Serious Question: How is Coronavirus worse than Common Flu ?

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zebros_95
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In reply to texaggie90 • 11:10p, 3/19/20
AG
Right but like I said we have zero idea how many people have been infected. The mortality rate is meaningless without that number unless you specifically qualify by adding "in positive test cases of the people we actually tested the mortality rate is x"

But people don't quote it that way. So again the listed mortality rates are more likely to be wrong than right.
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Not a Bot
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In reply to Thomas Ford 91 • 11:13p, 3/19/20
AG
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.


I thought I was pessimistic about this until I started reading your posts.
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Fitch
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11:24p, 3/19/20
AG
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Thomas Ford 91
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In reply to Not a Bot • 11:31p, 3/19/20
AG
Moxley said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.


I thought I was pessimistic about this until I started reading your posts.


The worst 2 months in US history started today.
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DCAggie13y
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In reply to Thomas Ford 91 • 11:45p, 3/19/20
AG
Thomas Ford 91 said:
Moxley said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.


I thought I was pessimistic about this until I started reading your posts.


The worst 2 months in US history started today.


No it didnt. You've had too much to drink. This is nothing compared to the Civil War, Great Depression, World War 1, World War 2, or the Spanish Flu. The Spanish Flu killed 600,000 Americans which is the equivalent of 2.2M today.

Coronavirus killed 3,200 in China over 4 months and you think it's going to kill millions in the US???
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Win At Life
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In reply to NoseBleed • 11:59p, 3/19/20
AG
NoseBleed said:
Serious Question: How is Coronavirus worse than Common Flu ?
.
Read this article:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/30/health/flu-deadly-virus-15-million-infected-trnd/index.html
.
Far more are sickened by the common flu than what we are seeing with Coronavirus. We don't shut down everything for the common flu. What's the difference?


Please provide an example where the common flu killed 20 of 224 in a nursing home in one week and killed 3 of seven family members who are dinner together.
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Thomas Ford 91
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In reply to DCAggie13y • 12:06a, 3/20/20
AG
Gumby said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
Moxley said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.


I thought I was pessimistic about this until I started reading your posts.


The worst 2 months in US history started today.


No it didnt. You've had too much to drink. This is nothing compared to the Civil War, Great Depression, World War 1, World War 2, or the Spanish Flu. The Spanish Flu killed 600,000 Americans which is the equivalent of 2.2M today.

Coronavirus killed 3,200 in China over 4 months and you think it's going to kill millions in the US???


Killed more than that in Italy over the last 2 weeks.

I didn't say millions. I said 400,000 by May 7th. Huge dropoff after that. I don't expect it to ever kill 1 million US citizens.

Combined with economic meltdown, I'm pretty sure that would qualify as the worst 2 months in US history.
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ExtremeRush
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In reply to Thomas Ford 91 • 12:06a, 3/20/20
AG
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

FALSE
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Thomas Ford 91
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In reply to ExtremeRush • 12:10a, 3/20/20
AG
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

FALSE


Thank you. I stand corrected. A lot of people don't have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.
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DCAggie13y
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In reply to Thomas Ford 91 • 12:16a, 3/20/20
AG
Thomas Ford 91 said:
Gumby said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
Moxley said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.


I thought I was pessimistic about this until I started reading your posts.


The worst 2 months in US history started today.


No it didnt. You've had too much to drink. This is nothing compared to the Civil War, Great Depression, World War 1, World War 2, or the Spanish Flu. The Spanish Flu killed 600,000 Americans which is the equivalent of 2.2M today.

Coronavirus killed 3,200 in China over 4 months and you think it's going to kill millions in the US???


Killed more than that in Italy over the last 2 weeks.

I didn't say millions. I said 400,000 by May 7th. Huge dropoff after that. I don't expect it to ever kill 1 million US citizens.

Combined with economic meltdown, I'm pretty sure that would qualify as the worst 2 months in US history.


It's easy to be overly negative right now but I truly believe based on excessive research and listening to experts that it wont be as dire as you think. We will get through this. The main issue is increasing the capacity of our health care system. We will get there and turn the corner and beat this before it kills 400,000.

China, South Korea, Japan, and it looks like Germany have all turned it around. I really think Italy and Spain are the worst case scenarios and so far we are far below their case and mortality rates at this stage.
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ExtremeRush
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In reply to Thomas Ford 91 • 12:16a, 3/20/20
AG
Thomas Ford 91 said:
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

FALSE

Thank you. I stand corrected. A lot of people don't have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

I guess I'm really focusing on the absolute part of your comment stating that it will be "non-existent." Obviously I know you don't believe that but that's how I read it. Many hospitals right now are primarily postponing elective surgeries to free up resources. If you have a trauma (car accident), heart attack, etc. you're gonna receive life saving treatment, even as we experience an increase in COVID-19 cases.
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DCAggie13y
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In reply to ExtremeRush • 12:21a, 3/20/20
AG
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

FALSE

Thank you. I stand corrected. A lot of people don't have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

I guess I'm really focusing on the absolute part of your comment stating that it will be "non-existent." Obviously I know you don't believe that but that's how I read it. Many hospitals right now are primarily postponing elective surgeries to free up resources. If you have a trauma (car accident), heart attack, etc. you're gonna receive life saving treatment, even as we experience an increase in COVID-19 cases.


Yes and it seems like ventilators will be the main issue. Not necessarily ICU beds.
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Thomas Ford 91
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In reply to ExtremeRush • 12:25a, 3/20/20
AG
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

FALSE

Thank you. I stand corrected. A lot of people don't have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

I guess I'm really focusing on the absolute part of your comment stating that it will be "non-existent." Obviously I know you don't believe that but that's how I read it. Many hospitals right now are primarily postponing elective surgeries to free up resources. If you have a trauma (car accident), heart attack, etc. you're gonna receive life saving treatment, even as we experience an increase in COVID-19 cases.


Lots of ethical issues here. As a hospital administrator, do you turn away people with Covid19 you can save, to keep beds open for potential trauma or heart attacks? In large cities, I could see this problem being solved by setting a hospital aside for "everything else". But in smaller communities, where the bed you are saving is in the same building, the ethics are much more difficult to resolve.

For 2 months or more, Covid19 will take every ICU bed we have unless ICUs establish rules about how many beds it can have.
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Not a Bot
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In reply to ExtremeRush • 12:28a, 3/20/20
AG
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
ExtremeRush said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

FALSE

Thank you. I stand corrected. A lot of people don't have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.

I guess I'm really focusing on the absolute part of your comment stating that it will be "non-existent." Obviously I know you don't believe that but that's how I read it. Many hospitals right now are primarily postponing elective surgeries to free up resources. If you have a trauma (car accident), heart attack, etc. you're gonna receive life saving treatment, even as we experience an increase in COVID-19 cases.
Today, yes. Two weeks from now, had there been no intervention...possibly not in some areas. Risk was high. Some areas of Italy are taking over an hour to even answer emergency calls due to non-stop need for hospital transport for COVID. No telling how many people have died from other typically treatable conditions but that number is likely pretty high.

I think New York is on the brink of this possibly happening. They have way too few beds for a population that size to handle an outbreak like this. Based on their known existing cases and due to the time it takes for a person to get the virus, have symptoms, and need hospitalization it's possible they could reach that point by the end of next week. Hopefully not. I think the use of hydroxychloroquine is going to be a game changer in terms of need for longer-term hospitalization. If we can get people in and out sooner, keep them out of ICU / off the ventilator (the most important thing IMO) and start treating some of the outpatient cases it would go a long way toward easing the strain.
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Thomas Ford 91
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12:33a, 3/20/20
AG
I feel like we lost the OP a long time ago. I hope we've established how this is different from the flu. I hope I'm wrong. I think we'll know this time next week that I'm not. Good Night.
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Dr.HeadCase
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7:11a, 3/20/20
AG
For those feeling pessimistic about all of this (I've been one of them), here's a more positive take. One thing that you can't factor into any of the models - the entire world is working together to find a way to beat this thing. You can't underestimate that. The optimist in me says there will be some sort of unexpected breakthrough as a result.
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MaroonStain
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7:23a, 3/20/20
AG
Great to see someone found a place to return and spread propaganda.
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MaroonStain
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In reply to Dr.HeadCase • 7:25a, 3/20/20
AG
Dr.HeadCase said:
For those feeling pessimistic about all of this (I've been one of them), here's a more positive take. One thing that you can't factor into any of the models - the entire world is working together to find a way to beat this thing. You can't underestimate that. The optimist in me says there will be some sort of unexpected breakthrough as a result.


Exactly! Give me 200 lab techs in the US and this thing will get stopped!
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Pumpkinhead
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7:29a, 3/20/20
AG
It is kind of surprising that anyone is still asking 'how is this different than the flu?' Question this far into this thing. Given how much this has been discussed, all the articles out there, the press conferences by WHO, CDC, governments etc.

If you are still asking that question, then you are either not trying to find an answer or you don't like the answer that you are hearing so you keep asking the question.
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HotardAg07
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7:47a, 3/20/20
AG
I can't believe people are still asking this question, willfully ignoring every infectious disease expert and doctor who have told you this is more dangerous than the flu.
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beerad12man
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In reply to texaggie90 • 7:48a, 3/20/20
AG
Just to clarify:

0.1 to 0.2%. Not 0.01%. 0.01% means 1 out of every 10K
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dellgriffith
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In reply to Thomas Ford 91 • 8:02a, 3/20/20
AG
Thomas Ford 91 said:
Moxley said:
Thomas Ford 91 said:
I think a lot of people have a hard time wrapping their head around the concept that access to live-saving healthcare will be non-existent for a while.


I thought I was pessimistic about this until I started reading your posts.


The worst 2 months in US history started today.


It gives me comfort to see your posts about this subject. Because I have learned that you are wrong about, literally, everything you post. You were disgraced from the politics board because of your nonsense and now you are making up **** to scare people.
I wouldn't trust your opinion on something as simple as what color the sky is today.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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MaroonStain
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8:40a, 3/20/20
AG
The individual needs to be flagged and exited from this board as well.
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HotardRat
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In reply to Pumpkinhead • 9:26a, 3/20/20
AG
Pumpkinhead said:
It is kind of surprising that anyone is still asking 'how is this different than the flu?' Question this far into this thing. Given how much this has been discussed, all the articles out there, the press conferences by WHO, CDC, governments etc.

If you are still asking that question, then you are either not trying to find an answer or you don't like the answer that you are hearing so you keep asking the question.
This.

Also surprising how many of the people just on this thread who have provided detailed answers have not received rebuttals. It's just more people making more claims and ignoring the responses.
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Gordo14
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9:34a, 3/20/20
We have no natural immunity to this virus unlike the flu (plus if you have been vaccinated you have much more immunity). This is much more contagious than the flu, probably as a result of the lack of immunity. We develope symptoms later due to a long incubation period. And despite the super optimists here, there is no reason to believe the overall fatality rate is below 1%... Maybe .7%. This assumes the system isn't overwhelmed at the same time (which is definitely possible if not likely given how contagious this is). Obviously, if you're not over 70 and you are healthy, you will likely be fine if you get the virus. However, this is still much worse than the flu for the reasons mentioned above. We still don't fully understand long term side effects or what will happen to this virus long term.

So in summary, we should be concerned - very concerned. We shouldn't be panicked, because it is what it is at this point. But far too many posters get on here with their internet bravado and just say this doesn't even matter or it's probably got less of a fatality rate than the flu. There's little evidence to support what they're saying, and if our health care system gets overwhelmed (give it about a week in the hardest hit areas) it will be bad. Below is a pretty good visualization at just how quickly this virus has outpaced all other outbreaks and pandemics in death count and rate in recent history.

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Francis Macomber
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In reply to Gordo14 • 10:04a, 3/20/20
AG
Damn.
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cbr
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10:06a, 3/20/20
AG
Well one thing that hasnt been pointed out is that this virus essentially causes pneumonia, other inflammation sometimes deadly, and sometimes permanent lung damage, so its not just the flu anyway, regardless of stats.

Further, stats are all nonsense. Almost certainly deliberately falsified in most instances, but also dramatically incomplete across the board, so stats are only marginally useful.

Either the disease is much, much worse than publicly diclosed, and the stats too, or this economic reaction is the biggest overreaction in history.
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Francis Macomber
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In reply to cbr • 10:09a, 3/20/20
AG
cbr said:
Well one thing that hasnt been pointed out is that this virus essentially causes pneumonia, other inflammation sometimes deadly, and sometimes permanent lung damage, so its not just the flu anyway, regardless of stats.

Further, stats are all nonsense. Almost certainly deliberately falsified in most instances, but also dramatically incomplete across the board, so stats are only marginally useful.

Either the disease is much, much worse than publicly diclosed, and the stats too, or this economic reaction is the biggest overreaction in history.


Watch that video linked above.
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AggieKO
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In reply to Dad • 10:38a, 3/20/20
AG
aggie-beta said:
It seems to spread a lot faster and to a much larger percentage of the the population.

I think at the end of all of this they'll figure out that the fatality rate is about the same as the flu, in the area of 0.1% in this country. I think if we didn't do the social distancing and cancel everything we might have overwhelmed our hospitals and the death rate would end up being a lot higher than 0.1%.
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longeryak
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In reply to FrecklesDad • 10:45a, 3/20/20
FrecklesDad said:
But weren't they on the ship for an extended period of time?
Pass it around the ship and different soldiers are the carriers at US ports from the ones that were when leaving Europe.
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