Boerne Catholic Church is sponsoring a blood drive. In conjunction, community dropped off (I assume) mostly homemade masks.

According to the person in charge of the phlebotomists, it is each person's choice to wear the masks.

88planoAg said:

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Boerne Catholic Church is sponsoring a blood drive. In conjunction, community dropped off (I assume) mostly homemade masks.

According to the person in charge of the phlebotomists, it is each person's choice to wear the masks.

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Maybe the blood drive red flag is the phlebotomists that need implementation of a mask requirement...

Who is doing it?

I thought they shut down all the mobile blood drives in the San Antonio area

I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a phrontal lobotomy

jschroeder said:

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Who is doing it?

I thought they shut down all the mobile blood drives in the San Antonio area

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https://southtexasblood.org/Boerne

No. phlebotomist shouldn't be wearing masks, unless they are sick. Which in that case they should not be at work.

Cdc guidance is that only people who are sick should be wearing masks, or people who are actively treating infected patients should be wearing masks.

Blood donation is safe due to a multitude of factors (healthy donors, low risk contact, and stringent preCovid cleaning and sterilization SOPs) and blood banks have instituted more guidance for proper distancing (when possible... can't stick an arm from 6 ft away) and more cleaning/sterilization steps. By the time a donor gets tot he phlebotomists bed they are already screened for travel and bio metrics.

Donating blood is safer than going to the grocery store.

Not all blood drives were cancelled. Since March 15th however there have been over 14k cancelled nation wide. But a lot of organizations are stepping in to help keep the community supplies flowing.

Hmm. But if by definition 1) you can't keep social distance 2) you can be asymptomatic but contagious

Shouldn't there be masks used?

Lol I was there at the church in Boerne sitting in the truck waiting for my wife to come out from donating when the cops showed up to run the "Boerne Breaking news" guy off. He was walking around the parking lot recording himself talking about the phlebs not wearing masks. Pissed off the guys helping guide people. He asked the cops a couple of questions and the ran him off. Was kinda funny. Saw the video today on the FB. I'm prob in it sitting in a black Tahoe wondering wtf was going on

Reel Aggies said:

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Lol I was there at the church in Boerne sitting in the truck waiting for my wife to come out from donating when the cops showed up to run the "Boerne Breaking news" guy off. He was walking around the parking lot recording himself talking about the phlebs not wearing masks. Pissed off the guys helping guide people. He asked the cops a couple of questions and the ran him off. Was kinda funny. Saw the video today on the FB. I'm prob in it sitting in a black Tahoe wondering wtf was going on

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That is where I heard the news! Boerne drama. But was curious for opinions.

88planoAg said:

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Hmm. But if by definition 1) you can't keep social distance 2) you can be asymptomatic but contagious

Shouldn't there be masks used?

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you can keep social distance except for the brief phlebotomy (needle stick and withdraw). And the guidance states that prolonged contact with an infected person is how the disease is transmitted, through hand/face contact. Prolonged being defined as more than 10 minutes within 6 feet of an infected person.

Wearing a mask does not protect the donor nor the staff any more that anything else. It only compounds the chance of them having to touch their face.

Then likelihood of transmitting it via normal breaths from brief contact are slim and blood banks must follow the guidances and recommendations of the cdc and FDA

now compound the supply issues this would cause. Phlebotomists change their glove multiple times on the same donor and in between each donor. Add onto that having to change your mask between each donor when screened and each donor during phlebotomy. Generally a different person will screen than who sticks.

Because you wouldn't want to use the same mask between 2 different donors, that means that a blood drive seeing 30 donors would have to use at least 60 masks. More than likely, since there are generally at least 4 staff on a small blood drive, and each has to change their mask twice for each donor, that would mean about 160 masks for each drive.

All to screen/stick healthy people by healthy people. It's not warranted, nor is it feasible. All the while hospitals are short the same masks for their staff while actively treating known infected people.

Eta: all this being said. If the cdc and FDA come out with new guidance and change it based on new facts of viral transmission, not on public perception on the efficacy of masks, then blood banks will follow suit to meet those guidances.

My understanding is contagion can be spread through respirations too, given close contact. That and coughs and sneezes. That is why the 6 foot distance.

And no, I don't think masks have to be changed in between patients.

These were donated masks from the community. Not medical grade I don't think, my guess is homemade.

88planoAg said:

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My understanding is contagion can be spread through respirations too, given close contact. That and coughs and sneezes. That is why the 6 foot distance.

And no, I don't think masks have to be changed in between patients.

These were donated masks from the community. Not medical grade I don't think, my guess is homemade.

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Just an FYI. I work for a blood bank.

it could be spread through respiration, however the 6 Fr rule is to ensure you aren't close to someone who sneeze or coughs. I remember reading that coughs/sneezes only go about 4 ft, and they added 2 more to make sure. Normal respiration isn't going that nearly that far. And in all honesty, most of the time heads are 2-3 feet or further apart. Even during phlebotomy.

1) We would have to change them between donors. Everything is about the safety of the staff/donor and blood product. In order to ensure that, we would change them almost as often as we change our gloves.

2) we would only be able to use medical grade masks. Every thing we utilize in the course of operation has to be certified and quality controlled in order to meet regulatory standards.

3) please call them donors. Patients are sick and go to the hospital. We don't collect blood from sick people.

SoulSlaveAG2005 said:

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88planoAg said:

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Hmm. But if by definition 1) you can't keep social distance 2) you can be asymptomatic but contagious

Shouldn't there be masks used?

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you can keep social distance except for the brief phlebotomy (needle stick and withdraw). And the guidance states that prolonged contact with an infected person is how the disease is transmitted, through hand/face contact. Prolonged being defined as more than 10 minutes within 6 feet of an infected person.

Wearing a mask does not protect the donor nor the staff any more that anything else. It only compounds the chance of them having to touch their face.

Then likelihood of transmitting it via normal breaths from brief contact are slim and blood banks must follow the guidances and recommendations of the cdc and FDA

now compound the supply issues this would cause. Phlebotomists change their glove multiple times on the same donor and in between each donor. Add onto that having to change your mask between each donor when screened and each donor during phlebotomy. Generally a different person will screen than who sticks.

Because you wouldn't want to use the same mask between 2 different donors, that means that a blood drive seeing 30 donors would have to use at least 60 masks. More than likely, since there are generally at least 4 staff on a small blood drive, and each has to change their mask twice for each donor, that would mean about 160 masks for each drive.

All to screen/stick healthy people by healthy people. It's not warranted, nor is it feasible. All the while hospitals are short the same masks for their staff while actively treating known infected people.

Eta: all this being said. If the cdc and FDA come out with new guidance and change it based on new facts of viral transmission, not on public perception on the efficacy of masks, then blood banks will follow suit to meet those guidances.

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Changing masks between patients would never happen,and if it is would be overkill.

Between patients or donors?

I appreciate the thoughtful input, but our MDs and QA team have been pretty specific in our operational discussion about the can we/should we/how would we implement masks if we had to or needed to.

Shoot me a pm. I would be happy to talk about the overkill in regulation and processes, it's fun beer talk

SoulSlaveAG2005 said:

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88planoAg said:

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My understanding is contagion can be spread through respirations too, given close contact. That and coughs and sneezes. That is why the 6 foot distance.

And no, I don't think masks have to be changed in between patients.

These were donated masks from the community. Not medical grade I don't think, my guess is homemade.

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Just an FYI. I work for a blood bank.

it could be spread through respiration, however the 6 Fr rule is to ensure you aren't close to someone who sneeze or coughs. I remember reading that coughs/sneezes only go about 4 ft, and they added 2 more to make sure. Normal respiration isn't going that nearly that far. And in all honesty, most of the time heads are 2-3 feet or further apart. Even during phlebotomy.

1) We would have to change them between donors. Everything is about the safety of the staff/donor and blood product. In order to ensure that, we would change them almost as often as we change our gloves.

2) we would only be able to use medical grade masks. Every thing we utilize in the course of operation has to be certified and quality controlled in order to meet regulatory standards.

3) please call them donors. Patients are sick and go to the hospital. We don't collect blood from sick people.

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Got it. So maybe that is why the in charge person left it up to the individual professional to decide.

Thanks for the insight.

Happy to discuss. We are trying to adapt and different blood banks do interpret things or allow some variances across the spectrum.

Just give a pint and help save some lives