The Ex Officio Director said:

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IIIHorn said:

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Texas velvet maestro said:

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IIIHorn said:

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Texas velvet maestro said:

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The politically driven folks who demand the display of the 10 commandments probably will be the first to ignore them. I feel it's strictly for our entertainment. performative.

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Have you heard about the agnostic, dyslexic insomniac?

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stayed up all night and with much difficulty I read the book on it. wasn't sure.

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A guy who lies awake all night wondering whether or not there is a dog.

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Is the dog there in a psychical form? The dog could be in the mental form, or an emotional form. Don't forget the psychology aspect of the mind or spiritual. After all, some cultures worship a dog. Mind provoking thoughts on whether or the dog is really there or not. Me personally, I keep it simple when laying in bed night. What can I set on fire that would fun to watch burn.

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The spiral begins when you realize that littering is prohibited.

To be against the ten commandments is also antisemitic, just sayin.

BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

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"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

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"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

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You didn't answer his question.

How does that establish a religion?


Do you take issue with the Pledge of Allegiance? Or US Motto?

Im Gipper said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

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"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

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You didn't answer his question.

How does that establish a religion?


Do you take issue with the Pledge of Allegiance? Or US Motto?

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Whether I do or not (I don't) is irrelevant to the conversation. It's the squeaky wheel we're talking about.

IIIHorn said:

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...Ten...Commandments.

Your nonanswer speaks volumes.

Im Gipper said:

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Your nonanswer speaks volumes.

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I did answer. How does insisting on worshipping a single deity not an attempt at establishing religion in a public school?

If one religion gets to display their founding principles or imagery in classrooms, how are you going to legally stop other religions from doing the same?

The only way around that I can think of would be to display them in a historical context instead of a religious one.

Quote:

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How does insisting on worshipping a single deity not an attempt at establishing religion in a public school?

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LOL. No one is insisting any worship anything!

Im Gipper said:

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Quote:

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How does insisting on worshipping a single deity not an attempt at establishing religion in a public school?

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LOL. No one is insisting any worship anything!

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"Commandment"

these posts saying the 10 commandments being posted means kids are required to worship God are trolling, right? no way that is serious.



(1) government control over religious
doctrine, governance, and church personnel? nope

(2) compulsory church attendance? nope

(3) compelled financial support, especially in the form of land grants and religious taxes? nope

(4) prohibitions on worship in dissenting churches? nope

(5) use of church institutions for civil functions? nope

6) restriction of political participation to members of the established church? nope

BMX Bandit said:

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these posts saying the 10 commandments being posted means kids are required to worship God are trolling, right? no way that is serious.

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Nobody has said that.

B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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these posts saying the 10 commandments being posted means kids are required to worship God are trolling, right? no way that is serious.

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Nobody has said that.

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Quote:

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How does insisting on worshipping a single deity not an attempt at establishing religion in a public school?

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same poster

B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

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"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

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It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

I don't think a 9-8 decision from a very conservative circuit is hold up very well in front of SCOTUS, should they choose to take up the case.

96AgGrad said:

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If one religion gets to display their founding principles or imagery in classrooms, how are you going to legally stop other religions from doing the same?

The only way around that I can think of would be to display them in a historical context instead of a religious one.

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What are you talking about? You just write laws that permit us to do the thing. And then do it. Like right now the 10 commandments are hanging in TX classrooms, and other religions' precepts aren't. We did it. We're doing it right now.

BMX Bandit said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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these posts saying the 10 commandments being posted means kids are required to worship God are trolling, right? no way that is serious.

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Nobody has said that.

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Quote:

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How does insisting on worshipping a single deity not an attempt at establishing religion in a public school?

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same poster

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Those are the Commandments that say that at the front of the classroom, and they form the backbone of Judeo- Christian religions. Why have them on the classroom at all if none of them mean anything? While the school and teacher are not forcing children to worship that way, the concept that you can't see an obvious Constitutional issue here is troubling. No doubt posters would be delighted with passages from the Koran insisting on reverence for Muhammad.

Bob Lee said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

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"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

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I'd be willing to bet they feel the same way about your religion, whatever that is.

HTownAg98 said:

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Bob Lee said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

---

"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

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I'd be willing to bet they feel the same way about your religion, whatever that is.

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Which is why they don't have the 10 commandments in the classrooms wherever it is they're from. But I'd be willing to bet they encourage their religion's conception of the good in their societies. I'd be willing to bet they don't give a damn what I think.

Bob Lee said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

---

"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

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According to you. There's billions of people worldwide and tens of millions in the U.S. who think yours is a complete joke.

Quote:

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he concept that you can't see an obvious Constitutional issue here is troubling. No doubt posters would be delighted with passages from the Koran insisting on reverence for Muhammad.

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your issue is with whether its a good idea or not. you haven't even come close to explaining how this establishes a religion. and thats okay, because it doesn't. At least not in the relevant meaning at the time it was drafted. do you really think the founders would have thought it did?

the entire school of thought on why it would not be permissible is from the Lemon test which the court has been trying to walk away from since it was first written.


i would not like it one bit if Minnesota passed a law saying a passage from the Koran had to be hung in a classroom. It would pretty much signify the final death of that state. but that is completely different question than what is constitutional.


let us know how that " 9-0 two second SCOTUS slap down incoming" prediction turns out

Bob Lee said:

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HTownAg98 said:

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Bob Lee said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

---

"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

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I'd be willing to bet they feel the same way about your religion, whatever that is.

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Which is why they don't have the 10 commandments in the classrooms wherever it is they're from. But I'd be willing to bet they encourage their religion's conception of the good in their societies. I'd be willing to bet they don't give a damn what I think.

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Which is pretty much why 5-10 can be posted with ZERO pushback and wasted tax dollars fighting it.

[ol]

You shall have no other gods before Me.

You shall not make idols.

You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain.

Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.

Honor your father and your mother.

You shall not murder.

You shall not commit adultery.

You shall not steal.

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

You shall not covet.

[/ol]


.

Ervin Burrell said:

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Bob Lee said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

---

"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

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According to you. There's billions of people worldwide and tens of millions in the U.S. who think yours is a complete joke.

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Yeah but when their children go to class, they'll see the precepts of my religion hanging on the wall. Because there are more people in the U.S. who believe in the claims of Christianity than the 10s of millions who think it's a joke.

So people are free to worship as they choose, the state is free to mandate the posting of religious scripture, as long as its the one YOU like.

Bob Lee said:

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Ervin Burrell said:

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Bob Lee said:

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B-1 83 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

---

"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

---

According to you. There's billions of people worldwide and tens of millions in the U.S. who think yours is a complete joke.

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Yeah but when their children go to class, they'll see the precepts of my religion hanging on the wall. Because there are more people in the U.S. who believe in the claims of Christianity than the 10s of millions who think it's a joke.

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So your religion is "the right one" solely because it has a plurality of people who follow it?

Ervin Burrell said:

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Bob Lee said:

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Ervin Burrell said:

---

Bob Lee said:

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B-1 83 said:

---

BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

---

"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

---

According to you. There's billions of people worldwide and tens of millions in the U.S. who think yours is a complete joke.

---

Yeah but when their children go to class, they'll see the precepts of my religion hanging on the wall. Because there are more people in the U.S. who believe in the claims of Christianity than the 10s of millions who think it's a joke.

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So your religion is "the right one" solely because it has a plurality of people who follow it?

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Ervin Burrell said:

---

Bob Lee said:

---

Ervin Burrell said:

---

Bob Lee said:

---

B-1 83 said:

---

BMX Bandit said:

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" Ludicrous rationalizing by the court" is lib speak for "originalism"

Please explain how this establishes religion.

---

"Thou shall have no other gods before me" might be an issue if you are Buddhist or Animist or a host of other religions.

---

It's not possible to govern ourselves on the premise that every religion and philosophy are true. Americans, and nominally Christian ones, have been suckered into thinking it's possible to permit things Christians believe are an offense to God, forbid Christians in government from appealing to their faith in the law, remove all signs and symbols of Christianity from public view, and arrive at similar views about the treatment of people, human dignity, rights, obligations, importance of community, and the family as the fundamental political unit.

Why should I care what eastern or African religions think about the 10 commandments in our schools? They're false religions. Why should we trade the greatest society in human history, built by Christians on Christian ideas, so we can lower our moral standards to accommodate people with some BS worldview that we imported from poor and vicious societies half way around the world?

---

According to you. There's billions of people worldwide and tens of millions in the U.S. who think yours is a complete joke.

---

Yeah but when their children go to class, they'll see the precepts of my religion hanging on the wall. Because there are more people in the U.S. who believe in the claims of Christianity than the 10s of millions who think it's a joke.

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So your religion is "the right one" solely because it has a plurality of people who follow it?

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No. Christianity is true and a plurality of Americans are Christian.

This might be a good one for the classroom wall - "Do not take infidels as friends" Quran 3:28.

Ag_of_08 said:

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So people are free to worship as they choose, the state is free to mandate the posting of religious scripture, as long as its the one YOU like.

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Don't you believe in freedom? Why do you have such a problem with Christians imposing their will on you?

I.mean, they're clearly victims when they don't get to impose that will. Highly oppressed with a church every couple miles...

Ag_of_08 said:

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I.mean, they're clearly victims when they don't get to impose that will. Highly oppressed with a church every couple miles...

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If I want it to be permitted to hang the 10 commandments in classrooms, and you want to forbid it, we're at an impasse. The law can't be silent. It'll either be permitted or forbidden (or required I guess would be the 3rd option). All of these are an imposition of the will. One of us HAS to impose on the other if neither of us will change our minds. If you want them taken down, you or someone has to compel the people who put them there to take them down.

Let me ask you, why are you upset about it? I mean, really why do you care?

Im not mad about you being permitted it.

I'm angry that the state is requiring a single religions creed to be displayed.

Allowing is not the same thing is requiring. You're trying to conflate them to be a victim, but thenlaw says "shall", not "may", which is where it tramples the constitution

IIIHorn said:

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The Ex Officio Director said:

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IIIHorn said:

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Texas velvet maestro said:

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IIIHorn said:

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Texas velvet maestro said:

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The politically driven folks who demand the display of the 10 commandments probably will be the first to ignore them. I feel it's strictly for our entertainment. performative.

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Have you heard about the agnostic, dyslexic insomniac?

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stayed up all night and with much difficulty I read the book on it. wasn't sure.

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A guy who lies awake all night wondering whether or not there is a dog.

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Is the dog there in a psychical form? The dog could be in the mental form, or an emotional form. Don't forget the psychology aspect of the mind or spiritual. After all, some cultures worship a dog. Mind provoking thoughts on whether or the dog is really there or not. Me personally, I keep it simple when laying in bed night. What can I set on fire that would fun to watch burn.

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The spiral begins when you realize that littering is prohibited.

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This is the type of questions that keep me up at night. or is it the Red Bull at 1 in the morning.

Im angry about it because it imposes on peoples right to freely practice their religion. SHALL is the imposition, and in this case establishes a religion as official by default.