I wouldn't be able to find the thread, but after the Dallas series in 2011, I was thinking that James Harden was the 2nd best player on OKC, and that Scott Brooks was an idiot for not featuring him (and of course the game when Dallas had the huge comeback after Harden fouled out). I thought that they should have tried to trade Westbrook, possibly for a pass-first PG.

After last year, I began to reconsider. Anyway, I wonder if OKC might be in for a long frustrating run with the mercurial Westbrook. They needed more of a Drexler or Pippen player as the supporting star.

Thoughts?

What pass-first PG would you want?

Westbrook drives me crazy because he is high risk/high reward, but I don't think there is a PG in the NBA I would take over him right now. Chris Paul is the only one in the conversation.

If you could somehow get Rondo and someone else, you make that trade all day, but I don't think you can pull that off and I sure wouldn't want a 42 year old KG.

I floated the idea at one point for the same reasons, but I'm biased because Westbrook is irritating with his tough-guy sneering act.

This fits better here than in the Spurs thread, where I originally posted it in response to someone saying the Thunder should have kept Hardin:

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The argument is more likely "Harden should have accepted what the Thunder could afford". The cap is 58 mm. Durant/Westbrook make a combined 31.2 mm. Harden's new contract is for 16 mm per, which would put the Thunder at 47 mm in 2011-2012. That leaves them 11 million to fill out the roster, and Ibaka is getting paid 12 mm per year starting in 2012-2013. With their annual salary bumps, that puts the Thunder over 3 million over the cap with only 4 players. The smallest amount of money they can pay (league minimum for rookies) is 500K a pop, which means that filling out a 12 man roster with rookies would put them 7 mm over the cap (65 mm).

Figure that you're realistically going to end up with at least 12 million invested in the "non-big 4" part of the roster and they are 3 mm into the luxury tax... and that assumes that they get rid of Perkins 7 mm per and don't pick up any other posts with a pulse, because decent posts start at 4 mm and go up fast.

Their options were to
lose Ibaka, who is slated to get a very reasonable 12 mm, a premier shotblocker and developing offensive player
lose Durant (no)
lose Westbrook
completely gut their roster outside of Durant, Westbrook, Hardin, and Ibaka, probably only pay 8-9 people and half of them would be rookies or spares
lose Harden

As combo slasher guards, Harden and Westbrook are the closest things to redundant on that list. Do you invest 30 mm in PG/SG and erase your depth or defense, or do you trade the more expensive of your two guards for a quality role player (whose contract is up after this season), a prospect with potential, 3 draft picks, and payroll flexibility?

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[This message has been edited by Ulrich (edited 11/2/2012 9:19a).]

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Westbrook drives me crazy because he is high risk/high reward, but I don't think there is a PG in the NBA I would take over him right now. Chris Paul is the only one in the conversation.

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Not a single PG in the league you'd take over Westbrook, besides Chris Paul? Derrick Rose? Westbrook is consistently in the bottom 5-10 of the league in Assists/Turnover. He's a fantastic athlete and player, but he is not a great PG. He's much better as a SG IMO.

Russell Westbrook is an outstanding player, and the dropoff from Westbrook to a $3-5 million PG (Jerryd Bayless, Kidd, Billups, Felton, Sessions, Aaron Brooks, even Dragic at $7.5) is probably much greater than the dropoff from Harden to a $3-5 SG (Jamal Crawford, OJ Mayo, Jet, C. Lee).

Players shown are from free agent market from this last year. Losing or trading Westbrook would have been foolish, especially because of how valuable a PG is in the league.

Still, I love this gif.

Iowaggie, I agree they probably couldn't have gotten a fair return for Westbrook because he's too good and can play PG. Maybe a multi-team deal if Boston were willing to trade Rondo, but they aren't.

But on the flip side, both Harden and Westbrook can run an offense, and I'm not so sure Harden isn't better at it. Harden is a much better shooter, seems more willing to pass, and makes far fewer dumb decisions. Westbrook has "taken over" more games in his career though.

Westbrook drives me crazy because he is high risk/high reward, but I don't think there is a PG in the NBA I would take over him right now.
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i would take deron williams over westbrook any day

They should have payed the tax. OKC ownership are an evil group. First they screw over Seattle fans, now they are going to screw over OKC fans.

Harden nearly dropped 50 tonight on the Hawks. Finished with 45 points on 14-19fg, 2-4 3pt, and 15-17fts.

I didn't know anything about contracts when I started looking at the situation. It just seemed like Harden was a better player than Westbrook during the Dallas series 2 years ago, and I remember hoping that Brooks didn't realize it before Dallas won the series. Fortunately Brooks is a 2nd or 3rd tier coach...which I might not have noticed until I watched Carlisle for a while.

GS, I don't know. It was just a suggestion. The main thing would have been to move Westbrook. Maybe he and Ibaka could have been moved for some bigtime muscle. I don't know - it just seemed like Westbrook was stunting Durant's growth.

Interesting analysis:

Why Russell Westbrook Is Still Not A Championship Point Guard

http://youtu.be/YVitzGz9g2s

[This message has been edited by Uncle Boo Boo (edited 11/7/2012 10:10p).]

For lack of better place to put this, Derek Fisher has had enough time with family and is returning to OKC.

http://www.nba.com/thunder/?tmd=1

How surprising....I honestly think he is a piece of sh** now. He basically uses his daughter's illness to get out of contracts, so he can then sign with a better team. He has done it multiple times now. Really classy.

I said this last year and everyone called my comments tasteless. Eff Derek Fisher.

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Apparently with 26 games left before the start of the playoffs, family concerns are no longer an issue for Fisher, who wore No. 6 for the Mavs because, as he said, he joined them on a quest for a sixth title. “This is not a pit stop,” Fisher told his new Dallas teammates.

So how do the jilted Mavs feel about this turn of events?
Owner Mark Cuban did not reply to multiple emails on Monday, but one league source said the best way to describe the mood of the Dallas front office is “agitated.” The source said that Fisher and his representatives never contacted the Mavs during his decision-making process to discuss a possible return to Dallas, the team that, in good faith, initially signed him.

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Fisher is receiving some criticism from other places.

From NBA.com writer: f course, in 2007 when Fisher played for the Utah Jazz, he did have a family emergency in the playoffs. His 11-month-old daughter suffered from cancer in her left eye and required surgery in New York. After the playoffs — where Fisher had an iconic moment in the West semifinals — Fisher asked the Jazz to release him from his contract so he could concentrate on finding the best care for his daughter. After saying, “life for me outweighs the game of basketball,” Fisher would soon sign a three-year deal to return to the Lakers.


And Jason Whitlock claimed during All-Star weekend (pre Thunder signing) that the only reason Fisher signed with the Mavs at all was to be on a roster so he could stay NBAPA President.http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/derek-fisher-billy-hunter-no-upgrade-leading-nba-players-union-coup-021513. Interesting.

Derek Fisher is a turd, and has been for years. Lamar Odom actually had the decency to show up and play like a turd when he was traded, but Fisher is way too good for that.