Auburn area population is not close to 200k. They are super close to any other major metropolitan area either, maybe Montgomery, I guess.
Bruce Pearl calls out A&M fans for poor attendance
13,561 Views |
111 Replies |
Last: 1 yr ago by 91AggieLawyer
I would totally disagree on this. Look at the historical pre Texags basketball attendance and get back with meTexas_Ag11 said:
When will we point the finger at TexAgs as a primary driver for the negativity that gets generated and its impact on Aggie sports. I know its ironic that I am posting it here, but I do think TexAgs has an outsized impact on Aggies and where they get their direction on sports. Most sports fans of Aggie athletics are not deeply engrained in all aspects and don't care to know if someone is a troll that posts here or if they truly even know what they are talking about. Instead most use TexAgs as a pulse of the teams. In the last two weeks, if I am an alumni or student that only superficially follows this team, I am not sure I would be interested in going to the game either. The talk is about our terrible venue, our team sucking, our coach leaving, how we are going to lose 6-8 straight to end the year. All that drivel spewed mostly on here, the primary conduit for fan information. We are not covered by mainstream media, so the info comes from here. If we honestly think that has no effect on attendance, I don't know what to tell you.
Auburn is an hour dirve from Columbus, GA (metro 330,000) and Montgomery, AL (metro 400,000). The metro area for Auburn itself is 199,289, so yeah, pretty close to 200k...Ag Eng 92 said:
Auburn area population is not close to 200k. They are super close to any other major metropolitan area either, maybe Montgomery, I guess.
I included the Auburn-Opelika Metropolitan area which as of 2023 was ~200K.Ag Eng 92 said:
Auburn area population is not close to 200k. They are super close to any other major metropolitan area either, maybe Montgomery, I guess.
27 million people live within 3 hours of our arena, but I dont know if even 350,000 live within an hour of it.
Before I was married and had kids, I had season tickets and lived in Houston. Often the midweek game was at 7:00pm, so I could leave my job slightly before 5, pickup whoever I was taking, get on the road before the worst of rush hour, walk in the building before introductions, and be walking out of the building almost exactly at 9:00pm. 8pm games, you had to worry about getting home late, but college basketball back then was a lot like soccer (I also had Dynamo season tickets at one point). You show up, you were there for two hours exactly, and then the game was over (except that one time there were 5 overtimes).
I dont have seats anymore, but it would be extraordinarily difficult even if my family situation allowed time for it. SEC games are scheduled at 6pm making cutting the workday short absolutely necessary. And when it is a late game, the game doesn't start on time, and it definitely doesn't end on time like it used to. I can see where it's probably getting harder to justify going to basketball games, not easier, over the past several years.
I dont have seats anymore, but it would be extraordinarily difficult even if my family situation allowed time for it. SEC games are scheduled at 6pm making cutting the workday short absolutely necessary. And when it is a late game, the game doesn't start on time, and it definitely doesn't end on time like it used to. I can see where it's probably getting harder to justify going to basketball games, not easier, over the past several years.
Interpret this as you will, but I thought it might be interesting to look at a selection of SEC and Texas schools as a function of their relative attendance in football and basketball. This selection covers a range of geographic settings and enrollment sizes.
Football / Basketball / Ratio
Texas A&M………..103k / 9.7k / 10.6x
Texas…………………102k / 10.7k / 9.5x
Tennessee…………102k / 19.7k / 5.2x
Auburn………………88k / 9.1k / 9.7x
Arkansas……………73k / 19.1k / 3.8x
Texas Tech…………59k / 12.9k / 4.6x
Baylor………………..42k / 7.8k / 5.4x
Football / Basketball / Ratio
Texas A&M………..103k / 9.7k / 10.6x
Texas…………………102k / 10.7k / 9.5x
Tennessee…………102k / 19.7k / 5.2x
Auburn………………88k / 9.1k / 9.7x
Arkansas……………73k / 19.1k / 3.8x
Texas Tech…………59k / 12.9k / 4.6x
Baylor………………..42k / 7.8k / 5.4x
What is your interpretation of it?Scotts Tot said:
Interpret this as you will,
JJxvi said:What is your interpretation of it?Scotts Tot said:
Interpret this as you will,
My interpretation is that regardless of the geographical issues surrounding our location which certainly exacerbate the issue, there is simply not a strong culture around basketball at A&M. If the issue was purely a matter of location/geography, we wouldn't be able to pull in a top 5 football attendance year after year.
Scotts Tot said:
Interpret this as you will, but I thought it might be interesting to look at a selection of SEC and Texas schools as a function of their relative attendance in football and basketball. This selection covers a range of geographic settings and enrollment sizes.
Football / Basketball / Ratio
Texas A&M………..103k / 9.7k / 10.6x
Texas…………………102k / 10.7k / 9.5x
Tennessee…………102k / 19.7k / 5.2x
Auburn………………88k / 9.1k / 9.7x
Arkansas……………73k / 19.1k / 3.8x
Texas Tech…………59k / 12.9k / 4.6x
Baylor………………..42k / 7.8k / 5.4x
According to your numbers:
Football averaged about 99% capacity and basketball averaged 73%. So 1-in-a-100 empty for football and 1-in-4 empty for basketball.
JJxvi said:Auburn is an hour dirve from Columbus, GA (metro 330,000) and Montgomery, AL (metro 400,000). The metro area for Auburn itself is 199,289, so yeah, pretty close to 200k...Ag Eng 92 said:
Auburn area population is not close to 200k. They are super close to any other major metropolitan area either, maybe Montgomery, I guess.
I stand corrected- been there many times and it comes across as much more Starkville than BCS.
Disregard the above…
I just googled it because I knew it was half the size of BCS. Auburn is 82k. Opelika is 33k. Metro area is way smaller than Aggieland.
We all know the issue is that out of town folks just aren't going to make a Tuesday night game at 8 but A&M is happy to sell those seats to season ticket holders so they can't go to more students or locals
A&M can still sell to the big metro area donors. They still need to find a way to market and build up the local fanbase to make the games though. The job is not done just because you sold the ticket for that year.
Donors from Houston (primarily) and elsewhere buy the season slate. However, what doesn't exist is a secondary market of people wanting to go to the game and willing to buy a ticket. When I didnt go to a game, I usually either had to give my tickets away for free or in some cases couldn't even give 'em away (rare).
If effort were expended and local demand increased, they would be able to soak up some of that secondary market, allowing the big donors, to pay the 12th Man Foundation even more for season tickets since they would be getting some of that initial investment back more regularly. What we have now is whenever there is a strong secondary market game, its likely because every single Kentucky or Tennessee fan in Houston/Austin/Dallas all want to go to a game and the tickets get sold to our opponents fans.
Donors from Houston (primarily) and elsewhere buy the season slate. However, what doesn't exist is a secondary market of people wanting to go to the game and willing to buy a ticket. When I didnt go to a game, I usually either had to give my tickets away for free or in some cases couldn't even give 'em away (rare).
If effort were expended and local demand increased, they would be able to soak up some of that secondary market, allowing the big donors, to pay the 12th Man Foundation even more for season tickets since they would be getting some of that initial investment back more regularly. What we have now is whenever there is a strong secondary market game, its likely because every single Kentucky or Tennessee fan in Houston/Austin/Dallas all want to go to a game and the tickets get sold to our opponents fans.
For proof of the disparity in basketball culture look no further than the game in Fort Worth this year, where our fans were probably outnumbered 4 to 1 in a metro area with thousands more Aggies than Raiders.
Yes, I think you are right about A&M not having a strong "basketball culture". However, I also believe that our athletic marketing department is pretty comfortable with football where they do the minimum and get a fantastic ROI. I lived in Houston in the mid-2010s, and A&M played at least twice at the Toyota Center at the time; the only way I knew about the game was because I checked the A&M schedule on its website, and I followed the team closely. At the time, no marketing/ads were going on in the Houston area about A&M playing a good game. As far as I know, the marketing department invests very little in promoting non-football games in places like Houston or Dallas...heck I am sure there is an alumni database where, hypothetically, they could reach out via email (if they opt-in) to promote the game and additional activities.
agtrevino07 said:
Yes, I think you are right about A&M not having a strong "basketball culture". However, I also believe that our athletic marketing department is pretty comfortable with football where they do the minimum and get a fantastic ROI. I lived in Houston in the mid-2010s, and A&M played at least twice at the Toyota Center at the time; the only way I knew about the game was because I checked the A&M schedule on its website, and I followed the team closely. At the time, no marketing/ads were going on in the Houston area about A&M playing a good game. As far as I know, the marketing department invests very little in promoting non-football games in places like Houston or Dallas...heck I am sure there is an alumni database where, hypothetically, they could reach out via email (if they opt-in) to promote the game and additional activities.
This is true, but not sure it totally proves the point. I live pretty close to Dickies Arena (where this game was played). Local advertisement for the game was basically nonexistent. Maybe DFW Tech alumni were getting emails from their athletic department encouraging them to go to the game, which I doubt, but even without much local fanfare the Tech fans turned out in great numbers compared to the Aggies.
I was unable to attend, but read that almost 12.3k in attendance (out of a ~13k complete capacity for Reed Arean). Was the arena emptier than that as that's not that much of a discrepancy for a wkday game to go watch a struggling team (of late) who has had terrible shooting nights and some poor 3pt defensive nights vs. the annoited top team in the country? Presume all the complaints are prob sold tix of 12.3k and not that many in attendance.
Who cares if #1 team is in town and Pearl is a blow hard as it is a hard sell if your team has been consistently struggling thru the month off Feb. (esp. if you don't live in B/CS area or nearby).
Yes, I support teams and kids, but there has to be pragmatic/realistic view. Unfortunately, IMO, A&M doesn't have as many tshirt fans (in a smaller town) as most of the other SEC teams (esp tu, Bama, etc.) who fill seats regardless. It's the common topic of either you love and get A&M or you just don't.
Who cares if #1 team is in town and Pearl is a blow hard as it is a hard sell if your team has been consistently struggling thru the month off Feb. (esp. if you don't live in B/CS area or nearby).
Yes, I support teams and kids, but there has to be pragmatic/realistic view. Unfortunately, IMO, A&M doesn't have as many tshirt fans (in a smaller town) as most of the other SEC teams (esp tu, Bama, etc.) who fill seats regardless. It's the common topic of either you love and get A&M or you just don't.
Tech has better bball fans.Scotts Tot said:
For proof of the disparity in basketball culture look no further than the game in Fort Worth this year, where our fans were probably outnumbered 4 to 1 in a metro area with thousands more Aggies than Raiders.
To compare football to basketball attendance ratios fairly you'd need to look at Saturday hoops games only. Big difference between Tuesday at 8 PM and Saturday at 230 in terms of drawing out of towners.
Not denying the football to basketball culture differences at A & M, just saying drawing conclusions about out of town attendance of different schools in different sports needs context.
Not denying the football to basketball culture differences at A & M, just saying drawing conclusions about out of town attendance of different schools in different sports needs context.
You can't fix dgaf
Method Man said:Tech has better bball fans.Scotts Tot said:
For proof of the disparity in basketball culture look no further than the game in Fort Worth this year, where our fans were probably outnumbered 4 to 1 in a metro area with thousands more Aggies than Raiders.
Tech has recently been to the final 4. They averaged 12k attendance per game
A&m has never had a deep run. Ever. In the history of basketball
then how are we avg 10k this year which is 2nd best in school history.frenchtoast said:
You can't fix dgaf
If we'd just tarp off 2k, we'd sellout and everyone here would be happy
halfastros81 said:
To compare football to basketball attendance ratios fairly you'd need to look at Saturday hoops games only. Big difference between Tuesday at 8 PM and Saturday at 230 in terms of drawing out of towners.
Not denying the football to basketball culture differences at A & M, just saying drawing conclusions about out of town attendance of different schools in different sports needs context.
Right, but that's true for all schools. The point was to compare the schools against each other. Tech averages 13k per game in Lubbock in the middle of nowhere, way further from large metro areas than CS, including midweek games.
Doesn't Auburn play in a 9000 seat arena?
Understood. I'm just saying a Saturday's only look would sort of level the playing field for schools not near a major metro area as far as comparing football to basketball attendance ratios.
I also suspect if you compared Saturdays only to weeknights only you'd see a clear difference in basketball attendance trends for major metro schools versus not.
Your point about Tech is a good one but we are comparing to more than just Tech. I will say this, the numbers show that Tech's base is much more interested in basketball than ours and that's something our AD should try to address because for whatever reason we are leaving money on the table …. Compared to them anyway.
I also suspect if you compared Saturdays only to weeknights only you'd see a clear difference in basketball attendance trends for major metro schools versus not.
Your point about Tech is a good one but we are comparing to more than just Tech. I will say this, the numbers show that Tech's base is much more interested in basketball than ours and that's something our AD should try to address because for whatever reason we are leaving money on the table …. Compared to them anyway.
There is no significant "lets drive across the state" to see Texas Tech play. They have to price it so that people already in the local area go to the games.
Its costs $1200-1800 for tickets at Reed that cost $775-$900 in Lubbock. So we are squeezing out more juice from the prime seats by selling them to major metro areas, IMO. Everywhere else in the building, Tech gets more because there is a higher baseline level of demand there. They also have a cheaper floor than we do, as the worst seats are not all solely student seating there.
Not that this has anything to do with attendance, but just for info, their students pay $60 bucks in their tuition for admission to all sports. We charge $400 for the sports pass.
Its costs $1200-1800 for tickets at Reed that cost $775-$900 in Lubbock. So we are squeezing out more juice from the prime seats by selling them to major metro areas, IMO. Everywhere else in the building, Tech gets more because there is a higher baseline level of demand there. They also have a cheaper floor than we do, as the worst seats are not all solely student seating there.
Not that this has anything to do with attendance, but just for info, their students pay $60 bucks in their tuition for admission to all sports. We charge $400 for the sports pass.
Yes, the smallest in the SEC. Would be nice though as it makes the environment a lot better aka The Jungle.
Their arena is small, but as as far as I can tell it has been sold out for every game in the last 5 years.
Ags need a new and better but smaller arena.
The Baylor approach, nice. Maybe we can just tarp over seats?
There is an argument for a smaller building. The comparable markets I identified (Auburn, Gainesville, Athens, Oxford, Starkville, the average capacity of the arenas is just 10,044.
Also, tarping off is now the Texas approach. They have a 16,000+ seat arena commensurate with their very large market, but they tarp it off at 10,700 for Longhorn basketball.
Also, tarping off is now the Texas approach. They have a 16,000+ seat arena commensurate with their very large market, but they tarp it off at 10,700 for Longhorn basketball.
Neville Arena is also interesting to me, because it is actually built on the main square/quad/whaetever of one of their "neighborhoods" of residence halls. 2000 students live essentially on the grounds of the arena. There is a dining hall/food court literally only 50 feet away wall to wall from the arena.
In the era of NIL where facilities take a back seat, we are not building a new arena.
When your season ticket includes costs for parking and the lots are full at 7:30 and the closest parking is the parking lot at end of the track lot, it doesn't make for a enjoyable experience.
Plus concessions are ridiculous, cost and quality!
Featured Stories
See All
51:11
46m ago
1.5k
18:07
3h ago
3.3k
13:44
1h ago
1.7k
Showdown sweep surges Texas A&M into D1Baseball's top 10
by Richard Zane
Dement homers twice to complete sweep in Oxford
by Kayla Gaither