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wildly inconsistent and top 15 players in the league (or top 6 PF/C) doesn't equate (at least among people who watch basketball).

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then explain how carmelo made it on the list then, as, other than the last month of the season, he quit on his team for 3/4 of it and was supremely inconsistent as a F

I agree on that, and for that matter, many of those guys getting votes. Too much of a popularity contests, both at a national level and by the local guys.

Edit: This was really in response to Hudson, but it goes along with Yankees statement as well.

It is too much of a popularity contest among well marketed players and local guys plugging their own guy.

[This message has been edited by Iowaggie (edited 5/25/2012 9:11a).]

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When did I ever say that.

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Did you not agree that DMC deserved a vote on the All-NBA team which represents the top 15 players in the league?

Actually, as much as I love Ginobili, the fact that he recieved votes while missing half the season is pretty laughable.

[This message has been edited by Hudson2508 (edited 5/25/2012 9:18a).]

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Did you not agree that DMC deserved a vote on the All-NBA team which represents the top 15 players in the league?

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No. I don't think he deserved a vote. Did it surprise me that he got one? No. But that's what happens when everyone gets a vote. He's definitely not a top 15 player. However, I did say he's a top 15 player in terms of overall talent. Obviously, you have to have the right mindframe, drive, maturity level, system, teammates, etc. to become a top 15 overall player - something Cousins is definitely not.

But in terms of pure basketball talent, there are few in the league that can match him. He has the size, athleticism, touch, feel, and a lot of other things that can't be taught. I still think he'll have a better career than John Wall.

Just to clarify even more, I think Lamar Odom is also one of the 15 most, maybe 10 most talented players in the league. At least a couple of seasons ago. His combination of size, length, ballhandling, agility, etc. is crazy. But of course, he's one of the most mentally fragile and unmotivated players in the NBA. Someone who has rarely played up to his talent level.

Lamar Odom seems like the prototypical example of someone who plays basketball because that's what really tall, athletic guys are supposed to do... but he doesn't really care about the game.

On the other hand you have players like Ginobili who aren't exactly what you picture when someone says "basketball player", but have all kinds of drive and love for the game.

Cousins is a hothead who thinks that because he is big and talented everything will work out (and every call should go his way). Remains to be seen if he'll put in the work and settle in to be the player he could be.

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I think Lamar Odom is also one of the 15 most, maybe 10 most talented players in the league.

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i disagree. on pure talent alone:

dwade
durant
westbrook
lebron
rose
deron williams
chris paul
melo
Pau Gasol
DeMarcus Cousins
Blake Griffin
Monta Ellis
Kobe
Andrew Bynum
Dwight Howard

And that list was off the top of my head

Lamar Odom is very overrated in terms of talent. He's the black andrei kirilenko. They talk about all he can do, but he never does anything special with any consistency

[edit for saying bynum twice]

[This message has been edited by Yankees (edited 5/25/2012 9:52a).]

Agreed, always thought Odom's talent was overrated.

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dwade
durant
westbrook
lebron
bynum
rose
deron williams
chris paul
melo
Pau Gasol
DeMarcus Cousins
Blake Griffin
Monta Ellis
Kobe
Andrew Bynum
Dwight Howard

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Son...

blake griffin is a supreme talent. If you can't see that, you're nuts. He's like the lighter colored, higher scoring josh smith. If only smith would stop shooting threes. I forgot to add his name to that list

I'm talking about guys that if you saw them in the gym randomly and didn't know who they were, you would be like 'Damn. That guy can play.'

Not 'That guy can dunk or jump really high.' But that guy can flat out play. Like when Kevin Garnett was saying in that post-game that he was "built for this" - that's what I'm talking about. Guys that are put on this planet to play basketball and nothing else.

Kevin Garnett
Kevin Durant
Kobe Bryant
LeBron James
Dwyane Wade
Tim Duncan
Dirk Nowitzki
Chris Paul

Those are some pure basketball talents. Great skills, greater instincts and feel. Basketball machines.

I think Lamar Odom would have been the number one pick in the 1999 draft had he not had all the red flags coming into the league. He had a better skill set than Brand, Francis and Diddy. Length, agility, the ability to play inside and out, all of it.

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blake griffin is a supreme talent.

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He's a talent, yeah. But his game is 1.5 dimensional. There's a reason why he wasn't the number one basketball player coming out of high school (or even a top 10 player), a ranking system moreso than any other that is based on talent and potential alone. Not motivation or drive or even maturity since they were all high schoolers.

Who were the top guys on that list? Mike Beasley (who should be the captain of the Talented-But-Unmotivated All-Stars). Derrick Rose. Kevin Love. Because all those guys could flat out play.

#freebeasley

People underestimate the amount of work Demarcus Cousins puts into his game. Yes he falls in love with his jumpshot at times, and fouls way too much. But have you seen his footwork in the post; its amazing for a young player. How he catches the ball, uses his size and finishes around the rim are phenomenal.

Frankly someone of his talent and game should be able to ask for better coaches and better teammates. High volume shooting athletes like Tyreke Evans are a dime a dozen. And NBA coaches are almost completely random interchangeable parts (of course some separate themselves, but even those guys are very much dependent on talent).

There is no reason to think that with some minor tweaks, Cousins won't be a 22/12/2 guy on 50/70 shooting splits on a playoff team. I'd trade anyone on the Rockets for him without a second thought.

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But have you seen his footwork in the post; its amazing for a young player. How he catches the ball, uses his size and finishes around the rim are phenomenal.

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Exactly.

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There is no reason to think that with some minor tweaks, Cousins won't be a 22/12/2 guy on 50/70 shooting splits on a playoff team. I'd trade anyone on the Rockets for him without a second thought.

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i 100% agree. He's going to be an elite center talent in a year or two, especially if they get evans to pass

For the record, it looks like DeMarcus Cousins actually likes his coach.

I forgot the guys name but he actually let Cousins coach the last 5 min of a game one time.

Looking at the nba all time lists, a case could be made that Tim Duncan could be at 14 if he would not have stayed at Wake Forest his senior year.

jordan could have more if he hadnt broken his leg or "retired" in 1994-1995.

If and when Blake Griffin develops a consistent mid-range jumper, he will be a dominate offensive force in the league.

Defensively he has a long way to come. He needs to put forth a more consistent effort on that end of the court.

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If and when Blake Griffin develops a consistent mid-range jumper

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I see, now we're just throwing out absurd hypotheticals.

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jordan could have more if he hadnt broken his leg or "retired" in 1994-1995.

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I could have had more if I was bigger, taller and didn't suck at basketball.

Squirrel Master,

Don't get it twisted homey, Blake is still an all star player - absolute beast on the glass, great in transition, and obviously going to the basket. We'll see how his shot develops, but it isn't a stretch of the imagination.

[This message has been edited by Uncle Boo Boo (edited 5/25/2012 1:01p).]