Honest Debate Anyone?

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Thaddeus73
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11:37a, 9/21/25
AG
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?
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Mr. Thunderclap McGirthy
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2:40p, 9/21/25
AG
Jesus is the only way to heaven. I've been both and it is the one Lord who saves. We need to tighten up and secure our perimeter. The enemy is prowling and isn't hiding anymore.
In Hoc Signo Vinces
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10andBOUNCE
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In reply to Mr. Thunderclap McGirthy • 2:43p, 9/21/25
AG
^
What he said
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FIDO95
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3:48p, 9/21/25
AG


PSA, Maniacs are at the door
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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Thaddeus73
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6:56p, 9/21/25
AG
Quote:
Jesus is the only way to heaven.

No debate there!
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Pro Sandy
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6:59p, 9/21/25
AG
As a protestant, I think Catholics will also be in heaven as we both follow Jesus.
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94chem
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7:45p, 9/21/25
During the era of slavery, many missionaries refused to share the gospel with slaves, reasoning that converting them and baptizing them would acknowledge their humanity and make it difficult to justify ownership. Now I ask, was it the Catholic Good News or the Protestant Good News that was being withheld?
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
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Pro Sandy
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In reply to 94chem • 7:52p, 9/21/25
AG
The gospel isn't Catholic or protestant. The gospel is Jesus.

Anyone refusing to share it with others is violating the great commission of Jesus and if they view others as unworthy of receiving it are violating the teaching of God that we are made in His image and that Jesus came to offer salvation to all.
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94chem
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In reply to Pro Sandy • 8:05p, 9/21/25
Pro Sandy said:
The gospel isn't Catholic or protestant. The gospel is Jesus.

Anyone refusing to share it with others is violating the great commission of Jesus and if they view others as unworthy of receiving it are violating the teaching of God that we are made in His image and that Jesus came to offer salvation to all.


So the answer is "both"...or sort of, since there's only one. So suppose you as a Protestant knew that inly Catholic missionaries were available to reach these slaves. Would you want them to do so? (Rhetorical, I know how you will answer, I think).
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
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Pro Sandy
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In reply to 94chem • 8:08p, 9/21/25
AG
94chem said:
Pro Sandy said:
The gospel isn't Catholic or protestant. The gospel is Jesus.

Anyone refusing to share it with others is violating the great commission of Jesus and if they view others as unworthy of receiving it are violating the teaching of God that we are made in His image and that Jesus came to offer salvation to all.


So the answer is "both"...or sort of, since there's only one. So suppose you as a Protestant knew that inly Catholic missionaries were available to reach these slaves. Would you want them to do so? (Rhetorical, I know how you will answer, I think).
Looks like you have an specific point you are wanting to push and not have conversation since you say you already know my answer, so I'll disengage.
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dermdoc
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In reply to Thaddeus73 • 8:10p, 9/21/25
AG
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

This is a time for unity, not division. Let the Holy Spirit work.

And neither Protestantism or Catholicism is the way to heaven. Jesus is.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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94chem
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In reply to Pro Sandy • 8:14p, 9/21/25
Pro Sandy said:
94chem said:
Pro Sandy said:
The gospel isn't Catholic or protestant. The gospel is Jesus.

Anyone refusing to share it with others is violating the great commission of Jesus and if they view others as unworthy of receiving it are violating the teaching of God that we are made in His image and that Jesus came to offer salvation to all.


So the answer is "both"...or sort of, since there's only one. So suppose you as a Protestant knew that inly Catholic missionaries were available to reach these slaves. Would you want them to do so? (Rhetorical, I know how you will answer, I think).
Looks like you have an specific point you are wanting to push and not have conversation since you say you already know my answer, so I'll disengage.


I'm sorry. I didn't realize that was contentious. I was affirming what I thought you had answered in the previous post. If you have something to add, please go ahead.
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
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Mr. Thunderclap McGirthy
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8:15p, 9/21/25
AG
In Hoc Signo Vinces
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Quo Vadis?
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8:23p, 9/21/25
The Catholic Church is a gigantic superhighway created specifically by Christ that leads to Heaven, with refreshment stations along the way (the sacraments).

Protestants go wandering off the highway, roughing it through the forest, convinced that Jesus is so merciful he'll come save them anyway. They may be right, he is mercy incarnate, but I'm sure he'd rather you take the highway he made just for that purpose.
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plowboy1065
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8:29p, 9/21/25
S
Do those indigenous tribes just go straight to hell since they know of neither?
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94chem
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In reply to plowboy1065 • 8:47p, 9/21/25
plowboy1065 said:
Do those indigenous tribes just go straight to hell since they know of neither?


I believe there will be people in heaven who have never heard the name of Jesus. I hope that none of them knew me . Speaking if that, would you like to know anything about him?
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
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Mr. Thunderclap McGirthy
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In reply to plowboy1065 • 8:59p, 9/21/25
AG
plowboy1065 said:
Do those indigenous tribes just go straight to hell since they know of neither?


Welp!!! He got us, boys!!! Might as well give up this crazy god notion in our silly heads.

A mortal and finite man has pointed out that we don't always know why some things in life suck. That there are things beyond our understanding. Goodness. Science must surely have the answer. I'll check in on that after I get 7 or 8 Covid boosters.
In Hoc Signo Vinces
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FTACo88-FDT24dad
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11:46a, 9/22/25
AG
I thought he was talking about all those Bible-believing Protestants in the southern United States who quoted scripture in support of enslaving human beings.

Many Catholic saints opposed slavery, with Saint Patrick condemning it in antiquity and figures like Saint Josephine Bakhita and Saint Peter Claver dedicating their lives to helping enslaved people and fighting the institution of slavery in later centuries. St. Peter Claver baptized enslaved people and dedicated his life to ministering to them in Cartagena, Colombia, beginning in 1610. As a Jesuit missionary and the "Apostle to the Negroes," he provided immediate aid, care, and spiritual instruction, and it is estimated that he baptized over 300,000 enslaved Africans during his 40 years of service.

Other saints, such as Saint John of Matha, founded orders specifically to ransom captives, while Saints like Daniele Comboni and Henriette DeLille worked to end slavery and advocate for enslaved communities.

Saint Patrick (c. 415-493 AD) was the first to publicly condemn slavery, arguing that all men were created equal in God's eyes and deserved equal treatment under the law. Gregory of Nyssa (c. 335394 AD) went further than others by rejecting slavery as a practice and laying the moral groundwork for abolition centuries later, stating that slaves and masters shared the same origins and fate. Saint Ambrose and Saint Patrick himself made sacrifices to free slaves, seeing liberation as a worthy goal,

Saint John of Matha (1154-1213) founded the Order of the Most Holy Trinity for the Redemption of Captives (Trinitarians), which ransomed thousands of enslaved Christians during the Crusades. Saint Vincent de Paul (1581-1660) redeemed hundreds of slaves in the 17th century. Saint Peter Claver (1580-1654) ministered to enslaved Africans and became known as "Slave of the Slaves" and is the patron saint of ministry to African Americans.

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Thaddeus73
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2:10p, 9/22/25
AG
What I like about Protestants - Like Charlie Kirk, they aren't shy about sharing their faith in Jesus. They love the bible. I have many protestant friends who keep me up to speed on scripture...

What I dislike about Protestants - They only have 66 books in their bible. For the most part, they see the Eucharist as only a "symbol." They sometimes pull certain verses of the bible out of context, ignoring other verses.

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Dad-O-Lot
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2:19p, 9/22/25
AG
Thaddeus, I usually appreciate your posts. Not this time. To set it up as a zero-sum, either/or discussion is divisive in principle from the start.

Jesus said, "No one comes to the Father but by me". No individual, group, religion, or any other man-made philosophy has the authority to restrict how Jesus fulfills that "but by me" qualifier.

To offer the discussion as an "Us" or "Them" option is NOT honoring the memory of Charlie Kirk.
People of integrity expect to be believed, when they're not, they let time prove them right.
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Martin Q. Blank
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In reply to Thaddeus73 • 2:31p, 9/22/25
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

Protestantism is the way to Heaven. Catholicism is the way to purgatory.
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Quo Vadis?
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In reply to Martin Q. Blank • 2:35p, 9/22/25
Martin Q. Blank said:
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

Protestantism is the way to Heaven. Catholicism is the way to purgatory.


So essentially both are the way to heaven, in your opinion
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Martin Q. Blank
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In reply to Quo Vadis? • 2:40p, 9/22/25
Quo Vadis? said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

Protestantism is the way to Heaven. Catholicism is the way to purgatory.


So essentially both are the way to heaven, in your opinion

Heaven is glory. Purgatory is a medieval invention of punishment to satisfy for your sins after death. They are not the same.
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The Banned
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In reply to Martin Q. Blank • 2:45p, 9/22/25
Martin Q. Blank said:
Quo Vadis? said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

Protestantism is the way to Heaven. Catholicism is the way to purgatory.


So essentially both are the way to heaven, in your opinion

Heaven is glory. Purgatory is a medieval invention of punishment to satisfy for your sins after death. They are not the same.

This has been disproven 100 times over. But i guess you can keep banging that drum anyway...
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Martin Q. Blank
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In reply to The Banned • 2:51p, 9/22/25
The Banned said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Quo Vadis? said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

Protestantism is the way to Heaven. Catholicism is the way to purgatory.


So essentially both are the way to heaven, in your opinion

Heaven is glory. Purgatory is a medieval invention of punishment to satisfy for your sins after death. They are not the same.

This has been disproven 100 times over. But i guess you can keep banging that drum anyway...

I guess the honesty of this debate is now over.
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FTACo88-FDT24dad
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In reply to Martin Q. Blank • 2:57p, 9/22/25
AG
Martin Q. Blank said:
The Banned said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Quo Vadis? said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

Protestantism is the way to Heaven. Catholicism is the way to purgatory.


So essentially both are the way to heaven, in your opinion

Heaven is glory. Purgatory is a medieval invention of punishment to satisfy for your sins after death. They are not the same.

This has been disproven 100 times over. But i guess you can keep banging that drum anyway...

I guess the honesty of this debate is now over.


Do you think anything unholy or impure can have the beatific vision?
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The Banned
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In reply to Martin Q. Blank • 2:59p, 9/22/25
Martin Q. Blank said:
The Banned said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Quo Vadis? said:
Martin Q. Blank said:
Thaddeus73 said:
In the spirit of Charlie Kirk, I am proposing an honest, tough, no name-calling debate here on the R&P forum.

The topic: Protestantism, not Catholicism, is the way to Heaven.

Any takers?

Protestantism is the way to Heaven. Catholicism is the way to purgatory.


So essentially both are the way to heaven, in your opinion

Heaven is glory. Purgatory is a medieval invention of punishment to satisfy for your sins after death. They are not the same.

This has been disproven 100 times over. But i guess you can keep banging that drum anyway...

I guess the honesty of this debate is now over.

Tertullian. Origen. St Cyprian. St Augustine. St Ambrose. All talk about prayers for the dead and post-death purification. Even if purgatory isn't true, it's not a medieval invention. 2nd-3rd century invention at the very worst. You should know this by now.

Not to mention the bible verses that we would use. You'd say those verses should be interpreted differently. If only Jesus had left an authority on earth to help us do that....
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Martin Q. Blank
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In reply to The Banned • 3:18p, 9/22/25
And here too it is that we petition for forgiveness, where the sins are committed; here too are the temptations that allure and drive us to sinning; here, finally, the evil from which we wish to be freed. But in that other world none of these things will be found. -Augustine
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10andBOUNCE
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In reply to The Banned • 3:20p, 9/22/25
AG
My understanding is that much of the credit goes to Gregory the Great who took Augustine's musings on purgatory and ran with them.
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The Banned
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In reply to Martin Q. Blank • 3:23p, 9/22/25
Martin Q. Blank said:
And here too it is that we petition for forgiveness, where the sins are committed; here too are the temptations that allure and drive us to sinning; here, finally, the evil from which we wish to be freed. But in that other world none of these things will be found. -Augustine

Same as you proof text the bible, you proof text the fathers. Here's another from him:

  • City of God 21.26 (NPNF1, vol. 2, p. 469):
Quote:
"And it is not incredible that something of the same kind may take place even after this life. And it may be a matter that some believers are saved, not without passing through a certain purgatorial fire, more or less, according as they have loved the good things of this world more or less."


And there are plenty, plenty more. You should really brush up on this topic before tossing out nonsense
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The Banned
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In reply to 10andBOUNCE • 3:25p, 9/22/25
10andBOUNCE said:
My understanding is that much of the credit goes to Gregory the Great who took Augustine's musings on purgatory and ran with them.

Let's say that's true and there isn't a heap ton of evidence to the contrary. That makes it a 6th century invention. Not a medieval one, as was claimed. Martin hates the Catholic Church so much he doesn't bother checking his accusations for accuracy.
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10andBOUNCE
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In reply to Thaddeus73 • 3:25p, 9/22/25
AG
Thaddeus73 said:
They (Protestants) sometimes pull certain verses of the bible out of context, ignoring other verses.

Is your premise that Catholics are immune to this?
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10andBOUNCE
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In reply to The Banned • 3:26p, 9/22/25
AG
The Banned said:
10andBOUNCE said:
My understanding is that much of the credit goes to Gregory the Great who took Augustine's musings on purgatory and ran with them.

Let's say that's true and there isn't a heap ton of evidence to the contrary. That makes it a 6th century invention. Not a medieval one, as was claimed. Martin hates the Catholic Church so much he doesn't bother checking his accusations for accuracy.

Not to play semantics but the approx. period of the Medieval Church period was 500-1500. Obviously some sources will have different time periods cited, but this is roughly when it occurred. Gregory was pope 590-604. That is well within the bounds of the Medieval Church period.
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The Banned
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In reply to 10andBOUNCE • 3:31p, 9/22/25
10andBOUNCE said:
The Banned said:
10andBOUNCE said:
My understanding is that much of the credit goes to Gregory the Great who took Augustine's musings on purgatory and ran with them.

Let's say that's true and there isn't a heap ton of evidence to the contrary. That makes it a 6th century invention. Not a medieval one, as was claimed. Martin hates the Catholic Church so much he doesn't bother checking his accusations for accuracy.

Not to play semantics but the approx. period of the Medieval Church period was 500-1500. Obviously some sources will have different time periods cited, but this is roughly when it occurred. Gregory was pope 590-604. That is well within the bounds of the Medieval Church period.

Fair enough. Most claims of this sort focus on the actual word "purgatorium" being used in the 12th century. I assumed that's what he was driving at, as most do.

Guess it's a good thing I have quotes from far before that to save face
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Martin Q. Blank
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In reply to The Banned • 3:40p, 9/22/25
Quote:
And there are plenty, plenty more. You should really brush up on this topic before tossing out nonsense

I thought this was an honest debate "in the spirit of Charlie Kirk".
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