Fed meeting.

4,838 Views | 30 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by Captain Pablo
BTHOB-98
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Here is what I think the Fed will do.

Quarter-point rate increase. The Fed statement "were less certain about increases." Markets going to love that.

Fed officials' will give projections for unemployment, inflation, and where rate are headed. I still think they have no ****ing clue or they are lying.

Powell's post-meeting news conference will leave people completely confused not knowing whether another rate hike is coming or not. Market is in the crapper the rest of the week.
txaggieacct85
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'experts' polled said a 90% chance it will be a quarter point. so you're saying nothing surpising here.
Big Baccala
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Quarter-point is likely. Interested to see if he says that a pause may come in to play as the banking issues are likely to put a damper on the economy as banks tighten lending.
500,000ags
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25bps + wait and see = we have no clue
BTHOB-98
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500,000ags said:

25bps + wait and see = we have no clue


This is exactly my point. The worst part of all this is we don't need to raise interest rates anymore. We need to curb spending.
Wrighty
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500,000ags
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I agree, and why Fed bashing is over played right now IMO. Congress and POTUS flooded trillions into the economy the last 3-4 years and the Fed is trying to do something to reign in inflation. The Fed's real mistake was trying to do it too fast and not ensuring regional banks had liquidity.
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Ag CPA
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This press conference is going to be a circus.
strbrst777
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I'll bash Jerome Powell. I question his competence. Fed under his chairmanship lowered interest rates to absurdly low rates. Did he think this made sense, or was he going along with Biden politics? Same for Secy of Treas Janet Yellen. I have no confidence in or respect for Biden, Powell or Yellen. Re bank failures, where was the oversight? Where were the regulators and examiners? Where was the SEC? Total failure by government!
rathAG05
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500,000ags said:

I agree, and why Fed bashing is over played right now IMO. Congress and POTUS flooded trillions into the economy the last 3-4 years and the Fed is trying to do something to reign in inflation. The Fed's real mistake was trying to do it too fast and not ensuring regional banks had liquidity.


The Feds real mistake was waiting a year before raising rates. They waited way to damn long and the market got way out in front of itself.
rathAG05
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strbrst777 said:

I'll bash Jerome Powell. I question his competence. Fed under his chairmanship lowered interest rates to absurdly low rates. Did he think this made sense, or was he going along with Biden politics? Same for Secy of Treas Janet Yellen. I have no confidence in or respect for Biden, Powell or Yellen. Re bank failures, where was the oversight? Where were the regulators and examiners? Where was the SEC? Total failure by government!


Powell isn't terrible. Janet Yellen is an idiot and everyone except her knows it. She is Bidens pick and it comes as no surprise that she sucks at her job.
cgh1999
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500,000ags said:

I agree, and why Fed bashing is over played right now IMO. Congress and POTUS flooded trillions into the economy the last 3-4 years and the Fed is trying to do something to reign in inflation. The Fed's real mistake was trying to do it too fast and not ensuring regional banks had liquidity.

By removing $500B from money supply, they ensured the banks wouldn't have liquidity.
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AggieMainland
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Rates should have gone up pre covid. Everyone was too scared to give any bad news.
rathAG05
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ac04 said:

powell is also biden's pick and he is completely incompetent.


Low rates started way before Powell. M2 money supply is the problem and we haven't even really began to tackle that yet. I do think we need to pause on rates. Our economy became addicted to free money and pushing rates to 5% in less than 18 months is hard to digest. I feel as though inflation is going to continue to fall as we go into a recession. We also have a congress that doesn't have the stones to do what it takes to tackle our budget deficit.

It's not just Powell, our Government leaders in general are pretty incompetent. Providing a credit line to banks with hardly any fees or penalties? At some point, we are going to have to feel the pain. They just keep delaying the inevitable. Sound monetary policy and a LT plan is our only way out of this.
cgh1999
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rathAG05 said:

ac04 said:

powell is also biden's pick and he is completely incompetent.


Low rates started way before Powell. M2 money supply is the problem and we haven't even really began to tackle that yet. I do think we need to pause on rates. Our economy became addicted to free money and pushing rates to 5% in less than 18 months is hard to digest. I feel as though inflation is going to continue to fall as we go into a recession. We also have a congress that doesn't have the stones to do what it takes to tackle our budget deficit.

It's not just Powell, our Government leaders in general are pretty incompetent. Providing a credit line to banks with hardly any fees or penalties? At some point, we are going to have to feel the pain. They just keep delaying the inevitable. Sound monetary policy and a LT plan is our only way out of this.

It took 40 years to get this fat. We can't solve the problem overnight. But we definitely won't solve it if the government refuses to balance a budget.
jamey
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I don't understand why our government spends like a teenager being dropped off at the mall with their first credit card and no advice, no rules, nothing

Every adult either learns sound financial restraint or suffers consequences. I guess politicians suffer re-election
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Gordo14
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rathAG05 said:

500,000ags said:

I agree, and why Fed bashing is over played right now IMO. Congress and POTUS flooded trillions into the economy the last 3-4 years and the Fed is trying to do something to reign in inflation. The Fed's real mistake was trying to do it too fast and not ensuring regional banks had liquidity.


The Feds real mistake was waiting a year before raising rates. They waited way to damn long and the market got way out in front of itself.


Sure, but I think it's more complicated than that. Does the Fed raise rates or do they follow market trends for short term treasury bonds. What I mean is that short term yields were trading like inflation was transitory too at the beginning and I doubt the Fed wanted to raise rates and create a disconnect between short term yields and the Fed Funds rate. As soon as the treasury yields started rising, the Fed Funds rate started following. Are interest rates market driven or policy driven? I would argue they are market driven and the Fed is simply formalizing the process by following the market. If the 6 month T-bill was still yielding 2%, I would bet money that the Fed wouldn't have 5% interest rates.
Ag CPA
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ac04 said:

powell is also biden's pick and he is completely incompetent.
Trump picked him.
LOYAL AG
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There won't be a balanced budget for at least two decades so give up on that. The current national debt is roughly equal to total entitlement spending since 1965 and the demand for entitlements is only going to grow as the boomers transition into retirement. Their mass retirement is also going to drive up labor cost because they are significantly bigger than Gen Z which is replacing them in the workforce.

I'm by no means defending the Fed or the politicians but much of this is structural and way beyond their control. Worse still the things they can control you can rest assured they'll **** up. This push towards green energy and EV is simply not possible in the timeframe they want it done and that's going to cause a lot more pain and inflation than we're already going to see.

The world is changing and we don't have a roadmap for it. Now add to that the abject morons we like to elect and you can be certain this isn't going to go well.
The federal government was never meant to be this powerful.
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YouBet
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LOYAL AG said:

There won't be a balanced budget for at least two decades so give up on that. The current national debt is roughly equal to total entitlement spending since 1965 and the demand for entitlements is only going to grow as the boomers transition into retirement. Their mass retirement is also going to drive up labor cost because they are significantly bigger than Gen Z which is replacing them in the workforce.

I'm by no means defending the Fed or the politicians but much of this is structural and way beyond their control. Worse still the things they can control you can rest assured they'll **** up. This push towards green energy and EV is simply not possible in the timeframe they want it done and that's going to cause a lot more pain and inflation than we're already going to see.

The world is changing and we don't have a roadmap for it. Now add to that the abject morons we like to elect and you can be certain this isn't going to go well.
This. Frankly, there is nothing Powell can do at this point. No one in his position can. Our debt is so high and our fundamentals are so out of whack at this point that we are in unchartered waters. At this point, monetary policy is analogous to squeezing a water balloon. Whatever he does (raise or lower) he will break something critical. You literally just saw this with the bank crisis.

I've seen some make the comment "We need a Volcker!". Yeah, he was dealing with $3T in debt. We are 1,000% higher than that just 40 years later. Volcker would be in same spot that Powell is.

Agree that Yellen is incompetent as others have said. She advertised this during her confirmation hearings. She has no business being in that position so she's a net negative to this process.
LOYAL AG
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YouBet said:

LOYAL AG said:

There won't be a balanced budget for at least two decades so give up on that. The current national debt is roughly equal to total entitlement spending since 1965 and the demand for entitlements is only going to grow as the boomers transition into retirement. Their mass retirement is also going to drive up labor cost because they are significantly bigger than Gen Z which is replacing them in the workforce.

I'm by no means defending the Fed or the politicians but much of this is structural and way beyond their control. Worse still the things they can control you can rest assured they'll **** up. This push towards green energy and EV is simply not possible in the timeframe they want it done and that's going to cause a lot more pain and inflation than we're already going to see.

The world is changing and we don't have a roadmap for it. Now add to that the abject morons we like to elect and you can be certain this isn't going to go well.
This. Frankly, there is nothing Powell can do at this point. No one in his position can. Our debt is so high and our fundamentals are so out of whack at this point that we are in unchartered waters. At this point, monetary policy is analogous to squeezing a water balloon. Whatever he does (raise or lower) he will break something critical. You literally just saw this with the bank crisis.

I've seen some make the comment "We need a Volcker!". Yeah, he was dealing with $3T in debt. We are 1,000% higher than that just 40 years later. Volcker would be in same spot that Powell is.

Agree that Yellen is incompetent as others have said. She advertised this during her confirmation hearings. She has no business being in that position so she's a net negative to this process.


All of this is correct but what I was referring to when I said structural problems is actually peak population which is very nearly here. For all of recorded history population growth has been the primary driver of economic growth. We don't have an era in history with sustained growth that doesn't feature population growth.

We're currently at 8b people and I'd guess the peak is 8.5b before it plateaus then falls off for the rest of our lives. China alone assures we won't see growth when you realize their population in 2050 will be half what it is today. There is no other region that is big enough to generate 700m to replace those people never mind additional hundreds of millions to generate meaningful growth.

Now realize that most of Europe is stagnant and on the verge of similar population reductions, the US is more or less at its peak with our largest generation half way into retirement, Russia is in a similar spot to China, Japan has already peaked, Africa is far too unreliable from a food production perspective and South and Central America are stable at best. India appears to still be growing so that will slow down the decline but they alone can't stop this. There is no other part of the world that is going to generate meaningful population growth and current birth rates are far too low to reverse these trend. Global population is going to start shrinking and it won't stop for decades.

For all the fear of AI replacing humans at the workplace we're going to need significant amounts of automation just to staff the workplace as it exists today. 20 years from now we will have fewer people working than we have today, that's already known.

This is the time bomb we aren't discussing and maybe we don't need to since there isn't a solution. Globalization created the greatest era of peace and prosperity in human history but it also crashed birth rates which appears to be leading to the end of globalization and my guess is the other side of this will see us make up for all the peace and prosperity of the past 80 years with violence and famine.
The federal government was never meant to be this powerful.
500,000ags
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We are back to needing a war-time Fed Chair, someone call up ol' Ben B. See if he's available.
YouBet
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LOYAL AG said:

YouBet said:

LOYAL AG said:

There won't be a balanced budget for at least two decades so give up on that. The current national debt is roughly equal to total entitlement spending since 1965 and the demand for entitlements is only going to grow as the boomers transition into retirement. Their mass retirement is also going to drive up labor cost because they are significantly bigger than Gen Z which is replacing them in the workforce.

I'm by no means defending the Fed or the politicians but much of this is structural and way beyond their control. Worse still the things they can control you can rest assured they'll **** up. This push towards green energy and EV is simply not possible in the timeframe they want it done and that's going to cause a lot more pain and inflation than we're already going to see.

The world is changing and we don't have a roadmap for it. Now add to that the abject morons we like to elect and you can be certain this isn't going to go well.
This. Frankly, there is nothing Powell can do at this point. No one in his position can. Our debt is so high and our fundamentals are so out of whack at this point that we are in unchartered waters. At this point, monetary policy is analogous to squeezing a water balloon. Whatever he does (raise or lower) he will break something critical. You literally just saw this with the bank crisis.

I've seen some make the comment "We need a Volcker!". Yeah, he was dealing with $3T in debt. We are 1,000% higher than that just 40 years later. Volcker would be in same spot that Powell is.

Agree that Yellen is incompetent as others have said. She advertised this during her confirmation hearings. She has no business being in that position so she's a net negative to this process.


All of this is correct but what I was referring to when I said structural problems is actually peak population which is very nearly here. For all of recorded history population growth has been the primary driver of economic growth. We don't have an era in history with sustained growth that doesn't feature population growth.

We're currently at 8b people and I'd guess the peak is 8.5b before it plateaus then falls off for the rest of our lives. China alone assures we won't see growth when you realize their population in 2050 will be half what it is today. There is no other region that is big enough to generate 700m to replace those people never mind additional hundreds of millions to generate meaningful growth.

Now realize that most of Europe is stagnant and on the verge of similar population reductions, the US is more or less at its peak with our largest generation half way into retirement, Russia is in a similar spot to China, Japan has already peaked, Africa is far too unreliable from a food production perspective and South and Central America are stable at best. India appears to still be growing so that will slow down the decline but they alone can't stop this. There is no other part of the world that is going to generate meaningful population growth and current birth rates are far too low to reverse these trend. Global population is going to start shrinking and it won't stop for decades.

For all the fear of AI replacing humans at the workplace we're going to need significant amounts of automation just to staff the workplace as it exists today. 20 years from now we will have fewer people working than we have today, that's already known.

This is the time bomb we aren't discussing and maybe we don't need to since there isn't a solution. Globalization created the greatest era of peace and prosperity in human history but it also crashed birth rates which appears to be leading to the end of globalization and my guess is the other side of this will see us make up for all the peace and prosperity of the past 80 years with violence and famine.
Agreed on all of this.

Side note: I read this week that India has actually surpassed China in population now. I'm not sure if that is true because I didn't go track it down but they may have to be the ones to try and pick up some slack to extend all of this for any amount of time.

Bottom line though is that we are going back to a regional existence and full globalization will degrade in many aspects.
Ag CPA
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ac04 said:

Ag CPA said:

ac04 said:

powell is also biden's pick and he is completely incompetent.
Trump picked him.
and biden re-nominated him. in large part because powell did his bidding and stuck to the clearly absurd "transitory" talking point until the time to re-nominate. then right after that he suddenly has an epiphany that inflation is actually a problem, and then proceeds to crank the rate up at the fastest pace in history without understanding that he was rug pulling the entire bond market. strange timing right?

why anyone defends this guy is completely beyond me, he advanced his own career at the expense of all of us and he has zero vision or creativity.
Have you ever looked at who else was being considered? As bad as things are, it could be a lot worse if one of the liberal candidates had stepped in.
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Heineken-Ashi
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jamey said:

I don't understand why our government spends like a teenager being dropped off at the mall with their first credit card and no advice, no rules, nothing

Every adult either learns sound financial restraint or suffers consequences. I guess politicians suffer re-election


Our government and the FED have consistently gotten opposite results of their goals since the creation of the FED, and we're over still wondering why both can't seem to understand reasonable economics.

Neither has any intention. Nor have they ever. Their partnership has always been one of wealth accumulation, power, and control. Once you realize that what is happening, and why times like this always happen, despite being what we were promised we would avoid if we gave the FED power over the money supply, was always the gameplan.

You cant get more power and control if you don't have events they allow you to shock the system and create a pathway to tax the middle class further through the mechanism of inflation.
"H-A: In return for the flattery, can you reduce the size of your signature? It's the only part of your posts that don't add value. In its' place, just put "I'm an investing savant, and make no apologies for it", as oldarmy1 would do."
- I Bleed Maroon (distracted easily by signatures)
Captain Pablo
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ac04 said:

other people might be worse is not exactly a ringing endorsement.


Yeah, I see that rationale a lot when we have failing sports coaches
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