Wanted to talk HS baseball and love the traditional baseball powerhouse communities. Searched for Brenham, Woodlands, Bellaire, etc. Anyway ran across the 19-5A section and it peaked my curiosity.

Don't want to get too specific (you can look it up) in case there's nothing to it.

Anyone know anything that might be going on there?

Could you be a little more cryptic?

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Wanted to talk HS baseball and love the traditional baseball powerhouse communities. Searched for Brenham, Woodlands, Bellaire, etc. Anyway ran across the 19-5A section and it peaked my curiosity.

Don't want to get too specific (you can look it up) in case there's nothing to it.

Anyone know anything that might be going on there?

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Then talk

It appears that I am.

I make it a practice not to get on forums and get involved in the muck. As hard as I tried it appears I've jumped right in.

[Url] http://txhighschoolbaseball.com/forum/forum/4a-forum/15033-question-about-uil-and-hs-coach-power[/url]

I will tell you that is the arrangement\understanding I have about our baseball program (private school).

It is a little less overtly communicated, but you are left with certainty in the message.

AFAIK, you are not legally allowed to recruit or place players, but if they 'end up' there, that is just how it works out.

It is my guess with basketball and baseball there is a fine <dotted> line connecting many of these teams, players, schools and their parent's money.

I thought this was fairly common, and have no problem with it.

Not sure what the reason for this is other than to control players. Seems like priorities out of whack IMO.

My nephew plays in South Carolina and will play collegiately and that is exactly what his high school program did...

I wouldn't say that this isn't a big deal but I'm sure it goes on in many places.

A little different situation but, the Head football coach/AD at the high school I went to wouldn't allow you to play football if you played any baseball at all. This was 30 years ago, but we didn't even have a high school baseball team for that reason.

In general, I don't think there is anything wrong with a coach steering players to certain offseason programs. In the end, the best players should play when spring rolls around, but I can see making it clear that participating in such a program would give one a leg up.

But if that coach has any kind of financial interest in the offseason program, then it's flat-out unethical.

As a High school coach myself, I think I understand what the coach is doing but don't necessarily agree with it. The more your kids play together, the greater the benefit for your program. However, I don't like the idea of making them play with a particular organization in the summer. Many kids have played with the same organization for years and are comfortable where they are at, and some are better at getting their players schollies than others, so mandating where a kid plays outside of school time doesn't seem right. Playing during the fall season isn't a bad idea either, because that is more time for the kids to gel as a team instead of picking it up february 1st and trying to get rolling. Like I said, I don't necessarily agree with it but I understand his concept, and I'm not totally sure what the UIL says about it, never ran into that problem.
On my high school team, we all played with different teams in the summer, but in the fall we played together in tournaments, but that was not mandated by the coach. That was something we as a team decided to do.

When I was in high school guys were allowed to play on select teams in the off-season except for pitchers. We all had required fall and summer teams. Outside of the coach potentially benefiting financially this doesn't really seem like that big a deal to me.

I'm from Brenham...he just wants them to play together. It's not some grand scheme to make money through batter box. I would be very surprised if that place turned much of a profit. It's mainly there to give those guys a place to practice outside of the high school.

Have heard this as well and it's 100% against UIL rules. They are charging quite a bit of money as well so he is making money off his players.
Just another coach thinking he is above the rules. Forcing a kid to play with a select program is wrong.

Being from the area I have a bit o knowledge about the situation. I agree with the poster above that the Box isn't turning much of a profit and the brenham coach isn't forcing his kids to play there. That has been taken out of context. He is simply trying to get his kids to keep playing in the summer and the batters box happens to provide those services for the locals. Not to mention most of the better players from brenham and other towns play for the houston heat, kc chapman, bv renegades, etc..... I'm not a betting man but I bet if the coach had a kid who throws 90 and is left handed and the kid elects to play for a team from houston that coach would gladly welcome him to participate come spring time

This has simply been a case of some butt hurt parents twisting words because little billy isn't getting the playing time daddy thinks he should be getting

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I'm not a betting man but I bet if the coach had a kid who throws 90 and is left handed and the kid elects to play for a team from houston that coach would gladly welcome him to participate come spring time

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What if he isn't a 90's lefty? 1) It's against UIL rules either way. 2) You and your family have now been coerced by a community leader with threat of not playing in the spring. 3) Since when has it been appropriate for HS coaches to make choices for taxpayers/community members outside of his program?

Sounds like people are admitting the abuse of power and breaking of rules, but excusing it for the sake of the coach and community. Very scary.

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I'm not a betting man but I bet if the coach had a kid who throws 90 and is left handed and the kid elects to play for a team from houston that coach would gladly welcome him to participate come spring time

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What if he isn't a 90's lefty? 1) It's against UIL rules either way. 2) You and your family have now been coerced by a community leader with threat of not playing in the spring. 3) Since when has it been appropriate for HS coaches to make choices for taxpayers/community members outside of his program?

Sounds like people are admitting the abuse of power and breaking of rules, but excusing it for the sake of the coach and community. Very scary.

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Where did you grow up?

I was on our baseball team in HS, as a freshman. There were 3 fish. Coach was crystal clear... you miss practice, you don't play in the games. One of the freshman... I don't think he made it to a single practice. In fact, me and the other fish were surprised to see he was on the team, when he showed up to the 1st game... and he played. In fact, he showed up to most of the home games and played in all of the them, IIRC. Me and the other guy were at every practice, hazed as a freshman. He got 1 AB the entire season, and it was the final out of the season. I made it to the on-deck circle, right behind him that last game. It was a team that was well below .500.

Oh... did I mention the guy who got to play and never practiced... his dad was Principal of the HS. Coincidence?

My Sr year, I was behind a Sophomore whose daddy owned a sponsoring company. It wasn't until the guy had 3 Errors at 3B in one game that I went up to the coach and said, "You know, I could miss those balls as good as he did... I might even knock one down." He put me in to replace him. I ended up making All-District with every coach's vote except my own.

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I'm not a betting man but I bet if the coach had a kid who throws 90 and is left handed and the kid elects to play for a team from houston that coach would gladly welcome him to participate come spring time

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What if he isn't a 90's lefty? 1) It's against UIL rules either way. 2) You and your family have now been coerced by a community leader with threat of not playing in the spring. 3) Since when has it been appropriate for HS coaches to make choices for taxpayers/community members outside of his program?

Sounds like people are admitting the abuse of power and breaking of rules, but excusing it for the sake of the coach and community. Very scary.

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It is NOT against the UIL rules to suggest your players play for a certain team, and to give the info about off season baseball programs, etc. If it is every high school coach in TX would lose his job.

Once again this goes back to butt hurt daddies twisting words.

I'm sure he said something along the lines of "you need to play this summer because if you don't you probably wont play in the spring BECAUSE little johnny your teammate did play in the summer and he got better!"

Heck, most surrounding towns in the area I know for a fact have the high school coach get a players dad to "coach" a summer team and that team plays in the tr-county babe ruth baseball league. no different from what the batters box is doing.

Once again this goes back to butt hurt daddies twisting words. This is why youth/high school athletics is going downhill these days. Butt hurt daddies/helicopter parents crying foul over anything and everything that doesn't go their kids way

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I make it a practice not to get on forums and get involved in the muck. As hard as I tried it appears I've jumped right in.

[url=http://txhighschoolbaseball.com/forum/forum/4a-forum/15033-question-about-uil-and-hs-coach-power[/url]

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That's nothing new. Coaches did crap like that when I played back in the early 90's.

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I make it a practice not to get on forums and get involved in the muck. As hard as I tried it appears I've jumped right in.

[url=http://txhighschoolbaseball.com/forum/forum/4a-forum/15033-question-about-uil-and-hs-coach-power[/url]

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That's nothing new. Coaches did crap like that when I played back in the early 90's.

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select ball was NOTHING like it is now back in the early 90's. Was almost non existent.

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I make it a practice not to get on forums and get involved in the muck. As hard as I tried it appears I've jumped right in.

[url=http://txhighschoolbaseball.com/forum/forum/4a-forum/15033-question-about-uil-and-hs-coach-power[/url]

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That's nothing new. Coaches did crap like that when I played back in the early 90's.

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select ball was NOTHING like it is now back in the early 90's. Was almost non existent.

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correct, the majority of scouting happens on non-school affiliated summer and fall teams. it's not even close.

I don't think it's unethical at all. In fact, I think it's the right thing to do.

Its nonsense, and I think more coaches would agree me than don't agree.

High school coaches do not own their players. They are the player's coach when they are at school and playing for the high school team. That's it. Beyond that, their job is to, and only if they just see some really bad decision making or if invited to, help figure out what is best for the individual player.

I have a hard time imagining when giving an ultimatum that a player plays for a certain team in the off-season is the best for every individual player- and again, its not really the coach's job to stick his nose in that in the first place.

Even at the professional level team's do not assert that level of control, and they have millions invested players and managers, coaches, etc... employment is actually intimately tied to results. High school coaches who don't piss off their boosters or abuse their kids usually keep their jobs no matter the results.

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I'm not a betting man but I bet if the coach had a kid who throws 90 and is left handed and the kid elects to play for a team from houston that coach would gladly welcome him to participate come spring time

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What if he isn't a 90's lefty? 1) It's against UIL rules either way. 2) You and your family have now been coerced by a community leader with threat of not playing in the spring. 3) Since when has it been appropriate for HS coaches to make choices for taxpayers/community members outside of his program?

Sounds like people are admitting the abuse of power and breaking of rules, but excusing it for the sake of the coach and community. Very scary.

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It is NOT against the UIL rules to suggest your players play for a certain team, and to give the info about off season baseball programs, etc. If it is every high school coach in TX would lose his job.

Once again this goes back to butt hurt daddies twisting words.

I'm sure he said something along the lines of "you need to play this summer because if you don't you probably wont play in the spring BECAUSE little johnny your teammate did play in the summer and he got better!"

Heck, most surrounding towns in the area I know for a fact have the high school coach get a players dad to "coach" a summer team and that team plays in the tr-county babe ruth baseball league. no different from what the batters box is doing.

Once again this goes back to butt hurt daddies twisting words. This is why youth/high school athletics is going downhill these days. Butt hurt daddies/helicopter parents crying foul over anything and everything that doesn't go their kids way

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You know, as someone who grew up in high school and college athletic departments, I know "butt hurt daddies" are a real thing, but you know, I also know coaches can be *******s, coaches can over inflate their importance, coaches can misunderstand their jobs.

Coaches are capable of overstepping their bounds just as much, if not more, than parents are.

You sound terribly butthurt, yourself. It sounds like you don't know what was said, either, so just take it easy, man.

Are you a coach? Did your kid get passed up by another kid with a loudmouth father?

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Being from the area I have a bit o knowledge about the situation. I agree with the poster above that the Box isn't turning much of a profit and the brenham coach isn't forcing his kids to play there. That has been taken out of context. He is simply trying to get his kids to keep playing in the summer and the batters box happens to provide those services for the locals. Not to mention most of the better players from brenham and other towns play for the houston heat, kc chapman, bv renegades, etc..... I'm not a betting man but I bet if the coach had a kid who throws 90 and is left handed and the kid elects to play for a team from houston that coach would gladly welcome him to participate come spring time

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Where a guy plays shouldn't be the baseline for making decisions.

The thought process should never be "well, you're good enough so play wherever...the rest of you, you better play for this team otherwise you're not up for consideration."

1) That's a great way to hurt the talent level on your roster.

2) It teaches the wrong lessons to the kid with a 90 MPH fastball.

Let's flip the table. What if the Houston Heat coach decides he thinks Brenham doesn't do a great job developing their players, and maybe even teaches players bad habits. So, he "suggests" to his players they don't play for Brenham?

What would Lanny Williams up at Brenham HS think about that?

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Let's flip the table. What if the Houston Heat coach decides he thinks Brenham doesn't do a great job developing their players, and maybe even teaches players bad habits. So, he "suggests" to his players they don't play for Brenham?

What would Lanny Williams up at Brenham HS think about that?

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Let's flip the table on that....

What would the college coach think of this kid if he decided to not play high school ball for one of the best high school programs in the state because his summer ball coach doesn't want him too?

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Let's flip the table. What if the Houston Heat coach decides he thinks Brenham doesn't do a great job developing their players, and maybe even teaches players bad habits. So, he "suggests" to his players they don't play for Brenham?

What would Lanny Williams up at Brenham HS think about that?

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Let's flip the table on that....

What would the college coach think of this kid if he decided to not play high school ball for one of the best high school programs in the state because his summer ball coach doesn't want him too?

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1) Answer the question. Tit for tat.

2) Its hard to know, because some college coaches, for better or worse, give so few ****s about the high school season- which is part of why high school coaches often need to cool it on the overbearing shtick.

I think college coaches would question it, but would take a kid if he's good enough either way.

I think it'd be nonsense for a select coach to give that kind of ultimatum, but that's my point. Coaches- especially at the grade school level- don't need to be giving such ultimatums

(And they, by extension, don't need to be creating situations where certain players, because they're "good enough", are possibly going to get an exception from that ultimatum.)

I don't know if he gave the claimed ultimatum, or not, I'm responding to those who would have been OK with him doing so.

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What would the college coach think of this kid if he decided to not play high school ball for one of the best high school programs in the state because his summer ball coach doesn't want him too?

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That's the weird part, the high school coach is the only one guilty of this. There are no select coaches telling kids not to play for their high school.

For many of the kids, the fall is where they would get the most interest in terms of recruiting. It is the high school coach telling them that they can't play select ball in the fall.

It is interesting that you're defending a HS coach for something that you would have trouble accepting if a select coach did the same thing.

It is also strange that there are people on here that are ok with a government worker having this much control of a child and his baseball future. Disturbing.

Does anyone else but me see the irony in coaches that want to tip the scales back toward HS away from select mandating players do certain things or they won't play HS? At some point the players are going to go soccer on them and go full time select -- and not be harmed one bit by it (in terms of college and pro opportunities, at least). Maybe they wanted to play for their HS team but aren't willing to let someone force them into something that may not be in their best interest.

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It is interesting that you're defending a HS coach for something that you would have trouble accepting if a select coach did the same thing.

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I'm defending the high school coach because I don't believe for one second that he told his players to play for the batters box, or they won't play for the Brenham Cub baseball team. That's absurd. I do believe he encourages his players to play for the Batters Box though because they are local and give players the opportunity to get better. The ones he's encouraging them to play for the Batters Box are the players who DONT play for standout select teams out of CS or Houston. I'm sure he's just fine with his standout players playing for a better team against better competition. Somehow I have a feeling that this has all been turned into the coach saying "play for Batters Box, or you won't play for the Brenham Cubs"....Like I said earlier I have a huge feeling some butt hurt dad his taking his words and twisting them to make them seem like he is being unfair to little Johnny.
The Brenham coach could care less who his players play for in summer and fall ball, as long as they are ready to go come spring time and they win. which they are currently doing

Brenham plays Tomball Memorial this week in the playoffs