Umbrella policies

13,008 Views | 84 Replies | Last: 4 days ago by MRB10
SlickHairandlotsofmoney
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YouBet said:

TXTransplant said:

Mine is only $1MM.


I would get a broker. We've used one for several years now. It's a very easy button to push.


I typically like to avoid the middleman if I can, but a good insurance broker can be such a great service. They know the industry and which companies to avoid and how to structure plans to fit your needs. As an added bonus, they'll likely save you a good chunk of money too.
OldArmyCT
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AG
USAA, $1mm policy, cost has gone from about $12/month to $17/month in 5 years. Now I'm old but that's still a good deal.
Ducks4brkfast
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AG
Pinochet said:

Tormentos said:

So what is the right amount of umbrella to have? Currently I have a policy covering my net worth, including retirement assets and a home that is paid off (~$1.5M of the policy coverage I have in place).

Do I need to be including the home equity and retirement assets in my coverage?

I've been curious how the "just insure your net worth" advice was determined. My net worth becomes the additional amount someone could get once my insurance policy is gone, so a $1 million net worth and $1 million umbrella means someone gets a judgment for $2 million and I'm worth zero. Seems like the wrong measuring stick for insurance need.
Yeah I read that and thought the same.
rme
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AG
Should I exclude assets in a trust from "net worth" for insurance purposes?
strbrst777
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Insuring net worth is a false standard.
TxAger
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for those curious... I just got an umbrella quote from RLI, I'm located in MoCo

$1 mil - $286
$2 mil - $515
$3 mil - $686
$5 mil - $901


also...
Excess Uninsured/Underinsured Motorist Coverage:
$1 mil - $178
MemphisAg1
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AG
$2MM State Farm, $545/yr
ToddyHill
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AG
I currently have a 5 million dollar policy for $950 per year. Was just informed my insurance company is cutting their coverage to 2 million max. Can anyone recommend a company/companies that offers umbrella policies in the $5-$10 million range? TIA.
MRB10
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AG
You don't need excess UM/UIM, IMO. You're essentially increasing the limits you yourself have access to when you file a liability claim against your own policy.



Why do you feel like you need 5-10M in limit over your personal auto/homeowners?

I understand the need when it's a business and their balance sheet is exposed but am struggling to understand the decision for an individual.
MRB10
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AG
Additional context for why I'm asking the second question.

Grok:
If you're found responsible (at-fault) for an accident in Texas and a court judgment for damages exceeds your insurance policy limits, your insurer is only obligated to pay up to those limits. You become personally liable for the remaining amount, meaning the plaintiff (injured party) can pursue you directly to collect the excess through post-judgment enforcement actions, such as obtaining a writ of execution to seize assets or filing an abstract of judgment to create a lien on certain property. This process can take years, involve additional legal costs, and is often challenging for the plaintiff, as many defendants lack sufficient accessible assets.

Texas law provides strong protections for debtors, making it difficult for plaintiffs to collect on judgments. Many individuals are considered "judgment proof" because their income and property fall under exemptions, shielding them from seizure, garnishment, attachment, or execution to satisfy ordinary civil debts like auto accident judgments. 20 Exemptions do not apply to certain debts, such as child support, taxes, or secured loans (e.g., a car loan allowing repossession), but they generally protect against unsecured judgments from accidents.

Protected (Exempt) Assets and Income

The following are typically shielded under Texas law (primarily Property Code Chapters 41 and 42, plus other statutes):

Homestead (Primary Residence): Your home and surrounding land are fully exempt from forced sale or liens for this type of debt, with no dollar limit on value. Urban homesteads are limited to 10 acres; rural ones up to 200 acres for a family or 100 acres for a single adult. Proceeds from selling a homestead are protected for 6 months if intended for reinvestment in another homestead. Temporary renting doesn't forfeit this protection if you don't acquire a new homestead.

Personal Property: Up to an aggregate fair market value of $100,000 for a family or $50,000 for a single adult (excluding liens). This includes:
Home furnishings and family heirlooms.
Food provisions.

Farming/ranching vehicles, implements, and animals (e.g., up to 2 horses/mules/donkeys with tack, 12 cattle, 60 other livestock, 120 fowl).

Tools, equipment, books, and apparatus used in your trade or profession (including boats and motor vehicles).

Clothing.

Jewelry (up to 25% of the aggregate limit, so max $25,000 for a family or $12,500 for a single adult).

Two firearms.

Athletic/sporting equipment, including bicycles.

One motor vehicle (two-, three-, or four-wheeled) per licensed family member (or per unlicensed dependent relying on others to drive).

Household pets.

Retirement and Savings Accounts: Fully exempt, regardless of value, including IRAs, 401(k)s, pensions, annuities, health savings accounts (HSAs), education savings (e.g., 529 plans), and ABLE accounts for disabilities. Inherited interests and distributions are protected (distributions for 60 days if rolled over).

Income and Benefits:
Current wages for personal services (Texas prohibits wage garnishment via employers for most civil judgments).

Social Security, Veterans Affairs benefits, workers' compensation, unemployment benefits, TANF (welfare), child support/alimony/spousal maintenance, FEMA disaster aid, railroad retirement, federal employee retirement, and life insurance/annuity benefits.

Unpaid commissions for services (up to 25% of the personal property aggregate limit).

Banks must protect up to two months of directly deposited Social Security benefits.

Other Exempt Items: Professionally prescribed health aids, a religious bible or sacred writings, and alimony/support payments.

Assets the Plaintiff Could Potentially Access

If you have non-exempt assets, the plaintiff could seek a court order to seize or lien them after 30 days from the judgment. Examples include:

Bank accounts containing non-exempt funds (e.g., if wages or exempt benefits are mixed with other money, they may lose protection; keep exempt funds separate).

Non-homestead real estate (e.g., investment properties or land exceeding homestead limits).

Personal property exceeding the aggregate value limits or not fitting exempt categories (e.g., luxury items like boats or extra vehicles beyond the one-per-driver allowance, valuable collectibles, or excess jewelry).

Business assets if not qualifying as tools of trade.

In practice, plaintiffs often abandon collection efforts if only exempt assets exist, as seizure requires identifying and proving non-exempt status. An abstract of judgment can create a 10-year lien (renewable) on non-exempt real property, affecting your credit and future sales. 20
This is a general overview based on Texas lawspecifics can vary by case, and exemptions require proper claiming.
ToddyHill
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AG
Quote:

Texas law provides

I don't live in Texas.

ToddyHill
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AG
Fair enough. My last boss, prior to my retirement, was an attorney. He was all about Umbrella policies.
MRB10
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AG
Which state? I'm genuinely curious to see whether the exempt asset list is materially different.
ToddyHill
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AG
Tennessee
MRB10
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AG
It's definitely less favorable but I'm still on the fence about whether the below justifies that large of a policy. It's probably dependent on the risk tolerance of the individual and the confidence in their defensive driving abilities.

Unlike Texas, Tennessee allows wage garnishment for ordinary civil judgments, though with limits.

Protected (Exempt) Assets and Income

The following are generally shielded:
Homestead (Primary Residence): Up to $35,000 in equity (home value minus liens like mortgages) for an individual owner using it as their principal residence. For joint owners (e.g., spouses) using it as their principal place, up to $52,500 total, divided equally if claimed in the same proceeding. If only one joint owner is involved, it's $35,000. The exemption lasts for the owner's life and passes to a surviving spouse or minor children if they continue using it as their home. It can't be waived without joint spousal consent if married, but doesn't protect against property taxes, purchase-money debts, or waived secured debts.

Personal Property (Wildcard Exemption): Up to $10,000 total in debtor's equity interest in any owned personal property you select, including money, bank deposits, vehicles, furniture, electronics, household goods, cash, or other items. This is a flexible "wildcard" you choose to protect what's most important, but items bought or maintained with fraudulent funds don't qualify.

Absolutely Exempt Personal Items (No Dollar Limit, Don't Count Toward $10,000 Wildcard): All necessary wearing apparel and trunks/receptacles to hold it; family portraits and pictures; family Bible and school books.

Tools of the Trade and Health Aids: Up to $1,900 in implements, professional books, or tools used in your trade or profession (or a dependent's). Professionally prescribed health care aids for you or a dependent (full value).

Awards and Payments: Up to $15,000 total aggregate for: crime victim's reparation ($5,000 max); personal bodily injury payments ($7,500 max, excluding pain/suffering or pecuniary loss); wrongful death payments ($10,000 max, if you were a dependent). Payments for loss of future earnings (to the extent necessary for support). Liquid assets/stocks/bonds to cover child support obligations (if deposited into court or seized for that purpose).

Retirement and Pensions: Most are fully exempt, including rights to Social Security, veterans' benefits, disability/illness/unemployment benefits, or pensions vesting due to disability. Certain stock bonus, pension, profit-sharing, annuity, or similar plans (with restrictions if not qualified under specific IRC sections). State, federal, or local public pensions.

Income and Benefits:
Wages: Exempt up to the greater of 75% of disposable earnings or 30 times the federal minimum wage per week, plus $2.50 per week for each dependent child under 16 living with and supported by you.

Fully exempt: Social Security/SSI, unemployment compensation, Families First/AFDC/welfare, local public assistance, veterans' benefits, workers' compensation, alimony or child support (if due more than 30 days after claiming exemption).

Bank accounts: Fully protected if containing only exempt funds (e.g., the above benefits); otherwise, you can use the $10,000 wildcard.

Assets the Plaintiff Could Potentially Access

Non-exempt assets can be targeted after judgment (typically after 10-30 days), via court-ordered seizure, garnishment, or liens:

Home equity exceeding homestead limits.

Personal property or cash/bank funds over the $10,000 wildcard (e.g., extra vehicles, luxury items, collectibles).

Wages beyond the exempt portion (up to 25% of disposable earnings can be garnished after court judgment).

Non-homestead real estate (e.g., rental or vacation properties).

Business assets not qualifying as tools of trade.

Mixed bank funds (keep exempt income separate to avoid commingling issues).

In practice, creditors may file an abstract of judgment to lien non-exempt real property for 10 years (renewable), impacting credit and sales. If only exempt assets exist, collection often fails. You can challenge garnishment by claiming exemptions or requesting installment payments
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There is no blue.
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