Proof that Trump has broken a lot of people.

AtticusMatlock said:

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Well hopefully they don't just show up one day and be like "hey here's the new system we just came up with yesterday."

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Would be perfectly acceptable to say "hey, here is the new system we came up yesterday to monitor and comment on fraud in the Air Traffic Control management, and we will report that fraud to the alternative press" would be absolutely good for the government.

New system, that would be a career lifetime job for a big group of people. This is why they will get mad. 3-4 years of negotiations, with dinners and lunches too.

If you're against really bright people willing to update our antiquated air traffic control systems, you might be an idiot.

Are they fixing it or assessing it?

Media distorts reality..

TxLawDawg said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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People are up in arms assuming Elon will cheat the system whilst turning a blind eye for DECADES (and even now) to those that ACTUALLY cheated the system.

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FIFY

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clw04 said:

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How does it work any other way - SpaceX engineers come in and write requirements and then put it out for bid for other contractors to deliver a product that looks like SpaceX User interfaces since the requirements likely are based on them? We will see where all this goes, but the level of insight that they have into business strategies and such across all of government is ripe for issues with the conflict of interest protection being "trust us". Having Elon not involved in "day-to-day" operations doesn't relieve from conflict of interest - no one will know until years down the road for items like this.

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A bit of a weird flex against Elon, but having submitted proposals to government contracts for nearly 2 decades now, I can confirm that this is actually how most all procurements worth responding to work.

We never bid any contract that is based solely on lowest cost wins. Its stupid for the gubmit / contract admin and incredibly stupid for the contractor.

Instead, the better procurements focus on relevant experience with a HEAVY nod to previous experience working in such contracts. The only thing that it is second to in important is actual experience with the type of work being done.

I am thinking that regardless of DOGE, the company that can return rocket ships the size of a skyscraper to land itself back on a launch pad (repeatedly) and who has launched a complete revolution in communications across the globe to the remotest of areas including the polar regions and who has millions of cars out there they can locate within feet on a map... maybe they have some experience that would be applicable to ATC.

Oh, and they are doing this all in the open and they WELCOME competition.

Painting Elon as a bad guy is the ultimate in fool's errand.

I don't know what they will recommend, but if the technology changes significantly, I do know that refitting a lot of aircraft with new avionics won't be cheap and might drive a lot of GA users out of the sky.

SpaceX is ONE of the companies that could do this. They shouldn't just start without a selection process.

AW73 said:

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I don't know what they will recommend, but if the technology changes significantly, I do know that refitting a lot of aircraft with new avionics won't be cheap and might drive a lot of GA users out of the sky.

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Probably just a Starlink terminal - Sure SpaceX will hand them out for free.

MemphisAg1 said:

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I'm more concerned about bringing rapid improvements to air safety than I am if Elon somehow gets a business advantage from this.

Biden and team had every opportunity to revitalize this area but chose instead to focus on DEI, school board parents, LGBTQIA+, letting in illegals, and all kinds of other stuff.

I welcome a fresh set of eyes on this.

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Agree.
I am okay if Musk makes money as long as he fixes the system to a reasonable level of permanency. It is a small price to pay.

Honestly. with 433B, Musk cares 2 sheets about money. He wants power at this point and does not want to tarnish his name.

flown-the-coop said:

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clw04 said:

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How does it work any other way - SpaceX engineers come in and write requirements and then put it out for bid for other contractors to deliver a product that looks like SpaceX User interfaces since the requirements likely are based on them? We will see where all this goes, but the level of insight that they have into business strategies and such across all of government is ripe for issues with the conflict of interest protection being "trust us". Having Elon not involved in "day-to-day" operations doesn't relieve from conflict of interest - no one will know until years down the road for items like this.

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A bit of a weird flex against Elon, but having submitted proposals to government contracts for nearly 2 decades now, I can confirm that this is actually how most all procurements worth responding to work.

We never bid any contract that is based solely on lowest cost wins. Its stupid for the gubmit / contract admin and incredibly stupid for the contractor.

Instead, the better procurements focus on relevant experience with a HEAVY nod to previous experience working in such contracts. The only thing that it is second to in important is actual experience with the type of work being done.

I am thinking that regardless of DOGE, the company that can return rocket ships the size of a skyscraper to land itself back on a launch pad (repeatedly) and who has launched a complete revolution in communications across the globe to the remotest of areas including the polar regions and who has millions of cars out there they can locate within feet on a map... maybe they have some experience that would be applicable to ATC.

Oh, and they are doing this all in the open and they WELCOME competition.

Painting Elon as a bad guy is the ultimate in fool's errand.

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I don't think Elon is a bad guy - I just don't think anybody should have the amount of information/access he is aggregating without some level of oversight. We don't have oversight because that "would slow them down".

And they likely are not doing it out in the open - If they wanted to do it out in the open they could invite press and other potential bidders to the "sessions." Announcing that they are going to go do this and then doing it behind closed doors isn't doing it in the open. They are going to get insight into items that we used to red team for our proposals.

FriscoKid said:

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VegasAg86 said:

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FriscoKid said:

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I'm not liking the Musk relationship very much TBH. If he left his day job for 4 years then I would 100% appreciate his support, but he really can profit with the direction the government takes. His influence with AI is one thing. Space X and electric vehicles are another.

I hope his partnership with DC will help everyone and not be slanted to his company interests.

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You think he's going to try something shady while he's under a media microscope that rivals what was done to Trump?

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He already has. Look at how he is trying to crush OpenAI which would benefit X. I think he's an absolutely brilliant man that is doing revolutionary things, but I'm worried about replacing one swamp with another one. No crony capitalism from either side. Just, cut our bloated government.

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Can you provide a link to your claim that Elon is using the Federal government to crush OpenAI?

Musk co-founded OpenAI with the expectation it would remain non-profit and open source as a counter to private, for-profit AI. It did not.

clw04 said:

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I don't think Elon is a bad guy - I just don't think anybody should have the amount of information/access he is aggregating without some level of oversight. We don't have oversight because that "would slow them down".

And they likely are not doing it out in the open - If they wanted to do it out in the open they could invite press and other potential bidders to the "sessions." Announcing that they are going to go do this and then doing it behind closed doors isn't doing it in the open. They are going to get insight into items that we used to red team for our proposals.

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How exactly are they going behind closed doors and what value is there to have Auntie Maxine and liber press with the collective IQ of a donut sitting at the computer terminal with them?

Would love to hear a practical solution about how this "oversight" would work. Corrupt OMB looking at it? Corrupt OIGs looking at it? Corrupt GAO looking at it?'

Maybe we assign the FBI to take an in depth and impartial look at DOGE>

It probably won't hurt anything to have people that are competent in tech to look into the FAA.

Quote:

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New ideas, new ways and old-fashioned common sense can improve government while reducing its costs. Let me give you an example. The United States Government is the largest purchaser of vacuum tubes in the Western world. This is a Federal Aviation Administration vacuum tube. Good solid 1895 technology. This is the updated mid-1950s version. When you fly in America, vacuum
tubes in the air traffic control system keep you safe. Our purchasing rules are so complicated and so wasteful that our government has not been able in seven years to figure out how to
replace vacuum tubes with this. This is a microchip that has the computing power of 3 million vacuum tubes. So today's government operates this way; after we remake it, the government of the future will operate this way.

My point is this: this same reliance on the obsolete pervades most of the federal government--not just in regard to computers but in regard to its thinking, its attitudes, its approaches to problems.

-Newt Gingrich, 1995

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Even if the FAA updated all their systems in 1995, they are probably still running on that 1995 technology today.

Additionally, a new perspective on things that isn't starting from a place of "this is how its always worked" can often help to radically improve how systems function.

Is there any worthless sacred cow the left won't gnash their teeth to protect?

Not when they need the sacred cow to keep grifting and retain power.

Dems will fight until the last one loses their election.

Which is actually a good thing. They continue to tear themselves apart from within. We should encourage them.

clw04 said:

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flown-the-coop said:

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FriscoKid said:

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I'm not liking the Musk relationship very much TBH. If he left his day job for 4 years then I would 100% appreciate his support, but he really can profit with the direction the government takes. His influence with AI is one thing. Space X and electric vehicles are another.

I hope his partnership with DC will help everyone and not be slanted to his company interests.

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What existed before Elon was that bureaucrats would "retire" to the private sector then leverage their connections in Congress and in the Executive to define requirements for new government "needs" then talk to their other friends about how to meet those "needs" then lobby the funding and millions later we have a study saying we need a new system and a failed implementation due to HUB/Section 3/DEI requirements.

At least with Elon it is all happening in the open. And he doesn't come across as someone who just wants more money or to be even more richer. He seems to view the wealth as a means to keep pursuing endeavors he believes benefits mankind.

Let him and Trump do their thing. If they are successful and make some bank doing it, we all benefit. With the libs, they get their wealth through destruction. So this is better.

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Disagree that we shouldn't care - The system needs to be fixed but replacing one issue with a different set of issues isn't the way to do it. There needs to be transparency across the board and Elon's companies getting insight into systems and being able to manipulate that for their interest isn't really any better than the prior issues, its just different.

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Jesus. Do you read the **** you post?

Take a break, and have a good day.

TexAgs91 said:

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SpaceX is ONE of the companies that could do this. They shouldn't just start without a selection process.

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Yeah, lets give Boeing a shot at it first. Maybe they can do it as well and cheaply as they did with Starliner, and Elon can come in and pick up the pieces after they have hopelessly F'd it up again.