It is completely dependent on the corporation. I have consulted for the fortune 100 for 15 years. It was about 50/50 on whether or not they even have enough team members in a given location to make work from the office make sense.

I can tell you this much. Very rarely does a client pay for our travel anymore as we would just sit in an empty client building and get on calls with their team working from home and across the world. That used to be a standard 20% add on to all of our engagements for our travel.

We have been dropping floor after floor across the country including Chicago, NYC, Dallas, etc. As we continue to need less space. We are lucky we decided to sell all of our real estate circa 2015 and start leasing everything.

I worked for JPM Chase for a few years, and am a huge fan of Jamie Dimon.
That is a massive organization, and has made some screw ups along the way, but by and large they've avoided anything major. And compared to some of their peers, that's impressive. As for all the fines they've accumulated, you also have to keep in mind all the government regulators that depend on shaking down all the banks/financial companies to keep their budgets funded.

One of the points I've heard Dimon make is that WFH is perfectly fine…Just not at JPM Chase. I've long felt that if you had two similar companies, except one was mostly WFH and the other was in person….one would eat the lunch of the other one in the long term. Even more so in the world of finance.

If I was advising a young person that was debating taking a job with JPMC in the office, or some other company that offered WFH…get your butt to the office at JPMC every day! No doubt.

No opinion on whether it's a good place to work but the Madhoff billions went through a single checking account. How is it possible nothing suspicious was noticed? I suspect it was and negligence or worse was the reason. Dimond was the CEO when the bank enabled the largest fraud in history. Not sure how he's escaped liability for that.

jja79 said:

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No opinion on whether it's a good place to work but the Madhoff billions went through a single checking account. How is it possible nothing suspicious was noticed? I suspect it was and negligence or worse was the reason. Dimond was the CEO when the bank enabled the largest fraud in history. Not sure how he's escaped liability for that.

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Ever heard of an escrow account? Not unusual at all.

I am not a Jamie Dimon fan. I'll just leave it there.

I'm not familiar with the specifics of the bank account structure Madoff used, but I'd ask how you'd have structured it.

Some folks prefer a single account with a multitude of sub accounts.

infinity ag said:

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Jamie Dimon is an out of touch "let them have cake" type of moron.

I don't necessarily disagree with the RTO mandate, but this clueless boomer needs to realize that work in 2025 is international. In my previous job, we were asked to work from the office, but we all came in after 1.5 hours of commute only to get on calls all day with people in different parts of the US and the world. I never even talked to anyone in the office so what was the point of coming in? Everyone is on calls and shouting over each other. Meeting rooms were scarce as well.

I think he is on his way out anyway so he doesn't care. He's managed the company well for 20 years but he is now losing it. Does he think people can't waste time in the office? Dumbo.

Boomers like him who are stuck in the 70s need to be put to pasture.

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Dimon is right. GTFO if you don't want to do the job.

aggiehawg said:

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I have always liked Dimon, going back to the 2008 financial crisis. Saw that it was a s*** sandwich and that every bank was going to have to take a big bite to get through it and then fairly quickly get out of it. He managed the crisis well, in my view.

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Surprised you would like a tyrannical democrat jerk like him.

Every business owner worth a **** knows WFH is horrible for business. It's massively abused and deeply unproductive.

The ONLY benefit for a company that does remote is the ability to hire international employees that are much much cheaper.

Get to work you lazy hippies.

Got to fill up those CRE

Dan Scott said:

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WFH/remote work is so bad they say, but then corporations are laying off Americans and hiring Indians.

That makes no sense.

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Chicken/egg. All those people who insisted they were more efficient remotely than in the office forced management to make the rational choice of hiring a different remote worker for 1/10 of the cost.

There are definitely industries that have been hurt by WFH. Stuff that depended on an apprentice type model has slowly gotten worse. In-person communication skills have slipped while electronic (email/zoom/etc) has gotten better. Not sure what the answer is but I do know that he's the guy in charge there. He was specifically responding to a petition that some people signed. He has every right to tell people the business is not a ****ing democracy. You don't get to vote to overturn his decisions.

Screw this guy and this whole line of thinking. Any of yall agreeing are dinosaurs. I've worked every combination of full time office, full time remote, full time travel and now hybrid. Work/life balance doesn't have to mean loss productivity or missed social encounters. I personally think hybrid is ideal, but it's not always possible. 3/4 of my company is full time remote. If there was one thing good that came from Covid, it was the recognition globally that the world can still function without the monotonous schlep of work commutes and trying to manage child care, etc with a full office week. We have leveled up. People like Dimon are has beens with their line of thinking. I'll never go back to 5 days a week in office. Also, most of yall vying for this must live close to work and not be dealing with the 45 min or longer commutes in overly crowded cities like the rest of us. My commute was 15 mins a decade ago for reference. Work sucks…remote work makes it suck less.

HoustonAg9999 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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HoustonAg9999 said:

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He's very crass for a CEO just make a policy change if you want to, he just wants attention.

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It was leaked and not by him. And if you think that was crass, you haven't met many CEOs of large companies.

It ain't bean ball in how they got there in the first place.

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met plenty of CEO's that dont act like that, if you have to remind people you are in charge and the boss you failed as a leader, also not good for retaining top talent.

Also, hes a pretty slimily business man gotten JP morgan fined numerous times.

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That language and rage is New York banker culture. Loud, brash, offensive, and pedal to the metal 110% of the time.

Every bank gets fined from time to time. Too many rules and regulations but to run afoul of one every now and again. I'd look at how frequently and how much before concluding anything.

Wouldn't it be glorious if large American corporations hire the Musk DOGE team to cut out waste , fraud and abuse ! !

These work from home threads always get dominated by the IT crowd, who may very well be able to work from home doing their job.

But i truly believe most of the country's workforce isn't as efficient from home as they are from the office. And i'm not talking about efficient in their whole entire personal day, i.e. commute time, etc. I'm talking about their actual job tasks.

And he is 1000% correct about the damage it does to the young people just entering the workforce. Working from home, isolated behind your computer screen, will not get you the full training, knowledge, experience, and yes, socialization you need to advance your career. If you're in your forties, and you're not looking to climb the career ladder, then fine. Find a job you can do in your jammies at home.

But - and this is not a blanket statement for every industry, but a generalized statement for most industries - young people that are still trying to figure out their place and still trying to figure out exactly what they want to make a career out of? Those people need to report to an office.

Also....

https://www.yahoo.com/news/bosses-fed-remote-4-main-095000401.html

Quote:

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No. 1: Remote work is bad for new hires and junior employees

No. 2: Workers admit that remote work (sometimes) causes more problems than in-person work

No. 3: Remote workers put in 3.5 hours less per day of work compared to in-person workers

No. 4: Productivity plummets on days when everyone is working remotely (anecdotally)

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It's impossible to know just from a rant, but it sounds like the WFH failure started at the top. If he knows it's being abused, then get after the abusers. Usually, making a few examples sets the tone for everyone else. If his employees aren't accountable WFH, they won't be at the office, either. And it is much easier to hide there.

Pinochet said:

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Dan Scott said:

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WFH/remote work is so bad they say, but then corporations are laying off Americans and hiring Indians.

That makes no sense.

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Chicken/egg. All those people who insisted they were more efficient remotely than in the office forced management to make the rational choice of hiring a different remote worker for 1/10 of the cost.

There are definitely industries that have been hurt by WFH. Stuff that depended on an apprentice type model has slowly gotten worse. In-person communication skills have slipped while electronic (email/zoom/etc) has gotten better. Not sure what the answer is but I do know that he's the guy in charge there. He was specifically responding to a petition that some people signed. He has every right to tell people the business is not a ****ing democracy. You don't get to vote to overturn his decisions.

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That's some b.s. right there. Moving jobs overseas was going on a full quarter-century before Covid, which is when WFH really started to become an option for most. It's also amazing how many people say moving jobs to India and elsewhere is rarely cost-effective in the long run, yet it still keeps happening on a regular basis. It's very "penny wise, pound foolish" behavior.

chris1515 said:

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I'm not familiar with the specifics of the bank account structure Madoff used, but I'd ask how you'd have structured it.

Some folks prefer a single account with a multitude of sub accounts.

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They're supposed to report suspicious activities. I'd say thousands of wire transfers totalling billions would meet the requirements.

People can screw off in the office as well as at home.

Gen Xers are taking over and they better be willing to be flexible if they want the best and brightest workers. I'm not advocating full remote but hybrid is the absolute minimum now. A day or two at home per week is reasonable.

Several decades in banking so yes I've heard of it. Every person employed at a bank is required to take suspicious activity training annually. Still wondering why Dimon isn't in prison.

My 67 year old sister is 100% wfh handling disability claims for a large insurance company. She statistically averages handling about 40 cases in a day. Her much younger colleagues doing the exact same job from home handle on average 12 cases per day.

This is why people are being asked to return to the office even though their jobs could 100% be done from home if most were conscientious employees. How can this be a surprise to anyone?

Rockdoc said:

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100% agree with him. Don't want to do it his way? Theres the door.

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Yep. Or start your own company and allow everyone to work from home, or work from the golf course, or work from the lake. Of course, none of them will.

Pinochet said:

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Dan Scott said:

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WFH/remote work is so bad they say, but then corporations are laying off Americans and hiring Indians.

That makes no sense.

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Chicken/egg. All those people who insisted they were more efficient remotely than in the office forced management to make the rational choice of hiring a different remote worker for 1/10 of the cost.

There are definitely industries that have been hurt by WFH. Stuff that depended on an apprentice type model has slowly gotten worse. In-person communication skills have slipped while electronic (email/zoom/etc) has gotten better. Not sure what the answer is but I do know that he's the guy in charge there. He was specifically responding to a petition that some people signed. He has every right to tell people the business is not a ****ing democracy. You don't get to vote to overturn his decisions.

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How old are you? I've been in high tech since I graduated from a&m in the 80s. We started offshoring to reduce cost around the year 2000. WFH for American workers had nothing to do with it.

Logos Stick said:

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Pinochet said:

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Dan Scott said:

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WFH/remote work is so bad they say, but then corporations are laying off Americans and hiring Indians.

That makes no sense.

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Chicken/egg. All those people who insisted they were more efficient remotely than in the office forced management to make the rational choice of hiring a different remote worker for 1/10 of the cost.

There are definitely industries that have been hurt by WFH. Stuff that depended on an apprentice type model has slowly gotten worse. In-person communication skills have slipped while electronic (email/zoom/etc) has gotten better. Not sure what the answer is but I do know that he's the guy in charge there. He was specifically responding to a petition that some people signed. He has every right to tell people the business is not a ****ing democracy. You don't get to vote to overturn his decisions.

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How old are you? I've been in high tech since I graduated from a&m in the 80s. We started offshoring to reduce cost around the year 2000. WFH for American workers had nothing to do with it.

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Logos Stick said:

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People can screw off in the office as well as at home.

Gen Xers are taking over and they better be willing to be flexible if they want the best and brightest workers. I'm not advocating full remote but hybrid is the absolute minimum now. A day or two at home per week is reasonable.

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id say about 2 hours is wasted in the office, between bsing, coffee breaks, and lunch are people this clueless and endless meetings that go nowhere.

And that doesn't count another 1-2 hours of noodling around on the Internet.

Reading this thread has made me aware that too many of you spend way too much time yapping on the phone with members of your "team." Now hang up the damn phone and do some work ya gabby asses!

one safe place said:

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Reading this thread has made me aware that too many of you spend way too much time yapping on the phone with members of your "team." Now hang up the damn phone and do some work ya gabby asses!

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Reading this thread reminds me of what's wrong with our country today. The dang younger generation just doesn't want to work hard.

aggiehawg said:

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MemphisAg1 said:

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It's a natural reaction to those who abused WFH policies. I saw it within my company. There were people who didn't abuse it, but many others who did. Proving it to HR so that you can fire someone is difficult, so in this case they're just changing the policy for everyone. Sucks if you weren't an abuser, but that's the way organizational rules go.

The labor market has softened the past couple years, with numerous RIFs underway and announced almost daily. Employers have most of the leverage. If/when it goes back the other way, employees will have more leverage to demand a return to more WFH. Just the way the market rolls.

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Also a natural reaction for a CEO looking at commercial leasing market. Hate him or not, Dimon is still a leader. His company has exposure on commercial office space loans. Not just his company's leases but many many other commercial properties.

There is a longer play here. Work the problem.

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JPMC is not out over their skis on office space. They only lend to institutional investors for RE. Which means 65% or less LTV and extremely deep pockets. They aren't lending money to your avg CRE developer.