ehrmantraut said:

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No, you said "investing broadly in ETF's during a correction is not smart"

That's an idiotic statement. Which means you're an idiot for saying it.

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Threads on Ark ETFs genius. Go back to kicking the cat troll

If you want to get a broad base of high beta growth stocks to spread your risk out from any one stock, ARK is your jam.

But, when there is a broad correction amongst those stocks, it will suffer more because of the high beta. It also has a bit of a vicious cycle with withdrawals causing it to sell significant portions of daily float in some stocks, further depressing the price.

Just know your risks and invest accordingly.

*popcorn emoji*

aggiedaniel06 said:

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*popcorn emoji*

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I'm not risking actual money on it via puts because the premiums are crazy, but I bet ARKK goes below $100 by the end of April.

ebdb_bnb said:

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AggiEE said:

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NTXAg10 said:

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I like Cathy Wood.
My horizon is 20+ years away.
I'll continue investing in her funds.

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You'll continue to invest until her funds crash 80% and she closes up shop.

Doubtful she will last 5 years let alone 20

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4 of the 5 ETFs were created in Sept & Oct of 2014.

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Yes, and if she can't find more fools to buy her funds, she will close by default if they sell out enough

If she finds enough fools, she better close if she's being honest with them

Show me on the doll where Cathy touched you.

I'm in for a measly $20k currently. If she closes up shop then it's no big loss.

DubFalls said:

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aggiedaniel06 said:

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*popcorn emoji*

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I'm not risking actual money on it via puts because the premiums are crazy, but I bet ARKK goes below $100 by the end of April.

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End of April?

It's been consistently losing 3-5% per day.

If it continues that, and I don't see any reason it won't.... it'll be sub $100 by the end of this WEEK.

NTXAg10 said:

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Show me on the doll where Cathy touched you.

I'm in for a measly $20k currently. If she closes up shop then it's no big loss.

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Fair enough. No problem having it in a play money account with a small percentage of your portfolio. A lot of people seem to be YOLO'ing a signification portion into it though.

ARKK up bigly today! Shouldve bought more.

Except that's not the way it works

You know the funds have been around for more than a year right? CNBS seems to not know this.

She's not closing shop.

That's not how etfs work.

She doesn't have to manage fund flows. That's up to market makers who create or redeem shares.

She manages the portfolio with zero regard to fund flows. That's the beauty of the etf wrapper.

I know. I was playing along with EEs fantasy.

FunkyKO said:

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That's not how etfs work.

She doesn't have to manage fund flows. That's up to market makers who create or redeem shares.

She manages the portfolio with zero regard to fund flows. That's the beauty of the etf wrapper.

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Man, I really wanted to dispute this, but thankfully I remembered I'm a moron.

Thanks for posting - this made me go out and learn something.

For dummies like me, read this section: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exchange-traded_fund#Arbitrage

Edit to add... after learning this, it makes total sense why brokerages would want to eliminate commissions and get people trading like crazy (literally).

its a very slick method of active management.

traditional mutual funds have to be wary of fund flows....need to have cash on hand for redemptions.

ETF wrapper, the fund manager simply manages the portfolio with no regard to fund flows...allows them the freedom to truly manage the portfolio.

This is why Jim Cramer looked like a fool the other day when he said "close the fund". you can't close an etf to new investors like traditional mutual funds or hedge funds, nor can you limit redemption period or schedule. and the inflows or outflows really have no influence on the fund manager and their mgmt style. they post the trades they make and the market makers/authorized participants follow the same investment allocation.

really slick.

great wiki link by the way.

4th edit. see how the big index ETFs like SPY, VTI, IVV, VOO, QQQ etc....the big ones, see how this makes them more efficient and harder to beat by active managers, they don't have fund flows to contend with. Thats up to the market makers/participants.

my bad.

FunkyKO said:

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That's not how etfs work.

She doesn't have to manage fund flows. That's up to market makers who create or redeem shares.

She manages the portfolio with zero regard to fund flows. That's the beauty of the etf wrapper.

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You missed my point completely.

There's nothing preventing an ETF from being closed, it happens all the time.

Happen yes, All the time, not really.


The reasons etfs close, No interest, no assets.

quite while you're behind my friend.

Diggity said:

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quite while you're behind my friend.

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This is my advice for the Ark evangelists

You know she ran portfolios/funds/private accounts before ark invest right?

FunkyKO said:

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You know she ran portfolios/funds/private accounts before ark invest right?

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Yep. Did it for a very long time and wasn't particularly good at it like most active fund managers that have you believe otherwise. No reason to believe the ARK funds will be any different.

You're high. The three year and 5 year are annualized. Which index should I compare her incompetence to?

Ask yourself what the macroeconomic drivers are that will mitigate the hyperinflation we are about to experience for spending everything Treasury prints plus. We have a bubble about to burst and who will buy the 10 treasuries without yields continuing to rise? If you've never seen a bear market you are in for a surprise. Broadly investing in an aggressive growth ETF while growth stocks are not receiving institutional support is a recipe for ruin as the correction turns into a bear market. Caution is called for here.

True. Long duration growth technically does not like rising rates.

However look at at last three Interest rate situations and returns 12 months after said event leads to some interesting results.

For example. Taper tantrum. And 12 months after.

TheGroupGuy said:

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Ask yourself what the macroeconomic drivers are that will mitigate the hyperinflation we are about to experience for spending everything Treasury prints plus. We have a bubble about to burst and who will buy the 10 treasuries without yields continuing to rise? If you've never seen a bear market you are in for a surprise. Broadly investing in an aggressive growth ETF while growth stocks are not receiving institutional support is a recipe for ruin as the correction turns into a bear market. Caution is called for here.

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I think you're overestimating potential inflation in the short term. I agree completely about the reckless management of the US dollar and the eventual impact of that but for quite a few years now we've been in the business of exporting our inflation and that's going to continue for the foreseeable future. The global economy is going to experience a significant amount of restructuring in the next decade but until that's mostly completed we're going to continue to see the Fed be able to manage the official inflation numbers and keep treasury yields under control. This is one of the perks of being the global reserve currency and that status isn't changing in the foreseeable future either.

LOYAL AG said:

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TheGroupGuy said:

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Ask yourself what the macroeconomic drivers are that will mitigate the hyperinflation we are about to experience for spending everything Treasury prints plus. We have a bubble about to burst and who will buy the 10 treasuries without yields continuing to rise? If you've never seen a bear market you are in for a surprise. Broadly investing in an aggressive growth ETF while growth stocks are not receiving institutional support is a recipe for ruin as the correction turns into a bear market. Caution is called for here.

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I think you're overestimating potential inflation in the short term. I agree completely about the reckless management of the US dollar and the eventual impact of that but for quite a few years now we've been in the business of exporting our inflation and that's going to continue for the foreseeable future. The global economy is going to experience a significant amount of restructuring in the next decade but until that's mostly completed we're going to continue to see the Fed be able to manage the official inflation numbers and keep treasury yields under control. This is one of the perks of being the global reserve currency and that status isn't changing in the foreseeable future either.

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I think you are ignoring the Nasdaq tanking every time 10T yields rise north of 1.5%. Bloomberg attributed positive moves in the NASDAQ today to shorts covering their positions and despite a $1.9B stimulus passing the house today the NASDAQ finished red. All this bodes poorly for Ark funds. I wish I was wrong. Crypto is not exploding in price because your theory is correct. Consider...

Not necessarily. What were rates at in 2016. How did the q's or Arkk perform then. Just cause rates go up is not an automatic negative for growth

But seriously, a rising gap between the 30 year and 2 year treasury will lower the price of ARKK considerably.

It's gonna be allllllright

FunkyKO said:

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Not necessarily. What were rates at in 2016. How did the q's or Arkk perform then. Just cause rates go up is not an automatic negative for growth

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I'm talking about treasury 10 yr yields going up. When all the positive moves on Nasdaq are attributed to shorts covering this week and with more shorting in the future it's going to be difficult to earn a return especially from a basket or index. Targeted single stocks yes. Oh and sleepy joe is bout to announce his infrastructure plan plus his cure for cancer plans so there is him in office spending like a demented man with a democratic house and senate vs Trump in 2016 as a variable too