not a hugely popular gauge anymore.

12 gauge - the ultimate blue collar gauge. Workhorse, everybody makes a chambering in 12 gauge. With the popularity of high school shooting, it has danced on the line with being a white collar gauge but ultimately it is still the F250 of the shotgun world IMO

16 gauge - old school gauge here. Was designed as a happy medium between 12 and 20 gauges but never became as popular as either and, like the 10 gauge, is relegated more to a niche category. This gauge wears several belts: it's the nostalgic gauge. The gauge your great grandpappy carried in some no-name double side by side back at the turn of the century. It's also the retro/yuppie gauge carried by those guys that didn't grow up hunting but got into it, but can't conform with most of society in anything they do. They still wear red flannel and stocking caps and try hard as hell to be different. "Oh, I shoot a gauge you probably haven't ever seen in a gun you've never heard of because it is made by an uber obscure manufacturer that doesn't exist anymore".

20 gauge - white collar gauge. Doesn't have the oompth that a 12 does, not quite as many options (though still plenty of them). Smaller, lighter, just a a little more refined than a 12 gauge, but not overly so - it's that upper middle class gauge.

28 gauge - this is the tea and crumpets shotgun gauge. Hoity-toity and it generally looks down at all other gauges and bores because it is just higher up in the social circles. It's also expensive, so it's the C-suite level gauge that only goes out on occasion and when the weather is perfect. "Oh, you shoot a 20 gauge? Huh. Well, I shoulder a 28 gauge, it was custom made by an Italian gunmaker you've never heard of because you don't have that blue blood running through your veins like I do. I'll have a scone now while you eat your beef jerky".

.410 bore - red headed stepchild that nobody claims. Hell, it isn't even a gauge - it's a bore. It is the east Texas relative that we really aren't sure if it does meth or not, but it definitely lives in a double wide in the woods.

Edit - added 16 gauge, because I kinda forgot about it on the original post. Wanted to make it a complete list.
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AggieMarkSA
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In reply to schmellba99 • 9:43p, 8/15/25
Hey, I love my .410!
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gringogambler
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In reply to AggieMarkSA • 12:34p, 8/17/25
AG
I have one and seldom shoot it (only in alleys)- pricey shells!
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gringogambler
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In reply to schmellba99 • 12:36p, 8/17/25
AG
Ha ha! Love your descriptions - well done! The 28 ga made me laugh!
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Maximus Johnson
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In reply to SGrem • 8:11a, 8/18/25
AG
I shoot ducks with a 12ga loaded with 3.5'' #2's.

My dog doesn't chase cripples. Dead is dead.
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SGrem
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9:14a, 8/18/25
I will have a blind full of 20ga rental guns for my customers. And I shoot a 20ga. Shoot 3" #2s. My lil 29# Boykin doesn't have to chase either. Dead is dead. Much less weight. Much less expense. Dont need the abuse.

The CZ rep tried to get me into a 12ga chambered for 3.5". I respectfully declined as I will never have a need for 3.5" 12ga and dont want that sloppy spacing in the chamber or any loading issues or cycling issues or longer receiver. Just no need for me. I have too much respect for myself and my business to take gear from sponsors that I myself would not use.

Saw old timer Tom Estep at the range. (Tom is the local shooting coach for the high schools and has shot his whole life. Kind of a fixture at the ranges and competitions although he no longer competes.) He was having to shoot mounted under his arm because his shoulder was no good after numerous surgeries. I took out my 28ga and he said good idea even if you shoot 5 less....
Www.gowithgrem.com
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TXCAV
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3:52p, 8/20/25
Franchi Affinity 3. One of the best semi autos under 1k.
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Waterski02
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7:35p, 11/11/25
AG
Bringing this one back to the top, my wife and daughters 12/10 are interested in moving into shooting some clays for fun. Doubt it'll ever get serious, but enough to bring another firearm into the stable.

What's out there in, I'd assume 20ga, that would be a good overall gun for them? O/U, pump or SA? Thanks
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