Tom Kazansky 2012 said:

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Trump will assume office.

War will stop because the US will twilight funding edit or outright flipping the bird to everyone involved.

Ukraine doesn't want to fight if they do not have funds as the funds coming in are the primary reason this hasn't been resolved and put to an end.

Russia will want their energy deal to keep the lights on.

Trump will negotiate all of this and Putin will get his Donbas and his piece of the pie, because no one on either side gives a **** about it and those people are culturally Russian anyway.

I will be here, again, telling all of you I told you so and we will be hundreds of billions poorer because Biden wanted to grease his skids and some Americans, including some here on F16, were stupid enough to believe this conflict was anything besides a poorly orchestrated offensive kept up by corruption from our democrat party.

This conflict stole money from the American people and funneled it back to campaign funds thus making democrats, the war industrial complex, and their buddies (some republicans) rich.

The losers in this are the American people and our currency as well as the young men that senselssly blew each other up.

---

If only Putin hadn't invaded, all of that which you mentioned would never have happened or been an issue.

Artorias said:

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Tom Kazansky 2012 said:

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This conflict stole money from the American people and funneled it back to campaign funds and making democrats, the war industrial complex, and their buddies (some republicans) rich.

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At least we got a lot of dead Russians out of the deal, right?

/warmongers

---

LOL, exactly.

Just a few things not discussed on this call:

• "I think more deep strikes into Russia are a great idea."
• 2025 'counter-offensive'
• Next trip to DC to speak to congress/panhandle etc.
• $1.5 trillion "Marshall plan" for Kiev
• Kiev plans to develop nuclear weapons of their own
• Nato membership

The Vindman bro's have no doubt been read-in on the transcript for approval already.

No Spin Ag said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

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B-1 83 said:

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Gaeilge said:

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ELON MUSK JOINED TRUMP'S CALL WITH ZELENSKY - AXIOS.

— FinancialJuice (@financialjuice) November 8, 2024

Oh...and Elon was on the call as well. I'm thinking this call consisted of "You're not going to see another dime and you better be ready to sit your ass down."

Your thoughts?

---

Do people really think Trump will cut Ukraine off?
Bwahahahahahaha……get ready to be seriously disappointed. He's not letting Putin have all of Ukraine. Fortunately, he smarter than the TexAgs Putin lovers.

---

Wanting to stop a war makes one a "Putin lover"? Please, tell us more.

---

Not admitting Putin didn't have to invade and that he can stop whenever he wants to, sure would make it seem that way.

---

More shallow analysis. Please keep going.

I really wish these threads didn't always devolve into "if Putin had never invaded, there wouldn't be a problem!"... or "Putin can end the war whenever he wants by taking his forces out of UKE!"

Yes, we all know that, Captain Obvious. Those statements are meaningless and irrelevant because Putin did invade and he is never going to just pick up and go home. How about we focus on actual potential solutions to end the war that live in reality.

BlueTaze said:

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B-1 83 said:

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Gaeilge said:

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…,,,

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…,,,

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What makes you think Putin wants "all of Ukraine"?

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Because he kind of said so.
Restoration of empire is the endgame for Russia's Vladimir Putin Analysis by Nathan Hodge, CNN 4 minute read Updated 8:33 AM EDT, Sat June 11, 2022
quote from the article

• Putin's words speak for themselves: What he is aiming for in Ukraine is the restoration of Russia as an imperial power.
• Alluding directly to his own invasion of Ukraine, Putin added: "Clearly, it fell to our lot to return and reinforce as well."
  
  Those remarks were swiftly condemned by Ukrainians, who saw them as a naked admission of Putin's imperial ambitions.
• And Putin's project of imperial restoration could in theory extend to other territories that once belonged to the Russian Empire or the Soviet Union, something that should raise alarms in all the countries that emerged from the collapse of the USSR.

Putin obviously wants to reassemble the Soviet Union.

Gigem314 said:

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I think Trump will continue aid...but it might come with conditions now moving forward. I could absolutely see him making certain demands and not just giving Ukraine a blank check with no plan.

---

This. No more milking this. Time to either use it to throw Russia out or else

The continued removal of Russian culpability and denial of Ukrainian agency in this matter is staggering. Yes, had the US and Europe not assisted, Russia would have overrun the entirety of Ukraine and the war would have been short lived. That doesn't equate to "peace".

Even in the far Donbas region, the % of residents who consider themselves more Russian than Ukrainian is roughly a 50/50 split along generational lines due to both Russia's suppression of the disparate national identities and languages of the countries it subjugated but also the illegal immigration of Russian citizens into eastern Ukraine. Arguing that as a logical justification for redrawing boundaries is like arguing for giving the RGV back to Mexico because of the strong ties to Mexican nationality and heritage of the older generations and the illegals.

From a pragmatic standpoint, boundaries will likely have to be redrawn to reach a compromise and end hostilities but any argument that tries to justify it beyond that is inherently flawed, both ignoring logic and grossly oversimplifying the dynamics of the region past and present.

I wonder if Elon was listening while continuing to maintain his Diablo 4 ranking?

I mean, if you're going to continue building your legendary real word status you might as well take the time to maintain your status in the imagined worlds while your at it.

Also, Democrats trying to convince the American public that it's illegal for Trump and Elon to be on the phone with foreign leaders in 3…2…1

As far as my real take. Trump isn't going to leave Ukraine high and dry. But he's certainly going to create accountability and yeah, he's probably going to fight for Europe to pay for more going forward, while also trying to play hard ball with Putin.

Will Putin outmaneuver Trump here? Maybe, but I'm cautiously optimistic that the brain trust surrounding Trump this time around will create a scenario where Russia is put in its place and Ukraine is no longer on a path to told destruction or a take over by Russia.

policywonk98 said:

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I wonder if Elon was listening while continuing to maintain his Diablo 4 ranking?

I mean, if your going to continue building your legendary real word status you might as well take the time to maintain your status in the imagined worlds while your at it.

Also, Democrats trying to convince the American public that it's illegal for Trump and Elon to be on the phone with foreign leaders in 3…2…1

---

You really have to wonder where he finds the time to grind Diablo and keep everything else churning. Impressive.

Teslag said:

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A lot of posters on this board will be very disappointed when Trump continues aid.


Remember, he was the first to give them lethal aid, and gave Speaker the Johnson the go head on the last aid package that was passed.

---

The war started when Biden was in office, in 2022. The saber rattling started in 2021, when Biden was in office. Trump may have given them "lethal" aid as a deterrent, but not to continue a forever war. Sorry to disappoint any neocons and warmongers on here, but there's going to be a deal and in the words of Lt Col Kilgore (Robert Duvall), "this war's gonna end."

Funky Winkerbean said:

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No Spin Ag said:

---

Funky Winkerbean said:

---

B-1 83 said:

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Gaeilge said:

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ELON MUSK JOINED TRUMP'S CALL WITH ZELENSKY - AXIOS.

— FinancialJuice (@financialjuice) November 8, 2024

Oh...and Elon was on the call as well. I'm thinking this call consisted of "You're not going to see another dime and you better be ready to sit your ass down."

Your thoughts?

---

Do people really think Trump will cut Ukraine off?
Bwahahahahahaha……get ready to be seriously disappointed. He's not letting Putin have all of Ukraine. Fortunately, he smarter than the TexAgs Putin lovers.

---

Wanting to stop a war makes one a "Putin lover"? Please, tell us more.

---

Not admitting Putin didn't have to invade and that he can stop whenever he wants to, sure would make it seem that way.

---

More shallow analysis. Please keep going.

---

More not showing me to be wrong.

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Teslag said:

---

A lot of posters on this board will be very disappointed when Trump continues aid.


Remember, he was the first to give them lethal aid, and gave Speaker the Johnson the go head on the last aid package that was passed.

---

The war started when Biden was in office, in 2022. The saber rattling started in 2021, when Biden was in office. Trump may have given them "lethal" aid as a deterrent, but not to continue a forever war. Sorry to disappoint any neocons and warmongers on here, but there's going to be a deal and in the words of Robert Duvall, "this war's gonna end."

---

Nobody has said differently, and wanting Ukraine to end this on favorable terms while defending itself is not "warmongering" no matter how many times people say so.

Artorias said:

---

I really wish these threads didn't always devolve into "if Putin had never invaded, there wouldn't be a problem!"... or "Putin can end the war whenever he wants by taking his forces out of UKE!"

Yes, we all know that, Captain Obvious. Those statements are meaningless and irrelevant because Putin did invade and he is never going to just pick up and go home. How about we focus on actual potential solutions to end the war that live in reality.

---

Admitting Putin didn't have to invade is much more than what was said by Putin's sycophants when he did invade. I'll take that as a good thing.

Trump and Elon need to be careful. They'll go after Elon like they did to General Flynn.

Rossticus said:

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The continued removal of Russian culpability and denial of Ukrainian agency in this matter is staggering. Yes, had the US and Europe not assisted, Russia would have overrun the entirety of Ukraine and the war would have been short lived. That doesn't equate to "peace".

Even in the far Donbas region, the % of residents who consider themselves more Russian than Ukrainian is roughly a 50/50 split along generational lines due to both Russia's suppression of the disparate national identities and languages of the countries it subjugated but also the illegal immigration of Russian citizens into eastern Ukraine. Arguing that as a logical justification for redrawing boundaries is like arguing for giving the RGV back to Mexico because of the strong ties to Mexican nationality and heritage of the older generations and the illegals.

From a pragmatic standpoint, boundaries will likely have to be redrawn to reach a compromise and end hostilities but any argument that tries to justify it beyond that is inherently flawed, both ignoring logic and grossly oversimplifying the dynamics of the region past and present.

---

More hyperbolic remarks.

Putin is an evil dictator and I don't like him. Now can you reread what is said now that I have agreed the Russians are run by a mad man?

Just because Putin is evil doesn't mean we have to dump billions into a **** hole war zone to have our resources and young lives ruined. There was a time and place for it before in past wars but this one is a bull**** front for our oligarchs and theirs to get rich. And some people are too emotionally attached (read: foolish) to realize that.

Did DJT tell Z to F.O?

No Spin Ag said:

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Funky Winkerbean said:

---

No Spin Ag said:

---

Funky Winkerbean said:

---

B-1 83 said:

---

Gaeilge said:

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ELON MUSK JOINED TRUMP'S CALL WITH ZELENSKY - AXIOS.

— FinancialJuice (@financialjuice) November 8, 2024

Oh...and Elon was on the call as well. I'm thinking this call consisted of "You're not going to see another dime and you better be ready to sit your ass down."

Your thoughts?

---

Do people really think Trump will cut Ukraine off?
Bwahahahahahaha……get ready to be seriously disappointed. He's not letting Putin have all of Ukraine. Fortunately, he smarter than the TexAgs Putin lovers.

---

Wanting to stop a war makes one a "Putin lover"? Please, tell us more.

---

Not admitting Putin didn't have to invade and that he can stop whenever he wants to, sure would make it seem that way.

---

More shallow analysis. Please keep going.

---

More not showing me to be wrong.

---

You are not wrong but that outcome will never happen and you are suggesting an inconsequential hope.

You are the boomer executive in the board room suggesting we throw pizza party to help morale and to show the employees we care about them so that we can boost sales.

To you it sounds great but to the rest of us... wtf man who cares?

Is there any space for Crimea to become it's own country, neither part of Russia or Ukraine?

Who?mikejones! said:

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Is there any space for crimes to become it's own country, neither part of Russia or Ukraine?

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Russia will never give up crimea

Who?mikejones! said:

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Is there any space for Crimea to become it's own country, neither part of Russia or Ukraine?

---

no.

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Teslag said:

---

A lot of posters on this board will be very disappointed when Trump continues aid.


Remember, he was the first to give them lethal aid, and gave Speaker the Johnson the go head on the last aid package that was passed.

---

The war started when Biden was in office, in 2022. The saber rattling started in 2021, when Biden was in office. Trump may have given them "lethal" aid as a deterrent, but not to continue a forever war. Sorry to disappoint any neocons and warmongers on here, but there's going to be a deal and in the words of Robert Duvall, "this war's gonna end."

---

The war started when Obama was in office

Then this war probably won't end anytime soon

Who?mikejones! said:

---

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Teslag said:

---

A lot of posters on this board will be very disappointed when Trump continues aid.


Remember, he was the first to give them lethal aid, and gave Speaker the Johnson the go head on the last aid package that was passed.

---

The war started when Biden was in office, in 2022. The saber rattling started in 2021, when Biden was in office. Trump may have given them "lethal" aid as a deterrent, but not to continue a forever war. Sorry to disappoint any neocons and warmongers on here, but there's going to be a deal and in the words of Robert Duvall, "this war's gonna end."

---

The war started when Obama was in office

---

That was Crimea.

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Who?mikejones! said:

---

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Teslag said:

---

A lot of posters on this board will be very disappointed when Trump continues aid.


Remember, he was the first to give them lethal aid, and gave Speaker the Johnson the go head on the last aid package that was passed.

---

The war started when Biden was in office, in 2022. The saber rattling started in 2021, when Biden was in office. Trump may have given them "lethal" aid as a deterrent, but not to continue a forever war. Sorry to disappoint any neocons and warmongers on here, but there's going to be a deal and in the words of Robert Duvall, "this war's gonna end."

---

The war started when Obama was in office

---

That was Crimea.

---

And what was Crimea a part of?

If Trump and team can pull off the Abraham Accords, he can get Russia and Ukraine to stop fighting. He just has to threaten Russias European energy markets, and promise that Ukraine won't enter NATO.

Tom Kazansky 2012 said:

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No Spin Ag said:

---

Funky Winkerbean said:

---

No Spin Ag said:

---

Funky Winkerbean said:

---

B-1 83 said:

---

Gaeilge said:

---

ELON MUSK JOINED TRUMP'S CALL WITH ZELENSKY - AXIOS.

— FinancialJuice (@financialjuice) November 8, 2024

Oh...and Elon was on the call as well. I'm thinking this call consisted of "You're not going to see another dime and you better be ready to sit your ass down."

Your thoughts?

---

Do people really think Trump will cut Ukraine off?
Bwahahahahahaha……get ready to be seriously disappointed. He's not letting Putin have all of Ukraine. Fortunately, he smarter than the TexAgs Putin lovers.

---

Wanting to stop a war makes one a "Putin lover"? Please, tell us more.

---

Not admitting Putin didn't have to invade and that he can stop whenever he wants to, sure would make it seem that way.

---

More shallow analysis. Please keep going.

---

More not showing me to be wrong.

---

You are not wrong but that outcome will never happen and you are suggesting an inconsequential hope.

You are the boomer executive in the board room suggesting we throw pizza party to help morale and to show the employees we care about them so that we can boost sales.

To you it sounds great but to the rest of us... wtf man who cares?

---

That's okay, although I'm no Boomer (puro pinche Gen-X) I'll enjoy the fact that I couldn't be refuted. And like a true Gen-Xer, I don't care of you don't care. I also expect you to not care if I care.

Peace.

ETA: I appreciate the healthy discourse.

Teslag said:

---

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Who?mikejones! said:

---

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Teslag said:

---

A lot of posters on this board will be very disappointed when Trump continues aid.


Remember, he was the first to give them lethal aid, and gave Speaker the Johnson the go head on the last aid package that was passed.

---

The war started when Biden was in office, in 2022. The saber rattling started in 2021, when Biden was in office. Trump may have given them "lethal" aid as a deterrent, but not to continue a forever war. Sorry to disappoint any neocons and warmongers on here, but there's going to be a deal and in the words of Robert Duvall, "this war's gonna end."

---

The war started when Obama was in office

---

That was Crimea.

---

And what was Crimea a part of

---

... not part of the same war. Recall the interim period is when all our pols and their sons and daughters started making corrupt bank in Ukraine. The West under Obama acquiesced in the takeover.

Tom Kazansky 2012 said:

---

Rossticus said:

---

The continued removal of Russian culpability and denial of Ukrainian agency in this matter is staggering. Yes, had the US and Europe not assisted, Russia would have overrun the entirety of Ukraine and the war would have been short lived. That doesn't equate to "peace".

Even in the far Donbas region, the % of residents who consider themselves more Russian than Ukrainian is roughly a 50/50 split along generational lines due to both Russia's suppression of the disparate national identities and languages of the countries it subjugated but also the illegal immigration of Russian citizens into eastern Ukraine. Arguing that as a logical justification for redrawing boundaries is like arguing for giving the RGV back to Mexico because of the strong ties to Mexican nationality and heritage of the older generations and the illegals.

From a pragmatic standpoint, boundaries will likely have to be redrawn to reach a compromise and end hostilities but any argument that tries to justify it beyond that is inherently flawed, both ignoring logic and grossly oversimplifying the dynamics of the region past and present.

---

More hyperbolic remarks.

Putin is an evil dictator and I don't like him. Now can you reread what is said now that I have agreed the Russians are run by a mad man?

Just because Putin is evil doesn't mean we have to dump billions into a **** hole war zone to have our resources and young lives ruined. There was a time and place for it before in past wars but this one is a bull**** front for our oligarchs and theirs to get rich. And some people are too emotionally attached (read: foolish) to realize that.

---

I've not said we had to nor should initially have dumped billions of dollars into Ukraine. And I've stated numerous times that despite Putin's designs on Ukraine, competent American leadership would have deterred/prevented it.

I think, ultimately, we agree on some of the same core concepts but disagree on the most productive way to get there. I think that an immediate hard stop forces negotiations from a position of weakness, which in the long term potentially puts European economic stability at risk, and ultimately impacting the US negatively given that they're our most significant trade partner.

This war needs to end, and end as quickly as possible. But, IMO, doing it in ham handed fashion out of an anxious desire to stop and move on could have a greater long term negative impact than ensuring that the board is set to the advantage of all parties not named Russia. The ultimate goal is to ensure that the resolution reached prevents a recurrent incident and safeguards against long term negative consequences for Ukraine, Europe, and the US.

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Teslag said:

---

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Who?mikejones! said:

---

Flavius Agximus said:

---

Teslag said:

---

A lot of posters on this board will be very disappointed when Trump continues aid.


Remember, he was the first to give them lethal aid, and gave Speaker the Johnson the go head on the last aid package that was passed.

---

The war started when Biden was in office, in 2022. The saber rattling started in 2021, when Biden was in office. Trump may have given them "lethal" aid as a deterrent, but not to continue a forever war. Sorry to disappoint any neocons and warmongers on here, but there's going to be a deal and in the words of Robert Duvall, "this war's gonna end."

---

The war started when Obama was in office

---

That was Crimea.

---

And what was Crimea a part of

---

... not part of the same war. Recall the interim period is when all our pols and their sons and daughters started making corrupt bank in Ukraine. The West under Obama acquiesced in the takeover.

---

It never stopped. They continued small fighting since then. It is absolutely and extension of the same war. Remember, it wasn't just Crimea. They Russians also invaded eastern Ukraine in 2014.

Funky Winkerbean said:

---

B-1 83 said:

---

Gaeilge said:

---

ELON MUSK JOINED TRUMP'S CALL WITH ZELENSKY - AXIOS.

— FinancialJuice (@financialjuice) November 8, 2024

Oh...and Elon was on the call as well. I'm thinking this call consisted of "You're not going to see another dime and you better be ready to sit your ass down."

Your thoughts?

---

Do people really think Trump will cut Ukraine off?
Bwahahahahahaha……get ready to be seriously disappointed. He's not letting Putin have all of Ukraine. Fortunately, he smarter than the TexAgs Putin lovers.

---

Wanting to stop a war makes one a "Putin lover"? Please, tell us more.

---

We all want the war to stop, but only one side wants to see Putin consolidate his gains while pretending we won't be back here for a third time in another decade or so when he takes yet another bite at the apple. That's like liberals thinking criminals will stop committing crime if they just stop prosecuting them. "Well, you can keep all the stuff you stole, but please don't do it again, again."

Gigem314 said:

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I think Trump will continue aid...but it might come with conditions now moving forward. I could absolutely see him making certain demands and not just giving Ukraine a blank check with no plan.

---

Zelensky is an addict. It is best to pull him slowly out of the pig trough.

I'm hoping Trump looks at Europe/Nato, and tells them the US is not funding the war any longer.

If they want to contribute, because they're nervous about their own backyard, then they should do so. We shouldn't help, until they've collectively matched our contributions to date.

it would highlight allegiances, and would shine a bright light on what he warned them about 8 years ago (being dependent on Russia for fuel).

My bets are he talked to Z-Man about what he needs for a negotiated peace deal.

Tom Kazansky 2012 said:

---

Trump will assume office.

War will stop because the US will twilight funding edit or outright flipping the bird to everyone involved.

Ukraine doesn't want to fight if they do not have funds as the funds coming in are the primary reason this hasn't been resolved and put to an end.

Russia will want their energy deal to keep the lights on.

Trump will negotiate all of this and Putin will get his Donbas and his piece of the pie, because no one on either side gives a **** about it and those people are culturally Russian anyway.

I will be here, again, telling all of you I told you so and we will be hundreds of billions poorer because Biden wanted to grease his skids and some Americans, including some here on F16, were stupid enough to believe this conflict was anything besides a poorly orchestrated offensive kept up by corruption from our democrat party.

This conflict stole money from the American people and funneled it back to campaign funds thus making democrats, the war industrial complex, and their buddies (some republicans) rich.

The losers in this are the American people and our currency as well as the young men that senselssly blew each other up.

---

Absolutely spot on! As is Yukon.

And to add to it

I am gob smacked by the unequivocal support of the Neo cons for a what has been known and proven to be one of the most corrupt if not the most corrupt western government in the world? It is the main reason they came out in support of Kamala!! To defend their gravy train and their wicked black enterprises. This is well known by anyone who has done international business. TRUMP KNOWS THIS

Ukraine is a cabal led state, has been for a long time.

TRUMP NOT ONLY KNOWS THIS (JD Vance clearly stated this in an interview) he was attacked in his presidency by this same group.

I am amazed that the Neo Cons here just have totally, or selectively, forgotten the very beginning of Trump's presidency was met with the Russia, Russia, Russia scam. Where did that start?

Or Hunter Biden's and get 10% for the big guy. Or Vindman, or 2 impeachments that were brought against Trump all over and from UKRAINE, Soros, the WEF. THE CABAL.

Pull your head out of your backsides!

Let me tell ya how this is going to end. Russia is going to keep what they have, Ukraine will not be allowed into NATO for an extended period of time.

The US is going to have great relations with Russia, and they would have the first time Trump was in but the Neocons war mongering, Russian haters, i.e the cabal, did not want that at all.

Mark my words this will happen, and it will be from this group that any assassination attempt comes from.