First House Down Payment

9,287 Views | 73 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by Redstone
Michael Cera Palin
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I grew up in the suburbs, I know why people live there. Just saying I hated every second of it as a kid and have made every effort over the last 9 years of my life to position myself so I can escape it with an employer I like, doing meaningful work in my field, and in a location that I enjoy.

If I had to deal with the daily commute and BS that people put up with in DFW, Houston, and Austin I know I would blow my brains out. Even BCS has become too crowded for me. Just the way I am.
MAS444
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I'd say try living (and working) a little before you take such extreme positions. Good for you for having it all figured out at such a young age (or at least thinking you do) ...but life sometimes happens and has different plans. But go get em!
12thMan9
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txaggieacct85 said:

OldArmyCT said:

A lot of people will tell you to get a 15 year mortgage instead of a 30. Don't. Get the 30 and overpay monthly like it's a 15 if you want but if your finances change you can easily lower you mortgage payment. If you're in a 15 you have that payment and may have trouble re-fi'ing into a 30.
in 1990 we bought a house and assumed a loan (cant do that now). Assuming cut a lot of closing cost.

Anyway it was an 8.5% 30 year mortgage that escalated to 9.5 then 10.5.

I refinanced a few years later to a 15 year 7% mortgage.

A few more years later to a 15% 6% mortgage.

Then sold the property in 1999 and didnt get have much gain since prices were basically flat back then.

I bought a new house in 1999 for $240,000 and I live in that house now.

I paid my mortgage off in I think 2006 and haven't owed a bank a penny since then.


And all that dead money in your house is earning.... ?

Think of the income you're missing by not using those funds to generate income for you & your family.
Ronnie '88
txaggieacct85
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Huh? I've made over $1 million in the stock market in the last five years
txaggieacct85
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That sounds pretty extreme. I learned a lot listening to the radio on my commute. Or reading a book when I rode the bus to downtown . I worked for KPMG at the time and had two consulting clients in downtown.
txaggieacct85
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Actually I have family mortgages for two of my kids.

They both got around 3% rates

https://www.irs.gov/applicable-federal-rates
2%er/New Army
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12thMan9 said:

txaggieacct85 said:

OldArmyCT said:

A lot of people will tell you to get a 15 year mortgage instead of a 30. Don't. Get the 30 and overpay monthly like it's a 15 if you want but if your finances change you can easily lower you mortgage payment. If you're in a 15 you have that payment and may have trouble re-fi'ing into a 30.
in 1990 we bought a house and assumed a loan (cant do that now). Assuming cut a lot of closing cost.

Anyway it was an 8.5% 30 year mortgage that escalated to 9.5 then 10.5.

I refinanced a few years later to a 15 year 7% mortgage.

A few more years later to a 15% 6% mortgage.

Then sold the property in 1999 and didnt get have much gain since prices were basically flat back then.

I bought a new house in 1999 for $240,000 and I live in that house now.

I paid my mortgage off in I think 2006 and haven't owed a bank a penny since then.


And all that dead money in your house is earning.... ?

Think of the income you're missing by not using those funds to generate income for you & your family.


Wouldn't bother trying to discuss anything with that poster. He has it all figured out, haven't you gathered that by this thread?
JCRiley09
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We got paid to buy or first home. Only one of us filed for the Home Sweet Texas grant instead of filing jointly and we were approved. It was free money. We had a slightly higher than average interest rate, but this wasn't a forever home, so that was fine. We walked away from closing with $3000 more than when we started the home buying process.

So look for any first time homebuyer down payment assistance opportunities.
12thMan9
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2%er/New Army said:

12thMan9 said:

txaggieacct85 said:

OldArmyCT said:

A lot of people will tell you to get a 15 year mortgage instead of a 30. Don't. Get the 30 and overpay monthly like it's a 15 if you want but if your finances change you can easily lower you mortgage payment. If you're in a 15 you have that payment and may have trouble re-fi'ing into a 30.
in 1990 we bought a house and assumed a loan (cant do that now). Assuming cut a lot of closing cost.

Anyway it was an 8.5% 30 year mortgage that escalated to 9.5 then 10.5.

I refinanced a few years later to a 15 year 7% mortgage.

A few more years later to a 15% 6% mortgage.

Then sold the property in 1999 and didnt get have much gain since prices were basically flat back then.

I bought a new house in 1999 for $240,000 and I live in that house now.

I paid my mortgage off in I think 2006 and haven't owed a bank a penny since then.


And all that dead money in your house is earning.... ?

Think of the income you're missing by not using those funds to generate income for you & your family.


Wouldn't bother trying to discuss anything with that poster. He has it all figured out, haven't you gathered that by this thread?
Oh, yes. Saw it some time back. He's quite the enabler. More power to him.
Ronnie '88
Buck Compton
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Michael Cera Palin said:

jaggiemaggie said:

You have the rest of your lives to play house to deal with property taxes, HVAC, water heaters and all the crap that comes with being a homeowner. Buy one of these and travel make memories



We actually have our feet in the door at an employer located remotely in the mountains so all of that will be right next door. No offense to 99% of TexAgs posters, but the Texas suburban life sucks and we've set ourselves up to get out of it ASAP.
Wait, "we" have our feet in the door? You're going to work at the same company in the mountains?

No way that could ever go wrong.
txaggieacct85
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Michael Cera Palin said:

I grew up in the suburbs, I know why people live there. Just saying I hated every second of it as a kid and have made every effort over the last 9 years of my life to position myself so I can escape it with an employer I like, doing meaningful work in my field, and in a location that I enjoy.

If I had to deal with the daily commute and BS that people put up with in DFW, Houston, and Austin I know I would blow my brains out. Even BCS has become too crowded for me. Just the way I am.
" I hated every second of it as a kid"
" I know I would blow my brains out"

I assume you're exaggerating or there's something going on here other than just the suburbs.
txaggieacct85
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2%er/New Army said:

12thMan9 said:

txaggieacct85 said:

OldArmyCT said:

A lot of people will tell you to get a 15 year mortgage instead of a 30. Don't. Get the 30 and overpay monthly like it's a 15 if you want but if your finances change you can easily lower you mortgage payment. If you're in a 15 you have that payment and may have trouble re-fi'ing into a 30.
in 1990 we bought a house and assumed a loan (cant do that now). Assuming cut a lot of closing cost.

Anyway it was an 8.5% 30 year mortgage that escalated to 9.5 then 10.5.

I refinanced a few years later to a 15 year 7% mortgage.

A few more years later to a 15% 6% mortgage.

Then sold the property in 1999 and didnt get have much gain since prices were basically flat back then.

I bought a new house in 1999 for $240,000 and I live in that house now.

I paid my mortgage off in I think 2006 and haven't owed a bank a penny since then.


And all that dead money in your house is earning.... ?

Think of the income you're missing by not using those funds to generate income for you & your family.


Wouldn't bother trying to discuss anything with that poster. He has it all figured out, haven't you gathered that by this thread?
and you seem to have it figured out SA.

I've been debt free for a long time. it's not dead money. you think saving on paying interest to a bank is dead money. And with the money I would be paying on a mortgage I saved and make a lot of money with my business in the last six or seven years and made over $1 million in gains in my investments,

So maybe I do have it "figured out"
txaggieacct85
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JCRiley09 said:

We got paid to buy or first home. Only one of us filed for the Home Sweet Texas grant instead of filing jointly and we were approved. It was free money. We had a slightly higher than average interest rate, but this wasn't a forever home, so that was fine. We walked away from closing with $3000 more than when we started the home buying process.

So look for any first time homebuyer down payment assistance opportunities.
"It was free money"

free to you, but someone paid for it.
Aggie09Derek
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txaggieacct85 said:

Huh? I've made over $1 million in the stock market in the last five years


Was it 5 years or 6 or 7 like stated further down?

Michael Cera Palin
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Hey everyone, first I would like to reiterate what I said on the first page which is thank you for all the great advice. There are some amazing responses here with great advice for any couple both financial and personal.

Second, re-reading my posts (and the subsequent replies) I realize my comments and my exaggerations came off way way differently than I was intending. I wasn't trying to judge others, or act like I know it all. Regardless, I came off looking like an ass and I own up to that and apologize.

We have some opportunities in front of us we have worked very hard for and are both very excited about. They also happen to align with what we currently think we want out of life. I realize life may slap us in the face between now and then, or we chase those opportunities and realize they weren't really what we wanted. Because of that I am very grateful to the many posters who advised we take it slow, watch the market, don't jump into a house right away, don't buy the max you're approved for, and life doesn't always work out the way you think it will.

Anyway, I felt I needed to address that I didn't present myself in the best way and apologize.

Again, thanks to everyone for the great advice.
MAS444
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You're doing a hell of a lot more good financial analysis/planning than I probably was at (what I assume is your) your age. I did have a hell of a lot of fun though. It's good to do both, though, especially before kids, you get the olds, etc. Good luck!
JCRiley09
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I appreciate y'all!
txaggieacct85
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Aggie09Derek said:

txaggieacct85 said:

Huh? I've made over $1 million in the stock market in the last five years


Was it 5 years or 6 or 7 like stated further down?


ok let me clear it up for you.

Realized gains

2017 $5,124
2018 $32,605
2019 $626,891
2020 $98,779
2021 $995,195
2022 (363,436)

If I typed everything correctly, it totals 1,395,158 in realized gains.

And I just counted here that's six years.

Hope that helps.
BoDog
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Lately I am starting to come to the realization that owning a home-especially in Texas may be overrated. I own a total of five homes. One I live in, one I vacation in (out of state), and 3 rentals all in DFW.

When I put pen to paper and add up property taxes (that are higher than hell), insurance, maintenance costs, landscaping, HOA, etc etc I really dont think the juice is worth the squeeze.

I get the appreciation argument and if I cashed out I would make a **** ton on that alone-but if you trade up and I think many on here do, you lose a ton of said appreciation in realtor fees/transaction cost.

Does anyone else feel this way or am I being an idiot?

TIA
Aggie09Derek
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You were the one that stated two different timelines…

I didn't need "help"
Aggie09Derek
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Also…would love to see what you sold in 2021

Was it something had unrealized forever and finally sold or something that appreciated like crazy that year.
MAS444
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I'm curious about that too. Have several properties and am thinking about acquiring another rental...but wondering if the math truly works vs. just putting money in market. I guess one very important variable is how much the rental properties will appreciate over the next 10 - 15 - 20 years.
htxag09
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No you aren't alone in feeling that way or an idiot.

I'd say the rentals are a different game and if the rent is covering all your costs, including taxes, you're just sitting on a good investment at worst.

But for the primary residences I kind of agree. I disagree in the sense of what's the other option? To rent? If you're renting you'll still be paying those costs.

But 100% agree on the costs of moving and upgrading. Closing fees, moving costs, and furniture all add up and will eat into a lot of equity built up. Not to mention the house you're buying likely increased just as much, if not more, in value. So are you truly gaining anything?
BoDog
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Thats kind of my point. I didnt even mention the headaches and time that go along with it. When all my kids graduate HS I am going to seriously consider cashing out of everything and finding a great deal on a long term rental where if something breaks I dont have to lift a finger.
txaggieacct85
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Aggie09Derek said:

Also…would love to see what you sold in 2021

Was it something had unrealized forever and finally sold or something that appreciated like crazy that year.

Both.

but an example is I made $147,269.61 on NVDA and it was a series of trades that included both long term and short term gains.

Most of it was a purchase I made on 5/4/2020.

Also made $110,969.86 on AAPL that I mostly bought on 3/13/2020.

Also made $84,601.85 on AMZN but purchases spread out from 6/23/17 to 7/20/21

Also made $53,831.21 on GS that I bought on 5/3/2019, 10/20/19 and 3/30/20

This is just a sampling. I buy and sell stocks a lot and of course there were some losses in there.

I currently don't own NVDA, a little AAPL, a little AMZN, and don't own GS.

One of my best investments over the years has been BRK.B. I also once own 2 shares of BRK.A.



P.S.

I loaned a total of $650,000 to two of my kids for a purchase of a first home.

These purchases were in the summer of 2019 and last summer.

I saved some losses in the stock market by pulling money out in 2022 to loan my son money to buy his house. He paid $400,000 for it.

I did a family loan according to IRS rules and so I only make about 3% on their loans, but It makes me feel good that they are not paying a bank and I didn't charge them for PMI and their closing costs were minimal with no bank involved.
AnyOtherName
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Bought first home 2 years ago.

Put ~5% down (25k ish)
PMI is like $86 a month
Interest rate is sub 3% so we didn't feel the need to put more (honestly wanted to have more for emergency fund, renos)

Obviously, no regrets as the timing couldn't have been any better for us. But if we waited to put 20% down we probably wouldn't have bought and our scenario would have been night and day different.

Sounds like you are already on the right track of thinking about everything. Good luck
Tex117
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Howdy Dammit said:

Robinhood is currently offering 4% interest on uninvested money. Might be something to look at.

As far as the house. My wife and I purchased our first home in the 2021 craziness. We were only able to comfortably put down 15%, although I really did want 20. However, PMI is cheaper than I thought. Think we pay 118/month. A few things to note.

1. Our monthly payment was at 25% of my gross pay. This made things very tight since I fully fund my retirement.
2. I'm a couple raises down the road, so being strapped for one year wasn't the worst thing.
3. Furnishing is more expensive than I thought. Was another small down payment.
4. Our house was new, but something always breaks or is needed for the home. Seriously. Every single month we buy or fix something. Didn't anticipate that coming from an apartment.
5. A home is not the investment I thought it was. If you're buying just so you don't miss out, don't. Buy because you wanna be somewhere a minimum of 5 years.
6. Make sure you know what your wife is doing after a baby. Don't buy a house that needs both incomes. Seen several women think they will continue to work, and post baby realize they want to stay home, but can't because of the payment.

Goodluck!
This is one of the most reasonable posts regarding home ownership for normal people that I've ever read on TexAgs.

Nice work.

Quote:


But for the primary residences I kind of agree. I disagree in the sense of what's the other option? To rent? If you're renting you'll still be paying those costs.


Depends on alot.
Ag13
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This is the absolute perfect B&I thread
harleyds2
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The problem with this thought is discipline. Though i agree with your statement. I'm a retired bank president and for every person that said they were going the route of getting a 30 and paying like it is a fifteen year mortgage and failed to do it would blow your mind. They don't have the discipline and decide they like the extra money instead
AggieT
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htxag09 said:

I mean buying, selling, and moving to 3 houses in 10-15 years has a cost to it as well.

I'm not saying to overextend. But if you're young, don't have a lot of responsibilities (like kids, debt, etc.) and are comfortable with your realistic potential career progression, buying a little more house isn't the worst thing in the world.

I sometimes kick myself for being so conservative when we bought our house. We love it, have been here for 11 years now, and the low mortgage has been a blessing. But if we would have pushed the budget a little to get into a more desirable neighborhood the appreciation would have been significantly more. Like sitting on an extra $200k right now if we pushed the budget by $50k.

And that extra $50k was nowhere near the max of what we were pre-approved for. Plus, within a couple years after buying, my income had more than doubled. So we would have never been house poor.

Obviously, this has risks, like losing a job, an unforeseen pandemic, etc. But there's more than one side to every situation.
This. We bought when we were first married and didn't have much money. I was working, and my wife was just starting her law career. We bought a 1950's small "starter home" in the city which cost more than either of the homes we grew up in. We're both fairly conservative, and chose not to spend more. I wish we had spent double.

That said, we're still here, don't even notice the mortgage, and never worry about money. The only time in 15 years we have argued over money was when we tried to setup a budget... so we don't do that anymore.
Fredd
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I put down the 20% number on a home 4 years out of college. 30-35% of your net worth in your home/real estate is a good goal to keep when you're young. Keep all the other powder in wise investments.

Some people like to brag about having their house paid off: those people may feel better, but are missing out on higher upside of the market or other investments.
htxag09
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Fredd said:

I put down the 20% number on a home 4 years out of college. 30-35% of your net worth in your home/real estate is a good goal to keep when you're young. Keep all the other powder in wise investments.

Some people like to brag about having their house paid off: those people may feel better, but are missing out on higher upside of the market or other investments.

This is a pretty broad statement. I agree with low interest rates it doesn't make as much sense to aggressively pay of your mortgage.

However, someone who's lived in their home for 30 years, has it paid off, and directly rolled over all that cash into investments going forward, is going to be an infinitely better position than someone who keeps rolling over equity into an upgraded house purchase every 5 years.
Fredd
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htxag09 said:

Fredd said:

I put down the 20% number on a home 4 years out of college. 30-35% of your net worth in your home/real estate is a good goal to keep when you're young. Keep all the other powder in wise investments.

Some people like to brag about having their house paid off: those people may feel better, but are missing out on higher upside of the market or other investments.

This is a pretty broad statement. I agree with low interest rates it doesn't make as much sense to aggressively pay of your mortgage.

However, someone who's lived in their home for 30 years, has it paid off, and directly rolled over all that cash into investments going forward, is going to be an infinitely better position than someone who keeps rolling over equity into an upgraded house purchase every 5 years.


Did I say anything about upgrading your house every five years?
htxag09
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You did not. I was simply pointing out the broadness of your comment. You stated "Some people like to brag about having their house paid off: those people may feel better, but are missing out on higher upside of the market or other investments."

I'd argue many people, maybe the majority, take that statement and accept they'll have a mortgage the rest of their life. Because of your statement, they don't think having a mortgage forever is a bad thing. So why not just upgrade with that equity I have every 5 years? I mean it's only turning a 25 year note back into a 30 year….

I think we do have similar thoughts on this. Just arguing semantics as this is a message board.

I'm just pointing out that in a lot of cases not having a mortgage is a good thing. And everyone who's mortgageless isn't necessarily missing out. Honestly, most who own their home outright are probably pretty financially savvy so they're probably capitalizing.
The Lost
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Michael Cera Palin said:

jaggiemaggie said:

You have the rest of your lives to play house to deal with property taxes, HVAC, water heaters and all the crap that comes with being a homeowner. Buy one of these and travel make memories



We actually have our feet in the door at an employer located remotely in the mountains so all of that will be right next door. No offense to 99% of TexAgs posters, but the Texas suburban life sucks and we've set ourselves up to get out of it ASAP.


Lol at trying to get them divorced in the first year. Downtown apartment is way better idea. Most people can't live van life.
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