ABATTBQ11 said:

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AgLiving06 said:

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CDUB98 said:

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Quote:

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mandating a bio blend that is not road legal.

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How is it not road legal?

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Most/All diesel truck/car companies will say you are at risk of voiding your warranty if you use a biodiesel blend above 20% and have issues with the engine.

Portland, in their quest to reduce emissions, currently mandates diesel blends of 15% biodiesel.

However, in May, they are mandating a minimum biodiesel blend of 50%. In theory, you could do something like: 50% diesel, 30% renewable diesel, 20% biodiesel, but that's an operational nightmare. Or you could do 50%diesel/50% renewable diesel, but again, a bit of an operational mess to align a terminal that way.

So the simplest option is just to move to a fully renewable diesel product.

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Just because it might void your warranty doesn't mean it isn't legal

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Fair...it could be offered. Nobody would buy it. So technically legal, but there's nobody who would actually sell it at a station.

Oregon also doesn't have a single refinery.

Californians deserve everything they've voted for. Nothing that happens there saddens me anymore.

KentK93 said:

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This will impact more than just CA. Arizona gets a lot of their gasoline & diesel from CA.

Quote:

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Refineries are fleeing the Golden State as regulations drive operating costs 26 to 37% higher than the national average. Chevron moved its operations from the Bay Area to Texas, while Phillips 66 powered down its 140,000-barrel-per-day Los Angeles refinery in October.
Ariza warned that as refineries go dark, more Californians will also skip town, noting that the oil and gas industry supports 536,770 jobs and pumps $338 billion into the state's economy, the outlet reported.
He said Valero's accelerated shutdown comes after the company scrapped its crude oil contracts back in October.

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https://hotair.com/david-strom/2026/02/09/california-has-become-uninvestable-n3811709

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Didn't the regulations/ laws in California completely screw up a very expensive pipeline they had? They weren't pumping enough oil through pipelines to keep them from gumming up and clogging up and hardening or something like that? I saw a video of some oil man talking about how they would completely lose this huge expensive pipeline and wouldn't be able to clean it out if they didn't increase production and flow, but the DEMs had so many new rules, laws, and regulations in place trying to push their green energy agenda that they couldn't bring the production and flow of oil back up...

Ramdiesel said:

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KentK93 said:

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This will impact more than just CA. Arizona gets a lot of their gasoline & diesel from CA.

Quote:

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Refineries are fleeing the Golden State as regulations drive operating costs 26 to 37% higher than the national average. Chevron moved its operations from the Bay Area to Texas, while Phillips 66 powered down its 140,000-barrel-per-day Los Angeles refinery in October.
Ariza warned that as refineries go dark, more Californians will also skip town, noting that the oil and gas industry supports 536,770 jobs and pumps $338 billion into the state's economy, the outlet reported.
He said Valero's accelerated shutdown comes after the company scrapped its crude oil contracts back in October.

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https://hotair.com/david-strom/2026/02/09/california-has-become-uninvestable-n3811709

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Didn't the regulations/ laws in California completely screw up a very expensive pipeline they had? They weren't pumping enough oil through pipelines to keep them from gumming up and clogging up and hardening or something like that? I saw a video of some oil man talking about how they would completely lose this huge expensive pipeline and wouldn't be able to clean it out if they didn't increase production and flow, but the DEMs had so many new rules, laws, and regulations in place trying to push their green energy agenda that they couldn't bring the production and flow of oil back up...

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I don't know but wouldn't be surprised. CA is stage one thinker and doesn't think about 2nd & 3rd order affects.

A massive fire erupting at Chevron refinery in El Segundo, California is the consequence of the Democrat's disastrous progressive policies. I am originally from Fremont, California, and I have noticed the continuing decline of California. I moved to Texas in August 2013, and I have stayed in Texas, even after graduating from Texas A&M in May 2017. My parents encouraged me to move to Texas because they knew that if I had stayed in California, I would be paying a higher cost of living for a lower quality of life. I still visit my parents 2 or 3 times per year.

I saw a news report earlier this morning that gas prices in CA has jumped 40 cents. Found it:

https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/california-gas-prices-surge-40-cents-just-2-weeks-impact-refinery-closures-weighs

Having to import gasoline:
https://hotair.com/tree-hugging-sister/2026/02/16/annals-of-climate-cult-madness-ca-now-importing-gasoline-from-check-notes-4000-miles-away-n3811950

Is now a good time to point out that California's refineries sourced approximately:

23% of crude from in-state production

13% from Alaska, and

64% from foreign imports
with the foreign share rising due to declining domestic output and excessive regulation on CA producers.… https://t.co/iKbeGUmImb

— US Oil & Gas Association (@US_OGA) January 15, 2026

It's only just beginning for them.

Lets break this down in terms of insanity

Rerouting through Bahamas : 15 - 30 cents per gallon

California taxes: $1.32 to $1.78 per gallon depending on your county

Projected increase by end of 2026 +$4.00 over the national average due to California regulating out instate… https://t.co/6BTYcdrVet

— Tracy Shuchart (𝒞𝒽𝒾 ) (@chigrl) February 16, 2026

We'll just have to see if their state GOP finally takes advantage of this Democrat-created fiasco.

Quote:

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64% from foreign imports
with the foreign share rising due to declining domestic output and excessive regulation on CA producers.…

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Time for Trump to impose 50% tariffs on all imported oil & gas.

Just Kidding.

Sort of

nortex97 said:

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It's only just beginning for them.

Lets break this down in terms of insanity

Rerouting through Bahamas : 15 - 30 cents per gallon

California taxes: $1.32 to $1.78 per gallon depending on your county

Projected increase by end of 2026 +$4.00 over the national average due to California regulating out instate… https://t.co/6BTYcdrVet

— Tracy Shuchart (𝒞𝒽𝒾 ) (@chigrl) February 16, 2026

We'll just have to see if their state GOP finally takes advantage of this Democrat-created fiasco.

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The Cali Dems have permanently rigged the elections in their favor.

They've reached the point of socialism where they can't vote themselves out of it anymore.

Maroon Dawn said:

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nortex97 said:

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It's only just beginning for them.

Lets break this down in terms of insanity

Rerouting through Bahamas : 15 - 30 cents per gallon

California taxes: $1.32 to $1.78 per gallon depending on your county

Projected increase by end of 2026 +$4.00 over the national average due to California regulating out instate… https://t.co/6BTYcdrVet

— Tracy Shuchart (𝒞𝒽𝒾 ) (@chigrl) February 16, 2026

We'll just have to see if their state GOP finally takes advantage of this Democrat-created fiasco.

---

The Cali Dems have permanently rigged the elections in their favor.

They've reached the point of socialism where they can't vote themselves out of it anymore.

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I truly feel bad for the conservatives who are stuck in Cali. But the rest of them deserve this misery.

KentK93 said:

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I saw a news report earlier this morning that gas prices in CA has jumped 40 cents. Found it:

https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/california-gas-prices-surge-40-cents-just-2-weeks-impact-refinery-closures-weighs

Having to import gasoline:
https://hotair.com/tree-hugging-sister/2026/02/16/annals-of-climate-cult-madness-ca-now-importing-gasoline-from-check-notes-4000-miles-away-n3811950

Is now a good time to point out that California's refineries sourced approximately:

23% of crude from in-state production

13% from Alaska, and

64% from foreign imports
with the foreign share rising due to declining domestic output and excessive regulation on CA producers.… https://t.co/iKbeGUmImb

— US Oil & Gas Association (@US_OGA) January 15, 2026

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I'd like to own gas stations just across the California border. I'm old enough to remember gas lines.

ts5641 said:

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Maroon Dawn said:

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nortex97 said:

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It's only just beginning for them.

Lets break this down in terms of insanity

Rerouting through Bahamas : 15 - 30 cents per gallon

California taxes: $1.32 to $1.78 per gallon depending on your county

Projected increase by end of 2026 +$4.00 over the national average due to California regulating out instate… https://t.co/6BTYcdrVet

— Tracy Shuchart (𝒞𝒽𝒾 ) (@chigrl) February 16, 2026

We'll just have to see if their state GOP finally takes advantage of this Democrat-created fiasco.

---

The Cali Dems have permanently rigged the elections in their favor.

They've reached the point of socialism where they can't vote themselves out of it anymore.

---

I truly feel bad for the conservatives who are stuck in Cali. But the rest of them deserve this misery.

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I hope they have a chance to move because Democracy is a sham in the People's Republik of Kalifornia

Science Denier said:

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I'd like to own gas stations just across the California border. I'm old enough to remember gas lines.

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It's not a quick process to just drive back and forth across the border. You're talking about hours sitting in line

AlaskanAg99 said:

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Science Denier said:

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I'd like to own gas stations just across the California border. I'm old enough to remember gas lines.

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It's not a quick process to just drive back and forth across the border. You're talking about hours sitting in line

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Sorry, I should have clarified. Border STATES.

ts5641 said:

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Maroon Dawn said:

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nortex97 said:

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It's only just beginning for them.

Lets break this down in terms of insanity

Rerouting through Bahamas : 15 - 30 cents per gallon

California taxes: $1.32 to $1.78 per gallon depending on your county

Projected increase by end of 2026 +$4.00 over the national average due to California regulating out instate… https://t.co/6BTYcdrVet

— Tracy Shuchart (𝒞𝒽𝒾 ) (@chigrl) February 16, 2026

We'll just have to see if their state GOP finally takes advantage of this Democrat-created fiasco.

---

The Cali Dems have permanently rigged the elections in their favor.

They've reached the point of socialism where they can't vote themselves out of it anymore.

---

I truly feel bad for the conservatives who are stuck in Cali. But the rest of them deserve this misery.

---

After 3 years of Los Angeles, Covid lockdowns, I bailed out in late 2023.

The only Conservatives I know who are still there are stuck due to caring for their old people, or because their children have disabilities and they believe that they won't be able to find help as good elsewhere without breaking the bank.

Up in the Northern and Eastern parts of California, there are a lot of conservatives who need to break off and form The State of Jefferson.

Science Denier said:

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AlaskanAg99 said:

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Science Denier said:

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I'd like to own gas stations just across the California border. I'm old enough to remember gas lines.

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It's not a quick process to just drive back and forth across the border. You're talking about hours sitting in line

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Sorry, I should have clarified. Border STATES.

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Yeah, so that's also an issue as CA provides gas stock to both AZ and NV, so even if you're on the border you're not going to see a big difference to make the juice worth the squeeze. There's pretty much nothing in So Cal that makes driving to Yuma worthwhile and it's a long distance. Even if you're in the north I'm sure CA is proving southern OR their stock since OR has Zero refineries. CA is in a real bind. A very big self inflicted bind and there's is absolute no easy, or quick, way out of this.

I'm not understanding how they are getting locally refined gas via the Bahamas. So the refineries have enough spare capacity to produce their blend? It was my understanding that was not the case.

Or, more likely, they are replacing gas for the rest of the country with the Cali blend since they can make more money from it?! If so, that will drive up the price for everyone. The rest of the country will subsidize California gas. Trump needs to put a stop to it.

AlaskanAg99 said:

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Science Denier said:

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AlaskanAg99 said:

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Science Denier said:

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I'd like to own gas stations just across the California border. I'm old enough to remember gas lines.

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It's not a quick process to just drive back and forth across the border. You're talking about hours sitting in line

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Sorry, I should have clarified. Border STATES.

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Yeah, so that's also an issue as CA provides gas stock to both AZ and NV, so even if you're on the border you're not going to see a big difference to make the juice worth the squeeze. There's pretty much nothing in So Cal that makes driving to Yuma worthwhile and it's a long distance. Even if you're in the north I'm sure CA is proving southern OR their stock since OR has Zero refineries. CA is in a real bind. A very big self inflicted bind and there's is absolute no easy, or quick, way out of this.

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Well, the California gas tax is way below the Arizona gas tax, so there's that.

I actually went and looked because I was curious.

On Friday (market was closed yesterday):

Price Indexes were as followed for gasoline:

LA: 2.3710
SF: 2:4860

CHI: 1.5635 (RBOB)
NYH: 1.8920 (RBOB).
GC: 1.8160 (RBOB)

I used RBOB because most major cities tend to require it now, so it keeps it pretty like for like.

So while high, the indexes themselves don't justify the 2x price in California.

However, then we get to the state programs.

Somebody mentioned state taxes, and to no surprise it looks like California is the highest. Google says they are at 70 cpg right now vs a place like Texas at 20.

The last piece is that California charges "LCFS and CAR" on every gallon. (Low Carbon Fuel Standard and Cap at the Rack).

Friday Pricing:
LCFS: 20.23 cpg
CAR: 22.70 cpg.

All combined you end up with: High Gas Prices + High taxes + "Environmental" taxes and you see why the direct price costs more.

Then we factor in that all of the fuel providers to the stations also pay these premiums which simply get passed on and it's not hard to see why they are so much more expensive.

Maroon Dawn said:

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nortex97 said:

---

It's only just beginning for them.

Lets break this down in terms of insanity

Rerouting through Bahamas : 15 - 30 cents per gallon

California taxes: $1.32 to $1.78 per gallon depending on your county

Projected increase by end of 2026 +$4.00 over the national average due to California regulating out instate… https://t.co/6BTYcdrVet

— Tracy Shuchart (𝒞𝒽𝒾 ) (@chigrl) February 16, 2026

We'll just have to see if their state GOP finally takes advantage of this Democrat-created fiasco.

---

The Cali Dems have permanently rigged the elections in their favor.

They've reached the point of socialism where they can't vote themselves out of it anymore.

---

I'm not sure people would vote themselves out of it even if they could. The vast majority of Democrats are brain washed morons at this point. If they revolted over this at the polls, they would simply replace someone like Gavin with someone even more left wing.

In fact, we've already seen this in action in Chicago where the rage against Beetlejuice's policies resulted in an even more left wing idiot elected to office.

These are very dumb people who can't be trusted to vote with common sense and logic.

Good question and I have no idea as to the answer. My guess would be that they are…not changing their blend requirements.

Note the US only has like 55 US-flagged tankers among the thousands so the transport costs would be much higher from a Texas/US port.

Quote:

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We should note that the gas from the Bahamas is coming indirectly, in some cases, but there's an old law that complicates things.

Quote:

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Under the Jones Act, any goods shipped between US ports must travel on US-built, owned and operated vessels. Those tankers are in short supply and expensive to charter. There are about 55 Jones Act-compliant oil tankers worldwide, compared with more than 7,000 oil tankers globally.
"Even if there are such vessels, they would charge more than a foreign-flagged vessel would," said Martin Davies, director of Tulane University's Maritime Law Center.

---

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Hopefully they charge lots of carbon taxes on whatever deliveries are made for their subjects.

Science Denier said:

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KentK93 said:

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I saw a news report earlier this morning that gas prices in CA has jumped 40 cents. Found it:

https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/california-gas-prices-surge-40-cents-just-2-weeks-impact-refinery-closures-weighs

Having to import gasoline:
https://hotair.com/tree-hugging-sister/2026/02/16/annals-of-climate-cult-madness-ca-now-importing-gasoline-from-check-notes-4000-miles-away-n3811950

Is now a good time to point out that California's refineries sourced approximately:

23% of crude from in-state production

13% from Alaska, and

64% from foreign imports
with the foreign share rising due to declining domestic output and excessive regulation on CA producers.… https://t.co/iKbeGUmImb

— US Oil & Gas Association (@US_OGA) January 15, 2026

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I'd like to own gas stations just across the California border. I'm old enough to remember gas lines.

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Buc-ee's needs to build on right across the state border in AZ & NV.

Logos Stick said:

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I'm not understanding how they are getting locally refined gas via the Bahamas. So the refineries have enough spare capacity to produce their blend? It was my understanding that was not the case.

Or, more likely, they are replacing gas for the rest of the country with the Cali blend since they can make more money from it?! If so, that will drive up the price for everyone. The rest of the country will subsidize California gas. Trump needs to put a stop to it.

---

Think of it like a blended whiskey or a bond whiskey (the Irish kind, not bottled-in-bond). With the blended, a distiller would use multiple types of their own or even purchased whiskey to make their blend. In the Irish bond whiskey, merchants would buy new whiskey by the cask and age it themselves in their own blend of barrel types (oak, sherry, wine, etc) to make their own flavors.

California gets blend stock from different places, including California, and blends most of what they use themselves. They do end up buying about 10% of what they need from overseas refiners/blenders because they lack the capacity to always meet demand. The refinery closures will give them to import a lot more, and they're trying to get the infrastructure in place to handle that. They currently don't have enough to process that kind of influx from tankers or the tank space to hold a lot of it as a buffer between supply and use.

AlaskanAg99 said:

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Yeah, so that's also an issue as CA provides gas stock to both AZ and NV, so even if you're on the border you're not going to see a big difference to make the juice worth the squeeze. There's pretty much nothing in So Cal that makes driving to Yuma worthwhile and it's a long distance. Even if you're in the north I'm sure CA is proving southern OR their stock since OR has Zero refineries. CA is in a real bind. A very big self inflicted bind and there's is absolute no easy, or quick, way out of this.

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Mexico is were people in San Diego will go for gas I suspect.

KentK93 said:

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AlaskanAg99 said:

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Yeah, so that's also an issue as CA provides gas stock to both AZ and NV, so even if you're on the border you're not going to see a big difference to make the juice worth the squeeze. There's pretty much nothing in So Cal that makes driving to Yuma worthwhile and it's a long distance. Even if you're in the north I'm sure CA is proving southern OR their stock since OR has Zero refineries. CA is in a real bind. A very big self inflicted bind and there's is absolute no easy, or quick, way out of this.

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Mexico is were people in San Diego will go for gas I suspect.

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They can check out the donkey show and try to avoid a cartel kidnapping while there.

Ya'll need to look at a map.

There are no major population centers in CA close to AZ/NV. No one is going to hop across a state line to get a discount on gas. Especially because CA refines and supplies AZ/NV, it's a bit less expensive due to tax law, but then you have to add back transportation costs. For instance, San Diego to Yuma is 175mi one way. You'd have to buy a crapton of gallons to make that economically feasible. Maybe people in Tahoe can benefit but for the large majority it's not an option.

Same with going to MX....they're going to spend HOURS in traffic and again, that really only benefits people in San Diego.

CA is now going to FO regarding their ridiculous O&G policy.

Couple of things:

1) Kalifornia does not supply all of AZ and NV. There are refiners on the west side of the Rockies that do as well. HF Sinclair, Chevron, and Marathon come to mind.

2) People driving into Kalifornia, and there are not a small amount, would love to gas up before jumping the border. Anecdote: I watch David Friebuger's YouTube channel and he, on multiple occasions, has done exactly this.

KentK93 said:

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Science Denier said:

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KentK93 said:

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I saw a news report earlier this morning that gas prices in CA has jumped 40 cents. Found it:

https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/california-gas-prices-surge-40-cents-just-2-weeks-impact-refinery-closures-weighs

Having to import gasoline:
https://hotair.com/tree-hugging-sister/2026/02/16/annals-of-climate-cult-madness-ca-now-importing-gasoline-from-check-notes-4000-miles-away-n3811950

Is now a good time to point out that California's refineries sourced approximately:

23% of crude from in-state production

13% from Alaska, and

64% from foreign imports
with the foreign share rising due to declining domestic output and excessive regulation on CA producers.… https://t.co/iKbeGUmImb

— US Oil & Gas Association (@US_OGA) January 15, 2026

---

I'd like to own gas stations just across the California border. I'm old enough to remember gas lines.

---

Buc-ee's needs to build on right across the state border in AZ & NV.

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Wouldn't help much.

Two reasons:

1. Who from LA is driving to the AZ/NM boarder to get gas? Or from SF?

2. Guess where the supply for AZ/NV come from?

ABATTBQ11 said:

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Logos Stick said:

---

I'm not understanding how they are getting locally refined gas via the Bahamas. So the refineries have enough spare capacity to produce their blend? It was my understanding that was not the case.

Or, more likely, they are replacing gas for the rest of the country with the Cali blend since they can make more money from it?! If so, that will drive up the price for everyone. The rest of the country will subsidize California gas. Trump needs to put a stop to it.

---

Think of it like a blended whiskey or a bond whiskey (the Irish kind, not bottled-in-bond). With the blended, a distiller would use multiple types of their own or even purchased whiskey to make their blend. In the Irish bond whiskey, merchants would buy new whiskey by the cask and age it themselves in their own blend of barrel types (oak, sherry, wine, etc) to make their own flavors.

California gets blend stock from different places, including California, and blends most of what they use themselves. They do end up buying about 10% of what they need from overseas refiners/blenders because they lack the capacity to always meet demand. The refinery closures will give them to import a lot more, and they're trying to get the infrastructure in place to handle that. They currently don't have enough to process that kind of influx from tankers or the tank space to hold a lot of it as a buffer between supply and use.

---

I must be misunderstanding your post. I know that Cali has a special blend. That's the root issue here. They have shut down two refineries that make their particular recipe. The rest of the country does not normally make their blend.

Are you saying they can get some generic base from other states, and post process it to make their blend? That's not what I'm reading. I'm reading that some of the gulf refineries can and are producing CARB-complaint gas and are shipping it to Cali via the Bahamas (because of the Jones Act). They are not shipping some generic stock that Cali then uses to ultimately create its CARB gas. Any gas imported into Cali must already be CARB complaint, and it gets that way via the initial refinery, not post processing. Cali is not doing any additional processing to make the gas complaint.

Thus, my point remains. Unless the gulf refineries have spare capacity to make the Cali CARB gas, doing so impacts the supply for everyone else. I don't know if that's the case, but that would be the result.

CDUB98 said:

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Couple of things:

1) Kalifornia does not supply all of AZ and NV. There are refiners on the west side of the Rockies that do as well. HF Sinclair, Chevron, and Marathon come to mind.

2) People driving into Kalifornia, and there are not a small amount, would love to gas up before jumping the border. Anecdote: I watch David Friebuger's YouTube channel and he, on multiple occasions, has done exactly this.

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https://stillwaterassociates.com/arizona-and-nevada-brace-for-impact-as-california-refinery-exodus-creates-gasoline-supply-crunch/?cn-reloaded=1

Quote:

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According to Stillwater analysis, California supplies about 33% of the Arizona gasoline market and 88% of the Nevada gasoline market (including 100% of the Reno, NV market). With the closures of the P66 Wilmington and Valero Benicia refineries, California's gasoline refining capacity will reduce by about 17%. With this refining reduction, the supply of gasoline from California to other states will also likely decrease, leading to potential fuel shortages, especially during peak demand periods.

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I dont believe I said all, that's not what I meant. The reduced production in CA will have an impact on both of those states.

CDUB98 said:

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2) People driving into Kalifornia, and there are not a small amount, would love to gas up before jumping the border. Anecdote: I watch David Friebuger's YouTube channel and he, on multiple occasions, has done exactly this.

---

About 3-4 years ago, they opened several new gas stations in Quartzsite and Ehrenberg, Arizona which are the last stops before you enter California on I-10.

On I-80, there is a relatively new gas station in "Boomtown" before you leave Nevada and there's nothing after that for quite a ways once you enter California.

On US-50, I don't really recall too much in the way of gas stations in Stateline, NV but, I'm sure they'll get busier.

On I-15, Primm, Nevada was already busy and I've stopped there many times to get gas before I enter California and start that desert run back to LA. Sounds like it's going to get even busier.

I know where the supply for AZ comes from but if you are close to the borders it will be cheaper than CA. CA policies are going to raise the price of everything in AZ, NV, CA, OR, and WA because it's going increase transportation costs for every product. Here is question for you does aviation fuel cost more in CA than the rest of the country?

Sal has a lot of good information in this video

Next up will be CA somehow preventing their residents from crossing state lines for fuel. Don't laugh cause it will happen.

Is the special blend for CA also required for any of the neighboring states? I wonder what the law says about bringing in 500-1000 gallons of "illegal" fuel?