I didn't think the convention center was going to be proposed at the vacant Macy'ss but was assuming that the city will have to purchase the land in the Midtown area on which to have the center built and have a hotel built that is connected to the center. I gues the hotel could be on private land next door and connect it to the city-owned center?techno-ag said:The city only owns Macy's old location. So a private developer could build something adjacent in POM and the city wouldn't have to fund it.woodiewood said:Yep. It's like when an A&M department asks an outside focal groups or consultant group to evaluate a possible major project or expenditure. The hired consultant knows exactly what the department is looking for and collects the data and writes the report with the conclusions that the department is looking to get...wink, wink. Also, the consultant will always recommend that further investigations might be considered so as to generate furture work.EBrazosAg said:
All these studies are done to give cover to leaders to do what the want to do….. then if it doesn't work they can say "but the consultants said it was a great idea !"
My prediction is that if we build a convention center in the next few years for a couple of hundred million $$ it will run at a loss for a decade or so.
At that time a consultant will say that we need to remodel and/or or add more square footage to it as that will make it more attractive to planners of larger conventions and we will spend another 100 million $$.
I also don't think that the city should have a hotel built on city property competing with the existing private hotels.
Convention Center Viability in Brazos County
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Last: 11 mo ago by UmustBKidding
Arlington Convention Center, Frisco Conference Center, Galveston Convention Center, Irving Convention Center, Lubbock Convention Center, Hot Springs, AR Convention Center.Brian Alg said:
Name one municipally owned and operated convention center, ideally one in a similarly situated city like Waco or something, that you believe is well run and an exemplar of what you want College Station to build.
I mean, it's not like this is some kind of novelty idea for a city owned convention center.
woodiewood said:If it is such a boom of increased opportunities for businesses, why don't the businesses that will benefit form a partnership and build a private convention center and, as Waco had to do, hire a management company to run it?AgProgrammer said:
Not directly, but about the same as any hotel, restaurant, retail shop, construction company, etc…or lots of other business owners in area do.
Keep in mind, businesses also pay a rather large portion of the tax base, so increased opportunities for them are also a consideration in how that money should be reinvested into the city.
Pretty much all convention centers are run by a management company. Actual city operated convention centers are pretty rare.
The reason they are all city owned is because the financial benefit it brings to the city is not just realized in building rental. The big benefit is the number of hotel rooms being filled (hotel occupancy taxes), restaurant sales, alcohol sales, etc. There is also an income stream with food & beverage minimums associated with the building rental. A private owned convention center would have to realize 100% of their profits from the building rental and auxiliary sales, which would then make the rental rates substantially higher than other city-owned options in other parts of the state. That's common practice for every convention center in the country to keep the rental rates of the center "lower" than the actual operating costs of the building because the economic impact of thousands of hotel room nights far exceeds building rental rates.
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
The city's job is not to subsidize hotels and restaurants.
Herein lies the philosophical difference with how government works (or should).
Herein lies the philosophical difference with how government works (or should).
They aren't? They are bringing in additional events which lead to increased tax revenue from hotel and restaurants sales.tu ag said:
The city's job is not to subsidize hotels and restaurants.
Herein lies the philosophical difference with how government works (or should).
Why do you think the city gave TAMU so much money for the stadium renovation. It's because the alternate option of those events (football games) not being here those years would have a bigger negative effects on tax revenue that what they paid the university to keep the games here during the renovation.
There are literally hundreds of city owned convention centers across the country. Do you think they are all losing money for the cities?
woodiewood said:I didn't think the convention center was going to be proposed at the vacant Macy'ss but was assuming that the city will have to purchase the land in the Midtown area on which to have the center built and have a hotel built that is connected to the center. I gues the hotel could be on private land next door and connect it to the city-owned center?techno-ag said:The city only owns Macy's old location. So a private developer could build something adjacent in POM and the city wouldn't have to fund it.woodiewood said:Yep. It's like when an A&M department asks an outside focal groups or consultant group to evaluate a possible major project or expenditure. The hired consultant knows exactly what the department is looking for and collects the data and writes the report with the conclusions that the department is looking to get...wink, wink. Also, the consultant will always recommend that further investigations might be considered so as to generate furture work.EBrazosAg said:
All these studies are done to give cover to leaders to do what the want to do….. then if it doesn't work they can say "but the consultants said it was a great idea !"
My prediction is that if we build a convention center in the next few years for a couple of hundred million $$ it will run at a loss for a decade or so.
At that time a consultant will say that we need to remodel and/or or add more square footage to it as that will make it more attractive to planners of larger conventions and we will spend another 100 million $$.
I also don't think that the city should have a hotel built on city property competing with the existing private hotels.
I thought the Midtown developer said he'd gladly build the hotel connected to the CC. And he was going to donate land. But that may have been for the Rec Center.
Exactly this. In their last 100 reports, how many did they advise against the considered project? In the last 500 reports?tu ag said:
Hunden Partners entire business model is based on having cities build more stuff.
I would love to know how many of these projects they advised cities NOT to build?
Gonna bet 0.
Asking with genuine curiosity.
I wouldn't say subsidize but practically every city has some sort of tourism effort in play or a visitation office of some kind.tu ag said:
The city's job is not to subsidize hotels and restaurants.
Herein lies the philosophical difference with how government works (or should).
The left cannot kill the Spirit of Charlie Kirk.
Everyone else does it is your argument?
How about - is that how tax money is supposed to be spent?
Cities should leave business development alone. Esp. a city who has shown such a lack of business acumen as College Station. Throwing millions (of our taxes) at things in order to try and make either: amenities (outside of parks) or business development is a mistake.
Let the private sector provide amenities if the market dictates it.
Let businesses determine if they want to open something.
Furthermore- since a CC does greatly help a certain segment of businesses over others, why subsidize (yes that is what is happening) one segment of businesses over others? Why spend taxes on tourist and visitor sector and not others?
Either due to vanity or because "this is what cities ought to do" philosophy.
There is no real discernment here, it is all preplanned. They aren't after doing what is best for citizens, that is clear.
How about - is that how tax money is supposed to be spent?
Cities should leave business development alone. Esp. a city who has shown such a lack of business acumen as College Station. Throwing millions (of our taxes) at things in order to try and make either: amenities (outside of parks) or business development is a mistake.
Let the private sector provide amenities if the market dictates it.
Let businesses determine if they want to open something.
Furthermore- since a CC does greatly help a certain segment of businesses over others, why subsidize (yes that is what is happening) one segment of businesses over others? Why spend taxes on tourist and visitor sector and not others?
Either due to vanity or because "this is what cities ought to do" philosophy.
There is no real discernment here, it is all preplanned. They aren't after doing what is best for citizens, that is clear.
Brian Alg said:
The study (thank you, Councilman Yancy):
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1F67wmFD_dAliS7SpMiYB3TlACoj8cm-F/view?usp=sharing
I would like to point out that page 10 indicates the revenues lost as a result of "the 62 events lost due to space constraints" is around $13.2 million across 2022-2024.
That is $4.4 million per year. Less than half of the average Chic-Fil-A's annual revenue. If you calculate out the sales tax revenue lost according to the feasibility consultants we are talking about something on the order of $66k (4.4 million x 1.5%) in annual tax revenue we are missing out on.
If they are talking about anything that costs more than $66k in O&M shortfall and amortized CapEx, this is a loser for taxpayers.
The proposal for a municipally owned and operated convention center was always and will always be a loser for taxpayers. Any further time spent on this is a distraction at best. Any further money spent on studying boondoggle feasibility is taxpayer money wasted.
@Bob Yancy
Can you address the above?
You said the study claims there is a demand for a convention center and the council seems to be basing their entire "Let's Go! The study says we can and should" reasoning on that "demand"
$4.4 million Revenue per year is NOT profit (assuming we'd even get that many conventions/uses of the center out of it per year since the study can't say 100% that we would get that.) Gonna be a lot of costs involved with building it and then the upkeep, staffing, a new bureaucracy and staff to manage it, etc.
The city likes to build Taj Mahals so I don't expect it will be cheap
And the tax revenues/HOT revenues won't really bring in that much per year
Please make sure all this is taken into account when deciding and not just using a Consultant's "Independent Study" that says "we have demand" and you and the council use that as your justification.
Too many previous CS councils have relied on similar studies and when it turns out to be a dud (like almost every one has been), they claim "Well we used the best data we had"
Just because there is "a demand" doesn't mean we have to do it nor does it show it will be viable.
"Just because there is "a demand" doesn't mean we have to do it nor does it show it will be viable."
This! There are demands for many things, and it is not the city/state/feds job to provide them.
This! There are demands for many things, and it is not the city/state/feds job to provide them.
To float a convention center idea out there while we are still trying to figure out how to deal with the Macy's debacle is an issue, at least for me. I'm sure there are municipalities that have successful convention facilities. I'm also confident there are those out there who lose money.
But it's the bad taste of the Macy's deal that will linger for many of us.
But it's the bad taste of the Macy's deal that will linger for many of us.
91_Aggie said:Brian Alg said:
The study (thank you, Councilman Yancy):
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1F67wmFD_dAliS7SpMiYB3TlACoj8cm-F/view?usp=sharing
I would like to point out that page 10 indicates the revenues lost as a result of "the 62 events lost due to space constraints" is around $13.2 million across 2022-2024.
That is $4.4 million per year. Less than half of the average Chic-Fil-A's annual revenue. If you calculate out the sales tax revenue lost according to the feasibility consultants we are talking about something on the order of $66k (4.4 million x 1.5%) in annual tax revenue we are missing out on.
If they are talking about anything that costs more than $66k in O&M shortfall and amortized CapEx, this is a loser for taxpayers.
The proposal for a municipally owned and operated convention center was always and will always be a loser for taxpayers. Any further time spent on this is a distraction at best. Any further money spent on studying boondoggle feasibility is taxpayer money wasted.
@Bob Yancy
Can you address the above?
You said the study claims there is a demand for a convention center and the council seems to be basing their entire "Let's Go! The study says we can and should" reasoning on that "demand"
$4.4 million Revenue per year is NOT profit (assuming we'd even get that many conventions/uses of the center out of it per year since the study can't say 100% that we would get that.) Gonna be a lot of costs involved with building it and then the upkeep, staffing, a new bureaucracy and staff to manage it, etc.
The city likes to build Taj Mahals so I don't expect it will be cheap
And the tax revenues/HOT revenues won't really bring in that much per year
Please make sure all this is taken into account when deciding and not just using a Consultant's "Independent Study" that says "we have demand" and you and the council use that as your justification.
Too many previous CS councils have relied on similar studies and when it turns out to be a dud (like almost every one has been), they claim "Well we used the best data we had"
Just because there is "a demand" doesn't mean we have to do it nor does it show it will be viable.
I agree with some of your statement. In the last two budget cycles I've expressed concern during budget hearings that we are spending too much on capital projects. I worry about that a lot.
I'd rather see us spend $8m upgrading our existing Public Works HQ with a new motor pool building than spend $40m starting over from scratch. No private sector firm would ever build anew without thinking through what you're going to do with your existing site. That's poor capital planning.
I've opposed a new rec center all along, and I opposed the study, but I lost that vote. Complicating the rec center issue is there is a significant constituency that want one and the city has been talking about it for over a decade. Further complicating the issue is the many verbal promises made by prior councils to the folks in College Station's Midtown who pay higher taxes yet we never delivered on the promise of a rec center in that area. If you compare the Tale of Two Midtown's, one city committed and one didn't, broadly speaking. I know people see that keenly and I hear it a lot. We also have ever growing neighborhood density on the east side with far fewer public amenities.
As for a convention center, I support us having one for the volumetric reasons and research I've stated on this platform, but I do not support College Station going it alone. It would benefit everyone and thusly everyone should help fund it. We are losing business, tourism, and entertainment options for our citizens. We are too large a market and growing to have no Convention & Events Center.
I could go on down the list and will at some point, but wanted to be transparent on my thinking with CIP.
Respectfully
Yancy '95
My opinions are mine and should not be construed as those of city council or staff. I welcome robust debate but will cease communication on any thread in which colleagues or staff are personally criticized. I must refrain from comment on posted agenda items until after meetings are concluded. Bob Yancy 95
This is where I'm at. Just hearing the words College Station city council, gives me financial anxiety. I'm feeling like we'd be better off if we just paid for them to go on a 4 year tropical vacation, a long ways from here.
Bob, isn't it true that HOT funds can be used on convention centers? If so, this is a great way to pour back into the community.
The left cannot kill the Spirit of Charlie Kirk.
AgProgrammer said:
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
Except…no convention that size would ever come here and nobody in the right mind would build a facility that large here. That's a massive event. Conventions that size are in places where the attendees have other things to do, like Vegas or Orlando. 5000 people here for a convention that size would have nothing to do. Not to mention the total lack of transportation facilities for that. 5000 people flying into Houston or Austin to ride a bus or rental car would be a deal breaker.
techno-ag said:
Bob, isn't it true that HOT funds can be used on convention centers? If so, this is a great way to pour back into the community.
Yes it can. There are a variety of mechanisms through state legislation to fund convention centers. You can get a quick primer here…
https://comptroller.texas.gov/economy/fiscal-notes/archive/2018/august/convention-centers.php
Respectfully
Yancy
My opinions are mine and should not be construed as those of city council or staff. I welcome robust debate but will cease communication on any thread in which colleagues or staff are personally criticized. I must refrain from comment on posted agenda items until after meetings are concluded. Bob Yancy 95
Mathguy64 said:AgProgrammer said:
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
Except…no convention that size would ever come here and nobody in the right mind would build a facility that large here. That's a massive event. Conventions that size are in places where the attendees have other things to do, like Vegas or Orlando. 5000 people here for a convention that size would have nothing to do. Not to mention the total lack of transportation facilities for that. 5000 people flying into Houston or Austin to ride a bus or rental car would be a deal breaker.
They will absolutely never come here if we don't have a convention and events center.
Respectfully
Yancy '95
My opinions are mine and should not be construed as those of city council or staff. I welcome robust debate but will cease communication on any thread in which colleagues or staff are personally criticized. I must refrain from comment on posted agenda items until after meetings are concluded. Bob Yancy 95
I'm okay with tax or economic incentives from the cities, county, and even TAMU to a PRIVATE developer to build such a project.
I think the best location would be the run down Days Inn property, along with those empty retail spaces next to it and what used to be the Italian restaurant right there. You have a slew or hotels and restaurants there for attendees to stay and eat and drink. Perhaps there is someone with the money to make it come to fruition with some economic incentives. Someone other than the city.
I think the best location would be the run down Days Inn property, along with those empty retail spaces next to it and what used to be the Italian restaurant right there. You have a slew or hotels and restaurants there for attendees to stay and eat and drink. Perhaps there is someone with the money to make it come to fruition with some economic incentives. Someone other than the city.
That is an ok outcome for all of us who think COCS is incompetent when it comes to capital expenditures.Quote:
They will absolutely never come here if we don't have a convention and events center.
Bob Yancy said:Mathguy64 said:AgProgrammer said:
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
Except…no convention that size would ever come here and nobody in the right mind would build a facility that large here. That's a massive event. Conventions that size are in places where the attendees have other things to do, like Vegas or Orlando. 5000 people here for a convention that size would have nothing to do. Not to mention the total lack of transportation facilities for that. 5000 people flying into Houston or Austin to ride a bus or rental car would be a deal breaker.
They will absolutely never come here if we don't have a convention and events center.
Respectfully
Yancy '95
That is fine in the abstract. But to expect a conference with 5000 people in this location is not being realistic. This is not a location suitable for that any more than expecting it to be a viable option for State College PA or Starkville MS. It's a big college town off the interstate with local/regional travel services.
Mathguy64 said:AgProgrammer said:
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
Except…no convention that size would ever come here and nobody in the right mind would build a facility that large here. That's a massive event. Conventions that size are in places where the attendees have other things to do, like Vegas or Orlando. 5000 people here for a convention that size would have nothing to do. Not to mention the total lack of transportation facilities for that. 5000 people flying into Houston or Austin to ride a bus or rental car would be a deal breaker.
What has been made clear in this thread is the number of people who don't understand events like this. 2,500 -5,000 is not that big. The Hyatt Regency Reunion Tower in Dallas regularly hosts 5,000 person conventions in that one building. The Galveston convention center hosts 2,500-4,000 people all of the time.
Vegas, Orlando, Houston (GRB), Dallas Convention Center…those places are hosting 70,000+ attendees events. We aren't talking about that here. 2,500-5,000 is very realistic for our market.
I am getting really tired of this... you want feasibility? You want to cut to the chase.. fine
How budget has increased by by $230,000,000 in 4 years.
How debt payments have increased even beyond the est.
please stop the 'gaslighting'
The city budget has exploded.
You want to help the economy? You want to help our local area?
then STOP TAKING MONEY OUT OF THE ECONOMY TO SPEND ON STUPID CRAP.
The city already took $36,000,000 OUT of the economy to spend on a failed ballpark.
-------
This is not about this rec center or that conf center... it is about the fundamentals.
If you want to boost the economy than keep money IN IT! That is what I mean when I say poor management.
For a city that DEPENDS on people spending their extra dollars to GEN sales tax rev and lower the dependence on property tax ( balancing scales) you would think council would be fighting for that. But no, it is fighting for something that there is ZERO public support for.
my leg is wet but it ain't raining
How budget has increased by by $230,000,000 in 4 years.
How debt payments have increased even beyond the est.
please stop the 'gaslighting'
The city budget has exploded.
You want to help the economy? You want to help our local area?
then STOP TAKING MONEY OUT OF THE ECONOMY TO SPEND ON STUPID CRAP.
The city already took $36,000,000 OUT of the economy to spend on a failed ballpark.
-------
This is not about this rec center or that conf center... it is about the fundamentals.
If you want to boost the economy than keep money IN IT! That is what I mean when I say poor management.
For a city that DEPENDS on people spending their extra dollars to GEN sales tax rev and lower the dependence on property tax ( balancing scales) you would think council would be fighting for that. But no, it is fighting for something that there is ZERO public support for.
my leg is wet but it ain't raining
I understand 5000 very well. I've attended conferences with 200 and conferences with 35000.AgProgrammer said:Mathguy64 said:AgProgrammer said:
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
Except…no convention that size would ever come here and nobody in the right mind would build a facility that large here. That's a massive event. Conventions that size are in places where the attendees have other things to do, like Vegas or Orlando. 5000 people here for a convention that size would have nothing to do. Not to mention the total lack of transportation facilities for that. 5000 people flying into Houston or Austin to ride a bus or rental car would be a deal breaker.
What has been made clear in this thread is the number of people who don't understand events like this. 2,500 -5,000 is not that big. The Hyatt Regency Reunion Tower in Dallas regularly hosts 5,000 person conventions in that one building. The Galveston convention center hosts 2,500-4,000 people all of the time.
Vegas, Orlando, Houston (GRB), Dallas Convention Center…those places are hosting 70,000+ attendees events. We aren't talking about that here. 2,500-5,000 is very realistic for our market.
You aren't getting 5000 to fly to Houston to rent a car to drive 90 miles. That's a larger national level event.
Taxes should be for amenities used by citizens, not for amenities used by visitors.
Government shouldn't compete with private business.
CS has a horrific record in economic development.
Not only should this be stopped, but the city should reassign staff whose role it is to pursue economic development.
Stop shopping and you will stop buying.
Government shouldn't compete with private business.
CS has a horrific record in economic development.
Not only should this be stopped, but the city should reassign staff whose role it is to pursue economic development.
Stop shopping and you will stop buying.
this^Mathguy64 said:I understand 5000 very well. I've attended conferences with 200 and conferences with 35000.AgProgrammer said:Mathguy64 said:AgProgrammer said:
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
Except…no convention that size would ever come here and nobody in the right mind would build a facility that large here. That's a massive event. Conventions that size are in places where the attendees have other things to do, like Vegas or Orlando. 5000 people here for a convention that size would have nothing to do. Not to mention the total lack of transportation facilities for that. 5000 people flying into Houston or Austin to ride a bus or rental car would be a deal breaker.
What has been made clear in this thread is the number of people who don't understand events like this. 2,500 -5,000 is not that big. The Hyatt Regency Reunion Tower in Dallas regularly hosts 5,000 person conventions in that one building. The Galveston convention center hosts 2,500-4,000 people all of the time.
Vegas, Orlando, Houston (GRB), Dallas Convention Center…those places are hosting 70,000+ attendees events. We aren't talking about that here. 2,500-5,000 is very realistic for our market.
You aren't getting 5000 to fly to Houston to rent a car to drive 90 miles. That's a larger national level event.
This is all a vanity trip. We are adding SF of conv/rec centers into a market that already has a lot of the above.
So that is gonna work... well?
Building a convention space and building a massive hotel facility that has a large capacity to house and feed convention attendees are not the same thing.
Places like the Hyatt in Dallas exist because they are in large metro areas that can fill the hotel and utilize its various spaces (rooms sized for 100-200 up to large banquet and meeting facilities with smaller breakout rooms) for a large number of simultaneous events. Add on the fact they their dining and food capacity is purposefully made for that with the hotel on site.
We have several hotels that can accommodate smaller 100-500 attendees at once in both the Hilton and Stella.
If you build a separate convention facility that has break out rooms and spaces for 5000 but don't have the on site dining capacity for that you force people to leave to eat. That means they need the ability and time to travel.
But building that facility without constant usage means you have food storage issues. That facility can't just sit dark without food and you can't just stock it overnight for an event hosting 5000. So you need a hotel on site to be able to use those facilities regularly.
And I don't see Hyatt or anyone else in the real world offering to come here to build that level of facility. There just isn't the traffic for it. We are too far from the major transportion hubs and multi million person metro areas to make that churn work. Those places aren't surviving on a 5000 person conference. They make it work with weekly wedding receptions, and a constant churn of smaller events.
Places like the Hyatt in Dallas exist because they are in large metro areas that can fill the hotel and utilize its various spaces (rooms sized for 100-200 up to large banquet and meeting facilities with smaller breakout rooms) for a large number of simultaneous events. Add on the fact they their dining and food capacity is purposefully made for that with the hotel on site.
We have several hotels that can accommodate smaller 100-500 attendees at once in both the Hilton and Stella.
If you build a separate convention facility that has break out rooms and spaces for 5000 but don't have the on site dining capacity for that you force people to leave to eat. That means they need the ability and time to travel.
But building that facility without constant usage means you have food storage issues. That facility can't just sit dark without food and you can't just stock it overnight for an event hosting 5000. So you need a hotel on site to be able to use those facilities regularly.
And I don't see Hyatt or anyone else in the real world offering to come here to build that level of facility. There just isn't the traffic for it. We are too far from the major transportion hubs and multi million person metro areas to make that churn work. Those places aren't surviving on a 5000 person conference. They make it work with weekly wedding receptions, and a constant churn of smaller events.
Remember we could not even keep United airlines flying into our little city.
How will you get 5,000 conference attendees in/out of town on the 3 small American flights?
How will you get 5,000 conference attendees in/out of town on the 3 small American flights?
That's for later - paying a subsidy to Delta to bring 2 daily flights…..
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I don't see many conference planners of 4,000 to 5,000 attendee 5-day conferences picking College Station over San Antonio River walk area, Houston area with Moody Gardens, Galveston, Corpus Christi, , Austin, and the DFW areas with their off-hours options.AgProgrammer said:woodiewood said:If it is such a boom of increased opportunities for businesses, why don't the businesses that will benefit form a partnership and build a private convention center and, as Waco had to do, hire a management company to run it?AgProgrammer said:
Not directly, but about the same as any hotel, restaurant, retail shop, construction company, etc…or lots of other business owners in area do.
Keep in mind, businesses also pay a rather large portion of the tax base, so increased opportunities for them are also a consideration in how that money should be reinvested into the city.
Pretty much all convention centers are run by a management company. Actual city operated convention centers are pretty rare.
The reason they are all city owned is because the financial benefit it brings to the city is not just realized in building rental. The big benefit is the number of hotel rooms being filled (hotel occupancy taxes), restaurant sales, alcohol sales, etc. There is also an income stream with food & beverage minimums associated with the building rental. A private owned convention center would have to realize 100% of their profits from the building rental and auxiliary sales, which would then make the rental rates substantially higher than other city-owned options in other parts of the state. That's common practice for every convention center in the country to keep the rental rates of the center "lower" than the actual operating costs of the building because the economic impact of thousands of hotel room nights far exceeds building rental rates.
Everyone does realize what the economic impact of a ~2,500-5,000 person, 5-day conference has, correct? It's in the millions per event. The math is actually not that hard to follow.
Evern when I was with A&M and planned and managed conferences of from 500 to 1000 persons, one of the major evaluations was what were the attendees and their families going to do outside of the conference activities? Unique shopping options? Water parks for the kids? Minor league baseball? Botanical gardens? lakes, museums? fire restaurant options? river walk? historical visits? etc. etc. etc.
We have little to drawn them here except maybe less expensive terms.
A conference center here is going to be a tough sell to large convention planners looking at location options.
You can just have so many area-wide garage sales.
We all have our opinions.
You guys need to take a real, hard, long look at the Bell County Expo Center before going forward. They have a hard time filling that, and keeping it busy. The Temple / Belton / Killeen area is comparable to BCS with the terrible pay at Ft. Hood as a similar employer to TAMU.
Does the city have an inordinate amount of cash burning a hole in their pockets? If so, lower the tax rate.
Does the city have an inordinate amount of cash burning a hole in their pockets? If so, lower the tax rate.
Yhey'll drive not fly. BCS is central to the state within 2-3 hours of most metro areas.dubi said:
Remember we could not even keep United airlines flying into our little city.
How will you get 5,000 conference attendees in/out of town on the 3 small American flights?
The left cannot kill the Spirit of Charlie Kirk.
Nobody will do that. Nobody. Leave out the attendees. The committee hosting the conference would get roasted.
You seriously cannot expect someone from out of state to attend a conference where they fly to IAH, get a rent car for 2-3 days, drive it 90 miles on roads they do not know to a conference where they will park the car (where it will be charged parking for 2-3 days) and then drive back those 90 miles to catch an flight.
The conference host selection committee would bypass this option before the possible host city could say "why?"
You seriously cannot expect someone from out of state to attend a conference where they fly to IAH, get a rent car for 2-3 days, drive it 90 miles on roads they do not know to a conference where they will park the car (where it will be charged parking for 2-3 days) and then drive back those 90 miles to catch an flight.
The conference host selection committee would bypass this option before the possible host city could say "why?"
Talking Texans not out of staters necessarily. There's a need for state orgs to meet and we're in the middle of the state.Mathguy64 said:
Nobody will do that. Nobody. Leave out the attendees. The committee hosting the conference would get roasted.
You seriously cannot expect someone from out of state to attend a conference where they fly to IAH, get a rent car for 2-3 days, drive it 90 miles on roads they do not know to a conference where they will park the car (where it will be charged parking for 2-3 days) and then drive back those 90 miles to catch an flight.
The conference host selection committee would bypass this option before the possible host city could say "why?"
The left cannot kill the Spirit of Charlie Kirk.
CSPD does not have enough to do, we need a convention center!
https://www.fox4news.com/news/dallas-convention-center-police-presence
https://www.fox4news.com/news/dallas-convention-center-police-presence