So the enemy just learned they can attack an American air craft carrier if they disguise themselves as a shipping vessel….?

I think that clicking sound off in the distance is the sound of enemies updating spreadsheets.

it only took three weeks for Trump and Hegseth's ending of DEI to leave our war ships captain-less and rudderless.

USA*** said:

---

Pretty big ship to run into or get hit by.

---

Thank god it was only carrying condoms

Things are not different now than they were 6 hours ago. When in congested waters a ship could have always tried to hit one of our warships. There often isn't anywhere to go to avoid collision.

Sea Speed said:

---

Things are not different now than they were 6 hours ago. When in congested waters a ship could have always tried to hit one of our warships. There often isn't anywhere to go to avoid collision.

---

Iow, it's only a matter of time…there's nothing the Navy can do about it?

I'm certain waterways, if a ship wants to hit you, there really won't be much you can do about it. Singapore straits for instance, if a vessel is overtaking you and decides they want to cross your bow at a quarter mile, there's not really anything you can do about it except try and minimize damage.

I'm not talking about the specifics of this case, but speaking generally, if you're approaching a pilotage area and there are vessels anchored on one side of you and a ship alters course on the other side of you so as to have a risk of collision, intentionally, you don't have too many options to avoid that risk, especially if the other ship is going to continue to intentionally try to have a collision. This has been true as long as ships have operated in congested waters.

The good news is that there really aren't going to be ships out there that are going to try to intentionally have a collision. I won't get in to why I don't really see that as being something that would happen intentionally, but unintentionally it's obviously a lot more common. I know zero facts of this case, just giving my general perspective as a Maritime professional.

Sea Speed said:

---

Here's current traffic in the area. Lots of ships moving lots of places and a lot of ships anchored. Was the bulk carrier coming out of the canal northbound? Could potentially see where they would cut across a TSS or something. Who knows.

---

what do you need a vice, bit, hammer, and pry bar from Lowe's for, Sea Speed?

Sea Speed said:

---

When I left my position as a captain on a USNS ship, we were told we needed to turn on AIS when in maneuvering situations specifically to avoid things like this. Maybe they could turn it off when they pick up the pilot, but when going through a congested waterway like this, to me, it is absolutely imperative to have operational.

And while it isn't the Truman, figured I'd throw a little TBT out there.

---

Thanks. Was genuinely asking and figured you are the poster were with the most direct and pertinent knowledge!

As a matter of trivia, the former president normally signed his name Harry S Truman - no period after the S - since it is not an abbreviation for anything - his middle name is just the letter S.

But when he was president, an educational institution told him the S without a period was bad form and would be confusing to people, so he was OK with a period being used.

In short, both with and without the period are correct, but he preferred no period..

Don't ask questions you don't want to know the answers to.

Next time the houthis or Iran will have the freighter packed with a crap ton of explosives.

Kenneth_2003 said:

---

Sea Speed said:

---

When I left my position as a captain on a USNS ship, we were told we needed to turn on AIS when in maneuvering situations specifically to avoid things like this. Maybe they could turn it off when they pick up the pilot, but when going through a congested waterway like this, to me, it is absolutely imperative to have operational.

And while it isn't the Truman, figured I'd throw a little TBT out there.

---

Thanks. Was genuinely asking and figured you are the poster were with the most direct and pertinent knowledge!

---

I'd like to point out that this doesn't necessarily apply to big Navy, but it applied to USNS ships. I can't recall the specific instruction in that regard, unfortunately.

FTAG 2000 said:

---

Next time the houthis or Iran will have the freighter packed with a crap ton of explosives.

---

I just don't see this as being viable. You would have to have the whole crew ok with it because they would all be on a suicide mission. If they took over a ship to do this it would be known well in advance and our ships wouldn't be anywhere near it unless it was a DDG to blow it up. Additionally, the schedules of our warships isn't known in advance. When I would follow a carrier group our plans would change 5x per day, even on the high side we had to maintain constant watch to keep up. If you had a bunch of militants on a ship that was waiting for the opportunity they would need to be able to operate that ship in order to actually get that opportunity. A ship is complicated, newer ones are more technologically complicated and older ones need a lot of know how to keep older systems functioning, and I don't think a group of terrorists is really going to have that know how, and if one is hijacked and crew forced to do all that work, it would be known relatively quickly simply due to how much information charterers and operators want from the ship regularly.

oh no said:

---

Sea Speed said:

---

Here's current traffic in the area. Lots of ships moving lots of places and a lot of ships anchored. Was the bulk carrier coming out of the canal northbound? Could potentially see where they would cut across a TSS or something. Who knows.

---

what do you need a vice, bit, hammer, and pry bar from Lowe's for, Sea Speed?

---

He was trying to be brave...

What's this rock? | TexAgs

I would think if it was intentional, it was a spontaneous response by a crewman with an opportunity that presented itself by chance. From the sounds of it, it occurred at night after passing through the canal and dropping off the pilot. Any chance the senior crew were in bed and it was somebody junior piloting the ship?

I mean sure there is a chance, but still think it's extremely unlikely. There would also have been an AB on watch and he would have to deal with that. The likelihood of the officer in watch being Indian, Filipino, Chinese or Malaysian is quite high. Other nationalities you may see are Croatian, Ukrainian, Russian or Greek, but much less likely imo. None of those nationalities really lend themselves to something like this, but again, anything is possible I guess.

Sea Speed said:

---

I mean sure there is a chance, but still think it's extremely unlikely. There would also have been an AB on watch and he would have to deal with that. The likelihood of the officer in watch being Indian, Filipino, Chinese or Malaysian is quite high. Other nationalities you may see are Croatian, Ukrainian, Russian or Greek, but much less likely imo. None of those nationalities really lend themselves to something like this, but again, anything is possible I guess.

---

Obligatory

When I was at TAMUG ages ago, they had just started Navy ROTC in the hopes of getting officers who knew how to sail before they were commissioned. I've heard our ships aren't the best at, say, following the rules of the road.

I have a friend who was a licensed officer in the merchant marine reserves. Great guy. Good watch stander. He decided to go active duty and the navy promptly put him in the engine room.

G Martin 87 said:

---

2000AgPhD said:

---

Fox is reporting this - does anyone have more information? Said it was with a cargo ship, but no specifics.

---

How did anything but another Navy ship get close enough to an aircraft carrier to collide with it??

---

Must have been an Asian driver

Assuming this is the kind of mishap that leads to the CO being drummed out of the Navy quickly.

Maybe but it could also have been the least bad outcome depending on the circumstances.

One thing I thought was odd is that the captain on these is always a former pilot from my understanding.

Sid Farkas said:

---

So the enemy just learned they can attack an American air craft carrier if they disguise themselves as a shipping vessel….?

I think that clicking sound off in the distance is the sound of enemies updating spreadsheets.

---

Not really. You are forgetting the rules in wartime are different.

Yes, theoretically, there could be that `one shot' at the opening of a war, but it probably wouldn't be sunk or especially decisive. If with true leadership fearless to use power such as at present --- that would be the end of the entity responsible or the start of a general war. For dubious initial gain.

Once war is underway, the rules of approach become different.

Face it, there is no way to be hyper secure in global peacetime. The very nature of peacetime is a greater risk acceptance for other intangibles over security.

Sea Speed said:

---

Maybe but it could also have been the least bad outcome depending on the circumstances.

One thing I thought was odd is that the captain on these is always a former pilot from my understanding.

---

I'm assuming you mean air not water?

Yes that's correct.

Sea Speed said:

---

Maybe but it could also have been the least bad outcome depending on the circumstances.

One thing I thought was odd is that the captain on these is always a former pilot from my understanding.

---

I'm assuming you mean air not water?

Kenneth_2003 said:

---

Sea Speed said:

---

Maybe but it could also have been the least bad outcome depending on the circumstances.

One thing I thought was odd is that the captain on these is always a former pilot from my understanding.

---

I'm assuming you mean air not water?

---

Behold: the super rare post-reply double post

chickencoupe16 said:

---

Kenneth_2003 said:

---

Sea Speed said:

---

Maybe but it could also have been the least bad outcome depending on the circumstances.

One thing I thought was odd is that the captain on these is always a former pilot from my understanding.

---

I'm assuming you mean air not water?

---

Behold: the super rare post-reply double post

---

I was so confused at first because I could have sworn I replied to him already.

Sea Speed said:

---

Yes that's correct.

---

I presume you are aware of the old black shoe vs brown shoe divide in carrier aviation? May have played a role here but wouldn't conclude that without more evidence.

I am not.

Sea Speed said:

---

I am not.

---

Oh, given the posts kind of though that. Very briefly, in carrier aviation you had an early divide between the hot-shot daredevil aviators who pioneered so much (brown shoes, aviation in our case) vs black shoes, old style Navy officers -- who were more surface ship and operations oriented. It goes alot deeper than this, but on the most basic level think of it this way -- black shoes think of carriers as a ship first, part of a fleet. Brown shoes, or aviation minded, see it as their home airfield --- they put less stress on the "ship being" part.

Makes sense.

titan said:

---

Sea Speed said:

---

I am not.

---

Oh, given the posts kind of though that. Very briefly, in carrier aviation you had an early divide between the hot-shot daredevil aviators who pioneered so much (brown shoes, aviation in our case) vs black shoes, old style Navy officers -- who were more surface ship and operations oriented. It goes alot deeper than this, but on the most basic level think of it this way -- black shoes think of carriers as a ship first, part of a fleet. Brown shoes, or aviation minded, see it as their home airfield --- they put less stress on the "ship being" part.

---

I would guess too that there is bias towards pilots because they are the only large group in the Navy that have combat experience in today's world and really since WW2. Whether that translates to being a good captain/naval tactician or not, it impresses.